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Hi,
it will all depends on the kind of character you will play (roguish, arcane, fighting type or divine).
What books (i.e. races, classes, feats...) does your DM allow ?
What alignment & race do you intend to play ?
What is your gaming style ?
Without spoiling STAP, I would say Sasserine, where it all begins, is a harbour city, and you'll have water during the campaign.
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Well, first of all it depends on what everyone else in your group is doing. If noone else has decided, let me give a few recommendations:
Good Classes to consider:
Swashbuckler - you won't want to wear lots of heavy armor in a tropical and aquatic environment anyway. armor sinks REAL fast. So they're one of the better fighter types. Plus, it just feels appropriate given the adventure setting and style. My party has one and he's great.
Monk - see above, good fighter type with no armor issues
Rogue - every group of adventurers should have a rogue, this AP is no exception. You COULD do ok with a scout or ninja instead, or bard to a lesser extent. The point is that SOMEBODY needs to be able to spot and listen really well, to avoid giving all the bad guys a surprise round on you.
Ranger - again, it's a fighter type that doesn't load up on heavy armor
Mage / Sorceror - both are options, I might recommend the mage over the sorc for the simple fact that they get more feats, and I would highly recommend the taking of at least one or two Item Creation feats. There are long stretches of this campaign that take place away from large urban areas, so if your party wants items, somebody will need to make them.
Dragon Shaman - We have one, and his healing aura has saved all kinds of lives. This AP is vicious, you'll find PC's at negative hit points all the time, and the dragon shaman's healing aura will mean they automatically stabilize.
Druid - you might suffer a little in healing power over a cleric here, but I'd recommend the druid anyway. As mentioned, most of the AP takes place in rural areas, with lots of large, strange creatures. Additionally, again, I'd recommend staying away from the heavier armored classes, so I'd give Druid the edge over Cleric.
Classes I'd avoid:
Paladin - without trying to give away spoilers, there are times when the lawful good nature of the paladin will be a big problem. You'll be forced to choose "the lesser of two evils" on more than one occasion, and these are issues that are generally no good for paladins. Also, it's tough to use your mount on a boat, or in a jungle (usually).
Fighter - there are better fighter-type classes than plain fighter for this sort of adventure, in my opinion. See above.
Cleric - see entry on Druid.
Most of the rest of the classes that I didn't mention are ok, but in my mind, nothing stands out with them that would make them particularly good or bad. This would include Barbarians, Bards, Favored Souls, Shugenja, Samurai, Warlock, Warblade, and so on. You could certainly do them, though.
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In your experience is a really good combat Mage necesssary in this AP?
Khelvan.
Ah..yup. Spoilers aside, this is a very tough campaign. If you want to survive to get to the cool RP opportunities (which abound) you're gonna need firepower in the party. Since there's a lot of nautical adventuring in a city like Sasserine, those who can survive without armor or who can't wear it anyway will be in good shape. Sorcerer might be better than Wizard.
Druids might also work well, especially if you read Stormwrack for some ideas on how they work around water instead of just forests. If you want to sling steel instead of spells, I also like Swashbucklers in this environment for obvious reasons.
Have fun.
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Ok we will play in the FR Setting.
So what do you think about good Clerics?
Since you pointed out on Paladins having Problems how ist it with Clerics.
Some of the popular religions are good such as Lathander, Mystra, Torm,
Tyr, Helm ............
Do you think they will be trouble too?Khelvan.
We play in FR as well. I think playing a cleric of any of the LG gods might bring up some of the same issues as it would for the Paladins, though to a somewhat lesser degree. If you play as a cleric of Tyr, for instance, I might go with NG instead of LG as your alignment. I don't want to get into specifics for spoiler reasons, but again, this AP will force your characters to choose between the "lesser of two evils", and make agreements with individuals of a less than wholesome nature. These are issues a truly LG player might have serious problems with, especially a Paladin. Stick with NG or CG and you should be OK.
My group has a warblade in it. Now he does exceptionally well right up to a point where he might need to swim. At that point he just stops at the shoreline and refuses to go in (-8 to swim I guess). The rest of the party is made up of people wearing either light or no armor so they jump right in the water fine. Heavy armor wearing folk will have trouble in certain areas. As DM I left it wide open for classes on this though. I told my players that if they had the book and could show me the passages pertaining to the class it was ok with me. Same for spells and any other items. Our druid is using a Prodd with alchemical fire bullets now. (think light crossbow but shoots sling bullets)
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Sounds like some solid advice so far. I'd like to address a few things from the perspective of a player. For party composition, I'd suggest having one utility magic person, one blaster and a healbot for spellcasters. Full progression is best. You also need some beaters (more than one if you can swing it) for the front line and someone who can deal with the obligatory dungeon traps. Some of these roles can be wrapped into one character or spread over several.
When dealing with heavier armoured classes (knights, clerics etc.), I suggest looking at Stormwrack for Keeled Armour and the Item Compendium for the Crystal of Aquatic Action (least). These are cheap ways to mitigate/overcome the high penalty of swimming with armour. Either that, or play a race with a swim speed. We have a water spirit folk in our party, and she's hell on wheels when it comes to water-based encounters. I also recommend wand chambers for weapons (put them in your gauntlets!) and having holy symbols attached to armour/shields (Complete Scoundrel?). This will keep your hands free for weapons and scrolls.
I'm introducing my replacement character this evening; a half orc druid. The party just hit ECL 3, so I got to start with Lvl 3 gear. My big expense was armour. I splurged on +1 dragonhide keeled lamellar with a crystal of aquatic action (least) attached. This will offset the lower Dex and keep him from drowning in what has been a pretty soggy campaign so far.
In regards to a FR cleric, a Cleric of Shandukul would be a perfect fit. The portfolio (wayfaring and exploration) matches the going off to a relative unexplored land (Isle of Dread). The alignment of CN for the deity means that dealing with the various outsiders in the latter parts of the AP will not be the minefield that it would be if one is playing a cleric of Lathander, Tyr or Torm.
Seafaring barbarian and druids seem like great choices, while human is always a good race to pick for the extra feat and skill points.
One person in our group is going for paladin of freedom/barbarian multiclass (Church of the Whirling Fury). :)
Sorry about that.
In my defence, the OP did not specifically say 'No Spoilers'. And I didn't think it mattered in general since this area of the message board dealing with The Savage Tide is completely chalked with spoilers. You don't even have to go into a thread to see them.... just read the title of threads and you can notice them.
If "BoNS" were allowed I would recommend one of the classes from it for a fighter type, especially swordsage or warblade, since they fit well with the setting (and NO, I do not find them overpowered, cheesy or setting-breaking in real play.... actually, tehy do less damage than specialised fighters or barbies, but are tons more fun to play and GM )
Without going into spoilers, what you WILL need is good Knowledge Skills, lots of skill points, "high-yield" attacks and.... staying power (HP and saves ).
Ok we will play in the FR Setting.
So what do you think about good Clerics?
Since you pointed out on Paladins having Problems how ist it with Clerics.
Some of the popular religions are good such as Lathander, Mystra, Torm,
Tyr, Helm ............
Do you think they will be trouble too?Khelvan.
As long as your good cleric is of a mentality where using evil to fight evil for the greater good is an acceptable option there should be no problems. The Paladin can't do that - they can't try and manipulate evil against itself by many interpretations of the Paladins Code. They don't weigh what constitutes the greater good they just outright attack whatever evil happens to be in front of them. Their Code essentially prevents them from taking a longer or larger view.
As long as your good cleric is of a mentality where using evil to fight evil for the greater good is an acceptable option there should be no problems. The Paladin can't do that - they can't try and manipulate evil against itself by many interpretations of the Paladins Code. They don't weigh what constitutes the greater good they just outright attack whatever evil happens to be in front of them. Their Code essentially prevents them from taking a longer or larger view.
Stop stereotyping the paladin into an idiot. The paladin is entirely about the choosing the greater good. Granted, there are a lot of situations in STAP that paladins (and any other LG characters) will find difficult; not impossible, but difficult.
Having Dm'd about half of the STAP, I would go with Druid if I were to ever play it.
It is about the coolest class overall through most of the path.
You would be very happy with that choice.
I would have to just add in an agreement with Fiendish Dire Weasel that swashbucklers are the way to go in the STAP. Much better fighters for the type of campaign, and like he said, they fit the flavor nicely.
I would have to just add in an agreement with Fiendish Dire Weasel that swashbucklers are the way to go in the STAP. Much better fighters for the type of campaign, and like he said, they fit the flavor nicely.
Actually "Swashies" are about the worst pick possible IMHO.... if you want a light-fighter, consider a mobile hexblade, fighter/rogue combo (aim for duelist), or, if your GM permits the "warblade" or "swordsage" from BoNS ( not because they hit too hard - they just don't in reality - but because they give you skills, hitting power and a high degree of personal styling, plus working well with light armour situations ). Pure flavour amounts to little if all one does is dying..... Excellent fighting clases would be those from the BoNS (see my post above) but that books does not seem to be on the allowed list.
Then again, whatever floats your boat.
IMHO, the classes which provide the most versatile input into the STAP would be Druid, Spirit Shaman (yes, Spirit Shaman ), bards with a slight degree of multiclassing (yes, BARDS ! their PrCls can be monstrously effective in the STAP.....)and perhaps (depending on permissible PrCls) wizards .
That means - their abilities will be useful in every installemnt of the path plus survivability throughout.
YMMV.
Paladin can be great - as long as one remebers that lawful good does not mean "total idiot" - for one, those who demonstrably break the law cannot call fo its protection at the same time. Second, you have to do good - but not immediately,as long as there will be a comeuppance and reckoning. Third, there can always be "atonement". And fourth - who said that paladins had to be lovable guys ? A "Clint-Eastwood-style" paladin ( say a la "Pale Rider" ) can easily be lawful and good, he just may not appear that way..... (and it all comes down to deeds and intentions not appearances and delusions, right ?).
That said, Paladins will definitely be ethically challenged in the later part of the STAP.
'nuff said
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Thread hijack (kinda):
In regards to Paladins in this AP. From the SRD:
"Good" implies altruism, respect for life, and a concern for the dignity of sentient beings. Good characters make personal sacrifices to help others.
So no problems there in this AP, no Moral dilemmas at all.
And:
"Law" implies honor, trustworthiness, obedience to authority, and reliability. On the downside, lawfulness can include close-mindedness, reactionary adherence to tradition, judgmentalness, and a lack of adaptability. Those who consciously promote lawfulness say that only lawful behavior creates a society in which people can depend on each other and make the right decisions in full confidence that others will act as they should.
So no real problems there either.
and of course:
Lawful Good, "Crusader"
A lawful good character acts as a good person is expected or required to act. She combines a commitment to oppose evil with the discipline to fight relentlessly. She tells the truth, keeps her word, helps those in need, and speaks out against injustice. A lawful good character hates to see the guilty go unpunished.
Lawful good is the best alignment you can be because it combines honor and compassion.
I don't see how any of this implies a conflict with the Paladin in this AP. Paladin is a great choice.
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"Law" implies honor, trustworthiness, obedience to authority, and reliability. On the downside, lawfulness can include close-mindedness, reactionary adherence to tradition, judgmentalness, and a lack of adaptability. Those who consciously promote lawfulness say that only lawful behavior creates a society in which people can depend on each other and make the right decisions in full confidence that others will act as they should.So no real problems there either.
Disagree. The key part is "close-mindedness, reactionary adherence to tradition, judgmentalness, and a lack of adaptability."
Specifically, they would make a judgement based on a reactionary adherence to tradition, specifically, "Evil outsiders can not be trusted and should not be dealt with, because of their inherent evil nature." Their lack of adaptability and close-mindedness would likely make them unwilling to listen to counter-arguements about the "greater good" and so on.
And again, being a paladin is about more than being simply lawful good. They can never compromise their strict belief system without making atonement.
Can a paladin make it in this AP? With a good DM and a responsible, experienced player, Yes. Would I want to try? Not really. I didn't FORBID my players from making one in this AP, but I did warn them that it would probably not be their best option, and thankfully, none of them did.