Are they literally "samurai," with katanas and bamboo armor, or just sorta based on samurai?
Literally. Some daggone plane-hopping Oriental Adventures outcast introduced the tradition, and a number of the local elves just ate it up--couldn't wait to get proper accoutements, be schooled in the philospophical background, etc.
And again: Wrong thread?
GruB Gott! easy there... threadjack over. You can have it back now!
Are they literally "samurai," with katanas and bamboo armor, or just sorta based on samurai?
Mine are samurai, as in the samurai class from Complete Warrior, though all the Asian-flavored core classes are represented in the elven culture. The samurai is just the primary one. The elves wield katanas and wakizashis, etc. but their armor is crafted of insect carapaces, highly decorated and enamelled...those elves raise some big bugs. :)
As to this being a threadjack...this is a wishlist is it not? I'd love to see an "official" world where elven culture is based on Asian culture instead of being your typical tree-hugging, insufferable hippy.
Hmm, I just thought about it some more, and I realized that my "wish" is unlikely to happen for a few reasons. One the Complete books aren't part of the SRD. And two, samurai elves are quite a radical departure from "normal" D&D gaming.
Oh well. :(
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Hmm, I just thought about it some more, and I realized that my "wish" is unlikely to happen for a few reasons. One the Complete books aren't part of the SRD. And two, samurai elves are quite a radical departure from "normal" D&D gaming.
Oh well. :(
You insinuate, Sir, that we here at Paizo can't also create our own samurai class. I assure you that such an insinuation is incorrect.
;D
My wish list as follows:
1. Handouts. My players love them. More is better. What I really like is access to a PDF download. Trying to put the book into a copier or retype a handout to give out is a pain. I like what Necromancer does with its product support page.
2. Monsters with a purpose. If you are going to take the time to create one, let's get it in to the adventure. I have tons (well at least 9 monster manuals from WotC, Necro, & Monte) of monsters with no homes.
3. Side/optional encounters that can be used as published or as part of the on going adventure. I do not like leading the players on, so I enjoy the 1 off enconters that I can throw at them, but still has the flavor of the overall campaign arc. Maybe even a secondary bad guy that could reappear later. Or a wandering monster encounter that has additional details and could be thrown in at any time.
4. Tie ins to the GameMastery modules. I love supporting stuff that can easily be linked into the campaign arc. One of the things I like about Ptolus is that there is plenty of support (tactical maps, adventures, art books, etc..)
5. I love the big leader type bad guy. The more history, the more interaction, the more flavor, the better. No wimpy bad guys. Leaders with dragons as mounts are the best! It does not get any better.
6. PrCs. Minimize the new ones, but make sure that they fill an important flavor element. I liked what WotC did with the Ravenloft PrC's, and I thought that it fit in well with the overall plot arc. Generic PrC's do not do much for me.
7. The new WotC format is a huge space hog. For really complicated encouters, it is nice. But for an orc hiding behind a tree near aroad, I think I can handle it with a short stat line and a page number where I can find the orc write up. Back in 1st edition, the A series (Slavers) had a couple of tactical maps that were part of the index. To be honest, I thought that was perfect. I thought that the Red Hand of Doom was a good example of how to lay out an adenture. I liked the tactical maps that were included in the back. I also like the map booklet that was included in City of the Spider Queen or being able to download a map booklet to print out is great.
8. Use the Tome of Horrors from Necro. They have 3 books full of monsters. Lots of good stuff.
9. Demons, Devils, 'loths & Dragons....oh my! I just can not get enough :)
10. Half role, half roll play, with lots of behind the scenes details to all DM's to fully flesh out the adventure. I like castles and dungeons with lots of background flavor. I think that is the reason most folks like the original Ravenloft castle.
You insinuate, Sir, that we here at Paizo can't also create our own samurai class. I assure you that such an insinuation is incorrect.
;D
Okay Mike, your next task is to create a Samurai elf culture for Pathfinder. I'll even allow you to create a ninja class for yourself. ;)
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Hello Kirth,
I am not exactly from the "Grüß Gott" area (that's further to the south, but it's still a pretty close guess. ;-) ).
And sorry, I didn't mean to criticise you, I am still waiting for a reply from staff. But obviously samurai elves are more interesting than mundane book formatting questions... *eg*
Greetings,
Günther
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Hmm, I just thought about it some more, and I realized that my "wish" is unlikely to happen for a few reasons. One the Complete books aren't part of the SRD. And two, samurai elves are quite a radical departure from "normal" D&D gaming.
Oh well. :(
You insinuate, Sir, that we here at Paizo can't also create our own samurai class. I assure you that such an insinuation is incorrect.
;D
Not that sure about the restrictions of OGL.
Couldn't you just use rogues... and refer to WotC material as a valid alternative? (like: rogue 4 .... , alternative: Samurai, Complete Warrior, WotC)I know, maybe somewhat naive... ;-)
Greetings,
Günther
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My wish list as follows:
7. The new WotC format is a huge space hog. For really complicated encouters, it is nice. But for an orc hiding behind a tree near aroad, I think I can handle it with a short stat line and a page number where I can find the orc write up. Back in 1st edition, the A series (Slavers) had a couple of tactical maps that were part of the index. To be honest, I thought that was perfect. I thought that the Red Hand of Doom was a good example of how to lay out...
That's interesting.
Most critics so far criticised that complex encounters took up too much space in this format in contrast to small encounters which seem to work perfectly well.But then already some people from Paizo staff had opportunity to make their own experiences in this regard (-> Castle Greyhawk will use the new format, too, won't it?).
Greetings,
Günther
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What I really would like for Pathfinder is easy to spot analogues for the locations in the existing Adventure Paths. Rise of the Runelords will likely be in my hands by the time I start the Savage Tide. I'd like to jump right in with both feet.
Hell, the Isle of Dread is from Mystarra originally. It can be in the new world as easilly as Greyhawk.
Craig Shackleton,
The Rambling Scribe
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Hello everyone at Paizo,
Hi Guennarr! Now that I found the post you were talking about, let me answer what few bits I can. Keep in mind, I don't work on Pathfinder but I do sit about 10 feet from the guys who do. :)
=> PF will be a book. Even books sport some kind of introduction.
They do, and as I understand it so will Pathfinder.
b) reader letters (and your answers)
I know that reader letters are old fashioned by now (I am writing to a message board right now!).
This is a magazine thing, not a book thing.
Oh, as a second thought: I can imagine a clarification and FAQ section in "back matter".
Something like a Pathfinder Sage Advice section had been discussed a long time ago, but it's likely that if something like that exists it will be on our website.
Summing up, I would AP like to adhere to reader communication the way Dungeon and Dragon do.
That's extremely unlikely, as Pathfinder is a series of books, not a magazine. One would not expect to find reader communication in the back of a novel or D&D sourcebook, after all.
And I would like "back matter" to be more than just setting information and more rules and critters. Please keep DMs like me in mind who learned their DMing skills mostly from Dragon and more recently from Dungeon and wouldn't want to miss advice in the new publication.
Actually, I'd like to see DM advice as well. I'm a pretty sucky DM, so any help I can get is appreciated. ;D But I'm pretty sure such advice won't be appearing in Pathfinder. I think Wolfgang Baur plans to continue writing DM advice on his website, but I don't know that for sure, either. *shrug*
Actually, I'd like to see DM advice as well. I'm a pretty sucky DM, so any help I can get is appreciated. ;D But I'm pretty sure such advice won't be appearing in Pathfinder. I think Wolfgang Baur plans to continue writing DM advice on his website, but I don't know that for sure, either. *shrug*
I thought you guys had indicated some of the "back matter" material (i.e., the stuff that comes after each adventure) would include not only new monsters, feats, and prestige classes...but also DMing advice stuff on how to run a castle, and so on.
And didn't I also read James or someone saying there would be a few "behind the curtain" design insights shared in Pathfinder, too? That would seem like a logical place to include some DM advice material. Not exactly the same themed articles provided in Dungeon, but I think you can probably still get away with some support in that area as long as it relates to the adventure at hand.
Just my two-cents,
--Neil
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I thought you guys had indicated some of the "back matter" material (i.e., the stuff that comes after each adventure) would include not only new monsters, feats, and prestige classes...but also DMing advice stuff on how to run a castle, and so on.And didn't I also read James or someone saying there would be a few "behind the curtain" design insights shared in Pathfinder, too? That would seem like a logical place to include some DM advice material. Not exactly the same themed articles provided in Dungeon, but I think you can probably still get away with some support in that area as long as it relates to the adventure at hand.
Just my two-cents,
--Neil
I'd very much hope so!
Shouldn't there be a Paizo-specific difference between PF and any other adventure sequels books?Greetings,
Günther
Summing up, I would AP like to adhere to reader communication the way Dungeon and Dragon do.That's extremely unlikely, as Pathfinder is a series of books, not a magazine. One would not expect to find reader communication in the back of a novel or D&D sourcebook, after all.
Pardon me but that is akin to a parent telling a child they cannot do something "because I say so." It is not really a reason. In this day and age media crosses genre every day. It is time to do away with some conceptions about how different types of media should be done. A publication, be it magazine, book, or what-have-you should be able to include features such as editorials, letters, and reader submitted content without fear of reproach in regards to what is "acceptable" in that medium.
Now of course it is your prerogative to exclude those features but I hope for better reasons than simply, "they do not belong."
A good reason in my opinion is what you have already briefly touched on which is that a lot of that content is better on an online medium, thus freeing up more print space for the adventure and companion material.
However, there are still a lot of fans of Dungeon and Dragon magazines that do not have the internet or do not have a connection that allows them to download content quickly. For them they cannot submit questions via email and receive a prompt reply. It would appear that snail mail is going the way of the Dodo. I am sure they are a minority and have already been considered in the reasoning behind the decisions made for future productions but the fans deserve a better answer.
Respectfully,
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How about a bimonthly (or twice yearly) Dungeon Master's Annex or Council of Paizo (OK, I'm not a very good titlist), made up of articles to improve DMing, advice to players, etc. This could be perfect bound, as well, but include replies to emailed and surface mailed questions... (I think 'DM' is an OK term, since I see it in d20 and OGL books all the time; Monte Cook uses it throughout Ptolus.)
I can see it now...
"Master your game with the new GameMastery Postcards from the the Outer Planes! Every DM's #1 resource for better gaming!"
(OK, I'm not an ad man either...)
Please include an ongoing, "hot," war somewhere in the PSC. It's all well and good to have tension between countries, but very few campaign settings leave a festering war unresolved. I would very much like one to exist.
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Yes! With refugees and border incursions, and all the rest; some great opportunities for the PCs to get involved, either deliberately or as a matter of circumstance. Please, though, no 'Goblin Wars.' None of that Orcs v. Humans, light v. dark, etc...something more in tune (in my opinion) with the current themes in D&D: shades of grey, where right and wrong aren't necessarily that clearly defined...
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Pardon me but that is akin to a parent telling a child they cannot do something "because I say so."
It's nothing at all like that. It's more like "because it's not done that way."
It is time to do away with some conceptions about how different types of media should be done. A publication, be it magazine, book, or what-have-you should be able to include features such as editorials, letters, and reader submitted content without fear of reproach in regards to what is "acceptable" in that medium.
Maybe so, but taking the messenger to task isn't going to get you anywhere. There are massive, bureaucratic, and traditionalistic institutions that run the publishing world, and they are loath to change. They dictate what is a book and what is a magazine, not tiny publishers like us. If you want a utopian world where books and magazines comingle, you need to talk to companies like Curtis and Barnes & Nobles and the United States Postal Service (or move to Japan, home of mooks). Chewing me out for telling you how things are is counterproductive.
Now of course it is your prerogative to exclude those features but I hope for better reasons than simply, "they do not belong."
See previous paragraph.
However, there are still a lot of fans of Dungeon and Dragon magazines that do not have the internet or do not have a connection that allows them to download content quickly.
You're preaching to the choir, dude. We know that all too well.
but the fans deserve a better answer.
The answers I have given are perfectly fine and valid. I can't help it that you don't like them.
Have an Orc and Hobgoblin army that is allied and some dwarven enemies.
Pardon me but that is akin to a parent telling a child they cannot do something "because I say so."It's nothing at all like that. It's more like "because it's not done that way."
"Because it's not done that way" (in my opinion) sounds the same as "because I said so" (or rather, because someone else says so, in this case).
Maybe so, but taking the messenger to task isn't going to get you anywhere.
I realize you're just the messenger and it was not a personal attack against you, I'm just raging against the machine (as it were).
If you want a utopian world where books and magazines comingle, you need to talk to companies like Curtis and Barnes & Nobles and the United States Postal Service (or move to Japan, home of mooks). Chewing me out for telling you how things are is counterproductive.
I might have struck a nerve and for that I apologize. I was by no means "chewing you out." Again, I know there might be nothing you can do about it but I believe that there is someone who can.
I know there comes a time (and for some companies it is every day) where you have to examine the bottom line and make sacrifices in your vision in order to continue doing what you are doing. I myself am an independent game designer. There are some decent print options available (like Lulu and Mongoose's Flaming Cobra imprint) for small fish like me. I know you can't run a large business (and pay your staff what they deserve) operating by those means.
However, the time is rapidly approaching when those lines will blur. The big and little fish will all be swimming in the same pond. Someone is going to have to take the plunge and get the ball rolling eventually. Utopian dreaming? Maybe, but I think it's closer to a reality that some would think.
The answers I have given are perfectly fine and valid. I can't help it that you don't like them.
It is not your responsibility to appease me and I know that. Again, sorry if my reply bothered you, that was not my intention.
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"Because it's not done that way" (in my opinion) sounds the same as "because I said so" (or rather, because someone else says so, in this case).
As long as we're clear on the distinction there, we're cool. :)
I realize you're just the messenger and it was not a personal attack against you, I'm just raging against the machine (as it were).
Fair enough.
I might have struck a nerve and for that I apologize. I was by no means "chewing you out."
Okay then. We cool? We cool. :)
Again, I know there might be nothing you can do about it but I believe that there is someone who can.
Oh undoubtedly there are people who can make the changes, but most of them are uninterested in doing so. At least for now. At least as far as I can tell.
However, the time is rapidly approaching when those lines will blur. The big and little fish will all be swimming in the same pond. Someone is going to have to take the plunge and get the ball rolling eventually. Utopian dreaming? Maybe, but I think it's closer to a reality that some would think.
You might definitely be right here. I don't know. The problem is, the big fish are really, really, REALLY big, and they don't even know the little fish exist. On the other hand, like you say, the little fish can change directions more quickly, avoiding predators (like intersquids and printondemanatees) that the big fish don't even realize. Maybe the big fish will be able to continue swimming along, blithely unaware of all the turmoil in the raging seas below them, but maybe not. They might get sucked into the whirlpool of change whether they like it or not.
...
*blink blink*
I think I went too far with the fish metaphor there... ;D
...like intersquids and printondemanatees...
I'm confused. Which volume will these new critters be statted in?
Can you hint at a CR?
We cool? We cool. :)
Cool. :D
I think I went too far with the fish metaphor there... ;D
Heh, gave me a good laugh.
I thought you guys had indicated some of the "back matter" material (i.e., the stuff that comes after each adventure) would include not only new monsters, feats, and prestige classes...but also DMing advice stuff on how to run a castle, and so on.Really? I missed that post. But yay! :D
Oops. Maybe not. I think I miscontrued this bit of text from the blog:
Miscellaneous Crunch: Ah, the joy of the miscellaneous category! Here you'll find everything from new spells, rules, and feats tied to sin magic (a magic system tied to the seven deadly sins and utilized by the Runelords) to pieces on how to run and maintain your own keep or castle.
Empasis mine. And apparently my deluded brain assumed that meant how a DM might "run a castle" in addition to how a PC might do so. Oh well...I guess my 1337 "ninja skills" failed me. ;D
--Neil
You insinuate, Sir, that we here at Paizo can't also create our own samurai class. I assure you that such an insinuation is incorrect.
Thank god - the old one was a wretched mess. Less Miyamoto Musashi, more Toshirô Mifune, please.
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I think I went too far with the fish metaphor there... ;D
Yes, I think you did.
According to your example Paizo is one of the small fishes which big fish are unaware of.Therefore the small fishes are able to develop new stuff whichever way they like: the big fish wouldn't notice and wouldn't interfere...
Sounds dangerous... :p You might have to reconsider some of the ideas you thought to be too much astry from existing publishing standards.
Greetings,
Günther
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Sounds to me as if there were quite some people interested in finding DMing advice in PF.
You mentioned that such advice was freely availabe on web sites like Wolfgang Baur's site. If this was the case, why were people willing to buy Dragon/ Dungeon in the first place for so long? Just for crunch's sake?
It is likely that PF buyers will be almost exlusively DMs.
Why should DMs be interested in running adventure paths without getting advice on how to run them? Wasn't PF supposed to offer the full range? Adventure, setting information, rules crunch, and DM advice?
The fact that there aren't many books (in contrast to magazines: Dungeon) out there concentrating on DM advice is fact enough for not publishing anything like that? Instead the secure way is to publish at least six new monsters per month? I stay dubious - and am cool for christ's sake...
Greetings,
Günther
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You mentioned that such advice was freely availabe on web sites like Wolfgang Baur's site. If this was the case, why were people willing to buy Dragon/ Dungeon in the first place for so long? Just for crunch's sake?
Because Wolfgang hasn't started his series of DM advice on his website yet. And yeah, people bought Dungeon for the adventures. They bought Dragon for flavor and mechanics. I'm sure Dungeoncraft was a nice bonus to some (to those who actually bothered to read it), but I'd be shocked if more than 5% of sales occurred solely on the basis of Dungeoncraft. Our market data shows that, for the most part, people don't want advice articles.
Why should DMs be interested in running adventure paths without getting advice on how to run them?
I'm sure there'll be advice on how to run the adventures within PF. There are advice sidebars in our modules, and I think I heard James say he wanted to do that in PF as well.
The fact that there aren't many books (in contrast to magazines: Dungeon) out there concentrating on DM advice is fact enough for not publishing anything like that?
It's already been done. How many more do you need? There's Dungeon Master for Dummies, Robin's Laws of Good Game Mastering, Gamemastering Secrets Second Edition, and likely several more, if I cared to spend more time searching for them.
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According to your example Paizo is one of the small fishes which big fish are unaware of.
Therefore the small fishes are able to develop new stuff whichever way they like: the big fish wouldn't notice and wouldn't interfere...
Sounds dangerous... :p You might have to reconsider some of the ideas you thought to be too much astry from existing publishing standards.
You should also read the post I put up before that one. The big fish in my analogy aren't just the major publishing houses. They are also the distributors and printers, by whose rules we little fish must play, for they are large and we are small and crunchy (and taste good with tartar sauce). ;)
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You mentioned that such advice was freely availabe on web sites like Wolfgang Baur's site. If this was the case, why were people willing to buy Dragon/ Dungeon in the first place for so long? Just for crunch's sake?Because Wolfgang hasn't started his series of DM advice on his website yet. And yeah, people bought Dungeon for the adventures. They bought Dragon for flavor and mechanics. I'm sure Dungeoncraft was a nice bonus to some (to those who actually bothered to read it), but I'd be shocked if more than 5% of sales occurred solely on the basis of Dungeoncraft. Our market data shows that, for the most part, people don't want advice articles.
I'm one of those people who actually does like advice articles. Or, to be more specific, 'How this was done' articles. I'm a sucker for watching the creation process, particularly since I'm trying to get into the writing part of things (I have a ways to go, and not enough time, but if I never start it'll never happen). I missed the start of Mr Baur's Ghoul Empire world building project, but I'm keeping an eye out for more of his stuff.
It's already been done. How many more do you need? There's Dungeon Master for Dummies, Robin's Laws of Good Game Mastering, Gamemastering Secrets Second Edition, and likely several more, if I cared to spend more time searching for them.
Just let me take a moment to highly recommend Dungeon Master for Dummies. It's a very well written and constructed book for the starting DM, and contains information useful even to more experienced DMs. The section on campaign construction is good, as is most of the advice on player/DM relations.
Let me be part of the vocal minority (apparently) as well. While I've been DMing off and on for 20 years or so, I've always liked the Dungeoncraft and other articles like it. I find the creation process of others intriguing and I can usually pick up good tips and tricks for my own campaign.
I've especially liked the campaign journal for Tyralandi Scrimm by James Jacobs since it took something familiar (the Age of Worms AP) and provided a bit more of the background material of how another DM went about running that game, in the guise of a character's viewpoint. Similarly the AOWAP campaign journal by Balabar has been a good read for the same reason.
I also like the Jason Bulmahn DM's Eberron thread if only so I can poke fun at Mike McArtor. ;)
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How about a bimonthly (or twice yearly) Dungeon Master's Annex or Council of Paizo (OK, I'm not a very good titlist), made up of articles to improve DMing, advice to players, etc. This could be perfect bound, as well, but include replies to emailed and surface mailed questions... (I think 'DM' is an OK term, since I see it in d20 and OGL books all the time; Monte Cook uses it throughout Ptolus.)
I can see it now...
"Master your game with the new GameMastery Postcards from the Outer Planes! Every DM's #1 resource for better gaming!"
(OK, I'm not an ad man either...)
When I suggested this (the above comments) earlier today, what I did not mean was a collection of articles in the vein of "Dungeoncraft," but rather "Savage Tidings" and "Wormfood." In fact, the latter is precisely what I was thinking, but not articulating well at all (somewhat akin to this post :\ ). Naturally, that would mean it would have to be bimonthly, or at the least published at the midpoint of an AP. Maybe a PDF supplement?
At any rate, "...Tidings" and "Wormfood" were integral to how I ran the adventures, and I see one as the logical accompaniment to the other. Maybe "Runes" or "Runestones," something with additional spice for the AP that I can add to taste.
As I understand your postings, "back matter" is supposed to contain adventure specific back up material whereas Dungeoncraft provides general DM'ing advice from some of the most experienced industry's designers and DMs.
I hereby propose that the "back matter" be known as "Off the Path."
I officially grant Paizo a license to use my term in perpetuity.
El Skootro
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It's already been done. How many more do you need? There's Dungeon Master for Dummies, Robin's Laws of Good Game Mastering, Gamemastering Secrets Second Edition, and likely several more, if I cared to spend more time searching for them.
If it comes down to this argument: Everything has been done before.
New monsters, new adventures, new campaign worlds, and new DMing advice.But you made your point very clear. If this is Paizo's official point of view then there are only two possiblities: Take it or leave it.
Greetings,
Günther
P.S.
Two out of three titles you mentioned above, aren't available any more - at least not for any reasonable price on amazon. Maybe an unfilled niche in Paizo's web shop?
Creative Director
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Pathfinder is 96 pages long. Of those pages 44–50 will generally be adventure. The rest is a grab bag of support material, combining the type of articles that supported the Dungeon Adventure Paths (such as Wormfood, Savage Tidings, city backdrops, etc.) with even more articles similar in vein to monster ecologies, Core Beliefs, Demonomicon, and the Creature Catalog. There's not going to be a recurring DM advice column like Dungeoncraft, but there WILL be regular "Designer/Editor Notes" in each volume similar to those you saw in "Red Hand of Doom." Think of them as the commentary track for the adventure. In fact, I'd like to see Pathfinder serve not only as a pre-done adventure for busy GMs out there, but also as a sort of "how to" book that, over the course of an Adventure Path, provides lots of tips and advice on how to build your own adventures.
And of course, these messageboards aren't going anywhere. If anyone ever has a question about something in Pathfinder, you need only post that question here and chances are good that I'll answer it within 24 hours.