Hope You've Got Darkvision or that dagger isn't going to do much.


Races & Classes


A small thing on sneak attack. You can't use it against things with concealment, doesn't make very useful in a back alley, or sneaking up on someone in a shadowy corridor. Because shadowy illumination provides concealment. I just thought this was funny, I'm not an avid rogue player, so I wasn't aware of this small piece of information. And I'm pretty sure that in many of our games that this small rule is completely glazed over.

I'm still not a fan of the ambigious sneak attack, aka Pathfinder RPG Sneak Attack, ability to be used on everything under the sun. And with that in mind I beleive that it should be limited to only working on the first attack during a round. I'm not saying that it should be made into a standard action, but that if you've got 2 attacks which qualify for SA, that only first one gets the SA damage.

RPG Superstar 2009 Top 16, 2012 Top 32

RJM wrote:
A small thing on sneak attack. You can't use it against things with concealment, doesn't make very useful in a back alley, or sneaking up on someone in a shadowy corridor. Because shadowy illumination provides concealment. I just thought this was funny, I'm not an avid rogue player, so I wasn't aware of this small piece of information. And I'm pretty sure that in many of our games that this small rule is completely glazed over.

In my experience, that "small rule" actually ends up preventing rogues from making sneak attacks on a regular basis, possibly even more often than the immunity of certain creatures to sneak attacks. Darkness, fog, heavy snow, undergrowth, blur spells, minor cloaks of displacement, and plenty of similar things all render you completely immune to sneak attacks.


Indeed it does. My rogue is going to despise me from now on. *cackles* Er...I mean, I'm not evil. I swear. <.< >.>


PRPG mentions that you can rule certain types of creatures as being immune to sneak attacks. For example, I'd think that a zombie would be vulnerable to a sneak attack (sever the head or destroy the brain), while a skeleton warrior wouldn't.

Dark Archive

Windbit wrote:
For example, I'd think that a zombie would be vulnerable to a sneak attack (sever the head or destroy the brain), while a skeleton warrior wouldn't.

Let me say that again, sever the head or destroy the brain.


Funny how many things out there no matter how earthshakingly powerful are subject to "No head, you're dead" rule. Just harder to seperate some things from their head than others.


Archade wrote:
Windbit wrote:
For example, I'd think that a zombie would be vulnerable to a sneak attack (sever the head or destroy the brain), while a skeleton warrior wouldn't.
Let me say that again, sever the head or destroy the brain.

These are examples of coup de grace and not Sneak Attack, which is a knife in the kidney or a smack to the temple. Undead are immune to Sneak Attacks for a reason.

Even the examples you gave wouldn't necessarily stop a zombie. I can see one remaining functional without a head. The point of zombies is that none of their organs function, so puncturing the stomach, dicing the liver, piercing a kidney or pureeing the brain will make no difference.

Killing a Zombie requires literally hacking it apart into so many pieces that it becomes non-functional. That's why they have DR/slashing.

Rez

Sczarni

...well, as per DnD, they have no organs, so no, taking the head out means nothing as is...

of course, you shoot zombies in the head, they die...that's the trope.

sneak attack while under concealment means rogues need to get even more sneaky...trueseeing, darkvision, and the like are there for a reason.

-the hamster

RPG Superstar 2011 Top 16

Yeah these aren't virus driven zombies like from the movies. These are creatures that are only functioning at all do to a infusion of negative energy, this isn't about stopping the last brain functions because there are no brain functions remaining not even the baser ones.

Paizo Employee Director of Narrative

RJM wrote:
A small thing on sneak attack. You can't use it against things with concealment, doesn't make very useful in a back alley, or sneaking up on someone in a shadowy corridor. Because shadowy illumination provides concealment. I just thought this was funny, I'm not an avid rogue player, so I wasn't aware of this small piece of information. And I'm pretty sure that in many of our games that this small rule is completely glazed over.

That my friends, is the beauty of the Careful Targeting combat feat! Darkness and fog be damned!

Sczarni

hmmm....hand't considered that

will have to look at that for my upcoming rogue

-h


Rezdave wrote:
Archade wrote:
Windbit wrote:
For example, I'd think that a zombie would be vulnerable to a sneak attack (sever the head or destroy the brain), while a skeleton warrior wouldn't.
Let me say that again, sever the head or destroy the brain.

These are examples of coup de grace and not Sneak Attack, which is a knife in the kidney or a smack to the temple. Undead are immune to Sneak Attacks for a reason.

Even the examples you gave wouldn't necessarily stop a zombie. I can see one remaining functional without a head. The point of zombies is that none of their organs function, so puncturing the stomach, dicing the liver, piercing a kidney or pureeing the brain will make no difference.

Killing a Zombie requires literally hacking it apart into so many pieces that it becomes non-functional. That's why they have DR/slashing.

Rez

Now it represents being able to find a weak spot more so than striking at vital organs.

Thats from pg 26 PFRPG Designers Notes, you are not really attacking vital organs anymore, you are hitting a weak point, severing the spinal cord of skeletons, or hitting that one spot that is binding that negetive energy to the corpes in the first place, hitting that fualty bolt on the Iron Golems.
Somethings should remain immune to sneak attacks, that I agree with, if you need to, require that rogues have ranks in porper knowledge skills to get the sneak attack on the monsters that shouldnt be suseptable to SA.

To the OP, thats what elven rogues are for =D


Tivfus Ardwynor wrote:


To the OP, thats what elven rogues are for =D

And why nearly every rogue (and indeed most of my characters) end up getting darkvision permanently enchanted into them. Its too useful to not have it done.

Community / Forums / Archive / Pathfinder / Playtests & Prerelease Discussions / Pathfinder Roleplaying Game / Alpha Playtest Feedback / Alpha Release 2 / Races & Classes / Hope You've Got Darkvision or that dagger isn't going to do much. All Messageboards
Recent threads in Races & Classes