Feats and ability damage


Rules Questions


If a feat has an ability score requirement and there ability drops below that requirement, do they lose access to the feat. So if a fighters intelligence drops below 13, does he lose the whirlwind attck, if his dexterity drops below 15, does he lose his two-weapon fighting style feat?


I would say that if you are going to allow folks to qualify with bonuses from headbands and belts, then they should also suffer from penalties related to going below the minimum required ability score.

This would also apply to spell casting. If you have a 13 Int, you can't cast 4th level spells.

Ability damage is nasty stuff!


No it's not and no it doesn't.

Quoted from the rules:

"Diseases, poisons, spells, and other abilities can all deal damage directly to your ability scores. This damage does not actually reduce an ability, but it does apply a penalty to the skills and statistics that are based on that ability.

For every 2 points of damage you take to a single ability, apply a –1 penalty to skills and statistics listed with the relevant ability. If the amount of ability damage you have taken equals or exceeds your ability score, you immediately fall unconscious until the damage is less than your ability score. The only exception to this is your Constitution score. If the damage to your Constitution is equal to or greater than your Constitution score, you die. Unless otherwise noted, damage to your ability scores is healed at the rate of 1 per day to each ability score that has been damaged. Ability damage can be healed through the use of spells, such as lesser restoration. "

A quick look towards the bottom provides all the answers rather explicitly.

Ability drain is the nasty one that starts resetting everything.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

If you lose a prerequiste to the feat, then you lose access to the feat but are not refunded it. This also applies to class abilities, PrC's that require that feat etc.

So anything that reduces an ability score, such as drain and cursed items, or Feeblemind, etc. invokes this penalty.


LazarX wrote:

If you lose a prerequiste to the feat, then you lose access to the feat but are not refunded it. This also applies to class abilities, PrC's that require that feat etc.

So anything that reduces an ability score, such as drain and cursed items, or Feeblemind, etc. invokes this penalty.

You specified ability damage. Ability damage does not reduce the ability score. Therefore it doesn't cause a loss. Only ability drain does, as per the rules like I just referenced.


Abraham spalding wrote:
LazarX wrote:

If you lose a prerequiste to the feat, then you lose access to the feat but are not refunded it. This also applies to class abilities, PrC's that require that feat etc.

So anything that reduces an ability score, such as drain and cursed items, or Feeblemind, etc. invokes this penalty.

You specified ability damage. Ability damage does not reduce the ability score. Therefore it doesn't cause a loss. Only ability drain does, as per the rules like I just referenced.

the original poster And laserx specified neither. Congratulations on being aggressive and wrong.

Yes, if you fail to meet the prerequisites of the feat, you do lose access to it.


I was just going to ask this question another way myself.

What if, say, you're a fighter that has taken Dodge but you're wearing armor that has Max Dex of 0 (implying that your dex is temporarily being counted as 10 or 11, below the prerequisite for Dodge)?

Can you use Dodge while wearing that armor? Seems like not to me...but wearing the armor doesn't actually reduce the ability score, just the amount of bonus you can apply to AC, skills, etc.
M


mearrin69 wrote:

I was just going to ask this question another way myself.

What if, say, you're a fighter that has taken Dodge but you're wearing armor that has Max Dex of 0 (implying that your dex is temporarily being counted as 10 or 11, below the prerequisite for Dodge)?

Can you use Dodge while wearing that armor? Seems like not to me...but wearing the armor doesn't actually reduce the ability score, just the amount of bonus you can apply to AC, skills, etc.
M

That's not what Max Dex means. Max Dex only limits the bonus you can apply to AC. For everything else, you still use your full Dex (although you sill may have a general armor check penalty for heavier armor)- including prerequisites for feats.

Also, the text explicitly states that if a character's Dex Bonus to AC drops to 0 because of armor, it still doesn't count as a character losing his Dex Bonus. So feats like Dodge, or other bonuses that are usually lost when one loses his Dex, would still be applicable.


nexusphere wrote:
Abraham spalding wrote:
LazarX wrote:

If you lose a prerequiste to the feat, then you lose access to the feat but are not refunded it. This also applies to class abilities, PrC's that require that feat etc.

So anything that reduces an ability score, such as drain and cursed items, or Feeblemind, etc. invokes this penalty.

You specified ability damage. Ability damage does not reduce the ability score. Therefore it doesn't cause a loss. Only ability drain does, as per the rules like I just referenced.

the original poster And laserx specified neither. Congratulations on being aggressive and wrong.

Yes, if you fail to meet the prerequisites of the feat, you do lose access to it.

You are right Fergie stated ability damage, not LazarX. However I still stand by what the rules state: That only ability drain will cause the loss of access to a feat, which is correct.

The ONLY thing that causes an ability score to drop (currently) is Ability Drain.

Shadow Lodge

Abraham spalding wrote:

You are right Fergie stated ability damage, not LazarX. However I still stand by what the rules state: That only ability drain will cause the loss of access to a feat, which is correct.

The ONLY thing that causes an ability score to drop (currently) is Ability Drain.

This is correct. Most things now only cause a penalty, which does not make you lose feats, prestige classes, spellcasting/class abilities, or whatever. This also includes many spells, that now cause a penalty to abilites.

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