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Quick Question (Advice):
TLDR: Party goes to lavender's and through misadventure ends using charm person to make Vendra hand over a sample of her linament after starting a combat.
So they lay one of their badges on the bar (they had since been dismissed from the guard since Cressida claimed she could no longer pay them but still chose to use them as diplomacy leverage) and demanded to be able to compensate her and take one of the vials. Vendra starts trying to fast talk them out of it.
At this time the ninja chooses to use his ki to try and go invisible unnoticed. So he rolls a stealth check. Vendra notices and sensing shenanigans orders her guards to attack.
On the first round with her first action she tries to charm the swashbuckler, which fails.
Then the wizard casts charm person on Vendra and tells her to have her guards stand down.
The guards, being weak willed dummies who don't really understand magic, protest briefly but do as they are told. The party leaves with one of the vials.
So at this point Vendra knows that my party has the vial and they got it through charm person. Would that effectively wrap things up as I can only assume that she would immediately close shop and skip town?
Or would she hold out due to her own greed?
It could be interesting that she tried to silence the party by bribing them or something similar.
I'd rather insert some consequences for what the party did because that makes them feel relevant, but don't let them get away with it so easy making her just leave after that.
Why would Vendra run? She is a clever business woman, who has perfect deniability. She's selling one of her older ointments which suddenly seemed to be a cure for the disease. Of course, she knows it does not work, but she doesn't have to admit that. She might indeed have sold an ointment to a client who got better (just by making his saves) and thus been fooled into thinking that her linament had something to do with that person getting healthy again. So she can pretend she actually believes her ointment is a cure.
Even if it is proven that her ointment does not make people better, she can still claim that it might have had a placebo effect on some of her clients, and if not, she was still doing more than the governemnt combined, because she was giving the people something they desperately needed: hope!
So, no, she should not run, but stand her ground as a business woman. The worst that can happen is that she has to admit that her cure does not work, although she was convinced it did. There is not really anything illegal about that. And since there is no way to prove that she knew she was lying ...
By the way, continuing that line of thought, she might even go to the guard herself to issue a complaint against the PCs for using force and magic to attack her and steal from her.
Regarding the new hardcover version:
Dr D has lost 3 Bard levels in the move to Pathfinder. This makes him substantially weaker - I think almost to the point of being useless.
I don't like the expert levels as I don't feel 3 expert levels add 3 to the CR. Especially when compared to if these had been rogue or bard levels.
That said I do understand why they could be there (as he is a doctor).
The Bard part I do not understand. Does anyone have any guesses as to why he might be a Bard? Perhaps it is my mind immediately jumping to musical bard rather than creepy persuasive bard
Does anyone have any views on ways to rebuild him? I think either:
- Replace expert levels for bard and rogue levels (probably 5 and 5 or 6 and 4)
- Make a vivisectionist
- Make an investigator
All could be fun. I suppose the problem with options 2 and 3 is that he needs misdirection. But the others could have Undetectable Alignment as extracts...
What have others done?
I have seen mentions of turning the physicians into alchemists. Why was this something many seemed keen to do? Again I can understand vivisectionist but not standard alchemist. Same with the Doctor (who on an earlier post is stated as a 10th level alchemist). There is nothing in their descriptions that screams "throw bombs"
Thanks for any help
I made half the plague doctors regular, bomb-lobbing alchemists, and the other half vivisectionists. Here are the stat blocks I used (includes feats, buffs, etc) :
Vivisectionist
HP 23, init +10
AC 20 (+4 dex, +2 natural, +4 armor)
Fort 4, Ref 7, Will 2
Melee +7 or +5/+5 : 1d4+2/1d4+1 (sneak 2d6, +2 bleed)
Before combat : mutagen, mage armor
During combat : (mutagen,) (true strike maybe,) melee (flank), flees under 7 HP
Leather armor, 2 mwk daggers, wasp venom x2 (DC 18, 6 rounds, 1d2 Dex), Formulae book (300 gp), plague-bringer’s mask, surgeon’s tools, healer’s kit
Alchemist
HP 23, init +10
AC 20 (+4 dex, +2 natural, +4 armor)
Fort 4, Ref 7, Will 2
Ranged touch +7 : 2d6+3 (splash 5) (precision : can spare 2 tiles). 5/day
Melee +5 : 1d6+2
Before combat : mutagen, mage armor
During combat : (mutagen,) throws bombs, flees under 7 HP
Leather armor, mwk club, wasp venom x2 (DC 18, 6 rounds, 1d2 Dex), Formulae book (300 gp), plague-bringer’s mask, surgeon’s tools, healer’s kit
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Am i right in the fact that the pc's can easily start curing everybody in the hospice when they get their hands on a plaguebringer's mask?
Er... no. Two issues:
(1) A Plaguebringer's Mask is unique to the AP, costs only 2000 gp, and does not cast Remove Disease. You're thinking of the 27,000 gp Plague Mask from the PRD.
(2) The Plague Mask casts Remove Disease once per day at CL 5. That gives it a 50/50 chance of working at all. Curing one person per 2 days will do almost nothing to keep up with the virulence of the disease. In the original AP, it did some nice number crunching for you to show how little individual efforts would contribute. So it's a drop in the bucket, and would take an inordinate amount of time just for the people in the hospice.
EDIT: And on a personal note, I despise that both Remove Disease and Neutralize Poison require caster level checks, because for cleric levels where it matters (1-6 or so), you typically have to queue up 2-3 of each just to have a chance of succeeding. At level 7 you get Restoration and can just let the poison run its course for all of 100 gp, and at level 11 you get Heal and forget the whole thing. But so far I haven't convinced my GM of the righteousness of my case...
Plaguebringer's mask grants immunity too Blood veil, put it on someone they get cured and then rinse and repeat.Am i right in the fact that the pc's can easily start curing everybody in the hospice when they get their hands on a plaguebringer's mask?Er... no. Two issues:
(1) A Plaguebringer's Mask is unique to the AP, costs only 2000 gp, and does not cast Remove Disease. You're thinking of the 27,000 gp Plague Mask from the PRD.
(2) The Plague Mask casts Remove Disease once per day at CL 5. That gives it a 50/50 chance of working at all. Curing one person per 2 days will do almost nothing to keep up with the virulence of the disease. In the original AP, it did some nice number crunching for you to show how little individual efforts would contribute. So it's a drop in the bucket, and would take an inordinate amount of time just for the people in the hospice.
Ah, excellent point. That's up to your GM, then, because at that rate yes, one mask could rapidly cure the entire city.
RAW, it works. RAI, it "breaks" the AP, so the GM would have to come up with some reason it doesn't. (I always use the "24 hours to attune items that grant immunities" rule in my games for just such reasons. There are SOOOOO many magic items of the "hand it around and the whole problem is solved" variety that some kind of slowdown is necessary for storytelling purposes.)
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Plaguebringer's mask grants immunity too Blood veil, put it on someone they get cured and then rinse and repeat.Am i right in the fact that the pc's can easily start curing everybody in the hospice when they get their hands on a plaguebringer's mask?Er... no. Two issues:
(1) A Plaguebringer's Mask is unique to the AP, costs only 2000 gp, and does not cast Remove Disease. You're thinking of the 27,000 gp Plague Mask from the PRD.
(2) The Plague Mask casts Remove Disease once per day at CL 5. That gives it a 50/50 chance of working at all. Curing one person per 2 days will do almost nothing to keep up with the virulence of the disease. In the original AP, it did some nice number crunching for you to show how little individual efforts would contribute. So it's a drop in the bucket, and would take an inordinate amount of time just for the people in the hospice.
Ah, excellent point. That's up to your GM, then, because at that rate yes, one mask could rapidly cure the entire city.
RAW, it works. RAI, it "breaks" the AP, so the GM would have to come up with some reason it doesn't. (I always use the "24 hours to attune items that grant immunities" rule in my games for just such reasons. There are SOOOOO many magic items of the "hand it around and the whole problem is solved" variety that some kind of slowdown is necessary for storytelling purposes.)
I agree with NobodysHome, especially the part about it breaking the AP.
Blood veil is supposed to be one of the deadliest diseases created. It needs to be horrifying.
If this comes up in my game I will rule it thus:
The mask needs 24 hours to attune to the character before they gain immunity. Once the mask is removed the immunity is lost. If the mask is donned again with in 24 hours of taking it off, the immunity is regained without the 24 hour attune period. Over 24 hours and the immunity is lost and the 24 hour attune period will need to be repeated. Thus taking it off and putting on it someone else to give them immunity takes 24 hours. Re-donning it again after the other character gains immunity also means it was off for more then 24 hours and that character will have to re-attune.
Roth's spellbook:
Roth's spellbook:
** spoiler omitted **
It's similar to infuse with spell ability, except it only works on corporeal undead.
On page 118 of the hard cover, there is a 'Temple Under Alert' section that ** spoiler omitted **, is this a mistake?
I think it is not a mistake. At least not at this point. I believe the mistake is at the description of area G2. It should say Gray maidens instead of Queen's Physicians, as it says they should have their bows ready and the physicians have no bows in their gear.
Plaguebringer's mask grants immunity too Blood veil, put it on someone they get cured and then rinse and repeat.Am i right in the fact that the pc's can easily start curing everybody in the hospice when they get their hands on a plaguebringer's mask?Er... no. Two issues:
(1) A Plaguebringer's Mask is unique to the AP, costs only 2000 gp, and does not cast Remove Disease. You're thinking of the 27,000 gp Plague Mask from the PRD.
(2) The Plague Mask casts Remove Disease once per day at CL 5. That gives it a 50/50 chance of working at all. Curing one person per 2 days will do almost nothing to keep up with the virulence of the disease. In the original AP, it did some nice number crunching for you to show how little individual efforts would contribute. So it's a drop in the bucket, and would take an inordinate amount of time just for the people in the hospice.
Ah, excellent point. That's up to your GM, then, because at that rate yes, one mask could rapidly cure the entire city.
RAW, it works. RAI, it "breaks" the AP, so the GM would have to come up with some reason it doesn't. (I always use the "24 hours to attune items that grant immunities" rule in my games for just such reasons. There are SOOOOO many magic items of the "hand it around and the whole problem is solved" variety that some kind of slowdown is necessary for storytelling purposes.)
I don't think that's a Ruling, I think that's the Rule. Putting on the mask once doesn't make you Immune to Blood Veil forever, it makes you Immunre to Blood Veil while you are wearing it. Otherwise, why does the Cult need more than one? It's just like you only get a Resistance Bonus to Saves while wearing a Cloak of Resistance. You can't just get one and pass it around to everyone with any magic item.
Plaguebringer's mask grants immunity too Blood veil, put it on someone they get cured and then rinse and repeat.Am i right in the fact that the pc's can easily start curing everybody in the hospice when they get their hands on a plaguebringer's mask?Er... no. Two issues:
(1) A Plaguebringer's Mask is unique to the AP, costs only 2000 gp, and does not cast Remove Disease. You're thinking of the 27,000 gp Plague Mask from the PRD.
(2) The Plague Mask casts Remove Disease once per day at CL 5. That gives it a 50/50 chance of working at all. Curing one person per 2 days will do almost nothing to keep up with the virulence of the disease. In the original AP, it did some nice number crunching for you to show how little individual efforts would contribute. So it's a drop in the bucket, and would take an inordinate amount of time just for the people in the hospice.
Ah, excellent point. That's up to your GM, then, because at that rate yes, one mask could rapidly cure the entire city.
RAW, it works. RAI, it "breaks" the AP, so the GM would have to come up with some reason it doesn't. (I always use the "24 hours to attune items that grant immunities" rule in my games for just such reasons. There are SOOOOO many magic items of the "hand it around and the whole problem is solved" variety that some kind of slowdown is necessary for storytelling purposes.)
I don't think that's a Ruling, I think that's the Rule. Putting on the mask once doesn't make you Immune to Blood Veil forever, it makes you Immune to Blood Veil while you are wearing it. Otherwise, why does the Cult need more than one? It's just like you only get a Resistance Bonus to Saves while wearing a Cloak of Resistance. You can't just get one and pass it around to everyone with any magic item.
And if you're saying that putting on the Mask when you're already sick cures you, I don't think there's a rule that says that. While wearing the Mask you can't contract the disease, and if you already have it you won't get worse, but nothing says it cures the disease.
from PSRD:
Immunity (Ex or Su)
A creature with immunities takes no damage from listed sources. Immunities can also apply to afflictions, conditions, spells (based on school, level, or save type), and other effects. A creature that is immune does not suffer from these effects, or any secondary effects that are triggered due to an immune effect.
What would be a good way to handle the "Escort Trinia" mission that Vencarlo gives the party near the beginning, if the party had already been hiding her themselves, and a lookalike got rescued from the the execution instead?
Until this mission the books have been suggesting what could happen with that branch of narrative, but here it assumes that Trinia herself was rescued by Blackjack.
Yeah, I'm afraid they really derailed the train on this one. Book 2 is all about Cressida feeding them breadcrumbs as they slowly unwind the plot and determine who is at fault for the plague. My tendency would be to rewrite the story-driven quests to be given by (your choice) the Cerulean Society or Glorio Arkona.
Few people suffer more than underworld figures during a natural disaster, so getting a group of competent-but-bloodthirsty adventurers on the payroll wouldn't hurt their feelings a bit.
I'd personally LOVE using Arkona here because it would play into the way I like to run Book 3, with Arkona more interested in having his influence in play in every major faction, so no matter who wins, he comes out on top, but the Cerulean Society is a nice throwaway that could introduce the PCs to Boule (see Book 4 and the Deathhead Vaults if you're using the hardcover).
But be sure that they do little things to ATONE FOR KILLING A BUNCH OF GUARDS. They need Croft as an ally in Book 6, so while rewriting Book 2 to use underworld figures is remarkably not that hard, rewriting Book 6 would be harder.
Good luck!
What would be a good way to handle the "Escort Trinia" mission that Vencarlo gives the party near the beginning, if the party had already been hiding her themselves, and a lookalike got rescued from the the execution instead?
Until this mission the books have been suggesting what could happen with that branch of narrative, but here it assumes that Trinia herself was rescued by Blackjack.
Most groups I've read have had the party escort both Trinia and the lookalike out of town.
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To play devil's advocate here, you could also have Kroft send a message to them (using a Sending spell if you have to in order to get it to them). "Come see me about your murder spree if you don't want to be outlaws for the rest of your lives." And make it clear that this is probably their ONE chance to not be public enemy number one in Korvosa, a lawful major city where it's going to be damn hard to move about in disguise all the time and avoid all the guards, checkpoints, etc.
If they still insist on running and flee the city, then shrug and say they just wrote their characters out of the campaign. Start rolling dice for new ones.
If they do show up to meet Kroft, rather than have them arrested have her read them the riot act and that this was their ONE epic screw-up that they get. EVER. And that it took some doing, but Kroft has smoothed things over for them - by having the Church of Abadar/Asmodeus/Pharasma cast Raise Dead on the four guards they killed. They now owe her/the city 20,000 GP for those diamonds that got used up, and it's coming out of their asses by continuing to work for her, this time for free. While she's still figuring out how they can work off that debt to the city, the plague strikes (which, coincidentally, the major churchs are now depleted of diamonds, making their own Raise Dead spells harder to get, and also Restorations much rarer - a problem in a city with a stat-draining disease running lose!) Coincidentally, saving the city for the plague also counts in Kroft's book as repaying their debt, so long as they DON'T murder any more of her guards.
If you play your cards right, your players will be a little gun shy about going on a rampage again, and when they hear about shady things going on at the Hospice of the Blessed Maiden, maybe they'll be less inclined to go in half-cocked and murder everyone without being SURE that they're attacking and killing people who need killing rather than public servants just doing their jobs.
And then you get the delicious irony of them becoming outlaws and going on the run anyway in Book 3/4, because by stopping the plague they've torqued off the queen who is the legitimate authority in Korvosa by might and by right! Wheeheeheehee!
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And that it took some doing, but Kroft has smoothed things over for them - by having the Church of Abadar/Asmodeus/Pharasma cast Raise Dead on the four guards they killed. They now owe her/the city 20,000 GP for those diamonds that got used up, and it's coming out of their asses by continuing to work for her, this time for free. While she's still figuring out how they can work off that debt to the city...
So, Inspectre's entire idea is better than mine, but I implemented almost this exact set of circumstances in Book 5 when the PCs absent-mindedly turned a graveknight loose in Magnimar.
They had to pay for ALL of the resurrections.And they did.
And they're WAY more careful with things they can't identify.
Win-win!
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Another aspect of having the law come down on them, but having Kroft pull the blow enough to not derail the game entirely. They'll be used to a functional, lawful society where there are consequences to their actions. This *should* result in quite the culture shock when they get to Kaer Maga, which going by the source book "City of Strangers" is basically CE that's just one step above complete anarchy (how the city has managed to not be conquered by Korvosa in any of their wars in the past, especially when the Korvosan NPCs have almost double the levels of their Kaer Magan counterparts, who knows).
So when they get to Kaer Maga, have some gang (suicidally) pick a fight with them. Make them act like they're the local law enforcement, because they probably are in that portion of town. And then when the PCs slaughter them, have NOTHING happen. No one comes to avenge the fallen, no one even gives a s~#% save to fight over the scraps that are left of the curbstomped gang.
The players might well think they've gone to murderhobo heaven . . . for a little while. Until they realize that being a muderhobo is not much fun when *all* of your neighbors are also muderhobos looking for new and exciting ways to screw you over. They'll be begging to go back to Korvosa in a week.
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So a few questions about the new and improved Yvicca.
Her Tactic says she uses evil eye to daze her opponents before going into melee, but there is no dc on her evil eye in her stats.
Looked up the sea hag evil eye ability, but that is not a daze effect.There is also nothing that tells me what her horrific appearance does, but its a bit easier with that since just using the sea hag works there.
Also find it strange she cast speak with animals to talk to all those summons she can't make. But being able to tell the shark to flank does seem nice.
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/unique-monsters/cr-7/yvicca/
Hope that helps.
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So a few questions about the new and improved Yvicca.
Her Tactic says she uses evil eye to daze her opponents before going into melee, but there is no dc on her evil eye in her stats.
Looked up the sea hag evil eye ability, but that is not a daze effect.There is also nothing that tells me what her horrific appearance does, but its a bit easier with that since just using the sea hag works there.
Also find it strange she cast speak with animals to talk to all those summons she can't make. But being able to tell the shark to flank does seem nice.
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/unique-monsters/cr-7/yvicca/
Hope that helps.
Unfortunately not, it´s more like the old Yvicca but with updated rules.
So she has 3 druid lvl's more then the new one, and seems way to powerful for my 3 man, lvl 5 group.
I don't really understand your problem, unless of course you don't own the Bestiary. The DC for the evil eye ability and the horrific appearance are clearly stated in the Bestiary. I believe the CotCT AE mistakenly called it a daze when it actually staggers the victim.
Evil Eye (Su) Three times per day, a sea hag can cast her dire gaze upon any single creature within 30 feet. The target must succeed on a DC 14 Will save or be staggered as strange nebulous distress and a gnawing sense of impending doom plagues the victim. If a sea hag uses her evil eye on someone already afflicted by this curse, the victim must make a DC 14 Fortitude save or be overwhelmed with fright and collapse into a comatose state for 3 days. Each day that passes, the comatose victim must make a DC 14 Fortitude save or perish. The evil eye is a mind affecting fear effect. The save DCs are Charisma-based.
Evil Eye Curse: Gaze—failed save; save Will DC 14; frequency 1/day; effect staggered (or fall comatose if already under the effects of the evil eye).
Horrific Appearance (Su) The sight of a sea hag is so revolting that anyone within 60 feet (other than another hag) who sets eyes upon one must succeed on a DC 14 Fortitude save or instantly be weakened, taking 1d6 points of Strength damage. Creatures that are affected by this power or that successfully save against it cannot be affected again by the same hag’s horrific appearance for 24 hours. This is a mind affecting effect. The save DC is Charisma-based.
One of my PCs just got arrested by Gray Maidens outside the Hospice of the Blessed Maiden, and escorted inside for questioning - end of session cliffhanger, so I can work out what might happen!
This means he's going to get to observe the plague doctors and other Maidens while he's being questioned. One thing I'm not totally clear on is whether the Gray Maidens at the hospice know exactly what's going on? Do they know the Queen's Physicians are evil and trying to spread the plague? Or do they take Illeosa's orders to protect them at face value? Do they know the cult of Urgathoa are at work in the basement? I know that the Great Maidens are recruited from the underworld of Korvosa, and the training is brutal, but it still feels like a stretch that they'd all be on board with killing off the majority of the city's population.
Apologies if these answers are given in the text, I've read it a few times now and can't find anything to say either way.
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I don't think the Grey Maidens care if the physicians are evil, so are the maidens. The indoctrination and training the maidens go through makes them absolutely loyal to the Queen, and if they are told to guard the physicians with their lives, that is what they will do. I don't think it matters to them what the physicians are up too. I don't know how they could miss the fact about the temple and cult under the hospice, after all, some are stationed down there and I am sure they would be rotated out.
I would actually take the prisoner down to the temple and throw him or her in one of cells down there. He or she would make a fine candidate to test a new virulent version of blood veil on.
Thanks, I think you're right, the Gray Maidens are not going to question their orders from the queen, no matter what they are.
I think I'll keep the PC upstairs for now, though, I want the party to be able to discover the Temple's existence for themselves. They are extremely prone to mayhem, so I fully expect a brawl to break out once the rest of the group decide to go rescue the cleric...
On page 118 of the hard cover, there is a 'Temple Under Alert' section that ** spoiler omitted **, is this a mistake?
I don't see any answers on this one. There is a discrepancy between what "The Temple Under Alert" says changes, and what the non-Alert staffing is in the Guard Post (G2).
On page 118 of the hard cover, there is a 'Temple Under Alert' section that ** spoiler omitted **, is this a mistake?I don't see any answers on this one. There is a discrepancy between what "The Temple Under Alert" says changes, and what the non-Alert staffing is in the Guard Post (G2).
** spoiler omitted **
I caught that, too. My guess was that it was supposed to be Queen's Physicians since it said at one point that the Gray Maidens stayed upstairs for plausible deniability of what was going on down below, so I just made it the physicians. And that's what's in the encounter area, so I figured it was more likely the other part was an error than that.
I'm just starting Seven Days, and could use a little advice on how to handle a few things. I'm actually running the original modules, in D&D 3.5, in case that makes any difference compared to the hardcover updated AP and running it in Pathfinder. I'm also planning to implement MrVergee's excellent advice of basing the Red Mantis, Dr. Devaulus, Rolth, and the Urgathoans out of the abandoned House Porphyria villa of Lost End, and having the evidence found in the Direption pointing there, and only there.
Our previous session was mostly down-time between modules, with the only SDttG event that happened being the sinking of the Direption. Then, in tonight's session we started things in ernest; Grau came to the PC's for help, they cured Brienna, did the new Harrow reading, and escorted Trinia out of the city.
When Grau came to the party for help, the party was wise enough to stop at the Bank of Abadar on the way to Trail's End to secure a means of curing Brienna's sickness before even seeing her (they secured the services of a 6th-level paladin, the on-the-spot-dreampt-up captain of the Bank's guards, as the 150 gp for his Remove Disease was much cheaper than the cost of a scroll). They visited the Soldado home, spoke with Ishani (learning his concerns about not recognizing the combination of symptoms), had Brienna healed, and asked her about what she had been doing the previous few days. She told them about playing with a friend, and buying candy. That elicited a question from one of the PC's (and subsequently a surprised Tayce) about where she got money for candy. Brienna said she found it along the riverbank.
My PC's immediately latched on to either the candy or the coins being the vector of infection, and if the coins, then they came from the sunken "pirate" ship. While some went to check on if Brienna's friend was sick, the rest of the party went to the pastry and candy shop* to investigate. The merchant running the shop was already displaying symptoms of Blood Veil, and the party Druid asked to inspect his coinage, where he then cast Detect Magic to inspect the coins. For now I said that they did not detect as magical (if they should detect as magical, any infected coins could have easily been given as change in the 2 days since he obtained them from Brienna, providing the reason as to why none happened to be there currently).
So that's my first question: Should the infected coins detect as magical? They are made to carry the infection from the magic of the Death's Head Coffers, but it isn't clearly laid out as to if the DHC's effect is instantaneous, or if there is some lingering magic on the coins after they are removed. Since it doesn't say, I'm tempted to lean toward the coins not detecting as magical. It's an "instantaneous" effect that wears off after a stated duration. After all, we've seen Paizo do this exact same thing subsequently; there is that spell from the Second Darkness AP that allows the PC's to wear the corpse of a Drow, which is set up to work that same way. It is an "instantaneous" magical effect (thus it does not show up to most magical detections; the exception being Detect Undead, IIRC), but it ends after a set duration that isn't technically a "duration."
If I do go this route, what might be a different "Achille's Heel" of detection for a diseased coin, similar to how Detect Undead would light up on the Drow corpses used for that spell from Second Darkness (sorry, the name escapes me at the moment)?
Second, due to one of the PC's getting sick that first day, and thus they visited Ishani at the Bank of Abadar before he sends an acolyte to call for them (wasn't planning to have that happen for another five days or so), they learned very quickly that several of the other vaultkeepers were sick (and since cured). Since the PC's now strongly suspect the coinage is infected, they advised Ishani that the Bank of Abadar should boil all coinage that they have in their vault, and all coins that they might get their hands on in the future.
Should boiling the coinage kill the infection that they are carrying? I could go either way on this, but which way I go depends on if the infected coins remain magical or not. If the infected coins aren't magical, then I think one should rule that boiling the coins will work to kill any infection they are carrying. However, if the infected coins do detect as magical, then I could see letting the infection persist even after boiling. All in all, I'm tempted to go with the "coins don't detect as magical; boiling the coins will cleanse them of infection" route, as the other way makes it too easy to track down all the infected coins. At least with the non-magical coins some will continue to circulate undetected. Also, the cultists of Urgathoa could still "accidentally" "drop" infected coins in the streets (one coin every city block or two), to continue that infectious vector after the plans to boil the coinage becomes widespread.
I did caution my players to remember that germ theory probably isn't a thing in the game world, but reasonable precautions are fine and don't risk metagaming. To wit, one of them pointed out that in Game of Thrones someone had an infected wound cleaned out with boiling wine. Sure, seems reasonable.
Now to figure out how to fill another four days of in-game time before the first-infected start dying...
* The pastry and candy shop was named "Pete's Pastries" on the fly, by me. To which one of my players replied, "you mean Pete's Petri Dish."
First of all, thanks for the compliment. I hope that the idea of the House Porphyria villa in Lost End works out as well for your group as it did for mine.
Now, on the coin subject, it seems that 'germ theory' is not such a bad idea. The scientific background may not have been discovered yet, but that doesn't mean that germs don't work. The black death razed terribly in the Middle Ages and those germs didn't care whether men understood them or not.
With alchemists being a thing in the Pathfinder universe, concocting a germ-based disease is not such a far stretch. It also gives you two advantages: the coins do not detect as magic and anyone can disinfect them by boiling them. It can even be a great way for your PCs to contribute to fighting the plague, if they make it known that boiling the coins saves lives. It's an alternative way for your heroes to shine, so go with it!
So a few questions about the new and improved Yvicca.
Her Tactic says she uses evil eye to daze her opponents before going into melee, but there is no dc on her evil eye in her stats.
Looked up the sea hag evil eye ability, but that is not a daze effect.
Ah, but it WAS a daze effect when this adventure was first written. As an experienced DM who has often used modules from previous editions and had to update them, this is something I'm accustomed to dealing with, and seen many others run afoul of when not looking at a module in totality.
Pathfinder's Sea Hags don't inflict a dazed condition with their evil eye ability, but 3.5's Sea Hags did. Pathfinder changed it from 'target dazed for 3 days' to 'target staggered for 1 day; possibly comatose for 3 days after a further save.'
You always have to remember to go back to the original source material when running across something like this. The adventure was originally written for D&D 3.5, so look at 3.5's rules when noticing a discrepancy like this. (They're out there on-line, for free.) Even if only to understand why some odd-seeming statement is present in the text.
Also find it strange she cast speak with animals to talk to all those summons she can't make. But being able to tell the shark to flank does seem nice.
Again, look to the original material. She originally had 5 Druid levels, giving her lots of spell slots to use on summoning things like Medium Sharks and Fiendish Crocodiles, that would last five rounds each. Even in the updated module, she could still summon a Dolphin, though it would only last two rounds.
I ran the Carowyn Manor encounter about a month ago, and I took inspiration from this thread about adding the weaponized Vorel's Phage smoke bombs back into the scenario (they are mentioned in the original adventure, but no stats or tactics are provided concerning them).
I didn't want to make them too devastatingly strong, so I gave it a 1 minute incubation period, and then damage every hour after the initial damage. I started with the generic smoke bombs in the 3.5 DMG (which don't have a listed duration for the smoke... I treated it as 10 rounds absent any strong winds), and just added Vorel's Phage to it.
Smoke Bombs (DMG p. 145): Cost: 70 gp, Damage (Smoke), Blast Radius (20-foot cloud of smoke),
Range Increment: (10 ft.), Weight: (1 lb.), Damage Type: (–/none)
Smoke Bomb: This cylindrical bomb must be lit before it is thrown. Lighting it is a move action. Two rounds after it is lit, this nondamaging explosive emits a cloud of smoke (as a fog cloud spell) in a 20-foot radius. A moderate wind (11+ mph) disperses the smoke in 4 rounds; a strong wind (21+ mph) disperses the fog in 1 round. [Treat the duration as a CL 1st Fog Cloud spell, meaning the smoke persists for 10 rounds, normally.]
Jolistina’s smoke bombs also expose those in the smoke’s radius to a weaponized, fast-acting version of Vorel’s Phage (Pathfinder #2: The Skinsaw Murders, p. 27). To most victims, the phage causes a painful and hideous outbreak of facial tumors and a sickening deterioration of the skin across the entire body. [A different effect occurs only to those “of Vorel’s blood.”]
Weaponized Vorel’s Phage:
Infection — contact or ingestion; Fortitude DC 20; Incubation 1 minute; Damage 1d4 Charisma and 1d4 Constitution. Further damage inflicted every hour, rather than every day. Cured by two consecutive successful saves.
It worked out rather well, I got the entire party exposed with Jolistina's 2nd smoke bomb (the first was thrown at the party after they opened the doors to the manor; one of them kicked it away before it started emitting smoke), because Jolistina was invisible, lit the bomb, then held on to it until right before it started emitting smoke (I treated her as having been exposed as well), then chucked it at the party.
Two of five PC's failed their saves. Then combat ensued for several more rounds. As the party was securing the unconscious elf, and moving around the building while avoiding the infected smoke that was filling most of the stairway, the Bard and the Wizard/Archivist both broke out in facial tumors. Luckily the party still had the wand they'd looted from Vendra, so they immediately cured themselves, and recurrent instances of damage didn't ever happen.
With alchemists being a thing in the Pathfinder universe, concocting a germ-based disease is not such a far stretch. It also gives you two advantages: the coins do not detect as magic and anyone can disinfect them by boiling them. It can even be a great way for your PCs to contribute to fighting the plague, if they make it known that boiling the coins saves lives. It's an alternative way for your heroes to shine, so go with it!
I ended up settling on "contagion" theory, which was the understanding at the time of the Black Death. They know touching infected stuff is bad. Knowing that it's tiny microscopic germs... well, they know boiling works. That's about as far as germ theory has gotten in my campaign.
I have mentally added an additional "Korvosans saved" number to the number of people the party's actions will end up saving. I was thinking about 500 people, due to the curtailing of infected coins being dispersed by the Bank.
They have done fairly well throughout the module, aside from their multiple failures at encountering the vampire spawn (first time 4 of 5 PC's died; second time 2 of 5 PC's died, and 2 were Dominated). A few of them got bitten by some wererats (I threw one additional wererat at them, in the sewer tunnels long before the lair; it was a "teaching through bad guys' tactics" instructional moment... One was bitten there and failed his save vs. Lycanthropy [he even blew his last two Harrow points to reroll it twice; he rolled three 7's...], but a few others were bitten in that encounter, and the already infected one was bitten again by Girrigz in the wererat lair [and again failed his save; he also failed every second-chance save allowed via consuming Wolfsbane]). I guess the Fates want him to be a wererat...
Anyway, they just swam down to the Direption at the end of last session. We'll start next week with combat against Yvicca. Then they'll find my recreation of your map. I'm not going to put a glaring red X on it, but the Bard has a fairly good modifier for Knowledge (Nobility & Royalty), so a simple DC 20 check could quickly tell them what Lost End is, and a separate DC 15 check will allow him to recall House Porphyria's history with the Crown. Both can also be researched at a local library, if need be.
My party of PC's is nearly through the climax. They dealt with the Hospital up above one session, then last session they got 85% of the way through the Temple of Urgathoa. All that they have left is the VERY injured Leukodaemon, a second Leukodaemon that the injured one successfully summoned, Ramoska Arkminos, and then the last "inner sanctum" with Andaisin (and all that comes with that).
My big question is how to deal with the Conclusion section of the module. The early part of Escape from Old Korvosa presumes that Queen Ileosa has not been seen publicly since Trinia's botched execution. It seems that generally, most groups aren't expected to make it to "Saviors of the City" status, and thus most would only get the reward from Cressida Kroft. But my PC's have gone over and above, convincing the Bank of Abadar to boil their coinage, thinking Ishani's herbal brew (that he was making in the Soldado home) actually would help, an altruistic PC (Vow of Poverty) bought the ingredients in bulk, and worked with any Adepts, Herbalists, and healers in the city that he could find, to have this concoction made up and used for the sick. They even convinced the Crown to allot 20k gp to help pay for Remove Disease spells from the Bank of Abadar for the people of Korvosa.
For all this extra work, I assigned a "saved citizens" value. Despite a few near party wipes (only one PC that started this module is still alive), they have successfully completed all the little citizen-saving quests (Hungry Dead, etc.), and will most likely be seeing to the "patients" and prisoners in the Hospital and the Temple being healed and saved.
So they are very definitely going to reach Saviors of the City status. Even before entering the Hospice and encountering Grey Maidens, they began thinking that Queen Ileosa is being everything, though they have not publicly said as such (which would trigger Marcus Endrin awarding them the "Saviors of the City" reward, rather than the Queen). But I'm still very hesitant to have a public address with the PC's present before Ileosa gets her Crown of Fangs.
How should I deal with this?
Have Ileosa award the PC's at a public ceremony, but just have Sabina and lots of other Gray Maidens present, as well as having Togomor waiting at the edge of the ceremony, in case the PC's get some crazy idea?
Have Marcus Endrin do the ceremony anyway?
Have Ileosa do the ceremony, and presume that she already has the completed Crown of Fangs, and is wearing it, but in a concealed manner (such as being wrapped in a headdress/veil of some sort). Something like THIS, but with the crown under the head garments?
Any insight on how to avoid the PC's doing something they shouldn't?
I'm tempted to just go with Marcus Endrin leading the ceremony, on behalf of and with the thanks of the Crown. It will avoid problems, align with the presumptions of EfOK, and provide a personal interaction with Endrin just before his demise off-screen a few "days" later (really later in the same session).
Thoughts?
Why don’t you combine the ‘Saviors of the city’ ceremony with the demise of Marcus Endrin?
Ileosa knows by now that the PCs are thwarting her plans, while the PCs are getting a pretty sharp suspicion that Ileosa is evil. After completing the ‘Hospice of the Blessed Maiden’ part, the PCs will probably report to Kroft first and possibly tell her about their suspicions. The Field Marshal will ask them to keep things quiet for a little while longer, so she can investigate the matter more thoroughly and gather evidence. Until then, she suggests playing along with Ileosa.
Ileosa has plans of her own, she summons the PCs to the castle to ‘reward’ them in front of the city’s VIP’s. She starts off listing the efforts the PCs have taken to fight the plague, but then turns the tables on them and accuses them of secretly spreading the plague: the PCs had the bank boil coinage as a decoy, for everyone knows that diseases aren’t spread by money, the herbal brew contained an element that actually lowered people’s resistance to the plague, so the PCs fooled other well-meaning healers into doing evil, the PCs even convinced the crown to part with 20k, money they used for themselves, they also attacked and killed the queen’s physicians and concocted a BS story that the doctors were worshippers of Urgathoa, but no evidence of this could be found under the hospice … Worst of all, the PCs did not set these evil machinations in motion by themselves, but they were working with someone who has wanted to usurp the throne all along, Neolandus Kalepopolis and his partners in crime of the Sable Company.
At this point Gray Maidens surround the PCs and Marcus Endrin. Ileosa orders them to lay down their weapons and surrender, but Endrin refuses, shooting the bolt at Ileosa as in the AP as written, failing to kill her and dying at her hands a few seconds later, shouting to the PCs to escape. The PCs are helped by some Sable Company riders, who try to take them back to the Great Tower on their hippogriffs, but as they get there, the building is already under attack (since Ileosa planned her treason well). The soldiers want to defend their home, but they don’t want to drag the PCs into their suicide mission, so they drop them off across the Narrows of Saint Alika, in Old Korvosa, which is still under quarantine and so safe from the queen’s troops for now. (If the PCs insist on helping defend the Great Tower, you can let them. As the heroic but desperate effort fails, you can have the PCs escape across the water to Old Korvosa to start the next adventure.)
Hmmmm... I'm still debating how I'm going to handle the two possible public ceremonies. After mulling over the possibility of combining them, I had landed on doing them separately, with Marcus Endrin awarding the PC's their royal writs...
However, last session did not go as I had expected, and it was largely a series of setbacks for the party, and then recuperating, selling loot, and buying new gear to head back in to finish things off. So I have time to think over the ceremony aspect some more.
At the end of the previous session, the party had been beating up on the freed Leukodaemon, and damaging it pretty hard with Holy Storm, before it snagged a longbow from a PC, then retreated a short bit down the hall toward the inner sanctum, and (unbeknownst to my PC's) successfully summoned another Leukodaemon.
In this last session the injured Leukodaemon took up position behind the summoned one at full health, and they eventually started to wreck the party, hitting often, inflicting decent and consistent damage, and eventually starting to infect PC's with nasty diseases (I was forgetting the aura that penalizes saves against disease...)
The party successfully retreated, nearly losing a PC in their withdrawal from the pursuing still-healthy summoned fiend.
The next day the PC's returned, encountering three additional Queen's Physicians in the Temple (they had been out, "treating the sick" while the PC's assaulted the location previously), that were placed partly so Andaisin could use her same tactics of being alerted by her Status spell when one of her allies is injured/slain. The party ended up checking out that side lab on their way back down, encountering Ramoska Arkminos... and it is merely through benevolent DM fiat that they are not all dead... (they went in swinging, even though Arkminos' first act was to talk, and tell them to go away; he ended up Dominating a Barbarian and a Mystic Theurge, and the PC Cleric was bleeding to death before the party begged to talk things out...)
Side comment on the Nosferatu template... if the PC's attack and "slay" Arkminos to 0 hit points, he turns into a swarm (I prefer a bat swarm). A swarm that can no longer take damage, and cannot be destroyed via weapons (and unlikely via D&D Turning). He has an hour to harass the PC's, inflicting 1d6 damage to at least one PC every round, and causing bleeding damage. The PC's will have to flee (into daylight) or will be dead long before Arkminos needs to retreat to his coffin. Nosferatu are nasty.
Anyway, that's where we ended the session, which gives me time to have figured out what had happened the "day before" after the PC's left. The injured Leukodaemon and its summoned companion would have started to track down anyone to kill, as it implies in the module. So they went to go kill Andaisin (just about the only person left by that point). Andaisin was easily able to Dispel the summoned Leukodaemon, and then easily beat the 8 hp Leukodaemon into unconscious submission with nonlethal damage (remember, they wanted the Leukodaemons for sacrifice, to make more powerful strains of Blood Veil).
Here are my thoughts:
1. Andaisin would have gotten 2,000+ XP for "defeating" the CR 9 Leukodaemon by herself, so I'm going to level her up to 11th level (I had already leveled her up to 10th level, as per the Anniversary Edition, even though I'm running D&D 3.5), and reprepare spells at midnight.
2. Urgathoa has her eye on Andaisin and her efforts, and we already know there is going to be a divine intervention here as regards to Andaisin. I was flipping through Green Ronin's Advanced Bestiary (which the AP makes use of already, ala Dread Skeleton Minotaurs, etc., in Scarwall) and saw the Divine Guardian template... I'm going to have Urgathoa herself bestow the Divine Guardian template on the one surviving Leukodaemon, instilling in it a desire to protect this Temple of Urgathoa. It also explains getting the "extra" Queen's Physicians back into the temple (since the PC's now have the magic button for the cargo lift), as the Divine Guardian can Dimension Door within the site it is guarding, which would include the warehouse up above.
3. Andaisin will turn the three dead Leukodaemons (in the containment tanks) into undead creatures, though I'm struggling to figure out what undead creature templates I should utilize for this. Zombie is okay... though the Leukodaemons would lose all their disease abilities. There's also the HD limit; even with a Desecrate, two such Zombies would basically max out what Andaisin could create with a single Animate Dead spell. Dread Zombie from Green Ronin's Advanced Bestiary would keep several of those abilities, though there's no true method given in those "Dread" templates as to how those types of undead are created (just "magic going awry"... maybe another gift from Urgathoa...)
Andaisin also still has her Juju Zombies (another influence from the Anniversary Edition that I inserted into my campaign). Fluff-wise, I am treating them as Korvosan Guards that started getting too nosy at the Hospice. They were captured, and Andasin killed them with her Death Domain Death Touch ability (fitting the fluff means by which Juju Zombies come into being, ala Tome of Horrors).
Any criticisms or suggestions? The above additions will cause my six-PC party to reach 8th level prior to starting Escape from Old Korvosa, but I don't think that will prove to be an issue.
Should the cure that is devised via the research notes at the end of Seven Days to the Grave provide immunity, much like a vaccine? Or should it work to cure an infected individual, much like antibiotics?
Basically I'm asking if one dose should forever remove the threat of becoming infected with Blood Veil again.
Given the threat of running into pockets of Blood Veil in Escape from Old Korvosa, I'm guessing it should be the latter.
Thoughts?
When did most of you bring the bridges down between old Korvosa and the mainland? My group started staking out the hospice and after seeing some strange things came up with a rather decent plan to get inside.
While they spent the days/nights doing this I decided it would be a good time to blow up the bridges because I thought they were going to raid the hospice. Instead they forced their way in violently to the hospice then immediately deescalated the situation and stood down. I was shocked! listening to the DR’s spiel they agreed to leave And investigate the wererats in old Korvosa. But now they can’t get in there because the bridges are gone hahahahaha
Does the module specify the wererats are in Old Korvosa? I don't recall that being the case. In either event, I ran it as the wererat den being under the main part of the city, not Old Korvosa.
Yeah it does specify Old Korvosa and since I am using the Syrinscape audio add one it came out already. Mostly though they already built a decent arrangement with the wererats and they know there is no there tribe.
Well we finally got together and played again online. What a mess, the group started with a great plan to investigate that quickly fell apart. They knew the name of a guardsmen in F7 that they were out to rescue but because of that they missed some information there. Now they have basically come to the conclusion that something is going on there but that they are not in their legal right to cause a fight or scene. They have left to follow up on Dr D wererats in old Korvosa lead...
I'm looking for opinions on what Doctor Reiner Davaulus might do given what my group has gotten up to!
Short version:
They know the Queen's Physicians and Cult of Urgathoa are behind the plague. They went into the Hospice of the Blessed Maiden while disguised as physicians, made it straight from there into the basement and have cleared the place out, bargained with Ramoska Arkminos, and killed Andaisin.
BUT! During the fighting, Rolth Lamm dimension doored away. I'm figuring he went up to tell Dr. Davaulus what was going on down below. So my question is:
How would you have Davaulus react?
Would he leave the city, knowing that the jig is up?
Would he head to the queen to try to gain her protection? (In which case, she could hide him, say he's been executed... or actually execute him and then get him reincarnated... and then he can show up again later, maybe in book 4 with the Red Mantis... or Ileosa locks him away and they find him at the end of book 4 sitting in a cell...)
He wouldn't be dumb enough to attack the group with just a few Gray Maidens and Rolth, would he?
And what should I have Rolth doing? The group has been searching for him, and his father is still alive. (Gaedren was captured alive, arrested, thrown in the Longacre Building and was snuck out by the Curelean Society right when the Gray Maidens were taking over the building that way the Gray Maidens blame the arbiters and the arbiters blame the Gray Maidens.)
I figure Gaedren is with the Emperor of Old Korvosa so maybe Rolth is too? Then I can have that whole encounter be more of a fight...
Hell, maybe I should replace the Emperor with a slightly leveled up Rolth and Gaedren... Hookshanks was let go by he group so he could replace Jabbyr and he gave up evidence against Gaedren so his tongue being removed would make sense...