I noticed some builds are leaving out traits, why?
The Hunter's Eye trait from the Guide to Pathfinder Society Organized Play (2009) is both thematically appropriate as it denotes a familial tie to Erastil and meaningful, since it eliminates the second range penalty when using a bow.
The con is that it ties the player to Andoran, but there are other regional traits which could also provide meaningful benefits to an archer paladin build.
I was just thinking earlier today about a similar notion - a paladin who specializes in hurled weapons - and whether that would be very workable.
Are there any 3.x thrown weapons that actually do enough damage to make sense specializing in them though? Thrown dagger is okay for the rogue but base damage is pretty horrible. Throwing axe and javelin are really the only options. Starknife would fit for Golarion and Chakrams could definitely be developed.
Basically I think you'd have to go to something 3.x like the orc shotput and even then it's a highly dubious build.
The problem with thrown weapons are:
It's unfortunate, but throwing weapons are really not well supported in higher level play.
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Furthermore, unless you've got lots of extra hands, you can't full attack two rounds in a row with returning weapons because they all return at the same time, meaning some are going to clatter to the floor and require move actions to pick them up.
With thrown daggers and shurikens and such, I suggest to my players to think of it as them throwing multiple weapons at a time. You know, a dagger held between every two fingers in each hand.
Probably not ideal for the style of everyone's games, but it works for us. Realistic? Probably not. But an action movie/anime/videogame/fantasy fiction trope that looks cool? Oh yes.
edit-The results are very iffy, but here's another throwing method to consider.
I was just thinking earlier today about a similar notion - a paladin who specializes in hurled weapons - and whether that would be very workable.
Bounding Hammer feat, Dwarves of Golarion, pg. 20
Str: 14, Dex: 18, Con: 12 , Int: 10, Wis: 8, Cha: 14
That's an interesting line up. I'm quoting it because it is possible to build a mounted archer with these stats. Switch Con, Int and Wis to get: Str 14, Dex 18, Con 8, Int 12, Wis 10, Cha 14. That'll give an extra skill rank per level, which nicely pays for the ride skill. It also gives no penalty to Wis, for Will saves (arguably the most important). With your swift action Lay on Hands, and the mount taking some of your hits, plus a good HD and strong Fort saves, it works out okay to take the 8 for Con.
Switch Str and Cha and it is almost identical to my wife's (mounted archery) paladin's stats. She went from 1st to 20th (now) without too many troubles, only dying twice, both times due to bad luck.
Peace,
tfad
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Thrown weapons are v. tough; if you're wanting the strength bonus, the sling is randomly amazing though. Out of the box strength bonus to damage. But that's even more difficult for pallys; they require Dex, Chr, and a little Str right now, increasing the Str requirement to make it a good idea would be that much more difficult.
Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 4, Legendary Games
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Thrown weapons are v. tough; if you're wanting the strength bonus, the sling is randomly amazing though. Out of the box strength bonus to damage. But that's even more difficult for pallys; they require Dex, Chr, and a little Str right now, increasing the Str requirement to make it a good idea would be that much more difficult.
Oh definitely; I'm a sling fan as an easy missile weapon for strong types, esp. at low levels. It's a great barbarian ranged weapon. Cheap, easy, stacks with rage without needing special equipment.
You might consider a halfling paladin using staff sling instead of bow, esp. at lower levels where the iterative attacks don't matter much (or if you're mounted, so you can spend your move action to reload while your mount is moving) or if you house-rule that Rapid Reload can be taken with a sling.
The HSS also serves a dual-purpose as a melee weapon, which lets you double-dip for enchantment - a +1 flaming HSS is +1 and flaming whether you use it close up as a club or at range.
Straight-up thrown weapons, though, yeah they are tough. I suppose it can pay off if you go the Vital Strike route with a returning weapon and use Wind Stance and/or Shot on the Run. I don't know that any of them are juicy enough in terms of range, damage, or crits to make them more appealing than using a bow, crossbow, or sling instead.
The Hunter's Eye trait from the Guide to Pathfinder Society Organized Play (2009) is both thematically appropriate as it denotes a familial tie to Erastil and meaningful, since it eliminates the second range penalty when using a bow.
Nice pickup. Thanks
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Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 4, Legendary Games
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Switch Con, Int and Wis to get: Str 14, Dex 18, Con 8, Int 12, Wis 10, Cha 14.Or don't do that, because the only save more common than will is fort, plus the fact that HP damage is more common than both.
Yeah, you don't necessarily need a GREAT Con score as a paladin, given your save bonuses and your self-healing, but I don't think I'd go so far as to say you could get away with a sucky Con score.
Str: 14, Dex: 18, Con: 12 , Int: 10, Wis: 8, Cha: 14That's an interesting line up. I'm quoting it because it is possible to build a mounted archer with these stats. Switch Con, Int and Wis to get: Str 14, Dex 18, Con 8, Int 12, Wis 10, Cha 14. That'll give an extra skill rank per level, which nicely pays for the ride skill.
I might be bail on the mounted stuff to divine bond with the bow
I'm playing a Ranged Paladin of The Silver Flame this Sunday. Anyone have a miniature suggestion ? Prepainted preferably!
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I want to start a second PFS character who is focused on archery. I can't decide whether to go fighter, the new magus archetype, zen archer, or maybe paladin?. I am a fairly new player, so something with low reliance on spells or complicated strategy would be nice. Mainly looking for high DPR. Any suggestions on which class is currently leading in that or feat progressions would be great. Wouldn't mind seeing full builds either if people have time. Thanks.
jreyst where exactly are you getting the idea about a paladin fighting fairly, not take advantage of weaknesses, or meeting in melee whenever they can?
Not harping on you, I just like reading sources for peoples ideas :)
I know I've read of several noble, honor bound samurai who favored the longbow. It doesn't really seem like such a taboo idea as you present in literature.
I myself like the idea of the paladin with a bow, but I can help you out on the literary background to the idea that a knight (of which a paladin is the paragon) would not use a bow.
In the Iliad, the epic poem about the Trojan war, Prince Paris is repeatedly mocked and scorned for using a bow rather than engaging in melee. Achilles, Hector and the other great heroes always waded into the thick of things with spear and sword and shield, but Paris plinked away at people with his bow.
Later, the term paladin was first coined to refer to the twelve knightly companions of Charlemagne, of whom Roland was the chiefest. Throughout the entire corpus of Carolingian legends and Arthuriana, I have yet to read of a knightly hero using a bow, except to hunt. I am sure it does occur, but the focus of the poets is always the cleaving and hewing of swords and axes and the thrusting and shivering of spears.
I would suggest therefore that such a code against missile weapons is purely a cultural tradition, and so would apply differently to characters from different backgrounds. Furthermore said chivalry did not apply to the vilest of enemies. In D&D terms, a paladin of Good should have no compunction about how he defeats an orc, a witch, an anti-paladin or his henchmen.
I am contemplating building a paladin with a longbow (composite when rich enough). The idea of a hobbit excited me until I realized that in Pathfinder a small character uses smaller dice for damage. Is it still worthwhile? (Plus fewer skills and one less feat, but the racial bonuses seem a good balance for that.)
Someone mentioned Deadly Aim, but without the bonus feat, it will take a long time to get that. (After all Point Blank and Precise Shot should probably come first.)
EDIT: Doh. I see now that Deadly Aim has no prerequisite other than Dexterity. Time to try this out!
Are there any Halfling feats or items which counter act this size disadvantage?
