Last night we ran a one shot since we were going to be down a player and did not want to wrap up Curse of the Crimson Throne without him. One of my players took over GM duties and I got to play a human rogue 1/alchemist 5. The other two PCs were a dwarven monk 5 and a dwarven barbarian 5.
Having the Brew Potions feat is nice. The potions of lesser restoration help against the creatures we faced (a yellow musk creeper and a dark stalker). I was able to do passing duty as a cleric without needing to take the infusion discovery. Interestingly, we noticed that by RAW, an alchemist can brew any potion (some at a higher DC) since crafting potions do not require you to actually know the spell used in the potion.
I really like the addition of the Precise Bomb discovery. I was able to drob a bomb on a baslisk (for 15 damage) that was in melee with the barbarian without harming the dwarf.
Rogue has a good class synergy with the Alchemist. I was easily able to create a physician that easily double as an assassin if he needed to. As it was, I got a 1d6 sneak attack to back up the few occasion I was caught in melee.
Adding my Intelligence bonus to holy water damage aganist a shadow demon was nice too.
A couple of questions did crop up though. Does an Alchemist's bonus to splash weapons (from Intelligence) apply to splash damage as well as the direct hit damage? We ruled no, but a clairification might be nice.
Does the Precise Bomb discovery apply to the splash damage from other splash weapons? By RAW, the answer is no, but it would be reasonable to allow it.
Does the swift alchemy ability include crafting poisons? RAW applies only to alchemical items, but I plan to allow it as a houserule at the very least.
That is my general take on it too.
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A couple of questions did crop up though. Does an Alchemist's bonus to splash weapons (from Intelligence) apply to splash damage as well as the direct hit damage? We ruled no, but a clairification might be nice.
Straight from the PDF
Throw Anything (Ex): All alchemists gain the Throw Anything feat as a bonus feat at 1st level. An alchemist adds his Intelligence modifier to damage done with splash weapons. This bonus damage is already included in the bomb class feature.
Isn't the splash damage determined from the minimum direct damage the splash weapon would deal, or is that just for bombs? If it is indeed the case, then the +int to damage indirectly effects the splash damage.
Alchemist fire and acid flasks usually only do 1 point of splash damage. As it is written, an alchemist would include their Int mod to those items as well. A large buff to their damage.
That is how I am reading it, but it can also be read as applying only to the base damage. For the games I run, I plan to allow the Intelligence bonus to splash damage and the precise bomb discovery to work on other splash weapons as well.
Still, I would like to see both specificly called out.
Brew Potion - You can create a potion of any 3rd-level or lower spell that YOU KNOW and that targets one or more creatures. So he would actually have to know the spell still.
Brew Potion (Ex): At 1st level, alchemists receive Brew
Potion as a bonus feat. An alchemist can brew potions of
any formulae he knows (up to 3rd level), using his alchemist
level as his caster level.
So we have a look at the feat, and a look at the APG rule under alchemist. So it still has to be on your formulae list that he specifically knows.
Brew Potion - You can create a potion of any 3rd-level or lower spell that YOU KNOW and that targets one or more creatures. So he would actually have to know the spell still.
Brew Potion (Ex): At 1st level, alchemists receive Brew
Potion as a bonus feat. An alchemist can brew potions of
any formulae he knows (up to 3rd level), using his alchemist
level as his caster level.So we have a look at the feat, and a look at the APG rule under alchemist. So it still has to be on your formulae list that he specifically knows.
Except For this:
Note that all items have prerequisites in their descriptions. These prerequisites must be met for the item to be created. Most of the time, they take the form of spells that must be known by the item’s creator (although access through another magic item or spellcaster is allowed). The DC to create a magic item increases by +5 for each prerequisite the caster does not meet. The only exception to this is the requisite item creation feat, which is mandatory. In addition, you cannot create spelltrigger and spell-completion magic items without meeting their spell prerequisites.
You can attempt to brew potions of s spell or formulae you do not know, but the DC goes up.
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Brew Potion - You can create a potion of any 3rd-level or lower spell that YOU KNOW and that targets one or more creatures. So he would actually have to know the spell still.
Brew Potion (Ex): At 1st level, alchemists receive Brew
Potion as a bonus feat. An alchemist can brew potions of
any formulae he knows (up to 3rd level), using his alchemist
level as his caster level.So we have a look at the feat, and a look at the APG rule under alchemist. So it still has to be on your formulae list that he specifically knows.
Except For this:
Note that all items have prerequisites in their descriptions. These prerequisites must be met for the item to be created. Most of the time, they take the form of spells that must be known by the item’s creator (although access through another magic item or spellcaster is allowed). The DC to create a magic item increases by +5 for each prerequisite the caster does not meet. The only exception to this is the requisite item creation feat, which is mandatory. In addition, you cannot create spelltrigger and spell-completion magic items without meeting their spell prerequisites.You can attempt to brew potions of s spell or formulae you do not know, but the DC goes up.
I'd say the specific rules under Brew Potion would over-ride the general rules under the magic item creation section.
By RAW, an Alchemist gains the Brew Potions Feat. The only reason the following text calls out that "an alchemist can brew potions of any formulae he knows (up to 3rd level), using his alchemist level as his caster level," is because formulae are not spells.
If the general rules of magic item creation allows a wizard to take a +5 DC penalty to brew a potion of cure light wounds, then why not allow an alchemist? Does allowing the alchemist to make an oil of magic weapon really cut into the power of the wizard or the cleric?
I thought oils were covered under wondrous items and not brew potion.
I thought oils were covered under wondrous items and not brew potion.
I think you may have meant to post that in this discussion.
Nonetheless, here is the answer to your question.
A potion is a magic liquid that produces its effect when imbibed. Potions vary incredibly in appearance. Magic oils are similar to potions, except that oils are applied externally rather than imbibed. A potion or oil can be used only once. It can duplicate the effect of a spell of up to 3rd level that has a casting time of less than 1 minute and targets one or more creatures.
It should be noted that 3.5, oils typically targeted objects and potions targeted creatures. Elixirs (which do use the Craft Wondrous Item feat) are one shot items that typically create effects that do not duplicate spells.
No, i meant to post it here. Oils and elixirs use the craft wondrous item feat and not brew potion. While potions and oils are similar, they decided to not included them both into one feat. Brew potion specifically only creates potions. I've seen a thread with someone from paizo posting about how potions makes an item usable by any class and thats why the feat does less than wondrous items or arms and armor which are more versatile.
I'll try to find the thread and post a link.
Edit: it was Sean R. here potion creation thread
No, i meant to post it here. Oils and elixirs use the craft wondrous item feat and not brew potion. While potions and oils are similar, they decided to not included them both into one feat. Brew potion specifically only creates potions. I've seen a thread with someone from paizo posting about how potions makes an item usable by any class and thats why the feat does less than wondrous items or arms and armor which are more versatile.
I'll try to find the thread and post a link.
Edit: it was Sean R. here potion creation thread
Actually, SKR only only mentions elixirs requiring the Craft Wondrous Item feat because elixirs do not duplicate spells. Potions and oils both duplicate spells. You do not have oils of tumbling, but you do have elixirs of tumbling. You do not have elixirs of magic weapon, but you do have oils of magic weapon.
Oils are also mentioned under potions in the magic item section and not under wondrous items (which use Craft Wondrous Items to make).