NEW PAIZO PRODUCT: Item Cards

[Hojas]

Fake Healer wrote:

I just need to say this. Paizo staff has won me over to the card idea. I will keep an open mind to the randomized aspect because of the sheer variety and equal commonality (did I just make up a word?) of the cards. I think this product could be a real boon to DM's trying to inject a bit of tactile flavor. I have used props for decades in the game and I love the idea of handing a player what they found instead of trying to come up with a unique description of the 85th longsword that they stumble across.

I was very vocal in voicing my dislike of this product, but due to the dedication of Paizo's staff in trying to explain all the myriad details, I have been educated and find that my early opinion was wrong and came from an uninformed stance.
Sorry to run the Paizites through the ringer, but I'm glad you guys took the time to address the concerns out there.
I still hate the term "randomization", but I think this is one of a very, very limited times when the concept works.
Thanks again Paizites!

FH

Amen brother! I think the Paizo staff should also understand that a lot of us freak out when we see the word "random" because of those &%&*%&*% minis that so many of us only use for our weekly RPG games. I get so mad when I think about the money I have dropped on the minis for my AoW campaign. I swear to god I am going to go light my pile of "young masters" and "Fiendish T-rex"(seriously, a &&^%$# dinosaur as a huge mini???!!) on fire right after I finish typing this post. I might as well start using "homies" in my campaign. Back to the topic though, I like the cards now too!!

[Carnivore]

Some of my players actually came up with ways to organize magic item cards (I was using 3x5s) but alas, they still lost them - and usually at inoppurtune times. Oh well.

On fiendish T-rexes: I see I am not the only one to get all of them! I bought 12 total boxes of "giants of legend" and got 7 of those guys. I traded one and since I could not unload my other 5 available (I was intent on keeping one) I gave them to my buddy who owns a game shop last year to sell. He still has them.

The DnD minis thing ended for me recently when I picked up 2 boxes of "wardrums" from different stores on different days and they were almost identicle in contents.

[Fake Healer]

Fake Healer wrote:

I just got my 2 decks of Item cards today in the mail.

First Impressions- I love them, they are of a good variety and should work really well.
I think that the artwork is cool BUT I wish the items didn't look so rough. I always picture magic items as flawless examples of whatever they are with etchings, symbols, and other visual trappings. These tend to look more tribal, coarse, and unrefined than I like, especially the jewelry.
Also a double sword would need a much longer handle to use two-handed then the picture shows without lopping of one's own arm.

Overall, I really like them and will be picking up boosters as needed. These will be a big boon to my game. I just hope some of the other packs' artwork is more in line with my personal taste.

FH

[dougnoel]

When I first saw these in the Paizo email, I said , "Cool!" Then I went to the site and saw the words, "Random Booster Packs." This immediately turned me off. I then decided to read the end of this thread two weeks later. I saw the comment about all the helpful Paizo staff comments. So I skimmed the thread and read the staff comments. I now like the idea even more.

A few thoughts for Paizo.

1.) In reference to these comments:

Lisa Stevens wrote:

We will sell these item cards as singles in some fashion on paizo.com here ... and the price will be the same for each card whether it is a potion or a trident or whatever. No high priced rare cards here. There aren't any rare cards...each card is exactly as common as each other card.

Make that information known in the advertisement. As was pointed out by one of your staffers, most of your customers are not reading this thread. I have never subscribed to the random booster pack idea. I've been a gamer since I was 10, and it's never made sense to me. So when I see those words I opt out. It's a neat idea, so I would suggest taking this predjudice into account when marketing these items. I fall into your major marketing bracket for a while yet, and while I have disposable income, I'm not a colelctor. I always want to feel I'm getting value for my money.

2.) I would love to see a run of these in Dungeon in relation to an adventure. Similar to the monster tokens a while back. I think you would hook a lot of people on them that way.

3.) The ratios of items is a bit wonky IMO. In my experience (see below) the items I use cards for the most are:
1.> Potions
2.> Weapons
3.> Amulets/Rings/Gems (mundane and magical)/Wondrous Items
4.> Armor/Shields/Bracers
5.> Wands
6.> Rods/Scrolls
7.> Staves/Ammunition

The most glaring excess (in Pack 2) for me is staves. I think I've given away one magical staff in the last two years. I would prefer to see more exotic weapons. It would be nice to see a larger sword choice, such as scimitar, bastard sword, greatsword, greataxe, rapier, katana, wakizashi, urgosh, etc.

Perhaps booster packs such as oriental weapons, monk weapons, barbarian weapons, etcetera would work well.

5.) I give out mundane item cards as well. Perhaps this is in your dragon hoard pack. If not, I use things like bags of gems, piles of coins, etc. I find pictures of real coins and then use them to represent ancient coinage. I also use just random things like bags, boxes, statuettes etc for random treasure and/or as semi-magical items. It'd be nice to see some of this show up (and I see a little bit in pack 2.)

6.) Someone else mentioned blank cards. I would like these for the sole purpose of being able to hand out cards for everything. They're a bit sturdier, and I'd love to just paste existing pictures on blank cards and put the info on the back. I could use at least a half hundred of these just to get going.

7.) Bags of holding. You should think about marketing bags of holding for cards. Actual bags that can be used to represent magical (and mundane) containers. Keeps your cards and dice all in one place. If they're simple cloth bags, they could be written upon. Of course we could just put them in those binder sleeves as well, but my experience is that they always seem to fall out regardless of the method you use to store them. Since these are actual cards, they would hold up inside actual bags better and be more likely to stay together.

A few thoughts for DMs.

1.) I have been creating my own item cards for over two years now. I find just the right image on the net. I then print out two copies of the item. One pre-identified and one after identification. On the second card I include every game stat, including the price. In the case of sepcial items, I usually leave blanks or somehow indicate that there are more powers to discover. In these cases I print a full version to keep in my notes. You could do something similar, except all you would need to do is print out a little piece of paper with the ID'd info to attach to the back when the party identifies the item. If you tape them on, this makes the items cards more reusable. Resuability definitely goes up for these things as your party level increases.

2.) In my high-level campaign, these cards makes cashing in items easy for the players. If they need 20,000 gp to create a guardian golem to protect a city, they all look at their accumulated cards and decide what they can throw in the pot. It's kinda like playing Monopoly. It also makes trading the items between players easy.

3.) For containers (like bags of holding) I tape an item description to the front of an envelope. The chaarcter's name goes on the envelope. This helps when tryign to figure out how to haul out a dragon hoard. The size/weight limit is on the outside of the envelope. Players just fill the envelope to capacity and we spend less time worrying about carrying capacity.

4.) When using disposable items like potions, I put checkboxes representing the number of like items a character has. each time they drink one, they check off a box. I use a similar system for charged items, and each time they use one, I check against my notes to see if they're near the limit for the item. If not I don't worry about it for the adventure, if so I watch the number of uses that session.

5.) When handing out generic treasure, you can always give out blank cards. If the players aren't going to keep any +1 swords, then don't write anything on the cards. When they're sold, throw them back in the DM pile. Even if you do write on them, I often reuse cards, especially generic ones when giving out NPC treasure. Once you get used to using cards, both you and the players prefer to have a card, even if it's just a post-it note.

*clink, clink*
Doug

[Hojas]

I just ordered the 1st item pack. I can't wait to see them.

[Phil C.]

Erik Mona wrote:

Have you guys seen these?

I'm interested in your thoughts, as DMs, on using a product like this.

Thanks!

--Erik Mona

I looked at them, but they seem mildly generic. I understand that it's necessary to do so, but what if the dagger they find isn't so decorative? I think it's a bad idea to give someone a picture that doesn't actually correspond to what they've got. Handy for keeping track of items, though.

[Loviatar's Whipping Boy]

Erik Mona wrote:

Have you guys seen these?

I'm interested in your thoughts, as DMs, on using a product like this.

Thanks!

--Erik Mona

bit of a bump for this thread, just spent the last few minutes reading it, very entertaining

so has anyone actually used the cards in a game yet? any comments on their practicality, durability etc

i'm surprised no geezers like myself have chimed in on their experience with the 2e card sets (wizard spells, cleric spells, psionic powers, and MAGIC ITEMS) - don't get me started on the 1e monster card packs! how quaint they seem now
all still happily gathering dust in storage, never used. despite how primitive they compare to the new art, my first thought was "am i going to let my pizza/chip/chinese food eating, hygiene-questionable-enough-to-attract-carrion-crawlers group of drooling card-benders get their greasy paws on these? NEVER!!" an opinion hardly likely to change even if my 3e group seems interested in the new version. i say let them buy it themselves or let them eat photocopy!
point taken about lamination but that would perhaps spoil their resale value in the year 20xx when someone as desperate as me to recapture their youth and beauty wants to buy a pristine set at a premium to get a transient rush of nostalgia (which i just got from a few minutes of reading these boards - luvly!)

mayhem out

[James Thomas]

Erik Mona wrote:

Have you guys seen these?

I'm interested in your thoughts, as DMs, on using a product like this.

Thanks!

--Erik Mona

I've been using VShane's product at RPG Now for a few years now, and I create my own cards. I make one for every significan item a character has. My players love them, though they require a bit of prep time to locate an appropriate image, print out and detail. I think I'll check out Paizo's product. Looks high quality...

[Festivus]

Spell Cards of this quality would be something I wouldn't even think twice about buying, far more useful in this form factor than Item Cards.

Edit: Hah, I should read the entire thread before posting :)

[Chris Manos]

Alrighty, just saw this topic.

Erik, Way back when, I had the box of magical item cards from TSR. Must have been 2nd Edition. Heck. I might even still have them stuffed in a box somewhere. I don't recall if they got sold off with all of my 2nd Ed stuff.

I think the cards themselves are a great idea. These days I'm content to write stuff on a 3x5 card. But I will admit that when I saw the pack on Paizo.com, it sparked my interest. For one thing, I think you guys have really helped make D&D what it is, and I want to support that.

Random Booster Packs. I stopped buying these things 8 years ago when I stopped buying Magic cards. I have disposable income, and if I want a card, I'll go out and buy the card I want, instead of paying $4 for a crap shoot.

I haven't checked. Is there a place on the paizo.com site where we can buy the individual cards? This would be an excellent idea, so, when a DM is planning on running an adventure, he/she could go to the site and order all the cards for the specific adventure.

I'll probably be picking up the core deck sooner or later. Maybe one booster pack as well. Other than that, I'll be looking for a place where I can buy the individual cards.

[Celric]

Chris Manos wrote:

Alrighty, just saw this topic.

Erik, Way back when, I had the box of magical item cards from TSR. Must have been 2nd Edition. Heck. I might even still have them stuffed in a box somewhere. I don't recall if they got sold off with all of my 2nd Ed stuff.

I have these as well and had to go looking for them when the idea first was brought up about the new item packs.

Ok. Here are my thoughts: I like them, my players like them and we use them during the game seemlessly. I love the fact that I can, as the DM, write down what the item is and then not have to tell everyone right away if the item isn't self-identifying. (As an aside, I have found that players that moan to just tell them what an item is, for whatever good reason they can come up with, is the thing that most gets under my shin as a DM). My players like the artwork, the portability, and probably don't like that I can now visually keep track of the items they have.

I don't like the length of time it takes between deck and booster packs. I own a deck and the money I spent was well worth it. Now, if I want a visual card to depict the polearm the fighter just found or the different shields, amulets, etc that the party is carrying, I have to either buy another deck with the same artwork (unlikely) or wait for the new boosters to arive. I am not one of those guys that loathes boosters and I don't find them a waste of money at all in the same way that I don't find my subscription to Dungeon Magazine a waste of money - even if we're unlikely to run any adventures in the magazine there are still elements that can be used from them all.

Just thought I'd share

[Vic Wertz]

Chris Manos wrote:

Is there a place on the paizo.com site where we can buy the individual cards?

Not for the fixed starter set cards, no. We plan on trying that sort of thing for the cards in the boosters shortly after we release the first booster packs.

-Vic.
.

[farewell2kings]

How about some booster cards inserted into Dungeon magazines that correspond to some of the magic items in that issue of the magazine? That would be kind of cool--similar to those monster tokens that were included a few years ago. Might expose other readers to the product, because quite honestly--if I didn't check this website frequently, I wouldn't know about any of Paizo's products other than the magazines.

[Fake Healer]

farewell2kings wrote:

How about some booster cards inserted into Dungeon magazines that correspond to some of the magic items in that issue of the magazine? That would be kind of cool--similar to those monster tokens that were included a few years ago. Might expose other readers to the product, because quite honestly--if I didn't check this website frequently, I wouldn't know about any of Paizo's products other than the magazines.

Ditto here.

FH

[Vic Wertz]

farewell2kings wrote:

How about some booster cards inserted into Dungeon magazines that correspond to some of the magic items in that issue of the magazine?

We do hope to do such things, sort of—not really as a tie-in, though, since the adventures are official D&D content owned by Wizards of the Coast, and Item Cards are not—plus, item cards are meant to be somewhat generic.

The main problem is that our printer changed some of their systems a while back, and we can no longer easily insert playing-card-sized items. There are workarounds, which we're investigating.

-Vic.
.