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How do you all keep the Cleric a fresh Character to play?
Our party doesn't even have a cleric right now. We make use of Healing Belts and many wands of CLW for most injuries. This is usually enough. There are also rods that heal ability damage and potions for the same.
If you make healing a party responsibility and set aside loot into the party treasure fund for it, it leaves more room for the cleric to branch out and try new things.
First off, why are they particular about the Healing domain? One extra point of healing per spell at lower levels still isn't that much, and clerics have enough spells that slipping healing spells into their domain slots seems to be locking the cleric into the role of band-aid IMHO.
That said, break that party stereotype and take two domains that aren't healing. That's easy enough: take any of the other deities. In our group the cleric was the daughter of a soldier and learned how to make armor (multiple ranks in Craft: armorsmith). She had 4 levels of fighter, and then became a cleric. Her deity? Sune, goddess of love and beauty. She was a fairly militant cleric of the deity, determined to bonk people who destroyed pretty things.
I think the key is to remember that a cleric is more than just a healer. Clerics are there to buff, to heal, to protect, to personally beat down the enemies of the faith. Build an interesting character in your mind and then see how making that character a cleric makes sense. Our warforged (current campaign) "got religion" and has been trying to proselytize to any other warforged he meets. Oh, and he was a former sergeant in a Breland military unit.
Really, healing isn't the only reason clerics exist. They're representatives of their deities. I'd de-emphasize the healing a bit. Look at the descriptions of the gods in Faiths and Pantheons (or other sources) and see how those gods look at the world. Your character should relate to their deity in some way.
That was a bit rambly, but I don't happen to be running on a full set of cylinders just now. Good luck!
My first big suggestion is "play the character you want and let the other players buy cure potions if they don't like it". ;)
As for clerics, I always thought a grim "undead hunter" a la Van Helsing would make a neat character. With the war domain (I believe it is), you could have fun laying down some smitey smackdown on all those pesky undead that the rogue can't sneak attack.
Point is, try looking at your cleric as "X that also heals," rather than "healer who also does X". With spontaneous healing, you have a lot more flexibility.
-The Gneech
My first big suggestion is "play the character you want and let the other players buy cure potions if they don't like it". ;)
Seriously agree here. I enjoy playing primary healing clerics, but you should only do that if it's what you want. *Great* suggestion above re: designating a portion of party treasure for healing.
"Oh, you want me to heal you? Good thing we collectively shelled out for this wand of curing/staff of life."
Plenty of other domains that are better for you *and* the group -- Travel for instance - great spells, and you can never get Held (virtually).
Whether you need a cleric or not is going to be pretty dependent on the kind of game your in. At some tables its not necessary as the DM will compensate for whatever the party lacks. At mine its nearly required as I roll the dice in the open and always play my monsters to the best of my abilities - I'm trying to kill the PCs.
So at my table a cleric is necessary simply because cure lights wounds wands just won't cut it when the DM is doing 50 points of damage to you a round and you can be sure that once your wounded all the monsters with any intelligence or cunning at all will now concentrate on you until your dead. That sort of situation means that the uber healing stuff is critical and only a cleric can provide that.
All that being said clerics provide a verity of roles in a party including back up spell caster and back up fighter. Demanding that the cleric takes the healing domain makes the cleric less useful in these important back up roles. I'm of the opinion that these back up roles are really very important to the parties ultimate success.
A few extra healing spells when the cleric is already a great healing adds a little more strength to the clerics strongest area. I suspect that its actually better for the whole parties chance of survival.
If the party is under heavy assault from two directions some one needs to cover the mage and the fighter can only be in one place at one time. Here something like the War Domain and some ability to fight is more important then a few extra healing spells when there is currently no shortage of healing.
Similarly if the mage is taken out of the picture for a few rounds, say by solid fog then the critical magic support role just fell to the cleric. Better that the cleric had a different domain in this case.
I think that you should forget the cleric.
And now for something completely different...
Seriously, though, I think druids are good enough. If you really want a cleric, though, I can offer this advice: who needs a healing domain? That would only be an extra point. Just make sure you get spontaneous healing. That is very handy. You don't have to select a single healing spell, but if you need one then you can just switch some other spell for it.
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IF you want HEALING ON DEMAND, pool some doucats and get me a wand."
Gods below, I've got the party so convinced that my archivist's spells are better spent on useful things that they've even let me scribe healing scrolls from party treasure. I still pay XP, but that's pretty small.
I also keep a close wounds on hand for them for emergencies and an inflict light wounds for me though (necropolitan). The rest is augmented summoned crocodiles and pie -healing comes from scrolls and wands.
Basically I can echo what everyone else here has said. The cleric is more than a band aid heal bot. If that's what they want, tell them to take the leadership feat and pick up a cleric cohort, cause that's all they want.
In the vast majority of cases, healing in combat is a lousy option (unless of course healing is needed to keep someone alive). Much better for the cleric to help take down the enemies faster so that everyone takes less damage, and then burn through a few CLW from a wand (or even better, lesser vigor) afterwards.
To really drive the point home, if you have a bard, ranger or paladin, or a rogue with UMD, give them the wand, and make them do the healing.
In the meantime, play your cleric how YOU want to play him (her). You want to be bringing the smack down with War and Strength domains, go ahead. I'm currently playing a cleric with the War and Travel domains, and bringing the smackdown with a Great axe, and it's great fun.
Of course the Orc Barbarian was dishing out more damage (a 20 str will do that), but I wasn't that far behind. Now the Duskblade (our beloved Barbarian died) can dish out more damage with his spells, but in pure swordplay (or axe play) I can usually keep up.
To keep the cleric fresh, play them how you want. If the party want a healbot band-aid, tell someone to take the leadership feat for a cleric, because there is no way you are playing a cohort.
Oh, just so you know, the healing domain is one of the weakest out there.
Just remember that you are nobody's 'Walking Potion(tm)' and if you want to play a complete battle cleric then you should go for that. Play the class in a way that you like and if the others don't agree they can shove it.
Me. I love to play clerics, yes I like to be a healer but I've also got needs. Needs that include smashing/killing/being the hero/etc and I will play to get those things. Need healing? Buy a potion/wand/character level. That and setting aside 10% of the total party loot for healing gear usually keeps those people well stocked, those things are the only healing-related thing that I owe them since they paid for them.
So yeah, give your party the finger and play whatever you want! Cleric powah!
Can't remember when I last had a cleric with the healing domain. Probably never.
The thing is, you don't really need it. You can get by without. In fact, I found that I always had enough healing power and still got to beat up bad guys with Righteous Fury™.
Get a cheap wand of cure light wounds or three and you can handle a lot of healing between fights without using up your spell slots.
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I can only think of three healing spells off the top of my head I would use. Cure Minor, for quick garanteed stabilization of a downed ally, Close Wounds (because healing the wizard as he sails by after getting grand slammed by an ogre tickles my funny bone), and Heal, because it's the only one that can keep pace with damage per round. Okay, I'll throw Cure X Mass in there too, since it can get quite a few people at once.
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I agree with most of the posts about picking other domains and using spontaneous healing being more versatile.
That said, I am currently a NG DRUID 9 with no healing capacity and no wild shape ability playing in the Time of Troubles (? -where the Gods are just coming back) in Krynn. I also have CLERIC 1 (Mishikal)/RANGER 1. So I have GOOD and HEALING as domains for flavor and am the closest thing the party has as a medic (before it was either Goodberry or Heal skill and time/rest). We have no FIGHTER currently and just lost our mage to a CR5 encounter out of the Dragonlance/Krynn Bestiary...ability damaged to death with one envenomed blow. Now it's just me and a kleptomaniac gully dwarf ROGUE ?/WIZARD ?/CLERIC 1, LOL.
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I also echo the whole "take the domains you want that fits with your character concept" thing. The Healing domain hits it's cap really quick. For example after 4th level it has no effect on CLW, as it doesn't add one point to your healing, it adds one level to you, so the +5 cap comes into play.
I personally nearly always play clerics. I am currently playing a cloistered cleric (from Unearthed Arcana) who has max ranks in a lot of the knowledges...I love Knowledge domain and lots of skill points. It really can help the party when you can tell them what the monsters strengths and weaknesses are. I am also basically the party's bang-bang spell caster.
I am also playing a cleric of Justice...think Judge Dredd.
I have probably played about 10 clerics in 3.5ed and not one has had the Healing Domain...
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Cleric is my favorite class to play, since they have a wide range of builds and may be the best class in the game. You should tell your fellow players you'll take their domains when you get to pick the fighter's feats and the arcane caster's spells known.
Now to domain selection:
Many start out thinking Healing is really for first aid, and Death and Destruction are for evil priests to be Really Evil. This is correct only to a point. Actually, like Glory and Sun, they also exist for people looking to build undead specialists. Similarly, the alignment domains exist not just to make your character extra fanatical, but also for campaigns focused on extraplanar opponents. The element domains are there for people who want to have buffs and offense that don't come stock on the cleric spell list, or for people who want to play very charasimatic clerics in certain non-undead campaigns. Animal, Magic, Plant, Strength, Trickery, Travel, and War are there for people who want to dip into other abilities, or who need to help cover other party roles. Luck and Protection I think of as domains to take when you want a cleric with extra cleric flavor. Because if you're the only person in the party who can cast, say, break enchantment, there are times when you absolutely must make that save.
As for the SRD additional domains, some are there for the campaign style where long stretches of time pass between adventures, and for campaigns with a lot of roleplay. The rest tend to support campaigns focused on a certain type of villain.
The group I play with is very particular about the clerics. They always want ones with the Healing Domain so they get the extra healing. In Forgotten Realms there are only 6 Diety's with the Healing Domain. So I kind of get a narrowed selection.
How do you all keep the Cleric a fresh Character to play?
I play the cleric as a complete character and not just a heal-bot.
Talk to the rest of the group and mention that clerics can do more than just provide healing. Also mention that bards, druids, paladins, and rangers have access to healing spells, so other characters can provide healing. Talk about pooling funds to purchase healing potions and wands (bards, druids, paladins, and rangers can all use a wand of cure light wounds without needing Use Magic Device).
Then, come up with a concept and choose the diety and domains to suit the concept. Want to play cleric who's a front-line fighter? Design a cleric of Tempus with the Strength and War domains. Want to play a cleric focused on fighting evil and undead? Design a cleric of Lathander with the Good and Sun domains. The Healing domain is really not necessary unless it's part of the character concept. BTW, the absolute best domain for a cleric to take is Magic: use arcane devices (spell trigger and spell completion) as a wizard of 1/2 cleric level and cast identify as a 2nd level domain spell without needing a 100gp pearl.
Tell them, "eff you, I'll take whatever domain I want. I'm not your effing henchman. IF you want HEALING ON DEMAND, pool some doucats and get me a wand."
Words from my mouth.
When I play clerics I occasionally do play healers (that is, characters concentrating on healing domain) so that's not a biggie. Thing is, I play then healers, not healbots. Healing, corporeal damage etc is big thing on what they think about, so they might be philosophically opposed to violence, or in one case unhealthily interested in it...
My healers are usually really good at what they do, and often very proud of their profession: they have secrets of life and death in their hands. Often they are surrounded by these idiots who just keep on hurting themselves, getting into messes they could avoid by little thinking...you are their big sister, who should guide them and scold them when they do something wrong. With love, of course.
Trust me, there are players who are much happier when I play cleric of Olidammara with a wand and spontaneous healing than when I play a healer.
Clerics require sometimes extreme philsophical thinking to be played well, they are rarely pragmatic. They have an "in" with a god. Don't let the others to forget it. Playing a cleric as a healbot is boring.
I agree with most of the posts about picking other domains and using spontaneous healing being more versatile.
That said, I am currently a NG DRUID 9 with no healing capacity and no wild shape ability playing in the Time of Troubles (? -where the Gods are just coming back) in Krynn. I also have CLERIC 1 (Mishikal)/RANGER 1. So I have GOOD and HEALING as domains for flavor and am the closest thing the party has as a medic (before it was either Goodberry or Heal skill and time/rest). We have no FIGHTER currently and just lost our mage to a CR5 encounter out of the Dragonlance/Krynn Bestiary...ability damaged to death with one envenomed blow. Now it's just me and a kleptomaniac gully dwarf ROGUE ?/WIZARD ?/CLERIC 1, LOL.
I used to love Dragonlance, but if you're anything other than a mystic, sorcerer or bard, you have to worship someone. Even the druids have to worship a god. It was then and there that I started looking for a new Campaign Setting.
I DM for a mixed party: druid, ranger, monk, sorcerer and bard. There's no stereotypical anything, really. The sorcerer focuses more on social skills, the druid spends most of his time as a crocodile, the ranger is a halfling axe fighter (so therefore not the min-maxed ranged artillery) ... Everyone can heal a little bit (monk has self-healing, ranger a few cures, druid a few cures, bard a few cures, sorc can use wands).
Any group can work, as long as you have an understanding DM. I don't even have to pull my punches, I just design encounters of an appropriate level. You don't have to go by the book in choosing EL for a given party level, and you don't have to base XP off of CR defeated. Make the game work for you.
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The only time I'd choose the Healing Domain is if I was going for Radiant Servant of Pelor / Lathandar / whomever.
Several of the Clerics I've enjoyed most haven't even been able to Spontaneously cast cure spells, being non-good Rebukers headed for Master of Shrouds or whatever.
If you are going straight Cleric, or taking a PrC that advances Domains (like that Paragnostic Apostle or whatever in Complete Champion), it's a great idea to look at Domains whose power grows with level, like Strength or Destruction. A +1 caster level to something isn't going to look that sexy at 8th level, whereas the ability to Rebuke Earth creatures (Earth Domain) is going to allow one to have a pair of Large Elementals following you around as 'pets.'
Depending on what Domains you pick, air creatures (Air), fire creatures (Fire), earth creatures (Earth), water creatures (Water), cold creatures (Cold, Winter), reptilian snakes and animals (Scalykind), spiders (Spider), oozes (Slime, Thirst), constructs (Warforged), etc. can be your huckleberries. A 1st level Cleric of Lolth with the Spider Domain and Improved Turning can have a pair of 2 HD Spider Swarms accompanying her (in addition to a pair of 2 HD Zombies or quartest of 1 HD Skeletons, since she can also Rebuke Undead). Spend the gold on a Wand of Cure Light Wounds and be done with it!
A low-level non-good Cleric with the Magic and Death Domains can use a Wand of Spectral Hand to get away with all sorts of behind-the-scenes Inflict / touch-spell / death-touch goodness. And since he can spontaneously Inflict, he can take all the healing, buffing and / or summoning spells he wants, burning them as needed for damaging effects. Plus he can use that Spectral Hand to channel cures, on people he doesn't want to get too close to, like the Barbarian who is now surrounded by Goblins...