Oracle: Elemental mysteries & the 3 new - Spells and skills

[Zark]

Here are some thoughts on the oracle of Stone and some other stuff. I will add my thoughts on all elemental mysteries and all of the new mysteries. My thoughts are of course subjective opinons. If you spot any snark remarks, they are not intentional., but please let me know.
I’m not saying the Oracle of Stone suck or is broken. I just want to point out that I think it needs some changes

Stone Bonus Spells:

1 magic stone – Good solid spell. Great vs undeads. And oracles don’t have channelling so a nice choice. Fits the concept better than shield. Stone seem to be based on melee so some might think this is an odd one. But she can give the ammunition to her allies.

2 acid arrow – Great spell. No SR and damage stops regeneration. A good damage spell and a good utility spell.

3 Meld into stone – Not good. The Earth Glide revelation makes this spell more or less redundant. The spell fits the concept but it’s not very good. I played a Holy Warrior in 3.0 for some years with this as a SPA. He never used it. In 3.5 he got Stone shape instead. That he did use. Not often, but it wasn’t useless. My suggestion? Give the Oracle Stone shape or Protection from Energy

4 Wall of stone – Good utility spell. Fits the concept. A nice spell if you have Acid fog as well. Also good if you have stone shape. Some would perhaps prefer spike stones. (Spike stones is also nice with acid fog).

5 Stoneskin – Great spell.

6 Stone tell – A tricky spell to use. The player really is at the mercy of the DM/GM. The spell is very much an oracle spell. Stone doesn’t have any clairvoyance revelation (like Water Sight, Gaze of Flames or Wind Sight) so it fits the build. But I would prefer Stone got a clairvoyance revelation and another spell. Acid fog, SMVI, Elemental Body III (Earth only) or something else. You could also give Stone tell to him/her as a SPA or SU. If you give her acid fog make sure she can se through the fog.
Add a passage in Crystal Sight that you can see though fog (similar to Water Sight, Gaze of Flames or Wind Sight) or give her some sort of clairvoyance revelation.

7 Statue – Edit: A buff spell, not one of my favourite spells. Having stoneskin and healing spells and armor and shiled proficiency makes it even more usless. You don't need hardness you can heal and you got good armor. My suggestion is change this to Elemental Body IV (or Acid fog if she doesn’t have it as a level 6 spell).

8 Repel metal or stone – Another utility spell. A powerful spell perhaps, but a bit hard to use. Not one of my favourites spells.

9 Elemental swarm (earth only) – Good solid spell that fits the concept.

Conclusion:
Spells and abilities are overlapping.
The Final Revelation doesn’t match her spell list: she only have one acid spell and the other spells aren’t that much fun to begin with.
The spell list contains a lot of utility spells but they are not very good. If you are a wizard or a druid that is no problem. You have the whole list can pick an odd spell if you know what you are up against. If you give a this class a utility spell that spell should be able to be used at least once in a while. Most of the utility spells are highly situational.
This concept is more focused on melee that range attacks. Yet it has no melee boost spell but she has 2 range attack spells (magic stone acid arrow)

Suggestions on fixes, se above. However I would like to stress three of them

1) Statue. I hope this bonus spell doesn’t make it to the final.
Giving her Elemental Body IV would be focusing a bit more on melee and stability. Fits the concept. Unlike Flame and Waves, Stone (and Wind) doesn't have an elemental form.
(Flame has Form of Flame and Waves has Water Form. Both abilities should be nerfed to last 10 minutes per level. Otherwise you just end up with an Oracle in this form all the time. She only needs to pick Eschew Materials and she/he is ready to go).

Give her Acid Fog? I know it’s a 6 level spell, but Acid fog would also fit the concept and would make the final revelation a bit more useful. If she also were given the ability to se through fog it would let a Stone Oracle do something similar to The Oracle of Flames.
(An Oracle of Flames can cast incendiary cloud and see through the fog. Even more fun she can target spells inside the fog, Very nasty. Of course she can also cast resist energy (or protection from energy) on her allies.)

2) Make Stone Tell a Su or Spa that works 3 times per day or something or give her some sort of clairvoyance revelation. Give her Acid fog or Elemental Body III

3) Edit: Meld into stone. I really hope this bonus spell doesn’t make it to the final. Change it to Stone shape or Protection from Energy or somthing else. If I got it right the Earth Glide revelation makes Meld into stone redundant.

Some last notes on the skills.
She adds Appraise, Climb, Intimidate, and Survival to her list.
Using Earth Glide is like swimming right? But Earth Glide doesn’t give her swim speed and she doesn’t have swim as a class skill. Perhaps I have misunderstood this.
Shouldn’t stone have Knowledge Dungeoneering? She is an Oracle and she is an Oracle of Stone. Knowledge Dungeoneering seems right.

I think all elemental mysteries have a rather weak Final Revelation and it’s also a bit boring.
You might want to look into some of the other Final Revelations. Some need explaining and some need to be nerfed.

Edit: Nature: I don’t understand this Final Revelation. I seems you have started messing with your own polymorph rules. Or am I wrong? Some of the changes in the core rolebook that that was great was the new polymorph rules (and CMB/CMD; Skills; Channeling, Multi-classing). Starting to change how polymorph function can't be a good thing.

Heavens: You receive a bonus on all saving throws equal to your Charisma modifier.
This bonus should be halved. This is a spell casting mystery. An oracle of the heavens will start with a charisma score between 16 to 20. By level 20 she will ha at least 30.
That’s +10 on all saves. This need to be nerfed. Even without the capstone ability Heavens is one of the most powerful Mysteries.

Battle: You can take a full-attack action and move up to your speed as a full-round action (you can move before or after the attacks). During the whole playtest of the Core Rulebook people asked for iterative attacks. They didn’t get any. Not even a feat that let them use iterative attacks x times per day. A 20 level TW fighter with haste has only one attack after a move, but an oracle can do it all the time? If an Oracle of Battle can do it 3 times per day as an Ex. It would be OK, but always on is to good. If there is any class that should be able to do this its the fighter (and possibly the Barbarian and monk). Also, this messes with the basic mechanics dealing with full round actions and standard action. Not good.

I'll be back with more during the weekend.

[hogarth]

Zark wrote:

7 Statue – I’m probably biased but I think this is one of the worst spells in the game. It’s a utility spell, but not a very good one.

You might be misunderestimating the spell a bit (I know I used to). The key thing is that one can turn it on and off as a free action, so the subject can have hardness 8 whenever he/she is not acting (un-statue, act, re-statue). And it lasts basically all day at that level.

It's not a great spell, but it's kind of neat.

[Zark]

hogarth wrote:

Zark wrote:

7 Statue – I’m probably biased but I think this is one of the worst spells in the game. It’s a utility spell, but not a very good one.

You might be misunderestimating the spell a bit (I know I used to). The key thing is that one can turn it on and off as a free action, so the subject can have hardness 8 whenever he/she is not acting (un-statue, act, re-statue). And it lasts basically all day at that level.

It's not a great spell, but it's kind of neat.

Thanks for the information, my bad. I'm to tired to rewrite it all.

I do however still think Elemental Body IV or Acid fog is more fun. I can see a wizard using Statue, but an Oracle. The got healing spells and stoneskin and a good armor, they don't need it.

[hogarth]

Zark wrote:

Thanks for the information, my bad. I'm to tired to rewrite it all.
I do however still think Elemental Body IV or Acid fog is more fun. I can see a wizard using Statue, but an Oracle. The got healing spells and stoneskin and a good armor, they don't need it.

So cast it on your buddy the wizard; it's not a "Personal" range spell, after all. And by level 15, there are plenty of creatures that basically have no chance of missing an oracle (medium armor or no medium armor).

I agree that Elemental Body IV would be cool. I have some personal objections to the "earth = acid" theory, but Acid Fog would be OK, too.

[Zark]

hogarth wrote:

Zark wrote:

Thanks for the information, my bad. I'm to tired to rewrite it all.
I do however still think Elemental Body IV or Acid fog is more fun. I can see a wizard using Statue, but an Oracle. The got healing spells and stoneskin and a good armor, they don't need it.

So cast it on your buddy the wizard; it's not a "Personal" range spell, after all. And by level 15, there are plenty of creatures that basically have no chance of missing an oracle (medium armor or no medium armor).

I agree that Elemental Body IV would be cool. I have some personal objections to the "earth = acid" theory, but Acid Fog would be OK, too.

Perhaps you are right about Statue, but I don't like that spell. I like it more now that you have explained how it works (I edited the post), but still. Since she don't have any elemental form like Waves and Flame so I think Elemental Body IV would be nice.

I still think Stone Tell and Meld into stone should be replaced.

[KaeYoss]

hogarth wrote:

Zark wrote:

7 Statue – I’m probably biased but I think this is one of the worst spells in the game. It’s a utility spell, but not a very good one.

You might be misunderestimating the spell a bit (I know I used to). The key thing is that one can turn it on and off as a free action, so the subject can have hardness 8 whenever he/she is not acting (un-statue, act, re-statue). And it lasts basically all day at that level.

It's not a great spell, but it's kind of neat.

Now what does that remind me of?

[Zark]

Nature
The bonus skills.
She adds Climb, Fly, Knowledge (nature), Ride, Survival, and Swim to her list of class skills. I’m not sure why she should get fly as a class skill. I would rather add Handle animal. It fits better with the concept and it fits with her revelations: Bonded Mount, Speak with Animals and Friend to the Animals.
I would perhaps change the “Speak with Animals” revelation. Make it a SPA or SU that works exactly like the spell Speak with animals. It can be used a number of times per day equal to 3 + your Charisma modifier.

Speaking of revelations it seems that Erosion Touch and Undo Artifice are somewhat overlapping each other .

As she get a Bonded Mount she probably should get magic fang or/and greater magic fang as spell or as a SU or Spa.

Nature’s Whispers: This should be able to pick util level 5 or 7. A bard or a Paladin or even a Sorcerer will gladly pick one level Oracle jut do get this Revelation.

I don’t understand the final revelation, se previous post.

Let’s take a look at the spell list.

Bonus Spells:

1) Charm animal – A situational spell. Even if it fits your campaign the Oracle doesn’t have speak with animals, nor does she have handle animal as a class skill. The spell fit the concept even if it’s a bit weak. At higher levels this spell becomes obsolete. Magic fang or speak with animals could be alternatives.

2) Barkskin – A great buff spell.

3) Speak with plants – another situational spell and a GM’s nightmare. This spell and Stone tell both suffers from more or less the same problems: The Stone's/The Plant's "perspective, perception, and knowledge may prevent the stone from providing the details you are looking for.” + The Stone's/The Plant's "sense of its surroundings is limited, so it won’t be able to give (or recognize) detailed descriptions creatures or answer questions about events outside its immediate vicinity.” So if you ask a stone or a tree something what can it tell you? It has no eyes etc. and no intelligence and no sense of time. An answer might be: Some flesh creatures came by and fought other flesh creatures. These spells are a players nightmare or a GM’s nightmare or both.

4) Ice storm – Great spell. God combat spell and can be used as a utility spell. Cast it and run away.

5) Awaken – Nice spell, but problematic. A good utility spell. The 2000 gp cost prevents it from being abused but it also prevents it from being used. That makes it a bit problematic. Greater magic fang might me an alternative. Breath of Life might, Animal Growth or Baleful Polymorph might also be alternatives.

6) Stone tell – Problematic, se Speak with plants. I would say this is even worse than speak with plants. There are usually more stones in a dungeon than plants but what can a stone tell you? Speak with plants at least can be used to talk to plant creatures. I rather see Heal as the level 6 spell. She’s in tune with nature and can heal all living creatures or harm undead creatures that are a violation of nature.

7) Creeping doom – This spell is just a Great. It really fits the concept of a Nature Mystery. Casting time is a standard action. A really good battle field control. No Spell Resistance makes this a wonderful spell.

8) Animal shapes – Another situational spell Can’t really say if this is a great spell or a bad spell. It depends what kind of party you have. I’m not sure your allies really want you to use this one.

9) Storm of vengeance – A very powerful spell, but it’s very hard to use.

Looking at the mysteries it seems that one have been looking to much on the literal meaning of the names of most mysteries. To make each Mystery funny and balanced one should think outside the box. Stone doesn’t have to get Stone spells, wind doesn’t have to get wind or whether spells. Nature doesn’t have to get animal or plant spells. A great example of this is the Wind spell Shield. I have no problem seeing the Oracle of Wind calling on the pure force/magic of the wind. Grating her a shield of wind force. Hovering in the air and made of the very essence of the wind. The shield moves like the wind grating shield bonus vs all attackers. Even vs. incorporeal creatures. This mean Wind could also have spells like haste. You can move like the wind and act as fast as the wind. Or why not create new spells?

[Erik Mona]

Excellent. Thanks for posting this analysis!

[Zark]

Erik Mona wrote:

Excellent. Thanks for posting this analysis!

Thanks. I will continue with the rest of the elements and Lore.

I will try to add some more thoughts on Heavens.
My English isn't great so please ask me anything if something is unclear.

[Scipion del Ferro]

Having Enlarge Spell and Extend Spell would be nice if they could actually help wall of stone and stone shape. Allowing you to shape 50% more material would be really useful. Extend can't really do anything as they are already permanent spells....

[Zark]

Scipion del Ferro wrote:

Having Enlarge Spell and Extend Spell would be nice if they could actually help wall of stone and stone shape. Allowing you to shape 50% more material would be really useful. Extend can't really do anything as they are already permanent spells....

Agree. Enlarge is only good if range is a problem, like rays or summon monster, or remove fear. I really hate when people run away in fear when you try to help them. ;-) And Extend Spell is only good with mage armor, longstrider, protection from energy, freedom of movement, etc.

[Zark]

Next on up is Lore. I post it tomorrow.
Then Fire, Wind and Waves.
Finally I will do a quick run though the remaining.

[Zark]

This will be my longest post I hope it’s readable. I know my English is a bit of and I am dyslectic so obviously there are errors. If anything is unclear please let me know.
Lore.
I like the idea of a Lore mystery, but the execution isn’t to my liking. It has flavour, but lacks some colour. It needs to be a bit more fun or sexy. Mysteries are a bit like rock stars. Some are sexy some fun and some are violent. Robert Plant was sexy, Ian Gillan wasn’t but he was funny. So if Lore can’t be Plant, can we make it a bit more Gillan?
Creating a fun mystery doesn’t have to involve giving the Oracle a lot of damage spells (more of that in my next post). Nor does all bonus spells have to be from the arcane spell list.
In this case though giving Lore mostly arcane spells really fits the bill. The problem with many of the spells on the current list is, they aren’t funny enough or they overlap or they are situational or the mystery itself doesn’t need it due to its revelations or the bonus spells are expencive or even dangerous to use. With the exception of Mass owl’s wisdom and Time Stop, the spell list is perhaps too focused on the literal sense of Lore. If you cut down on lore it would benefit both players and GM. Few spells can makes a GM more frustrated than Divinations spells, well that would be Teleport spells.
Finally, there are no blast spells on the list. Is this a problem? I would say no, it’s not. What makes a list of utility spells problematic is if:

the spells are Situational

the spells are used seldom or used as a scroll /wand or used in down time.

hard to use or/and the rules are ambiguous

two spells have the same function or if a spell has the same function as a Revelation.

the spells have expensive material components

too many spells on the list aren’t either sexy or funny enough.

If you recognise this you need to change the list and perhaps even add/change some Revelations. Revelation that interacts with one or more spells on the list is better than revelations that make the spells/spells redundant.

Lets compare two spells that you hopefully don’t have to use that often ;-) Break Enchantment and Breath of Life.
The great thing about being a spontaneous caster is that you don’t have to prepare spells, but cleric do. As a Cleric I would never prepare Breath of Life as a domain spell, but I would have it as a scrolls or prepare it in one of the other spell slots. As a high level cleric I would prepare at least two of Breath of Life. Would I as a cleric prepare Break Enchantment? I would say no, not unless I was a high level cleric and had a lot of spell slots. It has a casting time of 1 minute so you can’t use it in battle, hence you can just as well wait until the effect ends. If the effect is instantaneous I also need to succeed in a caster level check. So we might just as well go back to town with our petrified friend or use plane shift or Teleport. If I can't find someone to depetrifie my friend. I would just sleep one night and use Break Enchantment the next day.
If there as an “Aid” mystery would I want any of these two spells as my bonus spells? Perhaps, perhaps not. Would I pick one of them as a spell known? Yes, I would pick Breath of life. Breath of life is just great for a spontaneous healer to have. But what of Break Enchantment? No I would never pick it. I rather go back to town and find a bard or a cleric. But what if we make Break Enchantment more sexy or fun? Let’s create a Revelation where we cut down the casting time to one full round and X times per day you can cast it as a standard action. We give a bonus to caster level when using this spell. Also X times per day I get to roll 20 Vs Petrifaction or gaze effects.
I think Lore has a bit of the same problem. The spells are not bad but you don't want them all on your list. Also the spell list need to be more fun or sexy or both. It got the flavour, but it needs some colour.

Class Skills: She adds: Appraise, Spellcraft, and all Knowledge skills to her list of class skills.

Oracles already have Spellcraft as a class skill. I would instead add one or more of these skill

Linguistics

Perception – this skill might seem odd, put its used to search and to notice things. It fits.

Use magic device

Bonus Spells:
Tongues as a 2nd level spell and Locate object as a 3rd level spell? I’m not going to assume the spell list is faulty. If Togues should be a 3rd level spell and Locate object 2nd level please let me know and I rewrite some of the review.

1 Identify – Good utility spell. Becomes obsolete eventually, but the 3 rounds per level lets you identify more items as caster level increase. It fits the lore theme and clerics don’t have this one on the list. Very nice.

2 Tongues – Nice spell that fits the Lore theme. Fantastic to have this as a 2.nd level spell. Remember, Gather Info now is consolidated with Diplomacy and you play a charisma character with Diplomacy as a class skill. You want information? Talk to people! Tongues is great because you can get answers just by using Diplomacy and it’s good for role playing as well. I guess some might want to have a more fun spell or a spell that isn’t on the cleric list. See Invisibility or even darkvision might be nice options as a 2:nd level spell especially if Tongues really should be a 3rd level spell, but if it’s indeed a 2nd level spell then it’s great. Some might say: if you choose to play Lore, then you probably have boosted your Int and you will perhaps add some ranks in Linguistics. This might make this spell redundant eventually. I say: but you can cast it on others, like the rogue and at higher levels a 2nd level spell isn’t much of a problem. Again some like this spell some don’t. I do.

3 Locate object – Decent utility spell, but not one of my favourites. Not as a 3rd level spell. Nice if you want to find a door when you are in a dungeon. I rather have Locate creature or Clairaudience/Clairvoyance. Or why not Invisibility Purge or Daylight?

4 Legend lore – One more utility spell, but with diplomacy as a class skill and charisma as your main score I would rather use my knowledge skills, my Revelations and/or Diplomacy. Perhaps I would pick skill focus Diplomacy. Also, Handy Book, Think on It and Focused Trance make this spell (and Vision) pretty redundant. Also you get vision as a 7th level spell. As a 4th level spell I would rather have Arcane Eye or Locate Creature. Arcane Eye on the spell list would fit the theme and it would make this class so much more fun to play. Arcane Eye is both fun and sexy.

5 Contact other plane – Bad or Good? It depends on how much downtime you have. I don’t like this spell. The Avoid Int/Cha Decrease is just too nasty and you have Commune. Also Automatic Writing makes this spell redundant. I rather have Arcane Eye if she won’t get it as a 4th level spell or Telepathic Bond. Telepathic Bond, I love it. A great utility spell – never leave your home without it. One of those spells that would make this class so much more fun to play. Not because it’s extremely good, but because it’s fun and very useful. Rogues and other scouts usually love it. Good for role playing to:

spoiler:

- Hey I heard that! I know you think I’m beautiful, but I’m no slut.
And you can talk to Allies or insult them when you have to be quiet.
- Rogue, do you find any traps you Schmuck. Last time you missed one it nearly killed us!
- Hey, Rogue there is a guard up front. Are you both blind and deaf?
- Hey Rogue do you need some healing or do you want to fight that dragon yourself? Oh you want us to come and help you.

6 Mass owl’s wisdom – A bad spell. At this level those who needs wisdom (druid, monks, clerics) will have a +4 wisdom item. Even a fighter will have stuff that boost their wisdom. The spell doesn’t fit the concept and Orcales don’t use wisdom as a casting stat. Lore is the search for truth, knowledge, power and all that is hidden. Sure wisdom boost your perception, but this spell is useless when you get it. A quicken owl’s wisdom is far better. I would rather give her Planar Ally, Find the Path or Greater Dispel Magic. That’s right, Cleric spells not all spells need to be Arcane. Or if she can’t have Telepathic Bond as a 5th level spell. Give her that as a 6th level spell.

7 Vision – same as legend lore. Remove this or Legend lore or both. These two spells overlap too much and “Handy Book”, “Think on It” and “Focused Trance” make both of them pretty redundant. My suggestion is, give her Limited Wish. It really fits. The 1,500 gp material components prevents it from being abused, but at this level you can still afford to cast it when you really need it. Limited wish is one of those really sexy spells.

8 Moment of prescience – Great spell. What can I say. Just great. It also fits the Theme.

9 Time stop - Great spell. One of the best spells in the game. But, it doesn’t fit. It would work nice with an Oracle of the Wind. In fact I think this one should be on the Wind list. Act like the wind, etc. Oracle of Lore? Give her Foresight. It’s another great spell that really fits the her Lore Theme.

Revelations:

Arcane Archivist (Su): I’m not sure I understand this one correct. Is this an expensive way to cast spell you could cast by using wands or scrolls + use magic device? Good idea, but since spellbooks can be sold and wands/scrolls bought this Revelation is not that good.

Automatic Writing (Su): Great stuff. What can I say. But not so great with the current spell list.

Brain Drain (Su): Cool but it seams to be a bit problematic. How should a GM come up with stolen thoughts and memories?

Focused Trance (Ex): Good, but this revelation makes the final revelation a bit pointless. In fact the final revelation is too weak.

Handy Book (Ex): Great and fits the theme.

Mental Acuity (Ex): This is really fantastic. Especially with the Pathfinder rules on increasing intelligent affecting skills retroactively.

Sidestep Secret (Su): Great but dangerous. Charisma characters may want to pick one level Oracle just to get this one.

Spontaneous Symbology (Sp): If you like symbol spells you like this. I don’t.

Think on It (Ex): Too weak and to close to Focused Trance. I would make these two revelations one.

Whirlwind Lesson (Ex): Lets the party save some money. I don’t like this one.

Final Revelation: I really think this is one of the weakest final revelations.
You can take 20 on all Knowledge skill checks. At level 20 knowledge is not a problem, especially not if you are an Oracle of Lore.
Once per day, you can cast wish but you can’t used to replicate spells with expensive material components. Why not? And what is an expensive material components? 50 gp or 10 0001 gp? Here are some spells with expensive material components some of these would be nice to be able to cast using wish (there are more):

Consecrate (50 gp), Stoneskin (250 gp), Atonement (500 gp), Teleportation Circle (1 000 gp), Vision (1500 gp), Awaken ( 2,000 gp), Forbiddance, (1,500 gp, plus 1,500 gp per 60-foot cube), Greater Restoration (5,000 gp), Hallow (1,000 gp, plus 1,000 gp per level of the spell to be included). Resurrection (10 000 gp)

Atonement or Vision once per day is no big problem, is there? Restoration why not? Resurrection perhaps not. The simplest way would just to add a GP limit.
My suggestions on some GP limits and their applications, check out spoiler

spoiler:

Less than 1000 gp ( you can cast stuff like Consecrate, Stoneskin, Atonement)

No more than 1000 gp (you can cast Restoration as well)

No more than 2000 gp (you can cast Vision and hallow and add a 1st level spell to the Hallow and cast Awaken)

Less than 5000 gp ( you can cast most spells but not stuff like Greater restoration and Raise dead. You can cast Hallow and add a 3rd level spell, but not a 4th level spell, you can make one spell Permanent and cast a Forbiddance at a smaller area.)

No more than 5000 gp (you can cast most spells including stuff like Greater restoration and Raise dead and cast a Forbiddance at a smaller area. You can make a more powerful spell Permanent)

Less than 10 000 gp (you can cast stuff like Greater restoration and Raise dead but not resurrection and cast Forbiddance at a lager area. You can make one really powerful spell Permanent)

No more than 10 000 gp (you can cast stuff like Greater restoration and Raise dead and Resurrection)

[Zark]

Flame Let me start up by Fire away two Quotes.

KaeYoss wrote:

Clerics are not supposed to have blast spells, in the same way Sorcerers don't have healing spells.

Link . Another quote from the same thread.

Smerg wrote:

The Oracle is working off of the Sorcerer 'template'
Still, comparing directly to the Sorcerer and the Oracle is a bit ahead.
Character Level 1 Oracle gets in spells
Level 0 Spells - 4 Known spells
Level 1 Spells - Cure Light Wounds, 2 other Known spells
That is +1 Spell at level 1 for Oracle compared to Sorcerer.
Full access to all spells marked 'Cure' gives 8 extra spells (10 if your GM includes Heal in the Cure spells) over the 20 levels. {or 'Inflict' spells if you want to hurt people}
Oracles get Revelations at levels 1, 3, 7, 11, 15, 19, 20 (capstone)
Sorcerers get Bloodline powers at levels 1, 3, 9, 15, 20 (capstone)
Oracles get +1 Revelation with additional benefits of picking from a list and the choosing of order of when to take a benefit.
Oracles get skill selection of 4 + Int compared to a Sorcerers 2 + Int. That is 2 extra skill points per level.
Sorcerers do get Eschew materials and 3 bonus feats.
Oracles get their Curse which provides a trade off on benefits and minuses on levels 1, 5, 10, and 15. (You can get some good benefits out of this including more spells if you want or several feat like abilities).
Oracles also have a better hit die, BAB progression, and access to medium armour with shields.
Comparing the two in 'hard' numbers, the Oracle is better at every level then the Sorcerer. The real modifier between the two is the spell selection and punch value of the Arcane spell list compared to the Divine spell list.
Given the latest version of the Oracle, I don't see any need for a concern in when the bonus spells are awarded. The Oracle has the chops to be a solid class.

By the way, I recommend you to read Smergs posts. Some of his ideas/points are excellent. For a selection see spoiler.

spoiler:

Thread: Oracle - Final Revelation Wind, Link

Thread: Oracle of Nature and possibly elemental ones - Druid spell list?, Link

Thread: Oracle: Overall Thoughts, Link

Thread: Oracle mystery spells don't come in till 3rd level, Link

Thread: Oracle Wind Revelation thoughts, Link

Alright. This is probably one of the Mysteries I like the least. Why? Too much power and to much Sorcerer. Giving a cleric fireball as a domain spell is no big problem. He can cast it once per day, but as a Oracle you can cast it all day long and the DC will be much higher than then of a cleric. I have a hard time understanding that some people are so very upset that the Oracle can’t use Burning Magic until level 7. I agree it’s odd, but nothing that breaks the class. You can take quicken spell as well at level 1, but you won’t be able to use it until level 10.
Is this incarnation of The Oracle more powerful then the Sorcerer? Perhaps and I don’t like it and I don’t like that it’s almost entirely focused on damage. There is more to fun than just dealing damage, but for those who like to focus on damage. This one is one of the best.

Class Skills: She may add Acrobatics, Climb, Intimidate, and Perform to her list of
class skills.

I don’t understand why she has Climb as a class skill, but it’s fine by me.

1) Produce flame – more of a utility spell than a damage dealing spell. Good vs trolls. Not one of my favourite spells.

2) Resist energy – Great spell. The best resist spell in the game. Cast it on the rest of the party and fire away.

3) Fireball – solid damage dealing spell. Quicken fireball and then another fireball and Burning Magic.

4) Wall of fire – Good damage spell, but also a utility spell. Good for battle field control at lower and mid levels. Nasty with spikestones or if someone is immobilised. Well we have hold person and we will get Holy Word.

5) Summon monster V (fire elementals only) . – Good Utility spell. Good for battle field control. But this spell soon becomes obsolete. Some may perhaps prefer Flame Strike and get SM VI as a 6th level spell. If you are going to use this perhaps you should get Augment Summoning.

6) Fire seeds – Good damage dealing spell that needs planing. Might be a bit hard to use. But I agree Fire Seed is a good spell and it does fits. Great to have as a spontaneous caster.

7) Fire storm – Really powerful spell. Might be a bit hard to use, but you have already cast Resist energy on your friends.

8) Incendiary cloud – Great and Really powerful spell. This and Gaze of Flames is a real nice combo. Start by casting quicken fireball the use IC on the enemy. They can’t see you but you can see them. Just add with more damage dealing spells or help your friends while keeping an eye on the enemy. If you decide to heal your friends Burning Magic will add damage.

9) Elemental swarm (fire only) – Great spell. Especially if you have the Augment Summoning feat. Great for battlefield control. Why Heavens got Meteor Swarm and Fire didn’t is probably stuff some people might get upset about.

Revelations

Burning Magic (Su): Nice but you can’t really use it until level 7 since fireball is the only spell with fire damage an saving throw. Perhaps it should include SU or just add a level restriction till it or give Flames burning hands at level 3.

Cinder Dance (Ex): This one is just fantastic. Good design that you get more nice stuff at higher levels.

Fire Breath (Su): A good blast ability.

Firestorm (Su): A very good blast ability. More powerful than Fire Breath but a bit harder to use.

Form of Flame (Su): Really powerful. Duration is 1 hour/level should probably be nerfed. Shift into forms of flame and you can still cast spells and use weapon. At higher levels all you need is Resist Energy: Cold to protect yourself and Molten skin so you don’t burn you spell components.

Gaze of Flames (Su): This one is nice divination ability that lets you do nasty stuff with Incendiary cloud.

Heat Aura (Su): A nice ability. Damage and buff. Not über but cool. I like the blur effect.

Molten Skin (Ex): Great solid ability.

Touch of Flame (Su): Good at lower levels. Great utility ability when dealing with trolls and other nasty creatures.

Wings of Fire (Su): Great but do you need it when you have Form of Flame?

Final Revelation: It’s a bit dull, but The Flame bonus spell list makes this revelation one of the best elemental Capstones.

Flames is a good and powerful mystery but a bit too focused on fire damage, IMHO.

Next post will be Waves or Wind.

[hogarth]

Zark wrote:

3 Locate object – Decent utility spell, but not one of my favourites. Not as a 3rd level spell. Nice if you want to find a door when you are in a dungeon. I rather have Locate creature or Clairaudience/Clairvoyance. Or why not Invisibility Purge or Daylight?

Clairvoyance is a terrible spell because of the awful 10 minute casting time.

[Zark]

hogarth wrote:

Clairvoyance is a terrible spell because of the awful 10 minute casting time.

Edit: Sometimes it is. I have used it from time to time. terrible if you have allready cast short buffs. I have however used much more often than Locate object. If you don't like it I think Locate creature, Invisibility Purge and Daylight are all nice options.

[Zark]

I just want to add that even if I think that Lore and some of the other mysteries need a change, Lore, Heavens and Wind are my Favourite mysteries. I guess Nature, Stone and Wind are also mysteries I’ve got a soft spot for. The one I like the least are Bones, Battle and Fire. Especially Bones and Battle. So even if my post on Lore was long it’s still one of the coolest Mysteries.

[Zark]

hogarth wrote:

Clairvoyance is a terrible spell because of the awful 10 minute casting time.

I've been thinking about this, and you're probably right. This isn't a good option. It's better they get it, or something similar, as a revelation of some sort.