Philosopher’s Stone: The alchemist learns how to create
a philosopher’s stone, and can do so once per month at no
cost. Creating a philosopher’s stone takes 1 day of work.
Say what now? Am I going to be turning base metals into gold? Cuz I somehow see this angering my dm even at level 20. Is this going to be a magic item in the APG?
That's not the only use of a philosopher's stone. Think Full Metal Alchemist, not base metal transmutation. A philosophers stone was also supposed to impart immortality, bring back the dead, heal unhealable injuries, restore youth, grant eternal youth, and a dozen other things.
Considering the level, and the price (which is specifically stated as free, which to me intimates it's expensive normally), I'm betting it's a true ressurection item with some possible other uses.
Philosopher's Stone
Aura strong transmutation; CL 20th
Slot none; Weight 3 lbs.
Description
This rare substance appears to be an ordinary, sooty piece of blackish rock. If the stone is broken open (break DC 20), a cavity is revealed at the stone's heart. This cavity is lined with a magical type of quicksilver that enables any character with at least 10 ranks in Craft (alchemy) to transmute base metals (iron and lead) into silver and gold. A single philosopher's stone can turn up to 5,000 pounds of iron into silver (worth 25,000 gp), or up to 1,000 pounds of lead into gold (worth 50,000 gp). However, the quicksilver becomes unstable once the stone is opened and loses its potency within 24 hours, so all transmutations must take place within that period.
The quicksilver found in the center of the stone may also be put to another use. If mixed with any cure potion while the substance is still potent, it creates a special oil of life that acts as a true resurrection spell for any dead body it is sprinkled upon.
Destruction
The philosopher's stone can be destroyed by being placed in the heel of a titan's boot for at least 1 entire week.
It is a minor artifact in the core rulebook, page 545.
And yes.. it is really good.
Jason Bulmahn
Lead Designer
Paizo Publishing
LOL,
Completely missed that. :)
Being able to make a lot of money a month is great, assuming you can consistently find 1k lb of lead or 5k lb of iron. That's a lot of metal to try to scrounge up once, let alone several times; all in all the effort required to collect that much base metal balances out the payout decently. Besides, at level 20, even 50k is starting to look like chump change.
it's cool and all, but I see more taking Eternal Youth then I ever would taking the stone
wow I totally missed the philosophers stone in the core rules. I am going to have to make use of that.
50k once is chump change.
50k/month (minus the cost of the lead) is an entirely different issue.
-S
That is true, Selgard, but unless you own a very large lead mine, getting 1k lbs of lead is going to be a very difficult task, especially if you try to do it in the same area multiple times. NPC's aren't stupid, and they can easily jack the price up if there is that much demand for it, and probably jack it up even higher if its all going to the same buyer.
A pound of iron costs 1sp. That's quite a big profit margin if you can lay your hands on enough iron. After your first haul you can definitely afford the labour to start a mine for more iron ore ... or you can simply sell off the philosopher's stones.
I can see this being abused into an economy-breaking enterprise. A chaotic character can sell off his gold for less-than an even exchange and tank a country's currency single-handed.
I can see this being abused into an economy-breaking enterprise. A chaotic character can sell off his gold for less-than an even exchange and tank a country's currency single-handed.
That sounds like an interesting start to an adventure to me!
I can see this being abused into an economy-breaking enterprise. A chaotic character can sell off his gold for less-than an even exchange and tank a country's currency single-handed.That sounds like an interesting start to an adventure to me!
Oh, yeah, I thought the same thing!! :)
Notice, I didn't say GAME-breaking!!
Two words: Iron Golem.
They're made of 5000lbs. of iron. Suddenly, SILVER GOLEM! Just go out killing iron golems and turning what's left into silver. With high enough knowledge checks, you'll be able to find every iron golem in the world to find and destroy...
Dont forget there is also the creation spells. Just conjure up some lead or iron.
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A 20th level caster can create a wall of iron worth over 2000 gp:
100 feet square x 5 inches = 41.6666667 cubic feet = 1.17986861 m³
The density of iron is 7.874 g/cm³, so that'll be 9290.28542 kilograms of iron or 20481.5734 pounds. According to the Pathfinder RPG Core Rulebook, 1 pound of iron is worth 1 sp. So, each casting of the spell creates over 2000 gp worth of iron for the price of 50 gp. Even selling the iron for half it's worth would provide the character with nearly 974 gp per wall. A sorcerer without any bonus spells using all his high level slots to cast wall of iron could earn 23376 gp per day or 701280 gp per month.
Compared to that, the philosopher's stone seems rather harmless.
I might recommend looking at Wall of Iron again, it specifies that the iron is unsuitable for...anything else, really.
Contributor, RPG Superstar 2010 Top 8
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Two Words people.
marvelous pigments
Its a 4,000 gp wondrous item, which makes up to 1,000 cubic feet of "actual, permanent objects" and one of the materials it specifically produces is? You guessed it, Lead.
Google tells me Lead weighs 708 lbs per cubic foot, so one little jar of paints should give you plenty of lead to work with for the next, oh, I don't know, 59 Years. That 600,000 gp a year, for a total of 35,400,000 gp, or 35,396,000 gp of profit.
All and all that's not bad. And I think if the Alchemist wants to give up Eternal Life or one of the other fun mechanical benefits, he deserves his filthy lucre.
I can't say I'm really unhappy about that. Another change between 3.5 and Pathfinder RPG.
Me neither, as I'm the primary GM for our group. But then, I'm the type of person who would have some syndicate find out about this guy making all the gold and do their best to kidnap them...
Hmm... philosopher's stone or eternal youth... hard choice.
Were you inspired at all by the legend of this fellow... Count_of_St._Germain?
Count of St. Germain was an astounding charlatan. It's hard NOT to think of him when conceiving alchemy.
50k/month is tottaly overpower. Like someone said, this must be changed. How? Really don't know.
50k/month is tottaly overpower.
I guess it depends on how many level 20 Alchemists, let alone level 20 characters in general there are in a campaign world. In most campaigns, a level 20 character could make 50k gold in a month without blinking.
"Hmmm... which kingdom shall I overthrow TODAY?"
The good guys should be able to make money, too.
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One thing I can see creating a problem for a player making large amounts of gold with this is what they are going to do with the large chunks of un-worked gold or silver. It's not a liquid asset like coins so its real value will depend on how good they are at selling things. I am sure some GMs would have them just get the coin amounts, but I make my players work for it ;) That big chunk'o'gold will look like a nice prize for a local dragon!
One thing I can see creating a problem for a player making large amounts of gold with this is what they are going to do with the large chunks of un-worked gold or silver. It's not a liquid asset like coins so its real value will depend on how good they are at selling things. I am sure some GMs would have them just get the coin amounts, but I make my players work for it ;) That big chunk'o'gold will look like a nice prize for a local dragon!
If your players aren't buying lead/iron in bar form, they're probably all ready making things harder on themselves than necessary. A 5,000 pound chunk of iron is, in addition to being hard to work with, probably a bit tougher to find than bars or any other form of it. Note that it doesn't say that the iron and lead have to be in one giant piece...
Two Words people.
marvelous pigments
*cough*Nolzur*cough*
One thing I can see creating a problem for a player making large amounts of gold with this is what they are going to do with the large chunks of un-worked gold or silver. It's not a liquid asset like coins so its real value will depend on how good they are at selling things. I am sure some GMs would have them just get the coin amounts, but I make my players work for it ;) That big chunk'o'gold will look like a nice prize for a local dragon!If your players aren't buying lead/iron in bar form, they're probably all ready making things harder on themselves than necessary. A 5,000 pound chunk of iron is, in addition to being hard to work with, probably a bit tougher to find than bars or any other form of it. Note that it doesn't say that the iron and lead have to be in one giant piece...I'd like to point out that you are generally talking about adding a liquid to solids.
It doesn't work really well. You have to LIQUIFY the lead or iron to transform it, to mix the liquid quicksilver to the liquid metal to transform all that metal - otherwise you'll just transform the surface of the iron and waste your precious quicksilver. Liquifying 1000 pounds of lead is not exactly childsplay....
Well, i've always assumed it was a "pour it on it, do a little ritual and it becomes gold" sort of thing, not a "melt down and mix" thing. The actual text of it doesn't specify otherwise, so i would assume it's likely up to interpretation.
As far as world flavor is concerned, I could see certain regions/states/nations of Golarion cracking down on any Alchemist who is basically creating massive inflation. Especially in a way that mirrors modern counterfeiting.
So, basically, while a chaotic character might seek to take advantage of a philosopher's stone, they'd eventually run into economic and political oppression.
Maybe a detect magic spell (or something similar) could discover residues of the transformation, and merchants wouldn't accept the gold since it'd be "dirty money."
There are a lot of ways for a GM to make this difficult for a PC if they're really abusing it too much.
That's the best part of the marvelous pigments! You can paint the lead into being pre-formed into coinage, presto chango, and now you've got liquid assets.
Or trade bars... which works just as good as coin only in larger "chunks".
Honestly it's a moot point anyway.
Let's say you get 3-4 alchemists together who are turning iron and lead into silver and gold. They do this enough to flood the market with gold and silver.
The result?
Gold and silver are worth less, perhaps as much as copper.
Iron and Lead become scarcer, they are worth more gold than you can get for turning them into gold.
Result?
Economic instability, nations collapse, newly built up nations stop using gold and silver, and instead use copper, iron, and lead for coinage instead. Or they use some other thing like jewels or other rare metals.
Honestly it's a moot point anyway.
Let's say you get 3-4 alchemists together who are turning iron and lead into silver and gold. They do this enough to flood the market with gold and silver.
The result?
Gold and silver are worth less, perhaps as much as copper.
Iron and Lead become scarcer, they are worth more gold than you can get for turning them into gold.
Result?
Economic instability, nations collapse, newly built up nations stop using gold and silver, and instead use copper, iron, and lead for coinage instead. Or they use some other thing like jewels or other rare metals.
AKA, the Dragonlance campaign world.
AKA, the Dragonlance campaign world.
So that's how that got started! It's all the Alchemist's fault!