I'd love to see a DM's Kit that includes:
(1) DM screen
(1) set of Pathfinder-ized dice
(1) photocopyable "encounter" sheet
(1) photocopyable "dungeon" sheet
(1) photocopyable "npc" sheet
(1) pack of "condition cards"
(1) pack of "common spell effects cards"
(1) pack of colored and numbered 1" plastic tokens
(1) pack of initiative cards
<other DM helper tools>
I'd easily pay $30 for a DM Kit if it was made well.
I'd love to see a Player's Kit that includes:
(1) set of Pathfinder-ized dice
(1) photocopyable character sheet of each class type
(1) <Class> sheet for each class
(1) Condition sheet
[spoiler]a one-page quick summary of all game conditions so you know what it means when the DM tells you you are blinded
(1) pack of spell effect marker tokens
<other player helper items>
I'd guess player's would pay $10-15 for a player Kit if it was made well.
Just my thoughts :)
While I'm all for new spells and magic items, I'd rather spend a couple of years actually generating material to compile before immediately launching into compilations. We could likely compile a lot of OGL material and update some 3.5 items we've done so far, but my gut tells me this one can wait a bit. I would like to see more magic items and stuff in the Pathfinder Companion in the meantime.
I hardly need to tell you this, but this is the key to the greatness of Pathfinder AFAIC. What I love most about the AP is that it isn't a huge dump of spells/feats/items/monsters/etc all at the same time, but a mix of all of these things in a single book. This is vastly preferable for simple readability, game balance, and cost.
Please don't fall into the trap of "The Big Book of X" which is always a book that is truly useful only if your whole campaign centers on X. Splatbooks have a way of making only one or two players happy.
In other words, I prefer breadth over depth, which has made my Pathfinder subscription a sublime and economical experience.
EDIT: In fact... a good test for whether or not x deserves an entire book: "Would you base an entire campaign on x?" Epic book? Sadly yes. Psionics? Maybe. Spells? No. Therefore a spell reference book should wait and be a compiled reference which is a great kind of product to invest in after 5 or 6 years of a system.
I agreed with toyrobot that the combined package that paizo has done for it's campaign settings is rather nice.
One thing I would like to see more of though would be thoughts on how to incorporate the fluff into crunch. Maybe not as long, drawn out, and complicated as the 'organization' rules presented in the PHB 2, but something along the lines of "ideas of what to do to join group 'x', or get title 'y'" and what could be expected as perks (and problems) with getting that title or joining that group would be nice, and offers more for both players and DM's than a simple single PrC for an organization that only works for a few types of character builds.
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Each Adventure Path advances characters from 1st level all the way through 15th level and beyond. How is this style of storytelling compatible with supplements that treat different level bands as entirely different types of campaigns?
Adventure Paths blow you through those 15 levels in a matter of months, both in-game and actual playtime. Many old school campaigns, thanks to the old school leveling rules, could see you sitting comfortably in the 10-15 band for YEARS. Neither way is right or wrong, but the Slow, Medium, Fast advancement rules in the Beta do illustrate that there are preferences.
I think it would be nice to see Paizo release some products that acknowledge that slow play-style. It would also be nice to see some acknowledgement of why your PCs are hitting level 15 six months after starting their careers as adventurers, you have these NPCs that retired at 4th level. That's ONE adventure in an AP. It's not really retirement when you spent three weeks as an adventurer.
I'd be thrilled to see "Level Band" books.
<Snip>
Hey, help me sell a copy of the Core Rulebook to as many people as you can, and I'll do my best to increase the...Funny you should say that. Two of my friends, that are going to Gen Con, are planing on doing just that.
I hardly need to tell you this, but this is the key to the greatness of Pathfinder AFAIC. What I love most about the AP is that it isn't a huge dump of spells/feats/items/monsters/etc all at the same time, but a mix of all of these things in a single book. This is vastly preferable for simple readability, game balance, and cost.
Please don't fall into the trap of "The Big Book of X" which is always a book that is truly useful only if your whole campaign centers on X. Splatbooks have a way of making only one or two players happy.
In other words, I prefer breadth over depth, which has made my Pathfinder subscription a sublime and economical experience.
Unfortunately there is a drawback to that as well. There are many people who would look at a book a that encompasses "a bit of X, a bit of Y and a bit of Z" and say well that 3-4 pages on Y was neat but I don't want or need the 30+ pages of X or Z. Those people end up not buying the book and that is bad (from a marketing point). The reason it works so well (at least IMO) with the AP line is that you are buying an adventure (which is in effect "useful" for everyone involved) which ends up being 70-80% (ballpark) of the book. The extra PrC is potentially useful for everyone as well, the monsters are something the DM can always refer back to and keep useful even outside the AP, information on the gods is nice but not useful for everyone in reality (even less so if you are in a home brew campaign). Regardless, the DM is going to buy the book for the adventure, players aren't buying it for the extras normally.
Port that over to a supplement, what are you going to be replacing that 70-80% of the book with that is actually useful to everyone? In my experience most gamers don't buy all the books even if they happen to have the budget to do so. Again in my experience, more often the individuals of the group have preferences and then collect the books that have the majority of subject matter pertaining to that preference. Where they cross over is where the book is bought by multiple group members. A spell compendium is useful for the arcane casters as well as the divine casters, the campaign book pertaining to water adventures is bought by the player who likes pirates and the DM, the undead book is good for the DM and the player who likes necromancers or who wants to become a lich or vampire, things of that sort. That is definitely how it is in our group and I have seen it in friends group's as well. I mean if you have a supplement with a couple of pages for every class, a couple of pages for the players, a couple of pages for the DM's, a couple of pages for monsters, a couple of pages for spells, etc. It may well be a great resource and quality material BUT I could see many people just looking it through or waiting for someone else in the group to buy it, there may not be enough for them to justify buying it regardless of quality. It is kind of funny in that respect, having too much has the possibility of hurting sales.
In our group no one else is going to buy AP's because they know I am going to get them. We all agree they are great (after running the RotRL I let them read the AP's) but the subject matter is limited to pretty much the DM, the extras (PrC for example) can be printed out twice for the gaming table - they aren't going to buy the book for it though. Paizo is getting sales from 1 of 6+/- people out of our group. A sale is good, but not as good as 2 or more which is where the Handbook/Complete Book of race/class/X comes in. Traditionally they sell, there is no denying that, just like monster books. I guess I'm curious if the handbook/complete type books are the "boilerplate" or are the supplemental type from Paizo's POV. I mean they have already done an Elves book as a small soft cover so I'm unsure if they would consider it as a hard cover.
Personally I know my buying habits as well as those of my friends and I can only guess from observations that they are "typical." If they are, I wouldn't want Paizo to shoot themselves in the foot. Though given the projected book release Erik mentioned if they did try something experimental and it didn't go well they'd have probably half a year to figure out something else for that slot if not already having a plan "b" to fall back on at the time.
Unfortunately there is a drawback to that as well. ...I hardly need to tell you this, but this is the key to the greatness of Pathfinder AFAIC. What I love most about the AP is that it isn't a huge dump of spells/feats/items/monsters/etc all at the same time, but a mix of all of these things in a single book. This is vastly preferable for simple readability, game balance, and cost.
Please don't fall into the trap of "The Big Book of X" which is always a book that is truly useful only if your whole campaign centers on X. Splatbooks have a way of making only one or two players happy.
In other words, I prefer breadth over depth, which has made my Pathfinder subscription a sublime and economical experience.
I agree with Skylancer here.
You put out a book that everyone can use, and several people at the gaming table might buy one. Multiple sales per gaming group.
You put out an A.P. type book with lots of stuff for the GM and only a little stuff for all, and probably only one person at the gaming table will buy it. One sale per gaming group.
One of those scenarios is more finacially appealing than the other.
Maybe to some, "The Big Book of X" is a trap, but to publishers, it's a gold mine.
As for me, as a consumer, I have no problem at all with "The Big Book of X". I buy most of them. I ignore the ones I'll never use, but those are few and far between (and usually campaign-specific, such as the fact that I have over 60 3.x books on my shelf but not one Eberron book - I'm not interested in that campaign world).
I agree with Skylancer here.You put out a book that everyone can use, and several people at the gaming table might buy one. Multiple sales per gaming group.
You put out an A.P. type book with lots of stuff for the GM and only a little stuff for all, and probably only one person at the gaming table will buy it. One sale per gaming group.
One of those scenarios is more finacially appealing than the other.
Maybe to some, "The Big Book of X" is a trap, but to publishers, it's a gold mine.
As for me, as a consumer, I have no problem at all with "The Big Book of X". I buy most of them. I ignore the ones I'll never use, but those are few and far between (and usually campaign-specific, such as the fact that I have over 60 3.x books on my shelf but not one Eberron book - I'm not interested in that campaign world).
I guess I need to clarify —
There's a happy medium. But what are the non-martial types to do but twiddle their thumbs when the Martial-Types book is out and nothing else is?
I think what Mr. Mona said is what I wanted to hear anyway... don't generate new content without new context. It's what I love most about the Pathfinder line so far. It would be a shame to see that change.
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I guess I need to clarify —There's a happy medium. But what are the non-martial types to do but twiddle their thumbs when the Martial-Types book is out and nothing else is?
I think what Mr. Mona said is what I wanted to hear anyway... don't generate new content without new context. It's what I love most about the Pathfinder line so far. It would be a shame to see that change.
Are there players out there (I'm sure there are but is it a significant #) who will only ever play martial characters, therefor a book for divine types is something they'll never buy, just because your current campaign doesn't use one does that mean you won't want it for your next character, heck I bought some green ronin books for whole classes, they're non core and 3rd party, I might never be able to use them, but I got them because they were interesting and I might be able to put them to use one day.
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On another sort of deviation,I think with interest being what it is ,if a sort of compilation of the fluff from the APs i.e. the pathfinder arts. and a separate one for world info would be interesting to groups. the info. from RoTRL on Korvosa et al. was great but if I didn't have RoTRL when I ran CoTCT, I would have been less prepared.
In conclusion, if either as PDF or booklet form (if not full book) these articles would still sell. IMOSH
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[The current plan is to release three hardcover rulebooks on various subjects every year. The first year is going to be pretty boilerplate. The Core Rulebook, the Bestiary, and another book later in the year we haven't revealed yet.Erik, any chance of letting us know when we can expect this announcement? Soon? Origins? GenCon?
Paizocon?
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When I first saw this, I though meh.. But now that I am thinking about it, I think this would be a great idea if geared toward GMs. If it includes advice on using certain adventures in certain levels, etc. EX, a first level dungeon should Be way diff than a lvl 6 dungeon, which should be diff from a lvl 13 dungeon. The resources of the players change. Also the same with NPC attitudes and how they treat the character. Common NPC will treat lvl 13's diff as they have a rep and carry magic item, and in general give off that "bada$$" persona. Then there is room for advice on choosing treasure, maybe a list of thing the PCs should each have, so if one doesn't, you could put it in a treasure horde. How to handle animal companion, or followers, etc. The higher books can talk about players responsibility in the community, stronghold, maybe even how to play a king, lord, etc and what kinds of adventures work, or how to tailor stuff to them. I think there is really a lot of potential, if it is geared toward a GM. I think players would better be served by splat type book with option, and cool changes, and role playing tips, etc.
I've been mulling this as well, and it seems to be a natural fit to the Adventure Path style of writing - having a book targeted at writing and running games at those level breakdowns.
I hope that someone does pick the idea up and run with it.
I've been mulling this as well, and it seems to be a natural fit to the Adventure Path style of writing - having a book targeted at writing and running games at those level breakdowns.
Well said! What I want to see is a "generic" guide to running games at levels corresponding to each pathfinder issue in an AP!
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I like the concept of "level banded" sourcebooks, and don't wish to detract from that discussion; however ...
Pathfinder RPG is going to be a daunting 500+ pages, maybe priced out of reach of the casually interested new-comer to RPGs, considering they still require the Bestiary, and the price is also out of reach as a Christmas gift, particularly if you have more than one niece/nephew to buy for.
Yes, many of us were drawn into the game by someone who already knew the rules GMed for us, but some of us didn't have that luxury and had to teach ourselves.
Nothing inspires the imagination of a new player like a book of races, classes, weapons, spells, monsters and treasure covering levels 1 through 3, all in one book - enough rules to play through the first chapter of any Adventure Path, or play a few Pathfinder Society scenarios. Some players don't make it past 3rd level, so why buy a book of stuff they'll never use? Others will undoubtedly purchase more to expand their game after enjoying the first few levels.
Pathfinder needs an affordable entry point to the game to draw in new players.
I would love to see a basic set maybe 10 level maybe 5 with a small adventure and a few pages of magic and monsters. Maybe 60-100 pages or less. make a great gift
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Pathfinder needs an affordable entry point to the game to draw in new players.
That's a good argument for a 32-page PDF with very condensed cut-down rules, a howto-DM section, and an adventure with about 10 reduced monster stat-blocks.
It could be in Paizos interest to put something like this out as a free download at a suitable lead time from Christmas. Explicitly encourage FLGS owners to print and hand them out, etc.
You could even structure it like one of Ian Livingstone's Sorcery books and introduce the rules needed for a scene only when the players get to it - have a bit of flavour text for the newbie DM to read out and then a list of things the players might want to do and how to cope with it.
I wonder what Paizos response to a community produced book along these lines would be if they don't have the time/manpower to do it themselves - it would have to be approved before being distributed as it would otherwise infringe their IP.
Check out the chat logs here wherein James Jacobs discusses what he'd like to see - a $19.99 softcover that covers a low range of levels to introduce new players to PfRPG.
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Check out the chat logs here wherein James Jacobs discusses what he'd like to see - a $19.99 softcover that covers a low range of levels to introduce new players to PfRPG.
I'd buy it.
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Check out the chat logs here wherein James Jacobs discusses what he'd like to see - a $19.99 softcover that covers a low range of levels to introduce new players to PfRPG.I'd buy it.
I wouldn't, but I probably would have done if I'd seen it in the same place on the shelf as the red box when I was 12. Maybe... the fact that it was a box with 'stuff' in was a draw too.
James seems to have some very solid plans for that book.
I still think that there is an opportunity for a super-lite 'this is roleplaying' style of book, preferably free, that is accessible for age 8 and up.
Check out the chat logs here wherein James Jacobs discusses what he'd like to see - a $19.99 softcover that covers a low range of levels to introduce new players to PfRPG.
Thank you Lilith! Those logs are always a good read, and I don't get t read all of them!
What time and on whose clock do they actually take place?
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Check out the chat logs here wherein James Jacobs discusses what he'd like to see - a $19.99 softcover that covers a low range of levels to introduce new players to PfRPG.Thank you Lilith! Those logs are always a good read, and I don't get t read all of them!
What time and on whose clock do they actually take place?
Tuesday 20:00 PST, I believe.
Tuesday 20:00 PST, I believe.Check out the chat logs here wherein James Jacobs discusses what he'd like to see - a $19.99 softcover that covers a low range of levels to introduce new players to PfRPG.Thank you Lilith! Those logs are always a good read, and I don't get t read all of them!
What time and on whose clock do they actually take place?
Gah! 4am!