We are starting RORL after our current game is done. My players dont want to try Pathfinder till its all complete. I have a very extensive 3.5 library but its to much to keep up with.
So i have heard people talk about a book game where the PCs pick what books can be used, im trying to figure out a number of books besides the Core books and the Pathfinder campaign setting so what do you guys think?
At 2 per player there would not be any disscussion just each player would grab two books but at like 1.5 or 2.5 per player things could get interesting
We are starting RORL after our current game is done. My players dont want to try Pathfinder till its all complete. I have a very extensive 3.5 library but its to much to keep up with.
So i have heard people talk about a book game where the PCs pick what books can be used, im trying to figure out a number of books besides the Core books and the Pathfinder campaign setting so what do you guys think?
At 2 per player there would not be any disscussion just each player would grab two books but at like 1.5 or 2.5 per player things could get interesting
If I understand what you mean, I allow the following stuff in my Pathfinder game besides the core + Pathfinder RPG stuff.
1 main resource from which any content can be used (for example: Complete Divine)
1 additional resource from which the player can only use spells/feats (Spell Compendium?)
This is restricted by player as well, so each player has to decide what those books are that he wants to bring into the game, but other players don't get the benefit of those books unless they too choose them as their resources.
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We are starting RORL after our current game is done. My players dont want to try Pathfinder till its all complete. I have a very extensive 3.5 library but its to much to keep up with.
So i have heard people talk about a book game where the PCs pick what books can be used, im trying to figure out a number of books besides the Core books and the Pathfinder campaign setting so what do you guys think?
At 2 per player there would not be any disscussion just each player would grab two books but at like 1.5 or 2.5 per player things could get interesting
My recommendation for this would be to stick to 2.5 and let players share books. So if player A chooses complete divine and the draconomicon (for instance), then player B / C / D can also use either of those books. That way people don't feel too limited but also can create a group dynamic before there is a group.
Yeah they will be able to share the books
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There are two ways to handle this kind of game - by group or by player.
"By group" means that the group as a whole determines what resources are available, and those resources are available to the group as a whole. For something like this, I'd suggest 1 book per player - realizing that some books, like the Spell Compendium and Magic Item Compendium, will benefit the group as a whole, and so some players, particularly ones playing core classes, will be pressured (or volunteer!) to choose those books as "their" picks.
"By player" means each player chooses the books they can use separately; there is no crossover between players unless they both individually choose the same books. Some GMs go further than this, even, and put restrictions on, like, "One Complete book only," etc. Most games I've seen or head about run this way allow each player two books.
The advantage of the "by group" option is that the mechanical "universe" is fixed at Core + Pathfinder + exactly 4 or 5 books (depending on player count). No more, no less. This takes some of the pressure off of the GM, inasmuch as the options s/he has to learn are fixed at that amount. On the other hand, it does generally mean there is a larger potential for craziness happening as elements from different books combine.
The upside to the "by player" option is that crazy combinations are pretty hard to achieve, since there's just not as much to work with. The downsides, however, are twofold - first, non-core (and even some core classes like fighter) rely heavily on non-core sourcebooks to achieve their full potential, or even to exist at all. Second, the mechanical "universe" is potentially twice as wide as the other system, since every play might choose a different pair of books, which can lead to more headaches for the GM.
Another simple solution to weed out most of the obnoxious powergamer builds is to limit PC's to only two classes. e.g. 2 base classes, or a base clase and a PrC. Most of the broken builds take lots of levels of lots of different classes to cherry pick powers and abilities that work stupidly well together.
Also you might ban some of the more broken books (spell compendium, and the good and evil books whose name escapes me, etc)
Another simple solution to weed out most of the obnoxious powergamer builds is to limit PC's to only two classes. e.g. 2 base classes, or a base clase and a PrC. Most of the broken builds take lots of levels of lots of different classes to cherry pick powers and abilities that work stupidly well together.
Also you might ban some of the more broken books (spell compendium, and the good and evil books whose name escapes me, etc)
Characters with multiple classes dont bother me its just there is so much to keep track of, my library has over a couple hundred books so loop holes can be found easily
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For my game I stayed with the tried and true method of K.I.S.S. (Keep It Simple Stupid). I just used PHB, DMG and MM along with the RotRL PG and what was in the AP.
It irked one player as they relied to heavily on the Spell Compendium, but my logic was I didn't want to redo spell tables for NPCs because the player got the orb spells or other really unbalanced spells.
In the end I would really review what your players want and then be willing to sit down and edit entries in the AP so as to keep the playing field balanced.
Also don't be afraid to say no.
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Another simple solution to weed out most of the obnoxious powergamer builds is to limit PC's to only two classes. e.g. 2 base classes, or a base clase and a PrC. Most of the broken builds take lots of levels of lots of different classes to cherry pick powers and abilities that work stupidly well together.
Also you might ban some of the more broken books (spell compendium, and the good and evil books whose name escapes me, etc)
Book of Exhalted Deeds (BoED) and Book of Vile Darkness (BoVD), though I see them as more broken yet easily balanced than the Spell Compendium.
Well after talking to some of the players i think we are setting it at 2.5 books per player so in our 6 PC group there will be 15 books three have already been selected by two player sharing there half for the third book (PHB 2)
IMO, your best bet is to either allow specific material (either by supplement or using a predetermined list) or follow a "DM review/approval" process for anything outside the core. For Pathfinder APs (at least until they switch to the Pathfinder RPG), you may want to stick with just the PHB, parts of Unearthed Arcana (bloodlines, class variants, traits, etc.), the Player's Guide, and the Pathfinder Chronicles Gazetteer.
If your library is a few hundred books, then you have a lot of non-Wizards / non-Paizo stuff in there. I would really suggest that at a minimum you limit the books by manufacturere.
For me the rule has been any Wizards book is fine with the exception of Book of Exalted Deeds which would have anything from it accepted on a case by case basis (note that this does include the entirety of the Dungeon and Dragon magazines run, but no one other than me has seemed to realize this). Other than that anything people wanted to add would have to be approved (and not the whole book).
What I found most interesting is that other than the Complete books and the Compendiums, other books get no use at all in my game from players.
Sean Mahoney
So far it is adding an intersting mechanic as the players are building characters figuring out what books to use
I've seen someone else on here post their plan to allow their players to pick spells from other books, but for every spell the player picks from, say, the Spell Compendium, they have to drop a spell of the same level from the PHB. Also, these decisions have to be made before the campaign starts. It helps keep spell use ridiculousness down a little. This is what I plan to do when I finish RotRL and start Crimson Throne in a few months.
One problem we have come across is the creation of spells and magic items how should i handle original spells and magic items?