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It would occur to me that much our rants and raves would carry more weight at Gleemax than here. I could be wrong, but given WotC's limited amount of contact at Gleemax, its contact out here in the Outer Rim is likely nil.
WotC has likely written us off or simply finds comments on its official board more valid.
Thoughts?
RPG Superstar 2011 Top 32
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It would occur to me that much our rants and raves would carry more weight at Gleemax than here. I could be wrong, but given WotC's limited amount of contact at Gleemax, its contact out here in the Outer Rim is likely nil.
WotC has likely written us off or simply finds comments on its official board more valid.
Thoughts?
Don't forget that the Paizo guys are still friendly with alot of the designers at WotC. It's likely that, even if they don't check these boards, they still hear the occasional things that we bring up.
This is the main reason why I'm suggesting here to place your rant on WoC board instead of targeting Paizo...
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WotC has likely written us off or simply finds comments on its official board more valid.Thoughts?
Been there, done that; I can't attest to what they consider valid.
I don't have time to politely fight with a bunch of ice weasels, only to be politely ignored up and to the point where I or another say something that can be seen as an excuse to shut a thread down.Additionally, I don't want to hear a bunch of people saying what a sourpuss, pessimistic, old and set in my ways, afraid of change grognard I am, and I don't want to tell them they're a bunch of fanboy corporate zombie sheep servitors.
In my own defense, and proffering the above paragraph tongue-in-cheek and meant as more of a sarcastic lampoon of myself than an actual insult aimed at anybody,...of late, i.e. the last month or two, I stay away from the 4e. threads here for the most part. Apathy is good that way. It keeps me from wasting my time with lost causes.
See? Lemonade from a lemon. I'm not a total pessimist.
I agree with you, Heathy. If I wanted to be attacked by merciless cold-blooded piranhas I'd at least take the trip to the Amazon. Well, OK, that's not fair to those on the WotC messageboards. But from my experiences there, your assessment is dead in the black accurate.
Should this offend anyone who regularly posts over there, I apologize. I could also have just had the bad luck to look into the wrong thread and come out missing an eye or two. Opinions posted here are my own and do not reflect the views of Paizo etc.
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I just had my 1st run-in with those boards and was quickly ignored by a contributor, and of course the thread got shut down. They are doing a great job of damage control over there. It looks like the "tell them they love it overandoverandoverandover" marketing strategy is what we will be seeing from them until 4th. Let me just say that I love Paizo for the fact that they actually know what their customers want and try their hardest to give it to them. What a concept?!!??!!!
I just had my 1st run-in with those boards and was quickly ignored by a contributor, and of course the thread got shut down. They are doing a great job of damage control over there. It looks like the "tell them they love it overandoverandoverandover" marketing strategy is what we will be seeing from them until 4th. Let me just say that I love Paizo for the fact that they actually know what their customers want and try their hardest to give it to them. What a concept?!!??!!!
Sorry to hear about your trip over there. Check to make sure you've still got all your body parts. Oh, and never regret being ignored-it means your contending with an egomaniac who's begging the gods to Darwin him/her/it out of the system. And always obey my god's demands, hehehe . . . .
Let me just say that I love Paizo for the fact that they actually know what their customers want and try their hardest to give it to them. What a concept?!!??!!!
That whole listening to people goes a long way, doesn't it?
And the nifty thing is, Paizo has a backbone. HMM doesn't please everyone, but they do listen and they do respond.. and even if they can't change things on a drop of a dime, they consider what they've heard for the future.
I've read a WOTC board just long enough to realize that I'd probably stop enjoying the game if I spent enough time there. (World of Warcraft boards were similiar when I tried it for a while, reading the boards made me loathe the game).
When Erik's famous "4th Edition: Paizo Still Undecided" thread first came out, I checked out EN World. I expected it to be Pro 4th Edition, I didn't expect it to be moderated by off duty SWAT Team members.
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It would occur to me that much our rants and raves would carry more weight at Gleemax than here. I could be wrong, but given WotC's limited amount of contact at Gleemax, its contact out here in the Outer Rim is likely nil.
WotC has likely written us off or simply finds comments on its official board more valid.
Thoughts?
Yes, I do think they're not checking these boards, and no, I don't think that posting on WotC's boards makes it more valid.
First, they have created a "doubt and criticism" forum so as to "not pollute other discussions". Basically, dumping all the negative comments into a section they can ignore.
Second, the amount of noise on these boards is UNBELIEVABLE. There are way, way too many people posting there.
Third, the amount of childish argumentation, on either side of the isle, is actually staggering. For one guy who posts doubts about 4E, you will have a crowd of (usually the same) 4E proponents who will start flaming EVERYTHING said in the thread. Systematically. And WizOs do NOTHING about it. Then you'll have anti-4E trolls that will join the party, and the thread becomes just another flamewar of "this word isn't defined like in the Oxford dictionary" and "you don't have the competence to comment on the game" or "yeaaah another thread of WotC is Eeevil..."
Not a great platform for serious discussion.
Besides, to be honest, I know it's too late to influence WotC. The draft is done, whatever they might be saying about the pseudo-state of flux the rules might be in. If you ask me? With a release in June, the rules had better be done by now! *shakes head*
What I'm doing here, on these boards, is trying to have constructive discussions with other fans of Paizo's products and have a real dialog with Paizo's team, because I know I CAN. And that's awesome. I thank everyone at Paizo just for this occasion to discuss the matter, whatever their final business decisions end up being. I've got nothing but respect for them, precisely for that reason.
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What I'm doing here, on these boards, is trying to have constructive discussions with other fans of Paizo's products and have a real dialog with Paizo's team, because I know I CAN. And that's awesome. I thank everyone at Paizo just for this occasion to discuss the matter, whatever their final business decisions end up being. I've got nothing but respect for them, precisely for that...
Amen.
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Bella Sara Charter Superscriber
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There are three major problems with posting on the WotC Boards:
1. The poster quality is much lower on average than here. If you say anything even remotely controversial, you're going to be attacked. And has been said above, posting anything remotely negative about 4e will result in you getting attacked. A lot. Plus, there are posters who have been chased out of our community that have a grudge against Paizo. They are always looking for a Paizo "fanboi" to attack, and will do so at the drop of a hat. This problem is compounded by:
2. Their moderation is terrible. Not only should you not expect a cogent timely response from an editor as you would here, you should be prepared for hamfisted moderators to come in and delete posts left and right. Such deletions are generally targeted towards posts that are critical of 4e. But in any event, changes that you will get any feedback from an actual staff member are nearly zero. Chances that they will listen to you and not just post about how 4e is really cool and you are wrong in your opinion are zero.
3. The abyss stares back. I cross posted a nasty-gram about Dragon a month or so ago. Following that post, Paizo had a stream of trolls for a couple weeks after that time. I suspect they came from the WotC forums as a result of my post.
Those are my words of warning. Ultimately though, it's 2 that is the biggest problem. WotC is not listening, and it's almost impossible to get their attention. They don't care what you think.
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Yeah, showing up on the WotC forums and telling everyone how horrible everything is, and how incompetent the staff is, is a great way to make friends. That would never happen on the Paizo boards.
Oh wait, it does regularly.
I guess making gratuitous attacks based on poor or incorrect information, or making personal attacks against critics is something only "Lords of the Board" are allowed to do.
Maybe instead of some of the pots here looking for kettles over there, they should make an effort to clean up their own act first.
Specifically Sebastian:
1. You showed up insulting Kim Mohan without having a full knowledge of his background. When people called you on it, you started directing personal attacks at the people defending him.
2. The moderation removed nothing but directed personal attacks. It did not remove any of the criticism. This does not compare unfavorably to Paizo where the same has been done. The only that does compare unfavorably does so against Paizo, as personal attacks are addressed much faster, more consistently, and more thoroughly on the WotC forums.
3. Cross forum trolling is a charge best leveled against the number of Paizo posters who showed up to support your vicious personal rant, a rant for which you were chastised here on the Paizo forums by both the Erik Mona and James Jacobs, to make personal attacks against other people who had called you on your poor grasp of facts.
On those three counts, you are the last person who should be saying anything about people making complaints being treated poorly at WotC. I have made numerous posts criticizing elements of 4E there, just as I have made a number of qualified posts opposing condemning the DDI. I have noticed very little difference in the "quality" of attacks directed at me for them coming from WotC or Paizo supporters.
I guess making gratuitous attacks based on poor or incorrect information, or making personal attacks against critics is something only "Lords of the Board" are allowed to do.
Maybe instead of some of the pots here looking for kettles over there, they should make an effort to clean up their own act first.
Oooh. Not cool man. Not cool. Sebastian may be a crusty old rules lawyer, but he was the first guy to put down his gun in the whole anti-4e thing. He wrote a whole thread to that effect. Respect, man. Direct your wrath elsewhere.
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Oooh. Not cool man. Not cool. Sebastian may be a crusty old rules lawyer, but he was the first guy to put down his gun in the whole anti-4e thing. He wrote a whole thread to that effect. Respect, man. Direct your wrath elsewhere.
See my additions.
No.
He picked his gun right back up again with this vicious attack directed at everyone and then some, from WotC employees to people who post more frequently on the WotC forums.
If he finds the WotC forums uncomfortable because of his past behavior there, that is something he must deal with. To try and direct other people away from trying to open up lines of communication to WotC because his poor behavior and personal attacks have closed them off for him is unfair both to WotC and other people who might be able to make a useful contribution.
Lords of the Boards is not an elite group of snobs. Anyone who cares to go to the Lord of the Boards thread and give themselves a title confers Lord and Ladyship status upon themselves, and that has been explained repeatedly.
It's merely a gag name for people who regularly call this forum home for their thoughts. Another word might be brother or sister, because LotB is our epic fantasy way of expressing some sense of family. The term should be above sarcastic attack, because it's a positive thing.
Checking the WotC boards yesterday I did find that there they are quick to go "Flame on".
I did saw Sebastian's Kim Mohan thread and yes he did apologize when Chris T. explained things. I think that whole thread can be explained thus: Sebastian was all for 4e, defending it and then became disappointed with it when WotC marketing made a mess.
Anyways, WotC boards get loads of volume and the noise drowns out any conversation.
Checking the WotC boards yesterday I did find that there they are quick to go "Flame on".
I did saw Sebastian's Kim Mohan thread and yes he did apologize when Chris T. explained things. I think that whole thread can be explained thus: Sebastian was all for 4e, defending it and then became disappointed with it when WotC marketing made a mess.
Anyways, WotC boards get loads of volume and the noise drowns out any conversation.
I agree. I think the difference is inarguably obvious.
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Bella Sara Charter Superscriber
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*shrug* anyone who wants to can go and read what I wrote over there any time they want. I did not attack any of the WotC posters in that thread, and I apologized to the extent that my rant was misdiected at kim.
And sam, I'm not going to get in one of the nasty fights you enjoy so much. If you've got something to say to me about this or anything else, send me a message on the system at wotc.
Everyone else here, please do not respond to the attacks above. This is exactly the sort of nastiness I was talking about. I won't be back to play this game with Sam. The last time he got like this, it tainted the community for a week, resulted in multiple threads getting locked, and someone getting banned.
Thanks everyone. Apologies for even drawing out this level of hostility again. Sam represents a common type of response I've seen on wotc threads, and if this level of discourse is what you are seeking, you can find it on the wotc forums.
I agree. I think the difference is inarguably obvious.Checking the WotC boards yesterday I did find that there they are quick to go "Flame on".
I did saw Sebastian's Kim Mohan thread and yes he did apologize when Chris T. explained things. I think that whole thread can be explained thus: Sebastian was all for 4e, defending it and then became disappointed with it when WotC marketing made a mess.
Anyways, WotC boards get loads of volume and the noise drowns out any conversation.
On the other hand, the thread that I was interested in, the Dragon and Dungeon submission thread at WotC, was flame free. But that thread also missed some WotC input, unlike the black hole thread we had here.
Ah well, so many voices, so many opinions.
It's good that you can always ignore all of them ;->
Yes, and you are SO welcoming of unpopular opinions here. I should be ashamed of my preference for that forum over this one.
I dunno. It depends really. I think there are a few of us around here that tend to Hulk smash people a little unfairly at times--yeah. Then again, I've really noticed a vast improvement over at Gleemax (probably more due to the fact that I get an opportunity to vent here all I want here to likeminded folks--so I can be more positive when I go over there).
I'm not sure what opinion could be unpopular enough to get you flamed here. I mean I hate modules and post frequently on a forum where modules are just about all they produce. I'm pretty aberrant, but I've always felt comfortable. Not to try and play marriage councilor or anything...but I'd be interested to hear your beef.
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Lords of the Boards is not an elite group of snobs. Anyone who cares to go to the Lord of the Boards thread and give themselves a title is confers Lord and Ladyship status upon themselves, and that has been explained repeatedly.
It's merely a gag name for people who regularly call this forum home for their thoughts. Another word might be brother or sister, because LotB is our epic fantasy way of expressing some sense of family. The term should be above sarcastic attack, because it's a positive thing.
Except when it feeds into territorial attitude exemplied here, and used as bludgeon against "trolls" from the WotC forums who dare to speak out against things they do not like here.
Checking the WotC boards yesterday I did find that there they are quick to go "Flame on".
I did saw Sebastian's Kim Mohan thread and yes he did apologize when Chris T. explained things. I think that whole thread can be explained thus: Sebastian was all for 4e, defending it and then became disappointed with it when WotC marketing made a mess.
Anyways, WotC boards get loads of volume and the noise drowns out any conversation.
The only Sebastian apologized for was not knowing Kim Mohan's credentials. He never apologized for the personal attacks on him or anyone else, and he was rather specific about not withdrawing any of those attacks when called on them here. His disappointment is not an excuse for that degree of rudeness.
I agree. I think the difference is inarguably obvious.
I see just as many threads here get overloaded with excessively redundant and off-topic posts, as well as personal comments ranging from merely snide to gratuitously vicious. The thread on the content and classification of the start of Rise of the Runelords is a prime example. 9 pages and long since past going anywhere relevant. I suppose I can look forward to it being smurfed to death eventually, covering over even more of the relevant elements.
The volume does make a difference though. With higher traffic on the WotC boards comes a higher chance of someone imploding a thread for their own selfish reasons. There is obviously no real solution for such available, as cutting down traffic would just as much interfere with the intent of communications. That was a regular issue with the Greytalk mailing list when it sometimes got locked up with a posting limit.
Paizo.com and Gleemax have nothing on this site. It's the best there is.
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*shrug* anyone who wants to can go and read what I wrote over there any time they want. I did not attack any of the WotC posters in that thread, and I apologized to the extent that my rant was misdiected at kim.
Right, that you were wrong in some of the insults you direct at him, but not in your rude and obnoxious nature of the post in the first place.
That is very typical of your behavior Sebastian.And sam, I'm not going to get in one of the nasty fights you enjoy so much.
You are the one who jumped in on this thread with the vicious attacks Sebastian, not me.
It is clear why you do not want to have to address the issues I have raised, and that is because you know your behavior is indefensible.If you've got something to say to me about this or anything else, send me a message on the system at wotc.
So you want to take your insults private to avoid public review?
Everyone else here, please do not respond to the attacks above. This is exactly the sort of nastiness I was talking about. I won't be back to play this game with Sam. The last time he got like this, it tainted the community for a week, resulted in multiple threads getting locked, and someone getting banned.
Thanks everyone. Apologies for even drawing out this level of hostility again. Sam represents a common type of response I've seen on wotc threads, and if this level of discourse is what you are seeking, you can find it on the wotc forums.
And this is quite typical of the sort of nastiness you like to engage in Sebastian. A drive-by sneering at someone in the hopes of shutting down any discussion, particularly of your inability to hold yourself to the same standards of civility you demand everybody else maintain.
The last time "he got like this" was because of blatant anti-semitism. You may have no problems with such vile bigotry, but I do, yet again demonstrating a very distinct difference between the two of us. I "taint the community" over racism, while you just taint it because nobody puts you in charge of deciding the business plan for WotC and the magazines.This is the level of discourse you brought to the WotC forums, and then spread back here so you could bask in adoration and congratulations for being so "brave" as to take on the horrible monster WotC. If this is the level of discourse people are seeking, you can find it here, on the Paizo forums, when nobody stands up to this kind of gratuitous bullying.
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And this is quite typical of the sort of nastiness you like to engage in Sebastian. A drive-by sneering at someone in the hopes of shutting down any discussion, particularly of your inability to hold yourself to the same standards of civility you demand everybody else maintain.
The last time "he got like this" was because of blatant anti-semitism. You may have no problems with such vile bigotry, but I do, yet again demonstrating a very distinct difference between the two of us. I "taint the community" over racism, while you just taint it because nobody puts you in charge of deciding the business plan for WotC and the magazines.
This is the level of discourse you brought to the WotC forums, and then spread back here so you could bask in adoration and congratulations for being so "brave" as to take on the horrible monster WotC. If this is the level of discourse people are seeking, you can find it here, on the Paizo forums, when nobody stands up to this kind of gratuitous bullying.
Wow.
Sam, my point is that the term "Lords of the Board" doesn't actually typify a pattern of territorial aggressiveness on the part of Paizo.com regulars towards newcomers with big mouthes. It just says, "hey, we're Paizo.com regulars." Why sully the cheery local term to make an argument that doesn't require it?
I don't see a lot of territorialism at play when trolls are bludgeoned. Sometimes they just deserve a read down and everyone feels it. They'd feel it on another site too. I don't see all posts, but I don't see people getting attacked for unpopular opinions, I see them getting called on their own scathing personal attacks against those who don't agree with them. Can I think of Paizo regulars who've done what you're talking about? Sure. Should they be sorry? Probably. But that rare occasion doesn't suggest evidence enough to prove consistent abusiveness from Paizo regulars toward those who simply disagree with them.
I've never bullied anyone owing to my status as Paizo.com regular. I don't shoot from behind the cover of associates. I stand out in the square with my six-shooters as Sergio Leone's wailing singer provides the background theme. I never wait for reinforcements, nor do I worry much what my friends here will think if I speak my mind because I was born painfully frank. If I'm slightly aggressive here, it belies my far greater aggressiveness in the real world, and so the internet, and any site I frequent regularly falls outside my own equation when it comes to why I'd go after someone. The only people who think I'm a bully are the bullies I've bullied for being bullies. Same as when I was a kid. Everyone else knows I'm just a questing jester named Fester.
I think we should respond to rich and Sam a few more times so that we can all continue this over a few more pages.
=)
Personally, I don't think there is a whole lot of difference between the boards other than traffic and sense of community--and, uh, I think we have better comedians, but that's entirely IMO.
I'm just going to point out that personal attacks aren't cool, no matter the media its portrayed in, and the thread is getting dangerously close to that, if it hasn't crossed over already.
To the OP - if they check them, we wouldn't know, but it would be a smart thing to do on WotC's part to check other non-WotC boards for "market opinions" or whatever you want to call it.
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Sam, my point is that the term "Lords of the Board" doesn't actually typify a pattern of territorial aggressiveness on the part of Paizo.com regulars towards newcomers with big mouthes. It just says, "hey, we're Paizo.com regulars." Why sully the cheery local term to make an argument that doesn't require it?
To get your attention and so make a point.
I don't see a lot of territorialism at play when trolls are bludgeoned. Sometimes they just deserve a read down and everyone feels it. They'd feel it on another site too. I don't see all posts, but I don't see people getting attacked for unpopular opinions, I see them getting called on their own scathing personal attacks against those who don't agree with them. Can I think of Paizo regulars who've done what you're talking about? Sure. Should they be sorry? Probably. But that rare occasion doesn't suggest evidence enough to prove consistent abusiveness from Paizo regulars toward those who simply disagree with them.
In another circumstance I would agree. There have been a few obviously egregious trolls who needed to be told go away. Unfortunately, there are two problems with the process here:
1. There is no way to simply report the troll and have done with it. On the WotC forums, I can and have hit that little triangle multiple times. A few times it has been for someone who posts at Paizo as well. Indeed, at least once it was for a particular Paizo poster who has called me, personally and directly, a "terrorist" both here and on the WotC forums, and who was directly involved in the forums being "tainted" by me last time. That eh individual has never been called to account by Sebastian or others speaks very much against that lack on these forums.2. Because of that inability to report, "policing" is left to the forum members to carry out by direct reply. In some cases those replies are controlled. In too many they are not. And as such that effectively confirms that it is consistent.
Disagreeing gets you stomped on because there is no other control mechanism. If you wanted, I could rant about how that policy failed utterly on GreyTalk and how I am sure it will inevitably fail here as well, but even I am tired of hearing myself repeat it.
I've never bullied anyone owing to my status as Paizo.com regular. I don't shoot from behind the cover of associates. I stand out in the square with my six-shooters as Sergio Leone's wailing singer provides the background theme. I never wait for reinforcements, nor do I worry much what my friends here will think if I speak my mind because I was born painfully frank. If I'm slightly aggressive here, it belies my far greater aggressiveness in the real world, and so the internet, and any site I frequent regularly falls outside my own equation when it comes to why I'd go after someone. The only people who think I'm a bully are the bullies I've bullied for being bullies. Same as when I was a kid. Everyone else knows I'm just a questing jester named Fester.
That is correct, you do not.
Others do, and to a point where it becomes damaging to the reputation of this forum and its participants.That is part of the point I am trying to make.
Likewise about bullying bullies, but then I love tilting at windmills myself whenever I get a break from sentry duty at Fort Zinderneuf. A nasty habit, but somebody has to do it.
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I think we should respond to rich and Sam a few more times so that we can all continue this over a few more pages.
=)
whEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEze
Personally, I don't think there is a whole lot of difference between the boards other than traffic and sense of community--and, uh, I think we have better comedians, but that's entirely IMO.
That is oddly one of the few benefits of a lack of active moderation.
It is easier to get jokes out in a medium known for its inability to misconstrue them.And no, their is not much difference beyond that. That is why I dislike attempts I have seen to play one against the other.
And no, their is not much difference beyond that. That is why I dislike attempts I have seen to play one against the other.
Well, then, that should do it. Let's not play one against the other, after all, we are all gamers and there's no sense booting each other in the heads.
To the OP -->
I imagine that the occasional WoTCer finds his way over here every blue moon or so.
I doubt they find our opinions less valid than those on their boards, but if they posted here, it would be odd insomuch as they have their own boards (kind of like Jacobs, or Mona posting over on WoTC boards on a regular basis) and their fans are expecting them to post over there. So definitely not a question of validity in my mind.
Also, we are a bit spoiled, to be honest. I mean Paizo designs games the way most of enjoy, in addition they play great PR and customer service reps too. This is probably because they have a smaller company, more freedom to be 'open' and, of course, seem to possess a great passion for the game and their products. I doubt WoTC lacks the passions but I think they are not as versed in being open with thier community. I think the blogs our a great direction in that step, and I for one admit that I read them regularly.
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In another circumstance I would agree. There have been a few obviously egregious trolls who needed to be told go away. Unfortunately, there are two problems with the process here:
1. There is no way to simply report the troll and have done with it. On the WotC forums, I can and have hit that little triangle multiple times. A few times it has been for someone who posts at Paizo as well. Indeed, at least once it was for a particular Paizo poster who has called me, personally and directly, a "terrorist" both here and on the WotC forums, and who was directly involved in the forums being "tainted" by me last time. That eh individual has never been called to account by Sebastian or others speaks very much against that lack on these forums.
You can. Just email Gary Teter about the offensive poster. I did one time; it was when either the magazines were canceled or 4e was announced. Somebody wanted to drum up a fistfight at the Wizards booth at GenCon or some such nonsense.
It's likely that, even if they don't check these boards, they still hear the occasional things that we bring up.Umm... No comment.
Great. Mike's a spy.
*sigh*
Now we have to kill him and take his stuff....
Creative Director
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It's likely that, even if they don't check these boards, they still hear the occasional things that we bring up.Umm... No comment.Great. Mike's a spy.
*sigh*
Now we have to kill him and take his stuff....
REMEMBER: Killing Mike only causes him to be reborn in a more powerful and wrathful form. He's like Charon that way.
Likewise about bullying bullies, but then I love tilting at windmills myself whenever I get a break from sentry duty at Fort Zinderneuf. A nasty habit, but somebody has to do it.
Surely you Geste!
It's likely that, even if they don't check these boards, they still hear the occasional things that we bring up.Umm... No comment.Great. Mike's a spy.
*sigh*
Now we have to kill him and take his stuff....
Do you REALLY want to take a shot at the ninja master himself? I'm crazy, but I'm not THAT crazy. I mean, the shear number of shuriken alone is scary. And that's if you're not garroted, poisoned, or just pushed out into traffic . . . .
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I used to frequent the WotC boards heavily a few years ago (I'd be lying if I didn't admit that my ceasing of activity on that board occurred about the time I started frequenting this one....)
In general, I found there were some good ideas, but they got lost in the shuffle, argumentation, and dross. Heck, I still check out the Eberron site every-so-often, but a lot of ideas are rehashes of topics that have slipped past the first three pages of threads (a common occurrence with so much traffic) or often fill the heading of what I call "personal fulfillment fantasy," in which they attempt to complain about wrongs done by their GMS or proclaim the wonder of their recent idea (often involving a super feat or item)--- I want everyone to see, I said "often," not always.
However, I will give credit to a few posters on that board, specifically the utter devotion of Keith Baker in providing clarification of issues and further insights into his view of Eberron-- the man is a machine when it comes to the number and depth of his responses, and I feel it fair to compare him to Erik, James, Mike, and others of the Paizo staff in their dedication to their craft and the community.
Also, I believe James Wyatt recently came onto the "Timeline Advancement" debate thread, where Eberron fans discuss the benefits of a timeline advancement in 4th ed, and worked to reveal the thinking behind this proposed plan,responding to many other posters in a thoughtful manner. Later, he announced that the timeline would not be advanced, based on the concerns and points made on that discussion thread (and elsewhere).
You're welcome to judge this interplay with as much skepticism as you'd like, but I found it striking that a main 4th ed contributor would openly acknowledge the effect the concerns and discussions its fans could have on the design process.
Great. Mike's a spy.
*sigh*
Now we have to kill him and take his stuff....
You just try it! Hi-yah!!!!
I just wanted to voice that I admit I've made some bad choices in the past posting where I should have kept quiet on the WotC boards, and getting my big gnome nose involved in discussions in which only distantly affected my product purchasing choices. DDMs, some adventures, and creature tomes are about the only products I feel I can work with, seeing how I've made it my choice to stay with 2e. I'm staying out of conversations over there from now on. They're all mad.
That said, I'd like to commend Paizo's staff for keeping these boards fairly civil, and maintaining an active and consistent presence on these boards. It's one thing for a company to push new material impersonally from behind a corporate firewall and say take it or leave it, but it's entirely another thing to not be afraid to wade in neck-deep into the messageboard swamps and find out what the natives want.
I also think Paizo's marketing strategies for their new products are light years ahead of WotC's, too. You don't announce something as huge as a new edition 11 months in advance and expect your boards to remain civil and your fans to be cordial while they wait impatiently for any scraps to be thrown their way. Heh. This is why Paizo's marketing model is the way it should be. I think the most I've seen a Paizo product's wait time be is like 2 months, maybe 3 tops? I can live with that.
Okay, so Curse of the Crimson Throne cards are May 08. It's still much less than 11 months. ;)
Sebastian, I just gave offered you a compliment but it seems to have been eaten (unless I failed the complicated submission process, and this too is entirely possible).
It went something like:
lol. Sorry about that.
For the record, the boldness and incisiveness of your satirical posts always draws my eye and I envy your precision with language, as I am a bit more florid in style.
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Note, sometimes I take a day off and don't check my email. Like today.
If you want to report an offensive post, email me at webmaster@paizo.com.Note, sometimes I take a day off and don't check my email. Like today.
Check your mail.