now i know weve been looking at the base of the classes themselves for issues and areas were problems arise, however i dont feel that all of these problems are really problems or not as big as we think they are. going thru the core book i notice as a witch there a very few feats i like and the same for the summoner. now these classes are not of the ordinary and have a very special individuality to them, and should in turn have special feats that conform to these, which if they are in the works we wouldnt know about untill they either let us playtest em or they bring out the full book.
one idea i had for example is the witches hex spells, range of touch, Feat to resolve the problems, Enhanced hex, this feat gives the witch the ability to perform a ranged touch attack for hex spells on the target up to a range of 30 feet.
any one else have any other ideas
At 10th level, you could consider getting Quicken Spell Like Ability (pg 315, Pathfinder Bestiary) for the Summoner to use with his Summon Monster SLA.
Spell Focus (Conjuration), Augment Summoning, Improved Unarmed Strike, Deflect Arrows (for the Summoner with tentacles kind of like Elfen Lied), and several others depending on how you want to take your character.
Same with the witch.
Wait, I'm sorry, you don't see feat options for a summoner or witch in the core rulebook? Allow me to enlighten you.
Witch - The witch is nearly identical to the wizard in which feats she'll want to select. In fact, mechanically speaking, the two are quite similar. Beyond that, witches spend more time in melee than other casters, and I completely disagree with the idea of giving them a feat that allows them to cast hexes at range- it becomes a must-have, like natural spell, which quickly becomes a feat tax to play a class properly. Witches will almost certainly have to invest in Weapon Finesse to land their hexes with great efficiency, and weapon focus (touch attack) won't hurt either. Going the armored caster route isn't a terrible idea, since at the higher levels the witch's familiar will be casting spells as well and that will help her out with needing quicken spell. Defensive Combat Training will help you out majorly as you spend a lot of time on the front line, as would dodge/mobility.
Summoner - Spell Focus (Conjuration) & Augment Summoning are givens. Shield proficiency & Armored Caster are a good choice to further beef up your defenses. Arcane Strike & Rapid Reload gives the summoner something to do from the sidelines while his minions reign terror upon his foes. Being a charisma based character, the Weapon Focus/Dazzling Display/Shatter Defenses combination is actually a great option since he's really got two sets of actions. Toughness is never a waste, nor are some of the item creation feats like Craft Magic Arms & Armor (for your eidolon) or craft rod (for cheaper metamagic rods).
Just flex your thinking muscle a bit, and try to run with what we've already got.
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the witch is most definitely not BUILT to be a melee class. there's no need for a witch to enter the fracas of melee combat except to touch someone with most of their hexes.
they get no starting armor proficiency, while the summoner can cast spells in light armor. if the witch got the same allowance, maybe an armored build would be an option. but facing spell failure chances for the rest of the witch's spells... it seems like as poor a choice as an armored wizard.
requiring a touch attack on top of the saving throw for most of the hexes, is an annoying mechanic. by the same token, requiring a feat to use hexes at range is a waste. the real solution would seem to be give Hexes a range of Close, and give ranged hexes like the Evil Eye a range of Medium.
they get no starting armor proficiency, while the summoner can cast spells in light armor. if the witch got the same allowance, maybe an armored build would be an option. but facing spell failure chances for the rest of the witch's spells... it seems like as poor a choice as an armored wizard.
No, dude, I don't mean that you should just equip armor as a witch- that's a very poor choice. What I mean is that you should take the Arcane Armor Training feat, which requires the proficiency feat. Taking the normal route, leather armor has 10% spell failure, which is negated by the feat (and your swift action). A mithril chain shirt has 10% as well, which is your best option. Grabbing a mithril light shield is a great boon for any witch, since there's no armor check penalty and thus doesn't require proficiency to use effectively.
On the same note, Witches with owl familiars can cast magic vestment on their armor/shield for added protection.
they get no starting armor proficiency, while the summoner can cast spells in light armor. if the witch got the same allowance, maybe an armored build would be an option. but facing spell failure chances for the rest of the witch's spells... it seems like as poor a choice as an armored wizard.No, dude, I don't mean that you should just equip armor as a witch- that's a very poor choice. What I mean is that you should take the Arcane Armor Training feat, which requires the proficiency feat. Taking the normal route, leather armor has 10% spell failure, which is negated by the feat (and your swift action). A mithril chain shirt has 10% as well, which is your best option. Grabbing a mithril light shield is a great boon for any witch, since there's no armor check penalty and thus doesn't require proficiency to use effectively.
On the same note, Witches with owl familiars can cast magic vestment on their armor/shield for added protection.
if you progress to the second arcane armor training feat, elven chain begins to look quite nice. also (albeit for more gold) celestial armor is an awesome armor for witches.
if you progress to the second arcane armor training feat, elven chain begins to look quite nice. also (albeit for more gold) celestial armor is an awesome armor for witches.they get no starting armor proficiency, while the summoner can cast spells in light armor. if the witch got the same allowance, maybe an armored build would be an option. but facing spell failure chances for the rest of the witch's spells... it seems like as poor a choice as an armored wizard.No, dude, I don't mean that you should just equip armor as a witch- that's a very poor choice. What I mean is that you should take the Arcane Armor Training feat, which requires the proficiency feat. Taking the normal route, leather armor has 10% spell failure, which is negated by the feat (and your swift action). A mithril chain shirt has 10% as well, which is your best option. Grabbing a mithril light shield is a great boon for any witch, since there's no armor check penalty and thus doesn't require proficiency to use effectively.
On the same note, Witches with owl familiars can cast magic vestment on their armor/shield for added protection.
True, but I would probably dip fighter instead of spending 4 feats on it all.
Interesting, I find it hard to pick which feats i want for my summoner for an upcomming game. I cant decide if i want to focus on my casting, with a few metamagics particularly extend. Of give a shot to making him a melee character with things like weapon focus, exotic weapon prof(or martial depending on weapon choice), dodge, arcane strike, etc. Not to mention craft magical arms and equipment or craft wonderous items are on the list for either idea, and is toughness.