The Wizards magic staff.
Throughout fantasy literature it is a thing of power. A thing that merits respect. An item that invokes the power and majesty of all that is wizard. And for as long as I can recall Dungeons and Dragons has tried to nullify that.
How? Why charges of course.
Charges have effectively castrated magical staffs. In earlier editions once you used all the charges that was that. No more. Period. It made you wonder why even bother making a staff. Why bother putting any effort whatsoever into staffs. At least that is how every spellcaster that has been played under me have treated them, oh sure, hand them a staff of the magi and they'll enjoy it until it runs out but knowing it will run out of it's impressive power one day has always made even such a powerful item a little lackluster. I cannot see any sort of game balance issue involved with permitting a staff to be recharged, sure you shouldn't be able to use it's powers constantly, that become annoying to the DM and more than a little tiresome all around.
But why not permit recharging of the staff?
The recent release of Pathfinder Alpha did just that and used a rather nice concept as well and I thank you Mr. Bumahn, for finally seeing that.
I admit, maybe I'm a powergaming player in a DM's skin but it still seems a little limited. Is there any chance of Staffs being recharged faster? Or at least having more than 10 charges? Perhaps abilities that don't flat out mimic existing spells?
One interesting solution to the problem of charges I saw was in the Magic Item Compendium. An item would have 3+ charges a day. The use of one charge would have one affect, two charges would have a greater effect, and three charges would have a still greater effect. So you could use a combination of those... however, every new day, the charges would return. So it would be fairly limited, but more useful in the long term, is there any chance of something like that occurring rather than requiring 10 days to recharge a fully spent staff (if you're lucky)?
Just curious. Does anyone else have a take on this or am I the only person who holds this opinion?
DoR
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Yep, I agree, I liked being able to recharge the staff but I think the limit on charges (10) was a little low. I could see it working if it was more in the range of 25 charges like in older editions.
Now having daily use items mixed in would also work. Where you can cast X spell 3/day or something to that effect while having charges being used for the higher power effects to control their usage abit.
I complete agree with the first half of the OP's post.
Staves in campaigns I have been in have always been used as a stack of gold in stick form. Oh, a staff? What's a staff of Fire go for these days? For the vast majority of Staves- the gold gotten from selling it has been more useful than the spells they provided.
I do disagree with the second part however. I *love* the idea of 10 charge rechargeable staves. With the power of a staff in hand the Wizard has the ability to cast a few more spells in a day- even those not currently known. This ability is even more potent for the Sorc.
As long as they know one spell on the staff they can recharge it, albeit slowly.
While I wouldn't complain at more charges- I think 10 is a good balance. It keeps a wizard or sorc from depending solely on the staff while making it what it was really meant to be- a good backup weapon.
ALways keep in mind that Staves, unlike wands or other spell-like items, use the CL and mental stat of the user: Not that built into the staff. This is a *huge* advantage.
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Howdy!
You want a stick-like item that doesn't have charges, and that might include powers that don't mimic spells?
Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't those called "rods"? You can make a rod that looks like a walking stick, if you like.
(I think the Magic Item Compendium had another answer to this, too.)
Personally, I like this change. I hated the way staves were handled in 3.5. The Rune Staff in the MIC was a step up, but it ate spell slots from the caster, so what you gained in a non-disposable staff, was only a bit more versatility for a caster.
This seems to be a good cross between the two. 10 charges is a bit limiting... during the course off an adventure you're likely to be involved in more than 10 encounters before being able to recharge much/any. But, that leaves some resource management issues for the payers.
I really hope to be able to test something like this out with my bonded item (staff) in my sunday game (level 11 wizard, so I might be able to afford enhancing it as a magic staff of something in the near future).
Nice change all around. 10 is a good limit since any major downtime between adventures = fully charged staff. If it was 25 that's a lot of free power (Staff of Heal/Life anyone?), though I like the 1st edition feel of it.
I somewhat feel that this could be abused by spells that require material components - perhaps those should be required to recharge the staff? (Staff of Wish?)
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I've always detested disposable wands and staves. The recharge option is quite nice.
I still think staves would have a little more oomph to them if they confered at least a small continuous ability related to their focus. maybe a fire staff would give you a +1 caster level to fire spells you cast, for example. Stuff like that. makes them more than a rechargeable oversized wand.
Don't get me wrong, I like the change, my players might be iffy about it but I doubt they'd complain if I gave them such an item. Especially seeing as they get downtime in the game from time to time as opposed to some adventures (i.e. Age of Worms) where it felt like a days delay would cause the world to end so heaven help you should you stop to rest :-P. I do feel it could benefit from a slight increase, like mentioned earlier perhaps some minor #/Day abilities or an increase in charges (I think 15 would be nice without being overbalancing) thanks for the input on this. Right now I'm just glad someone finally made them not quite so disposable.
DoR
Balance Alert! I have not idea whether this would work but:
Wand of Magic Missiles
- May cast memorized Magic Missile spell slots as +1 caster level
- May substitite a 1st level memorized spell with Magic Missile (no caster level bonus)
- 1/day may cast Magic Missle at caster level (no caster level bonus)
Fun to use, but should not be crazy unbalanced. Gives a wizard a very limited way of using spell substitution. Why not a rod? Because I watch too much Harry Potter. I guess staves would do the same with more spells.
Common house rule for groups I played with from D&D boxed sets all the way up to 3.5 was that staves regenerated charges at the rate of 1 per day until they reached their maximum charge total. In these cases nothing short of a Limited Wish or Wish spell could recharge a staff at a quicker rate. We often included an item refered to as a greater wand which held only 10 charges and but regenerated at the same rate as a staff and cost double the normal price of the same type of wand.
-Weylin Stormcrowe
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Balance Alert! I have not idea whether this would work but:
Wand of Magic Missiles
- May cast memorized Magic Missile spell slots as +1 caster level
- May substitite a 1st level memorized spell with Magic Missile (no caster level bonus)
- 1/day may cast Magic Missle at caster level (no caster level bonus)Fun to use, but should not be crazy unbalanced. Gives a wizard a very limited way of using spell substitution. Why not a rod? Because I watch too much Harry Potter. I guess staves would do the same with more spells.
This sort of thing was suggested back in 2nd edition in an issue of Dragon. Magic items that had little or no real power of their own, but allowed a spellcaster to channel his pre-existing spells into the item to cast whatever spell it had.
Wand of Fireballs (batteries not included, requires 3rd level spell slots, see back for instructions).
It's a cool notion, and your upgraded version that allows casting of that one spell at +1 caster level or a single 'free' use per day, is very cool.
Another alternate power for such a device is that it might allow the caster to Metamagic that one particular spell at -1 to the total cost (+0 minimum!)
Or it could allow the spell-user to Metamagic that one particular spell by expending spell slots equal to the level modifier of the Metamagic. You want to Extend that Magic Missle to get the fleeing bad-guy on the Griffon? Spend an additional 1st level spell slot to do so!
I've got a wizard character whose "staff" is one foot long and a half-inch in diameter; he keeps it in a sheath on his belt, hanging opposite the short sword he never uses. Surprises the hell out of people when he starts casting maximized disintegrate spells out of a wand.
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I do disagree with the second part however. I *love* the idea of 10 charge rechargeable staves. With the power of a staff in hand the Wizard has the ability to cast a few more spells in a day- even those not currently known. This ability is even more potent for the Sorc.
As long as they know one spell on the staff they can recharge it, albeit slowly.
Ditto. Staves were grossly overpriced wands in 3.5. There was usually only one spell you'd use off of it, and the thing would cost more than an equivalent wand to do the same thing. The bonus to save DCs and spellcasting levels redeemed it somewhat, but not very much.
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This is going in a different direction than what has been posted so far, but what about setting up staffs more like magic weapons? They could come +1 to +5. This would raise the caster level of spells cast by the caster the way a magic weapon raises the attack roll of the wielder. They could also carry metamagic properties the way a weapon carries special weapon qualities like Keen or Flaming. You'd end up with things like a +2 Staff of Quickening or a +3 Staff of Empowering.
Wands would remain potions in a stick. There would finally be a real difference between the two.
Just a thought.
This is going in a different direction than what has been posted so far, but what about setting up staffs more like magic weapons? They could come +1 to +5. This would raise the caster level of spells cast by the caster the way a magic weapon raises the attack roll of the wielder. They could also carry metamagic properties the way a weapon carries special weapon qualities like Keen or Flaming. You'd end up with things like a +2 Staff of Quickening or a +3 Staff of Empowering.
Wands would remain potions in a stick. There would finally be a real difference between the two.
Just a thought.
I like this idea, but without some stiff restrictions, these items could rival artifacts. +5 staff of quickening? Would that mean you cast your spells at +5 caster level and the spell is quickened?
I like this idea, but without some stiff restrictions, these items could rival artifacts. +5 staff of quickening? Would that mean you cast your spells at +5 caster level and the spell is quickened?
Don't Forget your +5 Staff of Chain Spell + Quickening for all of your Finger of Death needs.
Giving up one high level spell slot for one charge in a wand sounds like a n unfair trade to me, as most one charge staff effects are similar to low level spells.
A lower price would be more appropriate, except if the aim is to forbid staff recharching during adventures. I suggest the following price/rule : a nth level spell (or spell slot) would put n charge back in the staff.
Or myabe a lower rate, but with added flexibility, as in the following rule : once a staff is "atuned" to a caster (a one day long ceremony), that magic-user may cast spells into the staff, recharching it of half the spell level of the spell cast, rounded down (i.e. an improved invisibility would put 3 charges back in the staff). A caster may only be attuned to one staff at a time.
BTW, concerning the controversial 10 charges limit for the staff ; i suggest to change it to a limit equal to the level of the caster to whom the staff is atuned.
Giving up one high level spell slot for one charge in a wand sounds like a n unfair trade to me, as most one charge staff effects are similar to low level spells.
A lower price would be more appropriate, except if the aim is to forbid staff recharching during adventures. I suggest the following price/rule : a nth level spell (or spell slot) would put n charge back in the staff.
Or myabe a lower rate, but with added flexibility, as in the following rule : once a staff is "atuned" to a caster (a one day long ceremony), that magic-user may cast spells into the staff, recharching it of half the spell level of the spell cast, rounded down (i.e. an improved invisibility would put 3 charges back in the staff). A caster may only be attuned to one staff at a time.
BTW, concerning the controversial 10 charges limit for the staff ; i suggest to change it to a limit equal to the level of the caster to whom the staff is atuned.Erratum : in my second version of the rule, Greater invisibility would put 2 charges back in the staff
Sorry
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I really like the recharge rules. I have always house ruled it that it slowly recharges (i never specified a real amount... just told them X charges had restored at the start of a new adventure/after a given time. but it equated to something about 10 a week). Honestly I have also always felt that the Staff was way to limited for what it represented in literature.
I am happy with the 10 charge limit, though i don't see why a feat couldn't be added to increase that number (but only a little... like +5 charges?) Perhaps saying regains charges = caster lvl or something might also be fair. All in all, i think the recharging rules make this iconic item much much more usable. My wizard player was very excited when he found out about this.
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Quite. And the new rules at least mean that staves are no longer disposable items, which is a big plus.
This always irked me too. Why bother putting any effort into a staff when you can put the same effort into a wand and just make yourself a +5 Quarterstaff. Once it runs out of charges it's just a big stick anyway. I like the "being able to recharge staves" idea, but to me a Wizard's Staff should be something that allows limited use spalls that never run out. 3/day Fireball, 1/day Teleport, stuff like that. Wave your staff and fire shoots from it's tip, but not as a charge, as a "there goes one of my daily uses". Much better flavour wise imho.
I feel that the number of charges (10) is too low for staves, it should be up at 25 charges as this is supposed to be a very powerful magic item. At 25, this gives the caster the usage, but then he or she still must be careful as he or she can only recharge at 1 charge per day. This gives short term usage capability with long term consequences of which to be mindful.
I also think that the cost should be 1 prepared spell or spell slot of the highest level spell in the staff; For example, in order to add one charge to a Staff of Power the caster would have to give up a 6th level prepared spell or spell slot for that day (Globe of Invulnerability is a 6th level spell and the highest level spell in a Staff of Power). The way Alpha 2 is presently it makes it so the higher level the caster the more it costs to recharge a staff which does not seem logical.