Aaaand on that note I'm done here. I've given multiple ways for using the RAW, I've given a few ways to tweak it yourself, and still people are not happy.
Yes, Paizo rushed it. Is it perfect? No. But if they introduced everything that people wanted to do, the core book would be utterly massive. The developers had a limited amount of pages to work with, and IMO, didn't polish the system enough. But they did what they could. There's still tons of material still left to publish, and us non subscribers haven't even gotten our alien archive yet.
So you guys, girls, and hosts can all sit back and complain that your magical book doesn't have the content you want, all you want. But you still have three options until expanded material comes out.
And that's it. Everyone on this thread, I hope you have a nice day.
Ouch. Calling my defense of the RAW half baked is kinda rude don't you think?
Either way, I'm just stating what the rules intend. Yes in the cases your describing, it's a little underwhelming. Characters can't do much to starship as a whole and that can be annoying. You want your party technomancer to be able to call down the wrath of the universe and, quoting 'The Force Unleashed', PULL THAT STAR DESTROYER OUT OF THE SKY! It would be epic! It's just that the rules as written don't let you right now. Maybe later, but not now.
So change it. You're the Dm. If you want to have games like star wars or GotG, go for it. I'd change the size of the starship to match creature sizes, with tiny becoming large to represent a ship with no passenger capability. I'd reduce the hardness to whatever material the ship is made of instead of a flat 55,and reduce ship damage to creatures to normal levels instead of x10. Thats just the simplest way to convert them down.
The only issue you're going to find is space combat with creatures. A dragon capable of space flight is going to tear through your small armada like tissue paper with its breath weapon alone because most weapons the armada could use, the dragon would be resistant at minimum to.
So there. Until the official rules come out, you have the basis for a system. Could we please keep this civil?
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A 40 foot dragon is Gargantuan. A 40 foot starship is Tiny. A Gargantuan starship is about 10,000 feet. Why on Golarion would the Tiny starship be on the same scale as the second one and not the first one?
Because the scales are different. Starfinder did take into account a small bit of realism with their ships. They need to be big, heavily armored tanks to survive the rigors of outer space. You know, massive radiation pulses, extreme heat AND cold, a speck of space dust that hits your hull while you're going the speed of light, etc.
What you're asking for is a customized system where it allows for smaller creatures to effectively damage something that's way bigger than them.
This isn't an anime brother. You're not going to find a creature less than challenge rating ten that can punch a starship once or twice and turn it into a pile of scrap.
If you're looking for a way to get something like a huge to colossal creature to be able to damage a ship, I've already told you how.
Use break checks. The DC for breaking chunks off a ship is high, but not impossible. Especially for big creatures.
I think part of the problem you may be having is that creature size does NOT match up to ship size. A tiny starship is roughly equal to a large or bigger creature. The developers explained this in the beginning of the ship section.
They also mentioned that creatures and ships were never meant to interact. That's why the monsters can't damage ships effectively, and also why you can't target a creature directly using ship weaponry.
I'm not sure what the problem is here.
What I did was look at the wealth by level of characters, and compare that to the BP for the ship of a same tier. So tier 1 has 55 BP, and WBL is 1000. Divide the WBL by the BP,and then multiply that by the number of players in your group, minimum 4.
So the cost per BP of a first tier ship comes out to about 73 to 91 credits a piece. That makes an at level starship affordable with a bit of work.
1000 / 55 * 4
I did it this way to represent the fact that Triune made space travel cheap and affordable, and to represent the fluctuating price of the starship economy. A side effect is, it makes your characters have to work together to afford the good stuff.
Salvaging ships could also be used this way. Treat them as trade goods. If you bring in a ship in pristine condition, say again, a tier 1, that'll net your entire party about 4k credits. If it's damaged at all, cut the price by 10 percent for every critical threshold the thing is down to a minimum of 50%.
If it's flat out destroyed, give them 10% of its full value to represent salvageable material.
This system makes starships affordable for the party, and makes salvaging/pirating worth it instead of "Hey, I brought you a starship." "Good job! Can't pay you, but props nonetheless!"
And I apologize, I just woke up when I posted that and realized I didn't give any information.
SF core book, page 406 to 409.
Starfinders system doesn't have energy attacks doing half damage to objects anymore. So if said creature doesn't quite have the strength to rip pieces of the hull off, it can still use any of its special abilities... Like a breath weapon... To do some serious damage to the hull. Even a colossal ship would only have a hardness of about the 50 or 60 per section. So if the attack did 120 points of damage to 4 sections at once, well, that's a harsh hit.
Though considering the bigger you get, the higher bonus you have to break things, anything that's huge or bigger could land on your ship, rip your thruster off, and beat the rest of the ship with it until the life support gives out.
And quick tip. Hulls have 'alot' of hp per section. Airlock doors... Not so much.
If you ask me, it honestly depends on the monster now doesn't it?
Take say... A giant flying space tarrasque. A monster like that should definitely be treated as its own ship. If it doesn't have a ship status block, 'make' one. Once the archive comes out we will have the rules to do so hopefully.
If it's not something that awesome, like a large size category void dragon, you run it just like the book says. It's too fast to lock on to directly, but your weapons count as AoEs against it. And while it can't nuke your ship like a colossal size one could, it could still latch on despite any shields you have (because it's not fast enough to trigger them) and could start tearing your ship apart using the item breaking rules as stated.
It would force your characters to get out of said ship to do some zero g combat...or get really creative by flying close to a sun or something.
Be creative! Come up with interesting ideas on how to run it.
Tali Wah wrote:
I'm aware that's how it is supposed to be, but my way seems less cruel than to say 'well, I've spent years working on my AI and one day, when it's fully grown, it will be like my child. It's own creature with feelings and emotions!'
'What about right now?'
'It's a glorified command prompt that's also a little retarded.'
121) The last time the ship was serviced, it was done by a team of manic Goblins. Now no one wants to touch it with a crane, much less a ten foot pole, and even less with paperwork.
"Slightly used ship for sale! May or May not have explosive components for chairs, beds, walls, the computers, and water supply."
I'll tell you what I would do. Have the drone equipped with manipulator arms. Just holding something or grasping an unattended object for the purposes of holding it without moving it, is no action, or a reflex save at worst.
So have your drone fly up to a place with a handle or even a pipe, and hold on. At that point your drone can sit there, attack as it wants, and never have to worry about falling.
Frankly, my hover drone would be equipped with long arm by level 4, and having it fly around and shoot things without my say so would be a little disconcerting. I'd worry it would go all skynet on me.
As for why your drone doesn't really work well without your input? The AI isn't in the drone. It's in your custom rig. And the rig is having to control the chassis remotely. Simple, easy, and explains why it doesn't work out of range.
I agree with you there, but that's what the forum thread is about. Technically this question should only be relevant in two real cases.
One, the player wants to start out with a class ability that he doesn't have levels in and two, as a valid question as to what happens when you wake up with a piece of hardware implanted in your brain that you have no idea what it is.
Technically this brings up a major question about androids in general. They can renew and basically die then swap souls. The new guy gets up and starts his new life.
What about his augments? If the previous 'soul' happened to be level 15ish and was decked out in a third arm, prosthetic eyes, a mechanical implant that increases intelligence by 6, and a hidden storage compartment with a million credit credstick?
The exocortex question is only the beginning to issues with Android renewal.
I'd have to disagree. One of the mechanics main abilities later on is being able to split up his ai between an exocortex and a drone. He literally assigns levels to which he wants.
Because of that, I'd say the ai is as much a part of the mechanic as he is a part of it. So if the android decides to renew, he takes most of the ai with him. When the process is complete, yes the new personality is level one. So is the exocortex because it renewed with him and left behind its own kid.
Space Goblin Outlaw. Drone mechanic with a camera equipped hover bot. Would have very little fighting experience, but his personal computer would be filled with terabytes of videos, most of which, people are unaware they were being taped.
He'd live in the vents of absolom station, eating only what he could steal from the local McAbadars.
Nope. He quoted the page number, I looked it up, and it says exactly what was quoted. Readied actions disrupt spells according to the description of paragraph 4,under concentration and interrupted spells.
However, you're right in that readied actions that are not purely defensive occur just after the actions that triggered it. So it seems that 'hooray' we have found a rules discrepancy.
Houserule until a developer can respond.
Just an observation on rules as a forum lurker, I'd like to point out you can absolutely see the sun via Pathfinder perception rules.
The distance modifier for perception is +1 per 10 feet. Which means that the distance to the sun, assuming it's still 93 million miles from Golarion, gives it about a +49 billion on its perception DC.
However, with the exponentially increasing penalty from size modifiers over colossal, that gives it a negative somewhere in the 95 billions.
If my math is off, it should still only be by 10 billion or so. Hence, even if the sun managed to roll a stealth check, it's penalty is way too high.
Just a note from a random lurker. Don't mind me.