I agree. Let's focus on finishing a single adventure... I'd say about 1st to 3rd level. After that, we'll see how things are going. Sound fine to everyone?
Works for me.
Hi all. One system I will be using is a centralized place we can see the list of PCs, a link to the current battle grid, and also a initiative chart (which I will update constantly). It will be on the profile of this alias (which I will use in the actual game thread as my posting alias).
EDIT: Oh, and I've been playing around with Google Docs for the spreadsheets. It should work out pretty well aside from the fact that I can't seem to find a way to get the cells to all be squares without manually resizing them... It might also require all of you to have a (free) account with google...
I think the profile links are a great idea. It will be nice to see the initiative order and battle grid at any time without having to scroll through the thread.
I encountered the same problem with resizing columns in Google Docs. I assumed that there was a way to do it properly, but never bothered to look into it. Maybe Pat knows?
Anyway, as much as I think Google is a useful tool, a link in your profile to the battle map is probably more convenient for everyone. Especially those who don't already use gmail. Once you're using a link, I don't really see any reason to use Google Docs instead of something more accommodating like Excel. The only advantage of Docs I guess is that you could edit it quickly and easily from any computer with an internet connection...
These sound like good ideas. It's key in 4E to optimise the team rather than each PC, so something like this will help us work together, especially those of us who have teleportation and slide abilities.
Sorry to nab Eladrin from you, btw! :D
I encountered the same problem with resizing columns in Google Docs. I assumed that there was a way to do it properly, but never bothered to look into it. Maybe Pat knows?
Anyway, as much as I think Google is a useful tool, a link in your profile to the battle map is probably more convenient for everyone. Especially those who don't already use gmail. Once you're using a link, I don't really see any reason to use Google Docs instead of something more accommodating like Excel. The only advantage of Docs I guess is that you could edit it quickly and easily from any computer with an internet connection...
I just resize manually.
The big advantage for me as DM of Google Docs is that there's not a separate step to upload the edited version -- just tick the box to republish automatically, and all you have to do is edit the map and it's updated.
Also, if the map is published you do not need a Google account to view it; the only reason for that is if Evil wanted to give us edit access.
Do you have a link to an example map on Google Docs, by any chance? I'd love to see it in action...
EDIT: Never mind. I found them in your profile. Very interesting. It should work out pretty well.
Please tell me that you will not steal away the small pleasure I have of rolling physical d20s for my initiative, attack rolls, etc. I also vote for accessing all game info through the DM's profile link.
I won't force you to use online dice rolling methods if you don't want to. We'll be using the honor system, though. Besides, it will be obvious if someone cheats. I will ask that you post die roll results like this:
Also, please roll damage (if any) at the same time as rolling an attack roll. Note that natural 20s are auto hits; they're a crit if the result hits the target's defense. Crits are usually just the highest possible result of your normal damage for the attack, though some things can add extra dice of damage.
I won't force you to use online dice rolling methods if you don't want to. We'll be using the honor system, though. Besides, it will be obvious if someone cheats. I will ask that you post die roll results like this:
Feel free to check the other PbPs I'm in for evidence of my honesty... generally speaking, I'm a pretty crappy roller! But thanks for not forcing on-line dice rolling...
Feel free to check the other PbPs I'm in for evidence of my honesty... generally speaking, I'm a pretty crappy roller! But thanks for not forcing on-line dice rolling...I won't force you to use online dice rolling methods if you don't want to. We'll be using the honor system, though. Besides, it will be obvious if someone cheats. I will ask that you post die roll results like this:
I can vouch for TwiceBorn's dice-rolling honesty. I've been in two games with him, and looking forward to the third! I would say he's an average roller. The dice favor no man or woman (though maybe a halfling).
One suggestion though. With seven PCs, it might be best for the DM to roll initiatives and/or surprise. It might be better than holding up the game for 2-3 days at the start of every encounter.
The one roll for initiative (modified by each individual PC's bonuses) works well for PbP. Either the DM rolls or the first player to post rolls.
... or each player could make 10 advance initiative rolls, which the DM can make use of as needed. This would give the player some "control" over their rolls, but the game would not be held up come combat. Just a suggestion...
Whichever init way we use, either the DM rolling, or each of us rolling 10 or so in advance is ok with me.
The problem with a communal initiative roll imo is that we always act in the same order, and that might make all combats sort of start out the same way. It's also less realistic since PCs would naturally fluctuate in levels of vigilance and reaction speed throughout the day. These are small sacrifices, but are we really saving that much effort by getting the DM to roll once per combat instead of seven times?
Pre-rolling 10 times is fine with me, as long as we don't metagame by knowing when we have an especially good or bad init roll coming up for the next encounter. eg. "Let's send Spike out in front first cause he has a Nat 20 on his next Init roll." Though I doubt anyone would do that.
But this isn't a big deal so I'm fine with any of those methods, including the communal initiative.
I'm partial to the prerolling initiative idea. Keep some randomness without adding delays.
I'm not feeling inspred on Vel's background. Evil, could you give us a hint about the adventure hook? That might give me some ideas.
It does feel as though we are light on fighters so I may throw one together or a cleric.. depending on what you guys think would be more useful for us at this point of the party being so developed? should be able to knock it out tonight and tomorrow now that I am back in the comfort of my own home! not 100% on race but just for the heads up.
Since we may also end up without a rogue in the party, I might take the Sneak of Shadow multiclass feat, which could work with my character concept... we'll see... But yeah, the absence of a cleric seems like a fairly significant gap in the party.
Remember that Clerics are not like they were in 3.5. They're not the medic buffers, and are no longer a necessary component of a party.
We have healing surges, and a Warlord with inspiring word. I say Cleric Smleric.
"What need I some feeble lackey of a so-called diety?"
Tieren, I'd prefer you make a Cleric since I've already started on my Dragonborn Fighter. If that doesn't work for you please let me know soon, because I'll switch to one of the "open" classes.
I agree we can try to roll without a cleric. We have healing surges, the inspiring word as mentioned, and my lay on hands which lets me spend one to let you get healed as if you had. My feat also lets me give regeneration 2 to a bloodied person until they are no longer bloodied :) I can use the feat once per encounter.
If someone wants to play a cleric, by all means do so, but I don't think we have to have one if it's not calling to anyone. IMO, play what you'd find fun or what ya wanna fool around with.
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Given 4E's mandate of allowing more crossover between classes so that you can more easily play without a given class, and given that we have a large party, I also think everyone should play what inspires them most.
That said, I'll just mention that one of my encounter powers would probably work well in conjunction with a rogue in particular. I wouldn't mind trying out the combo. But it's no big deal.
As far as background, I'm partly holding off until I have a better idea what's going on, but I was thinking something like this: Drogan's father was a mercenary soldier that made a fortune in some battle, and wanted a better life for his son. He sent Drogan to an Academy/university or something. Drogan was smart and did well, but mostly focused on military history.
Many of the citizens of the city where the academy was were resentful of the students who they saw as soft and lazy (ever been to any university town?) and in particular, a gang of toughs liked to harass the students that went off the academy grounds. Drogan organized a bunch of the students and spent a week training them up to minimum combat competence, then took them into town and helped them kick the crap out of the local toughs. He was then expelled and left the city. He's now trying to make his own way rather than return to his family who are sure to be disappointed in him.
Does that connect to anyone else or to the background? Does it work for you?
Hi all. I'm gonna say initiative will be done by pre-rolling a set of 10, and then when it comes to the start of combat, I'll just look at said list.
4th Edition definitely doesn't require a cleric for a party to be viable. Warlords are a great source of buffs and healing as well. The party does need a leader-type character but a paladin might be able to substitute for one if necessary. With both a paladin and a warlord, you all should be pretty safe.
The hook of the adventure will involve at least one of you being asked by Hawk Hill's constable (Avas Lucarn) to help the town in investigating the recent bandit attacks along the Lobraanian Highway near town. Then, connections between the PCs will allow them to join together in this investigation. So, if one (or more) of you have some manner of connection with the constable (or his direct superior, Lady Mayor Taurana Heward) or the town's force of soldiers/guards (called the Hawkwings).
Rambling Scribe, your background looks good. Hawk Hill, and indeed the whole Duchy of Niebold, is a pretty backwater place, so it's a good spot for an outcast to end up. You might work for Duke Durdigan or the constable as a strategist of some sort, or perhaps you help plan less acceptable operations for the thieves' guild in Hawk Hill--the Raven Syndicate. That might explain your power that works well with rogues.
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List of Characters (and their players):
Arianwyn, Eladrin Fey Pact Warlock (FabesMinis)
Drogan Bridgewater, Human Warlord (Rambling Scribe)
Kyleria Mistweaver, Half-Elf Paladin (Amelia)
Vel, Human Wizard (Pat o' the Ninth Power)
??, Dragonborn Fighter (Jonventus)
??, ?? ?? (Tieren)
??, ?? ?? (TwiceBorn)
So, Jonventus, Tieren, TwiceBorn still have to decide. The yet unclaimed classes are Cleric, Ranger, and Rogue. Rangers are great, and fit well in the area you are in. The local elves and shifters are often rangers... although they do not always agree on certain things; the elves are most often vegetarians and do not like when people hunt animals, while shifters are very big on 'the hunt.' A rogue would most likely work for the Raven Syndicate, and clerics have two churches they can serve in.
Arianwyn doesn't really have a connection that's obvious as yet. He's something of a wanderer. Composing a lay of his experiences.
Perhaps Vel is a town native who works as the "plainclothes" bouncer in the Spinning Coin, in an arrangement with the constable to use her non-lethal powers to keep things from getting out of control when the obvious bouncer faces a physical confrontation? I'd swap out Freezing Cloud for Sleep on her dailies, which I was thinking of doing anyway.
It's not much, but I'm not having much luck here.
You can mark me as confirmed for a Dragonborn Fighter. I haven't heard from Tieren and my character is ready aside from the background, though I haven't posted it yet.
Also fyi, I think Twiceborn said he was going to make a Shifter Ranger.
Tieren, I'm fine with you also making a Fighter if that's what you want. I think we can definitely live without a Cleric. Just thought it would be nice to cover as many classes as possible to see how they work. But we can design fairly different Fighters, or just smash foes as a dynamic duo.
As there isn't a perform skill, would it be ok to say that I have a good singing voice and can play wood and string instruments?
Yes, I did say that I would make a Shifter Ranger... but I might need to delay posting my character stats for another day or two (will try to get everything done by tonight, buuuut...). My apologies, everyone...
Alright, well put me down for a halfling rogue. Stats and info should be up in a bit with an alias
Sure, Arianwyn can know how to sing/play instruments... I don't see why not.
As for Vel, besides working as a bouncer at the Spinning Coin (where you'd be working alongside the other bouncer, a massive orc named Grug), there's a small school of magic in town run by one of the only eladrin in town. Danilven Ameraliss is a stern, mysterious eladrin, but he and a few other learned wizards and warlocks teach young apprentices the ways of magic in a beautiful complex--the Ameraliss School of Arcane Arts--on the edge of Hawk Hill. Vel could perhaps be a teacher there if that suits you.
If she works at the Spinning Coin, however, she'll invariably have a connection to the Raven Syndicate, as the bar is actually a front for the guild. That might work out for the game's benefit, assuming Tieren's rogue is a guild thief.
I think the Spinning Coin job suits her better, though she might have a contact or two at the school.
Cool. If anyone else needs some ideas, just holler :)
Works fine with me having my character being a guild thief, any info I should know about them?
This is going to crop up for a lot of 4e issues. Dragon "magazine" has published, within the last few hours, a Class Acts article with illusion spells for wizards. link
Are we going to be able to use such content? Blanket or case-by-case?
Thanks.
EDIT: I should have warned that that's a PDF link.
I think my rogue is pretty much done, let me know if there is anything that needs altering. Waiting on any background info on the guild to finish up the backstory
I think I'll allow most things on the Wizard's DDI, except for things that clearly don't fit into the setting (like the warforged article). Illusionist crunch is fine by my book!
Here's some info on the Raven Syndicate:
The Raven Syndicate is a large organization of professional thieves and burglars that operates in the Kingdom of Lobraan and surrounding areas. Their main focus is urban theft, but they also have a fleet of pirate ships that with which they ply their trade in the Gulf of Myrthradas (though rumor has it that pirates who fly the Raven flag do not target Lobraanian vessels, only foreign ones).
The primary rule for all Raven Syndicate operatives is that they cannot cause physical harm to those they are stealing from. This rule is lifted when the target is an enemy of Lobraan (it is said the founder of the Syndicate made a deal with the then ruler of Lobraan) or the Raven Syndicate; those who experience the combat skills of syndicate operatives the most include the ever-present Society of the Dread Fang (a cult of Zehir that plagues northern Lobraan), Terovingian agents (the City of Steel often sends terrorists into Lobraan), and various assassin's guilds (often sponsored by the Society of the Dread Fang) that crop up now and again. Beyond dealing with these and other threats to the kingdom and the syndicate, guild thieves ply their trade, be it piracy, cat burglary, money laundering, purse snatching, etc. Rarely do those who wear the badge of the Raven (always hidden beneath the folds of a cloak unless identifying oneself to a fellow guild member) engage in thuggery or acts of destruction. Syndicate members see themselves above such low acts.
In the town of Hawk Hill, the leader of the local Syndicate headquarters (hidden underneath the Spinning Coin) is Tevri Mantrilbon, a cunning human warrior from a fallen noble house. The sub-bosses of the local guild are Taps Goldenfoot, halfling proprietor of the Spinning Coin, and Aldous Moonhaven, a soft-spoken priest of Sehanine. Boss Mantrilbon is currently leading an offensive against a gang of cutthroats that has cropped up in town recently and seems to be aided by goblins.
Any chance I could have some sort of relation to Taps Goldenfoot? be it by blood or even just an old friendship?
Ok, Vel's mechanics are finalized and initiative prerolls are at the top of her profile.
The more I think about it, the more I'm liking the mob wizard idea ;-).
My background is up - though I may add some to it - under a spoiler thing, just for my own practice at doing it. I don't mind if people look :)
On a side note, yay for unaligned paladins - able to hang with mob mages with no alignment issues :)
Oh, my own hook can be simple - the church sent me to aid the constable. Does that work?
I think I prefer to keep Drogan connected with the Duke or the Constable rather than the thieves guild, but I can make it work either way.
Perhaps I'm actually supposed to be infiltrating the guild on the contable's behalf, but I've learned that the bandits they are at war with are a bigger threat/ nastier villains so I'm supporting them for now. I imagine the duke and the constable understand 'lesser evil' scenarios.
Well, we don't all have to be affilliated to the Thieves, do we?
I have a busy few days coming up. I'll finish my character and post it this weekend, probably on Saturday. Sorry if I'm the hold-up.
How did people find 4E character creation? I found it a little difficult to pick stats, feats, and equipment without knowing my complete power progression. Some Fighter powers seem to be keyed to weapon type and/or specific ability scores, and I didn't really want to read through them all. It's probably not an issue after playing a few times. I'm definitely psyched to try out my powers.
How did people find 4E character creation? I found it a little difficult to pick stats, feats, and equipment without knowing my complete power progression. Some Fighter powers seem to be keyed to weapon type and/or specific ability scores, and I didn't really want to read through them all. It's probably not an issue after playing a few times. I'm definitely psyched to try out my powers.
I also did not want to read through all the powers, but Wizard is in some ways easier. The first priority was that I picked an array of powers that target different defenses, and, within that, a mix of single creature and area spells. I'd decided to play a mostly-controller, so I looked for things with effects with durations.
In terms of feats, I had decided up front that I wanted to wear armor (the stat requirements pretty much cut if off at leather, but every bit helps). After that, Improved Initiative seemed like an obvious choice for a controller -- to get those area spells off before everybody's mixed together.
All in all, not that much different from picking spells for a low-level wizard in 3E.
I have a busy few days coming up. I'll finish my character and post it this weekend, probably on Saturday. Sorry if I'm the hold-up.
How did people find 4E character creation? I found it a little difficult to pick stats, feats, and equipment without knowing my complete power progression. Some Fighter powers seem to be keyed to weapon type and/or specific ability scores, and I didn't really want to read through them all. It's probably not an issue after playing a few times. I'm definitely psyched to try out my powers.
I found it pretty easy and I didn't even look much at powers beyond level 2. I read to level 3 for some classes, but for Paladin I looked at 1 and 2. I found level 1 chargen easier than in 3.5, but that could be because the first tier feats leave me feeling underwhelmed. For that matter, Channel Divinity's 2 base options leave me feeling the same way, so that's why I took the feat I did. Regen 2 to a badly hurt party member seemed better than a 1 round save bonus or an extra +1 to damage for 1 round.
I do hope more books give us more feat options for heroic tier, though I think I already know my level 2 feat - I really need the Athletics skill, since Ky should be able to swim :). So, that means skill training feat for me :)
I think the complexity is very much class based. As an (for example) elven ranger, there would be a ton of possible feats I woulda been debating between.
For fighters, from my skimming, it's seems you need to know what weapon your concept supports best, so that you can plug in it's attribute as a high one and pick powers that mesh with it. I could be wrong, though, I have just skimmed the classes :)
I just went with all the fey powers. :D And Linguist as a feat because this ol' eladrin's read a lot and travelled a lot.
So, we have:
Arianwyn (Fabes) - Eladrin Warlock
Drogan Bridgewater (Scribe) - Human Warlord
Fawks (Tieren) - Halfling Rogue
Kyleria (Amelia) - Half-Elf Paladin
Vel (Pat) - Human Wizard
TBN (Twiceborn) - Shifter Ranger
TBN (Jonventus) - Dragonborn Fighter
3 strikers, 1 leader, 1 controller, 2 defenders
Got the bases covered, with 7 of the 8 classes, and some heavy damage capacity.
Did I miss anything?
For fighters, from my skimming, it's seems you need to know what weapon your concept supports best, so that you can plug in it's attribute as a high one and pick powers that mesh with it. I could be wrong, though, I have just skimmed the classes :)
That's fairly accurate, and realistic. I suppose if you train extensively with one weapon, you would learn some cool tricks, and wouldn't be *as* proficient with another. It's a good way to differentiate an axe-fighter from, say, a sword-fighter. The problem atm is that there are not enough powers to really differentiate one axe-fighter from another. Though in 3.5, there are no ways to do this at low-level, aside from race and ability scores. So I guess it's an improvement.
The idea of them releasing more powers in various supplements and future Player's Handbooks bugs me. It sounds like there will be too many options spread over too wide an array of books. That's one of the reasons I really dislike Prestige Classes. I guess I'm a core rules guy and just want to core rules to be enough. Strictly speaking, they are, but choices seem very limited.
Rules Question:
My Fighter at-will powers are Cleave and Reaping Strike (I think. The one that does damage when you miss). Does anyone know if I have to announce that I am using these before my attack, or can I just cleave someone when I do hit and reap on a miss?
Rules Question:
My Fighter at-will powers are Cleave and Reaping Strike (I think. The one that does damage when you miss). Does anyone know if I have to announce that I am using these before my attack, or can I just cleave someone when I do hit and reap on a miss?
You declare before. Think how bizarre wizards, for example, would be otherwise.