Velvet Blade

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Nadya clenches her fist tightly. "She killed her. She killed my little Thora..." she says softly to herself.

"Excuse me for a moment." she says, and walks away from the fire to be alone for a few minutes, leaving the rest of you to talk to each other.

In lighter news, you have all now reached level 3


Nadya turns pale at Horvan's words, but says nothing more.

She and the other travelers quickly repack their sleds and lead you away from the mantis' body. You can see the village in the distance, but it's clear that in this weather you won't make it there tonight, and there is indeed a storm heading your way. Nadya finds a small area protected from the wind by large stones, and builds a small fire. They have enough meat from an earlier hunt to feed everyone for the night, so there is no need to use your rations tonight.

"Where have you all come from? And what makes you think this haunted doll you saw was my daughter?" she asks.


The name 'Thora' sounds awfully familiar...

Nadya looks to the sky for a moment and frowns. "There's a storm coming; no chance we'll make it to Waldsby in time. Lets get a move on and find a place to camp and sit out the storm. I can keep us away from the roads, which ought to prevent the witches finding you all."


"I have no idea what a 'mantis' is, but I do know where the Pale Tower lies. There is much danger there, and you ought to be more cautious about who you tell of your purpose here; the witches of Irrisen are cruel and cunning, and they hate children most of all. They took my own daughter, Thora for a minor slight, and I am headed to the tower to buy her freedom with this food."


"I didn't mean to offend you, I was just surprised to see chi--err, people so young out here like this. We're grateful for your help." Nadya replies. She and the others gasp in awe as Issi heales the man's injuries. He's still in need of considerable medical attention, but wounds that would have killed him now look survivable.

Looking over the dead mantis, Nadya shakes her head. "I've never seen such a creature in my life." she says, and the other travelers agree that it doesn't look like anything they've seen before.

Those of you who have spent time in the woods around Heldren have, of course, seen a praying mantis before, and have heard tales of giant varieties like this, but they're known for hunting other animals, and do not typically go looking for human prey.


Henyan charges the Mantis, driving his lance through the creature's thorax and sending it crashing into the snow, dead!

The surviving travelers raise a cheer of relief as the beast dies. One of them is cradling the wounded man, while another, a red haired woman with a furry cap, approaches.

"Hello! My name is Nadya Petska. Are you...children? What on earth are you doing out here? Where did you come from?"


Mantis reflex save: 1d20 + 4 ⇒ (12) + 4 = 16
The Mantis takes 2 points of fire damage from Issi's flames, and deftly dodges Donovan's attack.

ROUND 4

Issi quickly withdraws from the mantis...

...who then turns it's attention to Raggnor, and full attacks!
Claw attack: 1d20 + 7 ⇒ (6) + 7 = 131d6 + 5 ⇒ (1) + 5 = 6
Claw attack: 1d20 + 7 ⇒ (3) + 7 = 101d6 + 5 ⇒ (3) + 5 = 8

The Mantis flails wildly as Raggnor easily dodges between its strikes!

Raggnor then plunges his spear into the beast again, dealing 12 points of damage! The Mantis wobbles unsteadily on its feet, but doesn't fall yet.

Horvan TBA

Henyan TBA

Donovan TBA


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That's...still not a lot of info, and it still seems like that if you're going to include a background on a heritage, perhaps describing that heritage in the book would be a good idea.


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I was looking through my copy of the Lost Omens World Guide and noticed the Bekyar Redeemer background. There's a problem though: nowhere in the book (or the core book, or any other 2E book) does it explain who the Bekyar are, why they need to be redeemed (the background itself mentions that they're known for worshipping demons, but which demons?), what they look like, how they differ from other Mwangi natives, etc.


ROUND 3

Issi: TBA

The Giant Mantis, taking note of Issi's approach, moves close to her and attacks!

Claw Attack!: 1d20 + 7 ⇒ (19) + 7 = 261d6 + 5 ⇒ (5) + 5 = 10
Issi takes 10 points of slashing damage from the Giant Mantis!

Raggnor thrusts his spear deep into the Mantis' body, finding a sweet spot between the plates of its chitinous armor, dealing 11 points of damage.

Horvan's arrow is again blown wide by the cold winds of the north.

Henyan charges the creature, but his lance glances off of the hardened exoskeleton of the beast

Donovan: TBA


ROUND 2

Issi scurries through the snow in her snow shoes, and is now 10 feet from the giant mantis.

The Giant Mantis lashes out at another traveler
Claw attack: 1d20 + 7 ⇒ (5) + 7 = 121d6 + 5 ⇒ (3) + 5 = 8
Claw attack: 1d20 + 7 ⇒ (1) + 7 = 81d6 + 5 ⇒ (3) + 5 = 8
The nimble traveler moves out of the way, narrowly avoiding death at the claws of this creature.

Raggnor, without the benefit of Snowshoes, continues to move forward, and is now 40 feet from the Mantis.

Horvan, slowly creeping forward (70 feet from the Mantis) fires another arrow, but the winds blow it wide, and he misses.

Henyan's pony takes him within 20 feet of the Mantis

Donovan, also wearing snowshoes, moves to 20 feet from the Mantis, next to Henyan.


You would likely have known that it would be snowing where you were headed. Anyone with snowshoes can assume they moved 50% further (so if you moved 30', you actually moved 45'; if you moved 20', you actually moved 30')


Mantis Initiative: 1d20 + 3 ⇒ (20) + 3 = 23
Issi Initiative: 1d20 + 6 ⇒ (19) + 6 = 25
Henyan Initiative: 1d20 + 2 ⇒ (5) + 2 = 7
Horvan Initiative: 1d20 + 1 ⇒ (14) + 1 = 15
Donovan Initiative: 1d20 + 1 ⇒ (4) + 1 = 5
Raggnor Initiative: 1d20 + 2 ⇒ (14) + 2 = 16

ROUND ONE

Issi scurries through the snow; unfortunately, due to the depth of the snow, she is slowed to half speed, and moves only 30 feet this round. (so she is 70 feet from the Mantis)

The Mantis attacks one of the travelers
Mantis first attack: 1d20 + 7 ⇒ (2) + 7 = 91d6 + 5 ⇒ (2) + 5 = 7
Mantis second attack: 1d20 + 7 ⇒ (19) + 7 = 261d6 + 5 ⇒ (6) + 5 = 11
The traveler appears mortally wounded by the claw and falls in a heap.

Raggnor also moves forward through the snow, and is 70 feet away from the Mantis.

Horvan fires an arrow that strikes the Mantis for 12 points of damage!

Henyan rides his pony through the thick snow. It is slowed, like the others, but moves a bit faster, taking him 40 feet (to 60 feet from the Mantis) this around.

Donovan also moves forward through the snow, and is 70 feet away from the Mantis.


If you have any remaining RP/shopping to do, feel free. I'm just getting us to the next portion of the adventure :)

Some time later, your families escort you to the portal to see you all off. You are all given winter clothes, sufficient tents and bedrolls for the four of you, enough food for one week, and a single mule to carry it all.

On the other side of the portal, you find yourselves in a snow-covered wilderness, on the edge of a forested hillside. Looking down into the distance, you can see the warm lights of a small village about the same size as Heldren.

Somewhat closer, within about 100 feet or so, you can see a small group of travelers fighting with a giant (that is, grizzly bear-sized) Praying Mantis, which has one of the travelers in its jaws.


HORVAN
Your mother sighs. "You're gonna do what you want no matter what I say, so why ask? Just be careful out there, and bring yourself back in one piece."

Let's time jump back to the next day meeting what Issi got us started with :)


RAGGNOR
Survival: 1d20 + 6 ⇒ (3) + 6 = 9
You spend a couple of hours looking for your father, but perhaps the knowledge that this could be the last time you see him makes it difficult to concentrate. And so, it is quite a surprise when he grabs you from behind and tosses you to the ground.

"Daydreaming is a dangerous hobby in these woods, boy." he says simply. "What are you doing out here?"

DONOVAN
"I'll think about it." your father says simply. The rest of the morning passes in silence as you haul the wood back to the furnace. You return home for lunch, and are greeted by your mother.
"Well? Are you two all settled now? Care to tell your mother where you've been for the past few days...?" she asks/
"I'll explain it later, dear. The boy will be heading back out tomorrow, it seems. Can't be helped." replies your father.

I think that gets us all caught up to the next morning


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Ravingdork wrote:
spectrevk wrote:
I feel like “distinctive” isn’t good enough. It should match the theme of the creature, which is a highly disciplined militant race of humanoids. Goblins are the opposite of that, so making hobgoblins indistinguishable (other than size) is a problem, in my view, unless we are also revising what hobgoblins are as a whole. If they’re intended to just be Medium goblins, both in appearance and behavior, then the new design is fine.

All you'd need to visually represent them as highly disciplined military would be some polished uniforms and equipment (and maybe some peons/enemy soldiers being routed before them). Everything you've described is cultural, not biological.

Having them look like Medium goblins and having them look like highly disciplined militants isn't something that is mutually exclusive.

Theoretically sure, but in practice, thus far, they are mutually exclusive.


RAGGNOR
After you have finished your breakfast, your mother gives you a hug and sends you back into the woods.

"Your father shouldn't be too far; surely you can find him on your own now, right?"
Make a Survival check to track your father through the nearby woods

HORVAN
By the time you finish your story, the whole family is sitting around you with rapt attention. Your brother is the first to speak:

"I still want my armor back."

Your mother smacks him on the shoulder.

"That's not funny, and neither is this business you're getting up to in the woods, Horvan. If half of that tall tale is true, you're lucky to be alive, and I don't think I want you to go back out there. Trolls are dangerous - what if that little magic girl hadn't been there to burn him?"

HENYAN
"Well then, that's better." your mom says, her warm smile returning. "Eat up and get some rest if you plan to be tussling with any more trolls tomorrow. And remember to take some fire and acid with you; always comes in handy."

ISSI
Your father sighs deeply. "I really don't know, Sunshine. I want to tell you to stay here and be safe, but you're getting older now, and you seem different somehow. I want to believe that you'll be alright out there, and that you're doing something good in the world."


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vagrant-poet wrote:
Ravingdork wrote:
Midnight Anarch wrote:
Also, for so many reasons, this (also from Ironfang) says "Hobgoblin soldier" better than the new hob-soldier art, which as I've said elsewhere, looks more like a hobgoblin got his head stuffed inside his armor and had a goblin shoved down to fill the space instead. Again, I get the logic but the end result still manages to come across as bizarre and unfitting to the race.
Your "hobgoblin soldier" looks indistinguishable from an orc to me.

Was mostly staying out of the subjective art discussion, but was going to add this too, tbh. I don't especially like Yoletcha's art, I agree it's a bit raggedy and un-frightening, but I have to say I find Scarvinious and the aforementioned Ironfang soldier don't say hobgoblin to me. They say standard fantasy evil warrior. Which is a thematic and classic look for sure, but not especially distinctive.

Whatever the flaws of the new hobgoblin direction, it's very distinctive. And I like that about it. Less convinced by bugbear art I've seen so far, expect maybe the sketch Wayne Reynolds did during the playtest, and I'm not sure that's even where they are going with it.

I think the Bruthazmus art by Eric Belisle is perfect as hulking goblinoid though. So I hope they ere towards that style, even if it's older art.

I wasn't trying to pile on (just thought it was interesting how completely differently I felt about hobgobliness). Hope it didn't feel like I was.

I feel like “distinctive” isn’t good enough. It should match the theme of the creature, which is a highly disciplined militant race of humanoids. Goblins are the opposite of that, so making hobgoblins indistinguishable (other than size) is a problem, in my view, unless we are also revising what hobgoblins are as a whole. If they’re intended to just be Medium goblins, both in appearance and behavior, then the new design is fine.


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Tender Tendrils wrote:
spectrevk wrote:
Dragonstriker wrote:
spectrevk wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
The official new look for hobgoblins is that they look more like Medium size goblins. Now and then, stragglers will slip through the cracks as we adjust our style for them, which we'll get better at not doing as the edition goes on.
Is there anything we can say to change your mind? The medium-sized goblin look is terrible.
In your opinion.
Yes. By definition, anything I post here is my opinion.

Is it? If you state something

e.g. grass is a plant
Hobgoblins look terrible
The earth is round
Hobgoblins are goblinoids

It comes across as being stated as fact.

Why? We're discussing art depicting fictional creatures in a shared fictional world. Literally nothing we discuss here, outside of rules and lore written in officially published books, could be reasonably understood as "fact".


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Rysky wrote:
Arachnofiend wrote:

I think the issue is that the bestiary portrayal of hobgoblins is just really bad art. The Hobgoblin General in the bestiary looks ridiculous; she looks like you had physically stretched out a goblin. This woman does not look like a seasoned war veteran and leading officer in a military hierarchy, she looks like someone who is the subject of her subordinates' wacky hijinks and never quite manages to catch them red-handed.

The Hobgoblin Alchemist in the blog post (and which I assume is also in the Character Guide book) is FAR more believable as a member of hobgoblin society. There's nothing funny about this design and he manages to be legitimately intimidating. The muscle bulk really helps with this, though there's a lot more going on with his expression and other details that assist in making him look more serious. He still has the squashed head, long ears, and full set of pointy teeth to make him look more goblin than orc but he has all of those things without it being funny, which is absolutely crucial for hobgoblins.

Funny, the general is one of my favourite of the new Hob pieces.

... is it the non-blue skin?

I think it's the hunched posture, the spindly, weak limbs, and the sad, crestfallen facial expression. She just doesn't look comfortable in that outfit, or holding the weapon. Compare it to the posture, limbs, and facial expression of the hobgoblin leader from Ironfang Invasion. Note that both have nearly the same skin tone.


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Dragonstriker wrote:
spectrevk wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
The official new look for hobgoblins is that they look more like Medium size goblins. Now and then, stragglers will slip through the cracks as we adjust our style for them, which we'll get better at not doing as the edition goes on.
Is there anything we can say to change your mind? The medium-sized goblin look is terrible.
In your opinion.

Yes. By definition, anything I post here is my opinion.


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
Saros Palanthios wrote:
Squiggit wrote:
TBH the only thing that really stands out to me is that use of footwraps and handwraps feels a bit odd to me. They work for goblins because a scrabbled together aesthetic fits them really well, but hobgoblins have such an emphasis on regimentation and organization it feels like they'd try to dress more cleanly.

Footwraps (aka portyankis) and legwraps (aka puttees) have been a part of military uniforms around the world for centuries, right up through the 20th century. compared to socks they're a lot easier to produce, last longer, dry more quickly when wet, and stay up without garters or modern stretchy synthetic fibres.

the Paizo art team knows their military history.

In both of the examples you linked to, the footwraps and legwraps are being worn with shoes of some sort, not by themselves (as they are in the Bestiary art)


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James Jacobs wrote:
spectrevk wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
The official new look for hobgoblins is that they look more like Medium size goblins. Now and then, stragglers will slip through the cracks as we adjust our style for them, which we'll get better at not doing as the edition goes on.
Is there anything we can say to change your mind? The medium-sized goblin look is terrible.

I get it that it's not something everyone likes, but we like it. It's not really up for a vote. If over the years to come the feedback ends up being "hobgoblins look stupid" then maybe we'll consider it then, but we're pretty pleased with the look in-house at this time.

We'll still be looking at feedback, so by all means keep giving it to us, but don't expect us to change the look for these things suddenly simply because some folks don't like it. Give it time and it'll sort itself out.

Fair enough. I think the 1E look works beetter for a group of highly disciplined militant warrior types. The 2E goblins look too much like the more chaotic, slightly humorous goblins, so it kind of undercuts the theme of Hobgoblins, IMO. I think the 2E design could almost work better for Bugbears, who are a bit more wild in their behavior.


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Tender Tendrils wrote:
I love the new hobgoblins, they actually feel like they are related to other goblinoids now instead of just being Gray humanoids (1e hobgoblins reminded me a lot of LOTR Uruk-hai, which isn't a great thing as pathfinder goblins are veeerrryyy different to the goblins that uruk-hai are related to).

Goblinoids have never looked alike. Bugbears *still* look totally different from Goblins or either version of the Hobgoblin design.


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James Jacobs wrote:
The official new look for hobgoblins is that they look more like Medium size goblins. Now and then, stragglers will slip through the cracks as we adjust our style for them, which we'll get better at not doing as the edition goes on.

Is there anything we can say to change your mind? The medium-sized goblin look is terrible.


Did I miss a response from Horvan? I thought he was still bathing


Weird, now I can see the post.


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Like many people, I was opposed to the "new" Hobgoblin art style first introduced in Starfinder, where they become just Goblins with longer legs. When this continued in the Bestiary, I was similarly bummed out. But then I looked at the Lost Omens World Guide, and the Hobgoblin leader is illustrated in the style of 1E Hobgoblins. So which is it? Are there now multiple types of Hobgoblin?


I think the forum may have eaten my update in the gameplay section :(


The +1 was the strength rating.


ISSI
The front door swings open, and your father spends almost a minute just standing there, looking at you from the doorway. He looks a bit less put together than usual, and there are dark circles around his eyes, suggesting that he hasn't slept. Silently, he sweeps you up in his arms and hugs you tightly, then sets you down inside the house.

"Where have you been?" he asks, trying to keep a stoic face.

HENYAN
Your father cracks a wide smile and slaps you hard on the shoulder.

"That's m'boy!" he says with a chuckle, before catching himself and giving your mother a guilty look. She sighs and rolls her eyes.

"You're not a boy anymore, Henyan. Next time leave a note; I've been wasting good food for the past three days cooking meals you don't eat. Your dad's put on 10 pounds, I reckon."

RAGGNOR
Your mother begins preparing your favorite nettle porridge while you regale her with tales of your adventures in the woods, and the recent awakening of your connection with nature. By the time the porridge is ready, you can see her beaming with pride.

"My son, I'm so proud of the man that you are becoming, even as my heart breaks to know that you must leave this place behind. This unnatural winter must end, and the Green has blessed you with the gifts needed to end it."

She reaches into a pouch that she has worn around her neck for a s long as you can remember, and pulls out a old, worn wolf's fang. She wraps it with a leather cord, and then places it around your neck.

"This belonged to your great-grandfather. He shared your gift, your connection with the beasts of the land. Take it with you and remember where you've come from, no matter how far away the Green takes you."

DONOVAN
Your dad continues chopping wood as you explain what has happened. He never breaks stride, hardly seems to react, and you almost wonder if he's listening. When you finish, he begins to speak again.

"Well, that surely does sound like a real mess, son. You do look the part of a hero, I'll admit, with that armor on. But if you killed the troll, what's the problem?"


The troll's potion was also a potion of feather step, Horvan's identify spree would have identified it, and the stuff from Hommelstaub, but I'll need to get home and review the book to provide info on the latter.


Horvan:
When you arrive at home you find your family seated around the table enjoying breakfast. They pause as you enter, and your brother gives you a look that says he's a little peeved at your disappearing with his stuff for a few days. Your mother is the first to break the silence:

"Well, look who decided to join us for a meal again. First things first, go take a bath before you sit down. You smell like the woods. Then I want to hear all about what kept you out so long."

Henyan:
Both of your parents are busily working on your house when you approach, as usual. They purchased the house over a year ago, but neither has much faith in human craftsmanship, and have been working to retrofit it in their spare time.

"You're late for breakfast again, Henyan" says your mother. "It's stone cold by now." You sense that she may be a little upset.

Your father sets down his hammer and approaches, sets his hand on your shoulder and squeezes. "Welcome back, boy. Let's heat up that breakfast and you can tell me what was so important that you couldn't come home for three days?"

Raggnor:
Your parents live in a log cabin about a 10 minute walk from the village, nestled in the treeline near the western road. You can feel your mother's eyes upon you well before you reach the cabin, even if you cannot see her yet. Bluejays, shivering in the unseasonable cold, watch you on the road, and a young male wolf that your mother has been caring for watches you silently.

"Welcome home, Raggnor." says your mother, and you feel her warm hand resting on your shoulder. Behind her, as expected, you see no footsteps. Perhaps she was one of the birds?
"I can smell the forest on you. You've been on quite an adventure, haven't you? Your father has gone hunting, but you can tell me all about it. What would you like for breakfast?"

Donovan:
When you arrive at your family's cottage you find your father preparing himself for his usual trip into the woods to gather wood for burning. Your mother is outside as well, seeing him off. Both smile when you arrive.
"So, how was your adventure with your friends? Next time leave a note if you're going to go camping, and be more careful. The council says there are bandits about, you know." says your mother, chiding you softly. Your dad just gives you a subtle nod, and gestures to the pack you usually carry when you gather wood with him.

"You feel up to a bit of wood gathering, boy?" he asks.


There's no need to cut Tacey in; she didn't participate in the fight, and probably has too much pride to take money from children, even if she is/was a criminal.


Question: How do people feel about the prospect of moving our combats to Roll20 for easier map usage, turn tracking, etc? I'm not very experienced in using Roll20, but this would be an opportunity to learn. Roleplay and exploration would still occur here as usual.


Horvan's efforts on the treasure found with the Troll and his hoard identify the potions of feather step, and the spear as a Spear of Manhunting:https://imgur.com/a/JwvzQma

The spear possessed a strong feeling of bloodlust; it was forged solely for the hunting of men, and had only ever been used for that purpose. It was not evil, and possessed no hatred for humanity; rather, it was simply a bottomless pit of hunger, like a bear fresh from hibernation.

Miss Willowbark smiled at Raggnor and greeted both Tacey and Lady Argentea with a courteous bow.

I am glad that you've all returned safely. I do hope that your parents are not too upset. Perhaps I can show your guests to a hot bath while you all head home? If half of what you've told me is true, I imagine the village council will want to speak with everyone."


We'll just go with Henyan's check

It takes a couple of days, but Henyan leads the group through a detour around the bandits' hideout, and does his best to hide your tracks to prevent any further encounters with them. At last, you can see the familiar outline of the village of Heldren in the distance. On your way in, you are greeted by the town Apothecary, and elf named Tessaraea Willowbark, returning from her usual early-morning mushroom gathering.

"Well look who it is! People were starting to wonder where you'd run off to. This unnatural cold is only getting worse, and I've heard some crazy stories about odd creatures in the woods. Who are your new friends?" she asks, gesturing to Lady Argentea and Tacey.


"Any ideas for how we're going to get past those bandits?" Tacey asks.

Anyone can attempt a Survival check to determine an alternate route back to Heldren


The lockbox is full of stuff! Tacey helps you appraise the loot inside (she seems more excited about the loot than you are). Inside you find:

four potions of feather step in an iron coffer
four blue quartz “ice diamonds” from Irrisen worth 100 gp each
a silver diadem worth 300 gp
a near flawless diamond worth 500 gp
a jeweled necklace worth 400 gp
a painting of Whitethrone worth 100 gp
three sapphire rings worth 75 gp each
a decorative filigree longsword scabbard worth 125 gp
a small scrimshaw sculpture of dancing sprites surrounding a piping satyr worth 50 gp
2,457 gp 3,313 sp, and 1,760 cp.


Raggnor finds a few meager possessions on Teb Knotten's body, and a finely crafted spear that miraculously adjusts to his size when he touches it. The other possessions are:

- a belt pouch containing 48 gold pieces
- a set of keys
- a mirror
- a potion of some sort

Inside the cave, Raggnor finds just what he'd expect for a troll lair: it is damp and dark, with two bearskin rugs on the floor for comfort, and it is filled with crates and barrels of supplies that the troll likely took from nearby homes. There is meat here as well, preserved well in the cold but likely to spoil if the weather returns to normal for a Taldor summer. And in the very back of the cave, a strong lockbox.


In the third round, the already injured troll is brought down by your coordinated attacks, with Issi's flames searing the wounds and preventing any regeneration. His body turns the flames and eerie dark blue, but he is clearly dead. From here, you could search through the tents, look into the cave that the troll emerged from, or approach the portal. Or head home, if you wish to get Lady Argentea back to civilization.


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
Deadmanwalking wrote:
Squiggit wrote:
To be fair I'm not sure that's necessarily great either. Water doing the same damage type and getting a movement form that's going to be a lot less functional in most campaigns ends up making it feel like a pretty underwhelming choice if your campaign isn't going to heavily feature underwater content.
True, but it does mean that at least all four are meaningfully mechanically distinct.

I remembered the movement abilities, but I don't think they are enough to make the choice meaningful. Both swim speed and burrow speed are situational and of lesser utility than flight.


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
Squiggit wrote:


Incorporeal creatures have double resistance against nonmagical damage, but spells are magical so this isn't an issue.

Per the Core rulebook p.452:

"...most incorporeal creatures have additional, though lower, resistance to magical physical damage (such as damage dealt from a mace with the magical trait) and most other damage types."


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Apologies if this is a rehash of an old topic, but I'm curious about why the 2E elemental sorcerers were designed the way that they were. Some of the changes, like giving them the Primal spell list, seem welcome and interesting. But while Fire elemental sorcerers retain their ability to do Fire damage from 1E with their class spells; Water, Air, and Earth all do Bludgeoning damage. This is problematic for at least a couple of reasons:

1. It makes these options functionally identical, which makes the choice feel irrelevant. This is a shame, since one of my favorite things about 2E character generation is that the choices generally feel important and interesting.

2. It creates a bit of a balance issue, as Fire sorcerers get to deal energy damage, while Water, Earth, and Air are all stuck with physical damage. This means, for example, that the later three are all at a disadvantage when dealing with incorporeal creatures.

Now, I imagine that at least part of the reason for these changes was to create some rarity around access to acid, electrical, and cold damage. And perhaps there was something a little silly about an "earth" elemental dealing "acid" damage (are rocks known for dissolving things?) and "air" becoming more of a "lightning" element, but this solution doesn't sit right with me, or many of the other players and GMs that I've talked to in my area.

I think one possibly better solution, to at least resolve the first issue, would be to have Earth deal Bludgeoning, Air deal Piercing, and Water deal Slashing damage. This makes sense, as pressurized air can puncture objects, and pressurized water is used to cut things in industrial settings. It still doesn't resolve the second issue, though.


I think we're still waiting for Issi and Henyan's turns


Round 3

The troll grits his teeth after Henyan's spear digs into his flank, and turns his spear on the dwarf:

Spear attack: 1d20 + 6 ⇒ (5) + 6 = 111d8 + 5 ⇒ (8) + 5 = 13
Bite attack: 1d20 ⇒ 151d4 + 1 ⇒ (4) + 1 = 5


Henyan, go ahead and roll your charge attack


Round 2 so far:

Teb Knotten stabbled Raggnor with a spear for 7 points of damage

Raggnor dug into Teb knotten with his claws and teeth, dealing 7 points of damage with one claw, and 5 points of damage with a bite.

Donovan TBA

Issi TBA

Henyan Spent the last round preparing for a charge, and will presumably charge this turn?

Horvan attacked and narrowly missed with his cold iron longsword.


Raggnor's spear plunges into the Troll's side, though as soon as he withdraws it you can see the wound beginning to close. Donovan moves forward with a powerful swing that narrowly misses the troll, while Issi moves into a better position and Henyan mounts his pony.

just auto-attacking for Horvan to move things along
Horvan's attack: 1d20 + 6 ⇒ (4) + 6 = 101d8 + 6 ⇒ (8) + 6 = 14

Horvan presses the attack against the troll but doesn't manage to make much progress.

Ten Knotten turns his attention on Raggnor, saying "That's a nice spear you've got there, Orcling! Let me show you mine!"

Spear attack: 1d20 + 6 ⇒ (12) + 6 = 181d8 + 5 ⇒ (2) + 5 = 7
Bite attack: 1d20 ⇒ 11d4 + 1 ⇒ (4) + 1 = 5

His spear sinks into Raggnor's shoulder, dealing 7 points of damage.

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