Pnakotus Detsujin's page

So, in your campaign 2 Pcs actually survived, with the paladin getting a final moment of awesome, doing on this regard better than both Arnisant and Iomadae never did! Awesome.

I want to say something funny, possibly even provocative.

I believe that, if we have to see a god dogma inside the society in which it develops, then Erastil ... tecnically "invented" this philosophy of the patriarchal society.

I mean, both Thassilon and Azlant were - for what i get - beyond this ideas. I mean, humanity greatest historical figure was at that point the mythic warrior Savith, a lady that was able to unite the barbarian azlants and behead a god.

To me, in the age of Darkness, with all the destruction and the skies covered in dust ... Erastil "coded as a dogma" this viewpoint to ensure the humanoid races would survive, by having their cultures - which, in those centuries, were falling into barbarism - to preserve the females by having them not expose themselves to battle. To balance this, it forced the males to take more risks and view themselves as more "expendable", and therefore "heroic", to ensure the survival of society.

Problem is, after that era of darkness passed, and the world become less dangerous, the culture - images, expectations, shared believes outside the faithful - it had created lasted and further developed/degenerated into what is now.

What do you think about this?

Sorry, but i think this post is getting a bit off topic.

To me, "edginess" its not related towards how gods of the setting preach something, but how this reflect the society. The fact that a mysoginistic belief system such as diabolist has got a sorcerous queen at its top proves to me that divine dogma is generally less impactful on everyday lives than people's actions and ambition in Golarion.

I mean, in Pf2 we got a Dwarf High King (regent, overlady?) that's thinking how to MAKE PEACE WITH THE ORCS, following the dictated of one of their first mythical ruler, which - from what i get - is against a part of the "divine mandate" for their species/culture.
Yet, she's thinking about it, and no archon's popping down to say "Lady, just kill the greyskins. They're Rovagug's progeny"

Moreover, is /or should/ a god be envisioned inside a specific culture?
Should their "belief system" be viewed as separated and distinct, in their pure forms, from how those are adapted into a particular society?

Problem is, having so many deities in PF, it's normal to have different interpretations of their dogmas, since - and this should be remembered - gods do not think as humans or elves, and their dogmas represent always an "endgame" that looks beyond the lives of every single worshipper.

We all know Desna is a CB lovecraftian elder goddess, but we like to think of her as a naked fairy because that's a dreamlike, not threatening image of Azathoth's little butterfly. We know her white elf visage was gifted to the Kellids, and carried by the varisians into the shared imagination of the empire of Taldor. As such, even her stories and her doctrines were inherited and interpreted from that culture, and are not "hers" until they diverge too much from the image she crafted.

Moving on the topic of culture, i would like to take the Mongrelfolk as example, for I can see way they are not considered a "people": they have no culture, cause they are generally a (recent?) offshoot of humanity that somehow "pops up" in certain urban settings.

Yet, they are sometimes presented as an underground offshoot of azlant, and as such they should have an incredible culture, since they can mate with "EVERYTHING" down there.

Maybe the lack of content about mongrelfolk is, trurly, one of the edgiest things in golarion: they should be the most unique culture of them all, without racism or diffidence, and yet ... we ignore them.

I would like to say i'm very glad we see a few wizards from then Magaambyan tradition helping out with the process of restoring Sarkoris.

To me, it shows maturity and an humanitarian sprint when - in a society of easy teleport - people for half the world away can come to assist in the recovery of a land the shall now easily exploit themselves.

I mean, i would have seen cheliax or Razmirian run there and try to grab as much land as possible, but we don't seem to get it. Correct me if i'm wrong.

Sure, you are right.

Let us return to the main topic. This is a post about Golarion "edginess", and i'm glad that the potential bad ending of this PF2 campaign is not a big explosion, but a complex process that allows people to fight back to a certain degree.

Regarding the curse itself, The book express how this destruction arrives in waves, and it strikes to me as a gradual deterioration (weeks, months i suppose). This is also more realistic, thought to me falls in the same logic fallacy of this whole adventure: that somehow 5 thousand years of people living and building on Korthos did not "enrich" (on both a physical and magical way) the land more that the magical presence of those orbs.

Let us take another "edgy" topic of this AP, the ruin (slow genocide?) that Aroden's actions produced upon the Xulgath. This is treated with the proper respect and consideration to me. That's it way, way different from the approach of the Serpent Skull Ap, were the objective was to stop the resurrection of a evil god that would have united a fractured society into a (certain?) menace for the surface dwellers: in that scenario, there was no chance to "talk to the snakes", i believe.

Err, you are making latter sound not that bad when its less that and more "oh crap. We are going to die and we will see it coming"

As in, its not something you can fight, its very biblical apocalypse targeting the island where best case scenario is evacuating as many people as possible which probably won't happen in time considering pcs are likely dead at that point :p

I would be worried, but the point of many AP is to actually fight the apocalypse and win. A society like Absalom can, with a certain degree of difficulty, pull together the resources to either contrast or overcome this curse. Aroden never had the means to truly destroy what he created, and that's because humanity outgrow azlant, in both good and evil.

This is the flaw of the AP as a whole: the idea that the life of hundreds of generations of people living and cultivating the island of Korthos are not what makes the island itself work and live, but are accessories to some batteries stolen to the lizard people.

Regarding the World-ending scenarios, I'm glad we don't have that, cause many stories do not need such dangers. To me, they detract from the Pc's drama. Moreover, such events impact on the "modular" reality that are Golarion nations.

I'm also glad that the Worldwound was closed, cause its existence was a bit too much, and i never felt it's true impact on avistan's society and culture. Both Ustalav and the Mammoth lords realm where too little affected by such presence.

Regarding the differences between PF1 and PF2, lets us take Absalom as an example.

I want just to point out that, in the setting, the Worldwound was closed and the Apocalypse Dawn prophetized for 5000k years was stopped. Moreover, 3/4 apocalypse level events have been avoided.

Golarion remains a very dangerous place, with complex villains, but the "destroy the world" endings have been - and probably shall be - toned down, or the destruction limited to certain part of the settings.

I see this as a toned down edginess.
Moreover, greater representation leads also to stronger story possibility. The problem is, it crashes pre-constructed ideas

Like, what about a conflict to bonify/repopulate Sarkoris? That would be an interesting adventure, but a conflictual ones. What about only monster race can thrive there until the region has been properly restored?

However, i must admit that certain enemy npcs of the setting are treated with heavy plot armor and - most importantly - without greater involvement with the plot. No one says that Strahd von Zarovich, from Ravenloft, got plot armor because he'll be around, in your players face, and will be not only the prime mover of that adventure, but also forced to both play smart and manipulate the players to achieve his ends.
Without this involvement, the (structural) plot armor that the stories give to certain npcs become unbearable.

Hello, i'll had my mix regarding B's incompetence.

It all depends of how your players have acted against him.
If they openly antagonize him in their heroes persona, then B's gotta have a deeper grudge, which will lead to deeper plans and actions. After all, in his mind he's already "won", by having reached all its objectives.

Regarding book 3, it's possible that in the book Barzillai is not at the gala because it's misogyny and social awkwardness is so rampant that he cannot feel himself ok if surrounded by masked women in gala dresses. In my version of the story, B was present at the gala (the bone devil was instead hidden in the orchestra), and was attacked by not other that an evil version of the party, who pretended to have him mortally wounded and thrown downstairs from the pits on the platform, to later announce how they would have murdered all the presents to be "complacent" towards the "late thrune" will.

In book 4 I had him kidnap a Pc's ally, and then systematically strike each of their lesser refuges by his blue dragon ally, while he attacked another one in person with at least 2 npc from the temple. This forced all the pcs forces inside the lucky bones, there they were attacked by a mix of dottari (a few of the loyal ones) and two hellknights troops, backed up by devils - which, unfortunately, do not work well as you would believe when in a chokehold ... Then, after losing castle kingarto, B regrouped inside the temple and started his plans to summon hell itself!

How are you all handling the "no merchants" aspect of the first book? Does the problem persist after book one? (I'm kind of broke right now, just moved, so couldn't splurge on all the books).

Do I tell the PCs that the residents of Roslars Coffer are too unwell to handle buying/selling? Even if they were able to do it, it wouldn't work because the items wouldn't be of the material plane anymore, right?

Does it get addressed in the AP book, and I just missed it?

My problem is ... the pc find themselves in an abandoned cities, twice. While the first book is without a merchant option, this is in the spirit of the "survival horror genre" i suppose. What I fear it's a problem is that, both in Roslars Coffer and Vigil, once the cities are destroyed, all the LOOT inside the shops should become free loot. Radiant fire do not strip magical proprieties. In a city of 450 people around, if you know where to look you can find thousands upon thousands of gold pieces and non perishable goods. Heck, in Vigil, you could make a point that the pcs may think to look around for survivors AND weapons to fight the WW. All those weapons or spells that they may have wanted to buy before the city got nuked are still in the shops, while their owners are unfortunately dead.

Now, the adventure gives you narratively something "else" to do, namely protect people or escape from undead horrors. But I think, if your characters decide they want to quest around in ruined Vigil, after they helped people escape, possibly to loot or to recover relics of Lastwall, you should not punish them, but create a sidequest around it.

Goblins really have the sublime good fortune of not carrying the kind of baggage humans have around with them. Like, just imagine how hard it must be to come from the ancestry responsible for triggering Earthfall, or to know that half of the major catastrophes in the world can be traced back to Aroden, the human who became the god of humanity, and all of his traipsing around ignoring divine conventions, creating immortal liches, and provoking the Worldwound.

You are perfectly right.

For the record, we got: 16/17 humanborn villains, 1 elf, 1 genie, 1 snakeman, 1 lizardman (but was Aroden the motive), 1 fey, 1 evil A.I., 1 giant, 1 evil god, 1 hobgoblin and 1 aboleth.

I really hope the next A.P. it's about an evil dwarf ...

I feel there is some kind of fault in the way the story is presented. Unless the orbs take away propriety from the land they are in, removing them from Absalom should have ill effects no more. That land has been cultivated for more than 4 thousand years, and made fertile by the efforts of its people, and by the bodies of millions and millions of beings who died on that island and become dirt and soil that mixed with the original sea soil. Even the salt in the earth should have been reduced after thousands of years of rain.

Unless the orbs take away something else, i cannot see that island become a desert.

Greetings.
If you want to have your characters go down inside Gallowspire, i would suggest a kind "far finale" scenario, which have your players a 8 years timeskip, and then have them play the s10.98 pathfinder scenario Siege of Gallowspire, which sees them as veterans being contacted by pathfinder society to lead the exploration.

In this way, you can have your level 15 players actually enjoy having reached such threshold and become something important in Ustalav, or having other adventures, when then the time comes to return again to a very different gallowspire.

Obviously, at the end of the dungeon they should find the WW. Either himself, or a non mythic version of himself created by a certain obelisk, which is eager to punish the players for having stopped "his" freedom 8 years before.

I Love how the first part of this post is basically tyrant grasps ... but a bit better!

She was brought back as something by Baphon when he returned. She could not be active or relevant before that event, cause if so Aroden would have probably intervened again.

Now, i think she could be a mummy lord of sort. She's an ancient queen buried.
That could be classic.

But an interesting possibility would be to have her, in life, be a kalistrade prophet, and have actually achieved her own heaven. Until baphon's called her back, forcing her soul into a golden green body, and making her a failed prophet.

In this new, unique form, she has become a bitter, miserable being, which tries to regain what she's lost, but cannot. She converted into an urgathoan follower, hoping to regain the ability to "feel", but as a construct she cannot "proper" indulge into the excess she would like, and so she feasts of the bodies of other kalistrade followers, to absorb in herself their afterlives, in the hope, one day, to regain hers.

Now, as a statblock, i would use a martial class. I see her as an unique failed prophet monk 16/rogue 4 with the ability to consume not only gold and wealth, but also the "souls of the wealthy" to gain more power and abilities. Possibly a "soul scent" ability too. I don't think she should be another caster, but there is always the bard solution (starting by Queen Ileosa's stats).

I like the idea of Baphon having a melee powerhouse around, also able to shoot blast of fused gold and that he has to "applease" by gifting her jewels she eats.

Ok. let us be serious here. Baphon died around 59 years old, and he had descendent, so he was probably married. He was a wizard king, after all. He had to be a queen or similar at his side. We have to understand if this "consort" is the same one he was married when he was alive, or was she met/romanced when he was the Whispering tyrant?

I believe that, as a Lich, Baphon would have not felt the need to "marry" anyone.
He's described as a volatile, violent and self centered being. So, he's either married to some kind of trophy consort, or with someone that he "wants to have" of his old life.
Since we know not history of someone "forced" to become the tyrant's wife (cause if there was, Arazni would have probably plotted with them) I would therefore propose the following solution:

Baphon's consort is his first wife, the one he met and wed 4 millennia ago: The Golden Queen of Grafar (no other names are needed).
She was possibly one resident of Kestrillon (Grafar's previous name), or someone that plotted their ruin. She helped young Tar achieve it, and they bonded over that carnage. I imagine her as a ruthless queen, but with a twist: she could have been a true kalistocrat, and have different ideas from his husband about life and the afterlife.
She was the one that kept together the kingdom while Baphon was away, taming dragons and sacking cities, and was the one that kept for a while Grafar going after her husband was murdered by Aroden. She was, however, too killed, either by Aroden or by her's many, many enemies, and buried in Grafar's to be forgotten.

I would advise to not adventure along this way. The radiant fire it's an ill conceived power, and everywhere its used it has different effects for no clear reasons.

The whole issues of bodies it's one of those: the radiant fire should not leave bodies, yet we get zombie animals and similar stuff.
I would suggest to keep it vague ... or to explain in game that, everything a radiant fire shard is detonated, the effects are determined by what happens in the dice rolls:
you roll 100d10 negative energy and 100d10 positive energy.
If negative energy wins, it's dead zone and zombie apocalypse. If positive energy wins, it's immediate, revolting flesh cancer, followed by rapid grown of forests and the spontaneous formations of life forms from oozing pits of the rapidly living and dying creatures.
I would remember that this weapon can "create tapirs from nothing" ...

I notice, after 7 months, that the last post was never published.
I shall remedy.

The last thing i would like to propose, in this effort to rewrite book 6, it's a last scene of greater significance. For what i don't like from the battle is that, after TB reached a certain threshold, it just starts a cutscene, and all the freedom the players are given is to overcome a Save and possibly shield 1 npc. What I propose, is that the Pc's can actually Choose how they are going out.

Now, as we have stated, since TB is maintaining control of his armies, he cannot disengage even if the Pc's can repel him, nor is in his character to retreat. He's gonna be damage, and he's gonna fire. As i've propose, he's gonna try to detonate the Pc's shards from inside themselves, causing a more localized (few hundred meters) explosion around him. He should, therefore, have some kind of contingency to allow him to auto escape from a radiant fire blast, which is not in his stats. Wise DM should give him such.

As we know, the point of book 5 is to give the Pc's a chance to avoid this, and redirect the WW's spell on his shard's and himself. This not only overcome any contingency he might have, but creates the following situation:

When TB activates the radiant fire (a mythic spell that is a standard action to use, and that can overcome AMF), each Pc (both the living one's and any of the dead ones, whose souls are still present in the battlefield, even if they were made undead by Baphon) can react, by opposing Baphon's will.
While this happens, both parties get on the ground, from the pain and the energies of their respective shards.

This forces a clash of wills between Baphons +22 will save and the party, which can be done using the rules of an aid another action to the biggest roll made by one of the Pcs. While it's possible that the group beats Baphon outright, between Mythic points, the use of mythic wish and bad rolls, it should be clear that the Lich can actually overcome this. However, each pc has a choice that the Lich lord does not have: allow their fragments to reunite with the Tyrant's. This action destroys their bodies, but allows their soul to follow for a few moments the shard inside baphon's hand, and through this, to spread into baphon's body. This action - which could have any ramification outside of this scene - instantly gives the WW a penalty equal to that Pc Level. This means that, in the worst chase scenario, the sacrifice of 2 Pcs weakens BT so much that he goes from a +22 will to a -14 (assuming the Pcs are level 18).

This not only give each pc the chance to actually die and be utterly destroyed by striking down baphon with their own souls, but also allows a few others to actually survive this ordeal ... but not for long.
Cause as soon as Baphon explodes, that's radiant death for everybody in a 20 miles radius ... unless any surviving Pc has something to say about it.
To me, each remaining Pc should be able, at this point, to make that famous DC 30 roll to try to shield someone. However, this action should me made not to save 1 soul, but as many as possible by either containing the total kill radius of the explosion.

Let's say that the Radiant fire auto kills anyone with 20 hd or less in 1-4 miles of the explosion, then 16 hd in the 5-8 radius, then 12 in the 9 to 12, and so on until it just burns and shatter things, without the auto kill. The remaining pcs could either absorb or try to contain this explosion in a way that lesser the radius of the auto kill, and the HD of those targeted by 4 miles and 4 hd.

To do so, each remaining Pc has to "use" their shard to absorb some of the energies. This shatters the shard and probably, but not necessarely, kills them outright, and can have interesting epilogue consequences by DM's choice.

If 2 pcs are able to do such, this action actually saves a few section of the armies fighting in the cairnlands, who still get burned and blown away by the force, but not utterly disintegrated. This also saves the 2 npcs given by the book, if they are still alive.

In my opinion, this allows to have at least 1 pc that will survive these events, and to carry the memories and teaching of his companions in a brighter future. This pc will no doubt have to face the consequences of a fractured soul, destined to fade in time, but that is, to me, a story for a bittersweet epilogue.

Alderaan gets 30 seconds of screen time. By the end of Book 3, your players will have spent something like 50 hours of table time having their noses rubbed in one horrific aftermath after another. Will they really need "the entertainment value of offering sadistic taunts" in order to hate this guy?

Doug M.

Regarding books 1 to 3, I've got not much to say, except that the set up of book 1 should somewhat "pay off" in later books, yet does not contribute. If the Pc woke up, without memories, at level 5 in the middle of their nuked village, not much would change storywise in the later books.

My problem is with book 4 and going on.

These are the motivation that, to me, make this great, desperate epic lackluster in delivering it's ending.

Extra encounter - The queen's knight

Before we delve in the conundrum that is Tar Baphon's character in this AP and its long awaited, yet somewhat lackluster final, explosive confrontation with the party, I wish to address 2 other plot line which don't get touched in this Ap. The first one is, obviously, the consequences of Arazni's death. While this character has been quite foreshadowed in the first book well before the Pc's had any chance to meet her, after her demise we get nothing. While I'm not asking of an explanation for her ultimate destiny, the complete absence of her name from the book itself it's a missed opportunity to me. After all, from what the Pc may know, she should be somewhat alive and able to strike back again at Tar Baphon.

I therefore present the following scenario, which could happen at any point during Part 3 of book 6: a visit from an emissary from Geb. The ideal person could and should be sir Seldeg Bheldis, last survivor of the Council Libertine.

He should meet the Pc in a moment of potential break, when they are resting or returning from the battlefield. With his resources alone, the graveknight could easily reach the island of Kortos and move undetected, yet he is not alone in this travel, and thanks to this further aid, he's able to reach the Pc in an uncanny fashion.
At his arrival, however, he merely states his name and the motive of his visit before a different, distant voice start coming from his throat: the voice of Archmage Geb himself, who through necromantic rituals is currently projecting himself from his palace, able to listen and see, and to cast limited spell on his knight.

The ghost king has become aware of his "wife" passage, and after gaining all the knowledge divination magic could grant him, has decided to look for the last individuals who met her. He also demands from the Pc any relic given to them form Arazni, and especially the canopy jar containing her lungs, if its still in the Pc possession.

This encounter aims to satisfy the following objective: to give the Pc a chance to reflect on Arazni's action, to either defend her memory or condemn her choices, especially if they became aware that she is actually gone. Cause, unless I'm mistaken, they are never given this information in a clear manner in the AP, and may believe she's just kept away from the battle by her husband. This exchange allows the party to elaborate on the fact that she had somewhat planned to be nuked by Tar Baphon: a detail that Pc's may not even discover unless it's told them by Geb himself.

This is also an opportunity to have "Geb's" side of the story, which while surely a negative one, is somewhat outside the narrative: why did he resurrect Arazni in such fashion? Why did he bound her to be his queen? And most importantly, what he'll do against the one responsible for his "wife" and "queen" demise? Another prospective is that ot Bheldis, who was Arazni's greatest servant/jailer and was unable to intervene or assist in his "queen" final moments.

This encounter can have 3 potential outcomes:

- fight: the Pcs provoke the ghost king or insults Arazni's memory enough that Seldeg breaks his facade and attacks the party with murderous rage.

- compromise: the Pcs give to Seldeg any relic of Arazni in their possession and are left alone, while the Graveknight returns to Geb.

- bargain: the Pc are able to have Geb realize his wife ultimate desires, and his rage turns completely towards Tar Baphon. He still asks back the Pc relics, but this time the Ghost King grants something back: he first command Bheldis to reach the Spire of Nex, then he uses very old intelligence gained in the precedent millennia to free from the Spire a few specific outsiders, mostly psychopomps which are quickly tasked to assist the First Guard. After that, Bheldis become an npc like Gildais, wandering on the battlefield to cause mayhem against Baphon forces, while trying to wrestle away part of the army for himself.

Part 2 - Fallowdeep

Section B - An overview of Fallowdeep's Npcs.

After proposing a "past" to the fortress of Fallowdeep, let us explore the figures that reside in it.

Wanting to say something on the "mooks" of this level very quick, the "profane paladins" troops should be presented to me as proper mockery of the crusaders of the shining crusade: they should appear as heavily armored knights wearing rotten, defiled and corrupted version of the holy symbols and insignias of the faiths of Aroden, Arazni and the empire of Taldor. They should be dreadful to see ...
To spice up each encounter, they should also get some kind of "sub-boss" to guide them. I would suggest to throw around a CR 12 to 14 undead, like a classic graveknight or those vampire shield bearers that defend Lyanthari. A very cruel DM may have them be lead by one of the Scout's team npcs or by a gallowdead "left behind" by the Tyrant.

For the rest, Fallowdeep presents an interesting array of npc to play with. Looking at them, I find much potential for story purposes ...
Yet, i find this section of the adventure somewhat "lacks" of a "Punch" from a few of those enemy. Namely, much of the CR in each encounter are barely the same ECL of the group. Even assuming the pcs are at level 16 when they meet most of those, the party had clear chances to gain quite the intel to each of those people through already established means, and since the focus given to fighting undead, each party should be able to handle undead enemies of higher CR with ease.

For example, the potential fight against Moloun seems quite easy to me since both enemies go almost down to two heal spells, and their damage output is quite laughable for a CR 17 fight (a maximum to 15d4+15 damage for Moloun and 6d8+30 for the necrocraft). Aeonte's fight, both in G1 and G3, offer a way more difficult battle, and that in G3 sees a colossal enemy with grab, an undispellable flying enemy with poison and petrification and the ability to call of other minions, and yet it's CR 16.

I'll offer in the following posts a few ideas how use these npcs, their further motives, and how to "up" their stats a bit.

It has been 3 days: Klrau has got himself "together", and now he's an awaken demilich: he's rapidly regaining his spellcasting: he was at least a level 16 cleric, and now has recovered at least 11 levels of spellcasting, and with each pray he mutters, a bit of himself is called back due to Baphon's mythic magic.

This puts a few people really worried. In order:
- Iuphasti, who might have betrayed him and sees the opportunity of invading Akiton slipping away.
- Moloum, who seems himself as the top minion of the WT and wished to remain lord inventor of Fallowdeep, and that may also have planned for Klrau downfall
- Lyanthari, who got news of Baphon's promise to Klrau and wishes not the lich's return to prominence.
- Ceto, who literally just arrived only to discover she might be supplanted by an older undead.
Possibly a few of these people could plot against Klrau's awakening, but none possess the abilities needed to permanently destroy the demilich.
Surely, none at this moment would lift a finger in his aid.

The pcs now got a potential other quest: destroy Klrau to deprive Baphon of a collaborator he wants, and that if destroyed again, will not be able to be "called back" even by Baphon's wishes.

This is my overview on ho to explore an otherwise dumb boss monster (a classic awakened demilich is a wizard, while he was clearly a cleric) and give the Pc a way to directly go against Baphon's wishes on a personal level.

Allow me to propose a version of the events:

1) Of all the high ranking followers of Tar Baphon, mr Klrau seems the only one to be LE (originally the WT was also LE, but later version had he become NE). Due to his "honor" and his ability to "control" and "keep in check" other, way more chaotic forces, he was chosen to a difficult task: built in complete secret a 1 mile wide fortress of the dead, possibly bigger in size than Gallowspire itself.
2) To do such a thing, Baphon offered Klrau a worthy prize: to have his cult of Baalzebul spread in his dominion, and have it become a mayor religion in all the inner sea region: greater than Zyphus, Groetus, Charon, Norgorber ... and even Urgathoa. Klrau then took an oath, to serve and wait until called, and Baphon was also, as some level, obliged.
3) Klrau was however put in a difficult situation, since during the war, while he was still finishing the fortress, he had to give Baphon almost all of his forces due to the relentless success of the crusade. He found himself with barely an hundred of minions when then Shining Crusade reached Gallowspire walls, and it was a that point that Klaur started to "call in" all the nearby undead and allied forces. He did this not only to keep them near, but to slaughter any one that was not useful but that could have given around the information of Fallowdeep's existence.
4) At the time of Gallowspire sealing, Klrau saw himself forced to a similar situation. To defend the very existence of Fallowdeep, which he view as the "last hope" for his faith to become spread in the world, he took part in a ritual known as "The Great Lie": doing this, he called his vow and sealed himself and all his minions inside Fallowdeep halls, never to leave until called by his master. By doing so, he was able to literally "remove" Fallowdeep's existence and presence from the world's knowledge until he himself held the Lie. Doing so, he actually trapped many creatures that had not intention of spending centuries inside the facility, and that were tinned down in the following years and decades. This was done in honor to Baphon last orders, who had reached him like they arrived to the vampire general Malyas: "Gather strenght, wait my command"
5) "The Great Lie" offered, however, a loophole: somebody designated from the liar could leave, 1 time at month, for 1 hour, the place without breaking the lie, if he was able to never say the name "Fallowdeep" while away. Using muse servants, Klrau used this window of time to send around minions with (silenced) scrolls of recall, targeting each month a different cemetery in the Inner Sea Region, and had them steal at least 1 body belonging to a knight. Doing this, in the first 7 centuries, he was able to assemble (putting aside incidents and other, necessary travels) well more than 10 thousands of knights whose bodies were "taken by the Lie", never discovered.
6) Visiting often Lastwall, as a spite of the paladin's nation, Klrau stole hundreds of bodies of knights and paladins, which were reanimated as the profane paladins troops: he used the bodies of the defenders of Lastwall to create a formidable army able to use that same force against them.
7) Klrau's dream was however ... one that would have never reached its conclusion: weakened by the routine of Fallowdeep "daily" routine, forced to invest his much of his daily powers to sustain Fallowdeep magic, he started to slip away, taken by plans and ideas that were never being able to be planned out, kept "in the now" only by the bickering of his subordinates and the conversations with his 2 "guardian angels". 150 years before the time of the adventure, something happened that made him fall into a torpor he (almost) never woke up.
8) What happened could have been many things. Many Iuphasti crafted a decade long game which let the undead lord to simply forget himself in a continuous dream. Many the crafty alchemist Moloum gifted his liege with a counterfeit "incense of meditation" which, over the decades, weakened the lich's essence until his soul escaped. Whatever it was, Klrau fell into torpor and for 149 years he remained sitting on his throne, defended by Iuphasti and the bearbed devils, who through the use of major image had him appear quite active, so that his minions never had a real chance to realize his disappearance. While he was there, the Great Lie was still in place.
During this time, it was Iuphasti that moved around, looking no more for bodies but for informations and targets for her further plains. Maybe it was Iuphasti that found Ceto and gave her the "last push" necessary to have her become a servant of hell.
9) However, with the detonation of the Radiant fire, the entire complex was shocked and barely withstood its power. Klrau awoken, almost gone, as a normal demilich, and started to wretch his belongings. Any lie was soon after discovered when Tar Baphon himself, unable to either scry or contact Klrau mind, descended in person inside Fallowdeep, to find the place almost in order but unable to quickly deploy his resources as hoped. He also found Klrau totally broken, and his rage was great. He eradicated the demilich with mythic magic, and in from of he remains, he simply said: "Get yourself together, Klrau. I wish you at my side again. Be quick".

Part 2 - Fallowdeep

To further explore Fallowdeep, i find interesting to build up it's reputation through his history. If we take a step back, Fallowdeep is an horror hidden inside the earth in the heart of the very nation that was formed to stop the WT. Yet, not notion of such menace even existing was ever known by the defenders of Lastwall ... we to weave an answer.

Fallowdeep was built during the shining crusade, possibly in the latter part when the forces of Taldor had already reached Ustalav. Tar Baphon gave this task to mr Klrau, recently self made lich and cleric of Baalzebul, who spent a few decades to bucker the place, and his described to have "called in" as many WT followers he could when the shining crusade was on a winning side. They holed up, and then waited for a signal from their master that never came.

This explanation does not satisfy me, cause it lacks certain elements:
1) how were they able to gather so much dead bodies during the Shining Crusade, when all the WT forces would have been spent fighting Taldor's armies? Tar Baphon did really had a few thousand undead to spare and dozens of necrocrafts while he had Arnisant's knignts literally knocking at his door?
2) why did Klaur not receive any information, if not from Tar Baphon, from any of his other vassals, like dear old General Malyas or mr Geir? I get the Great Seal did stop even sending spells to the WT, but the WW has been very active in those centuries, yet he was able to get no info?
3) why di Klaur choose to wait, if no one ordered him such? With the ability to mobilize at least 5k undead and teleport them ANYWHERE in the entire solar system, in 900 years he could have well conquered Akiton, as miss Iuphasti wished, and then have gated himself in Ustalav with hundred of thousands of zombie aliens ...

So, we must ask ourself: why he didnt do any of this? Refusing the meta answer that is "Klaur's place never existed before 2018", my answer is: the choose not to.

Part 2 - Fallowdeep

Let us now explore the dungeon of Fallowdeep. From a meta prospective, the dungeon is easily divided in 3 main areas, each heavily characterized by their respective controllers, while the other tunnels are described as a 1 mile while maze of corridors and storage rooms filled with undead. There is also a central area, which is immediately accessible by the Pc and that contains their "main objective" (and, as such, is guarded by the (supposedly) strongest enemy).

I'll now be giving an overview of the Dungeon itself.

While the three main areas are well thought, the dungeon lacks to me of dynamic elements.

First and foremost, it lacks any form of "dread" that a location which as housed thousands of undead, and that was recently be visited by hundreds more, should have. I'm thinking about some kind of environmental effect, which may penalize the characters. Probably, the implication is that there is such effect, but since the Pc have their obols, they are somewhat immune to that.

I'd make so that, inside Fallowdeep, any undead gains fast healing 5, which grows to 30 for the profane troops. Living beings should instead get permanently sickened or get 1d6 negative energy damage each minute, and have themselves become undead if they were to be killed in this area. That's something trivial for the Pcs, which thanks to the obols ignore the damage, but that narratively "forces" them to go alone.

Secondly, as pointed out by the adventure, clever pcs may be able to literally have the dungeon sections collapse, making so that the undead present in each all cannot even arrive at the teleportation circle. While each of the undead leader may be able, through time ad effort, to remove any obstacles, like the debris of a fallen corridor, its a process that cannot be overcome by mere minutes, and in a round based action economy that's like to have "solved" a problem.

To avoid this, it's proper to discuss about Fallowdeep defenses.
While it's not stated at any point, i believe we should work with the assumption that the entire place was, and still is, under some form of "divine locking", which has allowed his existence to go undetected for 900 years by a force of paladins which as, in time, literally build a keep 50 meters upstairs!

This should have been some kind of blessing from Baalzebul which had made the entire area, and everybody in it, not subjected to divinations, and that has also contained in it the negative energies, which would have otherwise polluted the hole area like it happened at Vyrlich. The structure of Fallowdeep itself should be so infused of negative energy to be extra hard to damage (fall of force level of durability at least), otherwise a simple earthquake spell does end this entire section of the book.

This blessing should have also impeded dimensional travel, cause otherwise:
a) many devils inside the temple would have been able to go back and forth the complex b) Tar Baphon could have simply scryed inside and then teleported in, gather is army and then strike Absalom without needing to "waste" a shard.

The only exception should be the teleportation circles. Apparently, they were there from the start and where somehow made able to operate even inside that environment. Since to reach the "goal" of this part of the adventure, the pcs just need to sabotage the teleportation cycles and then kill anyone that could alert the WT of this actions (namely up to 5 npcs), it's clear to me how the Pcs can get an easy win condition by just dispelling the three circles and quickly retreat upstairs. They may not know it, but no one in Fallowdeep can - at this point - replicate the same magic, and since it's assumed the Pcs can get magical resources needed to return from Arcadia to Avistan, It's safe to assume they don't need to use those exact circles to reach Absalom.

To me, the three circles should at least be "buffed up", and protected by some kind of effect that stops their easy destruction. Tar Baphon or Klaur may have placed a dozen of symbols that react if certain words are not used, for example.

I've also noticed how one of the teleportation circles is directed to Gallowgarden. This may well mean that Baphon did send some profane paladins there, and devolve the plot a bit if the pcs are given indications of such, yet i find no notes or mentions of this possible development. I imagine it's something for the dms to build up.

Part 1 - Glerhadring's ruins, environment and the tomb giants
(Section b)

Since we have to get the pcs a few more fights before the descend into Fallowdeep, I think we need a way to make this cabal of giants plot relevant, either by making them a true obstacle, or by using them to further foreshadow the dangers of the levels below.

I'll offer two possible solutions:

A) The pallid knights

Eastapiron's cabal is not a random group of giants called by the WT, but a sect of Urgathoa's worshippers called by Lyanthari after she discovered how this entire complex filled with undead had not build a proper temple to her goddess. The shame! In this interaction, they are lazing off after just finished clearing up Glerhadring and are waiting their mistress's orders before properly consacrate this temple, which shall become "the beacon of the pallid princess faith" in the newly named "gravelands". In this interaction, the group is only minimally endangered by the Wyrmwraith, since they are in no need to go outside and shall be escorted/teleported out by their mistress should the need arise. They become plot relevant for 2 reasons:

1) There should be, somewhere in the complex, dozens of corpses somehow still intact, which are being moved or are being prepared to construct an urgathoan altar. These bones should be the first objective of the pcs in order to appease Trant's ghost. Removing these bones, which are being regrown into full corpses, should put the pcs in direct conflict with the giants.

2) They can become a powerful resource for Lyanthari. The daughter of Urgathoa has now got the chance to fall back from the pc's attack, move upstair and regroup with her followers. This option is still valid even if the pcs simply kill the giants. Image the pcs forcing the priestess to retreat, only to have her reappear after a few hours, followed by juju zombies Eastapiron, Rhal, ecc ...

B) The betrayed gamblers

Eastapiron's cabal is trapped downstair by the Wyrmwraith, and are waiting from answers for an emissary they send to fallowdeep. Such being, which could have been the true leader of the cabal, has angered one of the undead npc faithful to the tyrant (possibly Ceto) which his claims of betrayal from the WT's part, and has been properly killed and made and undead (I suggest a advanced devourer, since they are the right size, and lacking in this adventure). Unable to get a clear answer and not wanting to risk any more of his people lives, Eastapiron has decided to "hole up" since they can at least wait a few weeks with the food they got, while Rhal plans a strategy how to safely evacuate the most of them.

In this scenario, the giants are not actually hostile on sight and having them go free would damage any future alliances between the tomb giants cabals and the WT forces. However, they fully intend to "cut of their losses" even if informed that the Wyrmwraith has been defeated, either by gaining control of the whole Hammer Rock for their purposes, or to simply escape with all the bodies they found, some of which they may still have with them.

This would require diplomacy from the pc's part to either intimidate the giants to move away and don't return/attack them at a later point, or to convince them the area shall soon me either occupied by WT loyalists of retaken by Lastwall's forces. I'd suggest a DC 33 for each, with a +5 bonus if they can prove the Wyrmwraith's demise or bribe the giants, with a -5 penaly however for each request they make to the giants other then "leave".

On this account, we could have the Chimera match proposed by Clatchol as a way to defuse the situation, by allowing the pcs to "bet" parts of their equipment in exchange for the giant's leaving their loot (in the form of either the bodies or the belonging of Hammer Rock's defenders and refugees). Some Dm may have Eastapiron being a sore loose and start to bet off more and more things, to allows pcs to get even more loot from them.

Part 1 - Glerhadring's ruins, environment and the tomb giants
(Section a)

Regarding Glerhadring's ruins, I find it an interesting insert. While I'm not a fan of the "secret ruin" of Fallow Deep buried under the other ruin inside the castle, Glerhadring si thematically relevant since it shows the Pcs how much older the world really his, and how a group of people can dedicate their existence to a seemingly impossible aim, which is a good lesson.

I also really like the "Hall of oats" area, but i find it a bit strange how this area and the relic inside has gone somehow ignored by the modern's day Hammer Rock's defenders, since a few of those are dwarf. Having "unquiet dwarf spirits" in your underground floor seems really not a great idea, especially when you live in a nation founded to guard and contain another specific undead ... The image of the rusty gate is iconic, but I would have the place walled, only to have been recently opened by the giants how took notice the old passage way.

I also like the idea of a composite fight with the tomb giants, namely a fight that sees other enemies "join up" in the following rounds from help. It's a rare thing inside a dungeon, when should be in fact the norm. The giants CR seem to reflect this, since even if they fought together with all their forces (8 tomb giants + Eastapiron + rhal + chaltchot the rawhead), they could be still taken by a group of buffed level 16 pcs.

What i find lacking is that, inside these sections, we find no mention of the survivor's bodies or the refugees that had flock to Hammer Rock fortress. While it's possible these bodies have been moved downstair in request of the npcs of Fallowdeep, it depends much around how long it was since the WT detonated the radiant fire. It has been 3 days, as its said by Varvados, or 23 days, as written in the "fey mythology section?". Since we got with the first assumption, they must have been ungodly quick to clean all of this.

Also, none of the forces of this level directly block the Pc's advance towards Fallowdeep, nor they carry any useful insight of informations regarding the situation downstairs. They could not even notice the pcs if they employed any high level scout option (invisibility, ethereal forms, arcane eyes or simply high stealth rolls). The adventure takes notice of it, and explains how Eastapiron can be tricked into letting them pass. My consideration is that, since the Pcs should have met Tsomar right before they go downstairs, there is no need for further chatting, since the most direct line from the floor to Fallowdeep should be known by the ghost, and it's not blocked.

From a meta prospective, the giants are an entirely optional encounter, and are plot relevant only because their leader has got a few soldier bones inside his amazing fossil golem armor (a construct that, by its rules, can only be build using fossilized bones ... so, was this a last moment decision?).

They are, basically, there for loot and xp.

The giants seem also to be on "low alert". They do not move around the complex except if they hear battlecries. We don't get their daily schedule of activities, even thought they should be somewhat busy having just arrived, to either regroup and corpses which survived the radiant fire or to rebuild the keep to their needs. I mean, the roof is just 2 feet higher than them! They must be careful into swinging those long scythes.

Part 1 - Glerhadring's ruins, environment and the tomb giants
(Section a)

Regarding Glerhadring's ruins, I find it an interesting insert. While I'm not a fan of the "secret ruin" of Fallow Deep buried under the other ruin inside the castle, Glerhadring si thematically relevant since it shows the Pcs how much older the world really his, and how a group of people can dedicate their existence to a seemingly impossible aim, which is a good lesson.

I also really like the "Hall of oats" area, but i find it a bit strange how this area and the relic inside has gone somehow ignored by the modern's day Hammer Rock's defenders, since a few of those are dwarf. Having "unquiet dwarf spirits" in your underground floor seems really not a great idea, especially when you live in a nation founded to guard and contain another specific undead ... The image of the rusty gate is iconic, but I would have the place walled, only to have been recently opened by the giants how took notice the old passage way.

I also like the idea of a composite fight with the tomb giants, namely a fight that sees other enemies arrive in the following rounds from help. It's a rare thing inside a dungeon, when should be in fact the norm. The giants CR seem to reflect this, since even if they fought together with all their forces (8 tomb giants + Eastapiron + rhal + chaltchot the rawhead), they could be still taken by a group of buffed level 16 pcs.

What i find lacking is that, inside these sections, we find no mention of the survivor's bodies or the refugees that had flock to Hammer Rock fortress. While it's possible these bodies have been moved downstair in request of the npcs of Fallowdeep, it depends much around how long it was since the WT detonated the radiant fire. It has been 3 days, as its said by Varvados, or 23 days, as written in the "fey mythology section?". Since we got with the first assumption, they must have been ungodly quick to clean all of this.

Also, none of the forces of this level directly block the Pc's advance towards Fallowdeep, nor they carry any useful insight of informations. They could not even notice the pcs if they employed any high level scout option (invisibility, ethereal forms, arcane eyes or simply high stealth rolls). The adventure takes notice of it, and explains how Eastapiron can be tricked into letting them pass. My consideration is that, since the Pcs should have met Tsomar right before the go downstairs, there is no need for further chatting, since the most direct line from the floor to Fallowdeep should be known by the ghost, and it's not blocked.

From a meta prospective, the giants are an entirely optional encounter, and are plot relevant only because their leader has got a few soldier bones inside his amazing fossil golem armor (a construct that, by its rules, can only be build using fossilized bones). They are, basically, there for loot and xp. The giants seem also to be on "low alert". They do not move around the complex except if they hear battlecries. We don't get their daily schedule of activities, even thought they should be somewhat busy having just arrived, to either regroup and corpses which survived the radiant fire or to rebuild the keep to their needs.

I’ll elaborate now further on the role of Tsomar Trant on the adventure.

From a meta prospective, he’s basically a “free heal point” inside the dungeon which serves also as the last “social quest” of the campaign, aside diplomacy with enemy npcs and the taunting of the Whispering Tyrant himself. To allow Tsomar ghost to depart,
you need to put to rest the bodies of all Hammer Rock defenders, which is poetic and a plausible reason for one that has been a ghost for around 3-4 days. However, doing such curtesy doesn’t grant the party any boon or resource, while it “forces” them to explore all the dungeon of Fallowdeep, negating another potential “choice” of action, namely to collapse the entire fortress through the use of high level spells/powers.

As a character, I find also his role a bit lacking, since he provides informations to the Pcs, but refuses to follow them even in the first level. To me, he should have made a bit more occupied and mobile, to follow the pcs at least in the dwarves ruins after they have sufficiently clean up them. I’d have him go around, speaking with other, lesser spiritual presences and dispelling a few minor haunts.

What to me could be Tsomar’s main role is to show the Pcs the true dread of their adversaries through visions. Basically, I’have him use his oracular ghost powers to “mass possess” the party, in order to give them a first person point of view of what Captain Trant witnessed. In such manner, we can allow some kind of “interaction” between the Pcs and their main antagonists, with the focus on Tar Baphon himself. Tsomar may be able to do this once a day, or once every time the Pcs present him a success in his quest, which grants him hope that allows him to relive those dreadful moments without falling into despair.

I’d like to propose at least 4 visions:
1) The moment of the radiant fire detonation, to - finally - directly show the pcs what happen when you are caught in the blast, and show them the annihilation of Hammer Rock and its survivors. This scenario would have been the memories of the still living Trant.
2) The arrival of the grim army of the Whispering Tyrant. This scenario would be what a barely aware Tsomar saw through the ethereal place. It’l like to presente, with this scenario, further changes to the WT entourage, and the introduction of a few npc which shall shine in part 3.
3) The captivity of Tsomar, it's coming to realize his nature as a ghost and his speech with Gildais. This section is to show how Tsomar was dominated, and possibly used by the WT entourage. To make this momento worthy, I’ve have a mayor npc be the one who took him under control (possibly Ceto), and also give the Pcs a “taste” of what entails for an undead to be controlled through energy domination. This is due to allow them to not only sympathize with Tsomar, but also with Gildais, which should came through his speech to Tsomar regarding the urges of his new form, and how to express them without “losing yourself in them”
4) The armies of the dead, and the Tyrant’s departure. Tsomar may have witnessed the moment in which the WT stormed off Klrau’s halls, harassing his underlings and minions for their “Utter incompetence”, and have him do an “evil overlord speech”, praising a few minions while menacing all the others, giving them an ultimatum. After that, Tsomar may have witnessed the departure through the teleportation circle of the “First Dread Legion”, giving the players a taste of what they are gonna fight in part 3.

I invite you all to elaborate on this possible visions.

Moving on, regarding Tsomar’s quest, I’d like to allow to players to gain some kind of blessing to help the pcs in their battles with the WT’s generals, and possibly with the lich himself. I’d propose, at minimum, that the pcs gain a revelation from the oracle mystery of battle. More judicious Gms may simply grant them the ability to “count as mythic” when they’ll be subjected to the WT aura of absolute dread, and give them general bonuses against fear having “accepted death”.

I concur that the Whispering Tyrant may actually be hit quite hard by this failure on a psychological level.

That's what may have made a greater impact on the campaign if it was actually stated somewhere. Undead in this campaign are being treated, for maybe the first time, as being that can reasonably be affected by this kind of emotions and self doubts, whereas in the past we very rarely saw it occur (i remember a certain demilich in Shattered Star, while the main antagonist of book 6 could not be reasoned with ).

Problem is, the pcs are not "nobodies": they are the heroes of their generation, as much as Arnisant was the paragon of his age. Just because they are not at the head of an army doesn't mean they are not a worthy treat by themselves.

Also, more so than all his previous enemies, they are intrinsically bound with the WT destiny since they are, "for the first time in this creation" (as said by a certain giant raven) in the same condition of Tar Baphon. The WT is personally targeting them because he perceive them as a menace, and - to me at least - he should have tried to target their obols to make them explode as soon as he became aware of their condition.

Yet, Baphon is somehow unable to understand what makes the pcs "special" when they are literally in front of him. There is not time for a "I see you" moment, or to cement any kind of connection between those who'll defeat him, truly, for the first time in millennia.

However, more than humiliation ... For how much Baphon's scary as death itself, i wonder if, after barely surviving completely soul annihilation from obols detonation, he's simply got a good scare. Fear can be a terrible weakness, especially for a being that was unable to experience it for millennia.

I'm quite sure that, if it was written somewhere that Baphon stopped his attack at Absalom because, after barely surviving the destruction of his own soul, he has known fear at a level so vast he cannot control it, that reasoning would have make many players smile without diminishing their pcs sacrificed or the menace that the WT represent.

Part 1 - Hammer Rock's surface level and its surroundings.

Let us take a quick overview on the first floor of the fortress of Hammer Rock's, its inhabitants and surroundings. As I've proposed, Keirodera forest it's a location which takes time away from the main mission of this part of the adventure, and such shall be presented in a separate section as "extra content", with the intent to reward players who, seeing a magical fairy forest next to their objective, will have their character dedicate time and effort to discover its origins and, potentially, its purpose.

So, Hammer Rock's upper level is almost devoid of enemies, which is good, since there is a 50 ft. wyrmwraith that's basically death incarnate who should murder anything - alive or undead - not able to resurrect itself.

My problem is that there is also a "death chariot" which, somehow, formed itself due to "many horses dying", which has been left untouched by Ptemiazrol just because "it was there". Now, since a death coach is a funny visual enemy, I'll keep it but it shall not be in the stables, nor being born from the slaughter of the horses ...

Another problem is that, if Ptemiazrol see himself as a protector of Hammer Rock so much that he need to punish and devour any other defender, the presence of the tomb giants on the lower level becomes absurd, since the ruins of Glerhadring are basically just the floor below Hammer Rock and the Wyrmwraith can lifesense eveything in 60 ft at any time. He should have crushed ad devoured any of those giants (who, by my understanding, are unable to command him and utterly helpless against it: Ptemiazrol need to roll a natural 1 to be controlled by them).

So, let us make some explanations why he's not done so. And I've got an easy one: Baphon's is a "BB" - a Blasphemous Bastard. Arriving at Hammer Rock, the Lich Tyrant felt the presence of the draconic spirit and, while it was still forming itself, simply wish/whispered to him the right things to make sure he didn't retain any true self but was simply a killing machine (he's got a +30 bluff, after all). Due to this, Ptemiazrol cannot be reasoned nor redeemed ... he's under Tar' control without even realizing it! He's tasked to kill everything on the upper level of Hammer Rock, and remain within 1 mile from the fortress, never going down, had he cannot understand that the whispers in his mind are not is own thoughts!

And then, since Baphon's a BB, he invited the tomb giants to Hammer Rock with the purpose of having them first regroup the bodies on the sub level, only to be killed by the wyrmwraith and resurrected as greater wraiths the moment they walked out of Glerhadring. Baphon's did this only to laugh at their demise, since the fate of Klaur had put him into a worse mood than normal, and since another lieutenant (maybe dear Moloum) asked the WT for new flesh for experiments and necrocrafts.
And so the "buyers" were betrayed and sold by someone that cannot bother to even care for the consequences, since he's going to become a divine BB next week!

As such, right know the giants are technically trapped, and should have lost at least 2 of them to the Wraith's claws. Those corpses should be found in the middle of Hammer Rock plaza, maybe with a chart full of bodies. The Wyrmwraith therefore has got 3 dread wraiths: 2 large size and 1 small size. This makes him a battle against him and his entourage a CR 18/19, which should be climatic enough against a level 16 party with is expecting it, and dreadful against an unprepared party.

Tsomar role remains the same in this adventure. After his escape from the undead's control, he resurfaced, only to be destroyed by the wyrmwraith, and since then has found himself stuck in the room he first die. He's cool, and I'll elaborate further on this npc while talking about his quest in a later post. Thought, I must note we get a friendly ghost just the last adventure with a similar role.

I also must point out how the temple of Iomedeae should receive a greater significant since it somehow remained relatively untouched (and unlooted) even with the BB Baphon himself passing literally at 30 ft from it!
It should be pointed out how much "strange" this is. The structure could work as a natural place were to rest, and should be under an effect of forbiddance, or similar effect, maybe keyed against the undead.
That seems also a good point to gave the heroic pcs a vision of how things are going in Absalom, possibly while wielding that fancy sword on the altar.
Lastly, that fancy +3 holy silver longsword should totally gain the Oathammer treatment, becoming a unique kind of holy avenger after killing enough betrayers (just ignore the holy avenger from level 3, at this point)

Now, regarding the surrounding of Hammer Rock

a) the Weird haunt is quite interesting and should be left.

b) Those traps in the fortress also could be useful, and i thing could be made funnier if were made not as an obstacle, but as a potential resource against the Wyrmwraith: the pcs got to fight 2 dragons inside dungeons were they could not even hover! This time, the Wyrmwraith can fly over the nocturnal sky as he pleases, and should be allowed to do such. If the Pcs are in the open, he can attack them from hundreds of feet, so the Pcs should get the possibility to use Hammer rock's traps against it if they play smart.

To make those traps and haunt relevant, i'll have Stalgard teleport the Pcs at 1 mile and an half away from the fortress, into a structure which was engulfed by Keirodera forest, like a stone watchtower on top of an hill. The pcs will need to walk a bit, and could potentially start to look inside the forest for the missing team.

I'll elaborate in the next part my thought on them, and my usage of the dreaded death coach.

Regarding this Book, I've noticed something new which is strange. The adventure explains how, if the Pcs work to sabotage the teleportation circle, they might even get the WT to come there to fix those instruments ... since he needs reinforces.

It's a short line, which opens an interesting possibility, and also lots of problems:

1) While i love the idea of Tar getting angry, having a "I'm surrounded by idiots" moment, and quick teleporting to Fallowdeep to "do the plumbing", I refuse to believe he's not got around enough liches or mages with engineering skills that can fix the problem for him. Having him to show up would be problematic, just like having

2) Why Baphon needs reinforcements it's also unclear to me. He's an ungodly necromancer, capable to create entire legions by the use of quick spawn undead such as wights. I'm unfamiliar with the island of Kortos but, by rules, he just need to visit the near town of Diobel with a dozen wights 1 night ... and the next morning, he's got another 4k army ... It's atrocious, but it's also what the Whispering Tyrant can do and will do to quickly capture Absalom.

Also, remember the Fetoring Maw from book 2? Since Baphon is apparently it's creator, and "the whispering way owns several of these artifacts", one does wonder why he didn't smuggle a few of those in Absalom to, again horrifyingly, gas the entire population. Just a thought ...

After reading many complaints about this Ap ending, I thought It would be interesting to put our creative minds together in order to develop a different last act for the Tyrant Grasp's Ap. What follows here should be intended as a proposal for what I perceive could be a more focused Book 6, but wishes also to be a trend were to post useful statblocks and other DM tools.

Before embarking in this project, it's important to remark how this proposal is not done to denigrate the work behind the actual, published adventure. Tyrant Grasp, as a final 1 Edition adventure with a survival horror dynamic, is a great project, and the authors intent should not be questioned, nor disregarded. What I'll try to articulate in the following posts is merely a different interpretation of the same events, using the same settings and resources.

As such, one thing shall be made clear: the AP's finale shall remain the same. At the end of this adventure, it shall be required to the player characters to sacrifice their lives, and possibly their souls, to stop Tar Baphon's threat. What I'll try to propose is a different journey towards the same destiny.

My proposal shall developed in 3 chapters:
1) a rewriting of the first 2 parts of book 6 ("The nascent wilds" and "the fortress of the dead"); this shall be done in a few parts, since it explores 4 areas.
2) a reimagining of part 3 , with the inclusions of different encounters and npcs; this shall also be in a few parts, this time to proper present both the encounters and the atmosphere of each fight.
3) a specific section on the Whispering Tyrant, detailing not only the fight with Tar Baphon himself, but also a poetic suggestion in order to, in my opinion, better connect this specific fight with the Pc's personal story in the narrative.

These sections shall be intermixed by other suggestions, like a few extra "scenes" which could be developed into the narrative of book 6.

Writing down this will require a few weeks (english is not my native language), during which I'll be open to suggestions and considerations to interview them into the narrative.

Speaking of women, to move the topic again on the contents of book 6 ...
I'd like to hear your opinions around these questions.

1) Could Ceto's downfall have been portrayed more effectively?
I mean, the adventure make sure she returns as a graveknight if the Pcs either kill her or let her live after she is let to assault them in a very strong scene. Yet, the adventure suppose the Pcs left her with their armor, which is necessary to provoke the transformation into a Graveknight. Could we tide her rise to power to some outside force, like the archdevil Baalzebub? Or should we change her undead type into something else?

2) Should have been more consequences from Baphon's nuking of 3/4 of his starting army from the side of Urgathoa? I mean, Urgathoa is a deity which domains are undeath, disease and such. Baphon's nuked at least 15.000 undead in 1 strike, many of those with sentience, and filled the entire area with more positive energy than negative one to boot. I'd like to think the WT nuked at least 1/12 of the entire undead "population" of Avistan with that move. Since Lyanthari goes against the Pcs after they destroy a few undead, how should the choice of Baphon to nuke thousands of undead (many of whom were probably aware) be felt by a priestess of the goddess of undeads? Should Lyanthari be trying to not only make Baphon shallow is pride, but also punish him somehow?

Dear friends, I think we have expressed our discontent in a proper eloquent way. I believe it's time to merge it with our creativity and develop another post, in with to craft a different book 6 and a different execution of this controversial ending, one not bound by the limits of 59 pages.

However, something should be said regarding part 2 of book 6. It was more than decent, and offered quite the array of npc. Lyanthari, with her "quest to undermine Baphon's vanity" was refreshing, and thought Gilgais role in the AP was a bit butchered, he remains the mournful character that was foreshadowed for much of the Ap.
Tsomar Trant quest is interesting and grants a fine character moment, thought it does not let to concrete rewards in the form of oracular blessing and such, which would have made it cooler. On the other hand, the Oathkeeper shrine is quite enjoyable and the gaining of the Oathammer is a very cool moment, expecially thinking how much cool any character wielding hit will look to the dwarf paladin of chapter 3.
The grudges dinamic its also interesting, and offers social interaction with 2 crazy, egregious characters.
Ceto's role is also well thought, and see a familiar face offer great roleplaying potential, more so if moved from her encounter and placed as the head of a profane troop of paladins. Yet all of this pales in front of Iuphasti ambitions, which are very interesting and realistic: why bother with the WW projects, when you can conquer your own world? The campaign world is always bigger than the campaign itself, and this is proved by the origins of both Aeonte and Moloum (the latter of which has casually found a way to create a MR8 swarm of death).

Let's be methodical: what makes this a loss for Tar-baphon?

... He seems to have lost nothing but a little time, some expendable and replenishable resources, and a weapon that was causing him pain for centuries.

An aspect that I believe should be considered is this: by being destroyed, Baphon lost control over not only his army, but many of his minions that were directly controlled by him. Minions that, over 900 years of imprisonment, could not only not be so much faithful to him, but that could well be incline to:

To be fair, in the first book of the Ap it's written that the Radiant fire is generated by the usage of a mythic spell purposely crafted by the Tyrant, while in book 6 it's written that the Tyrant can call the Radiant fire as a "standard action". I point this out because the usage of a mythic spell was later reconnected probably in order to avoid having the entire party try to just "stop him from snapping his hand" by the many ways high level players can do (antimagic, counterspelling and all that "avengers endgame" stuff we all know and love).

It is also written that the WT is in constant pain due to the shard, yet this does not reflect on his stats in any ways, except for the fact - i suppose - he's angrier than usual.

A simple solution could have been a sidebar on his stats, but it's here the page limit strikes again. Between spells, his vast gear (with apparently no place to put it), the explanation of his mythic abilities, and the creepy portrait, there was simply not enough space. To mitigate this, I would have done this sidebar:

"Shard debilitation"

"This shard of the shield of Aroden in Baphon hand has been a thorn in the lich's side for almost a millennium. Unable to remove it without causing a massive explosion of positive energy, akin in fact to the detonation of the radiant fire, the lich has suffered his effects, only gaining limitate control over it in centuries of study. First and foremost, Baphon cannot use the hand with the shard for any effect related with negative energy (casting touch spell, using his paralyzing touch, healing himself and such). Secondly, the shard inflicts 1d6 divine damage to the Whispering Tyrant every minute, or every 10 minute if the lich resides in an area of great necromantic energies. Also, while Tar Baphon is able to cast any spell from level 0 to 8 without rolling for concentration, each time he cast a mythic spell the artifact reacts, inflicting him 5d6 divine damage and forcing a concentration roll against ongoing damage. If Baphon overcome the roll, his "sustained by magic" mythic ability generally heals instantly any damage caused by the artifact"

It's also written that Tar Baphon can, somehow, feel the presence of all the other shards of the Shield of Aroden, and therefore is able to choose which one blow up. However, in the AP, the WT doesn't seem to reach to the Pc's Obols in any way, while both Arazni and the old lady of book 5 seem to quickly understand the pcs situation.

I would therefore add another sidebar:

"The Tyrant gaze"

"After prolonged exposition to the shard, Baphon can immediately sense another piece of the shield of Aroden in a range of 1.000 ft, and can target any shard remaining with a divination/scrying effect as it was a creature familiar to him. During the battle, he's destined to realized the obols existence the moment the Pcs make themselves noteworthy. This also allow him to identify the Pcs as Arazni's pawn, and to deduce their actions in Arcadia. Yet, the WT takes the most simple explanation for granted, that the Pcs have imbedded in their soul a piece of the Kumaru tree in order to better resist his powers, and overlook the possibility of any kind of traps. Armed with this knowledge, Baphon's able to scry on the pcs without allowing any save, making him easy to surprise attack the party, first by sending assassins, then by teleporting himself. While at first the Tyrant is tempted to try to detonate the Pc's Obols, he lated decided in favor of killing the party and turning them into different kinds of undead, hoping to be able to remove their obols and gain more uses of the radiant fire".

Moving away from the conundrum that is Tar Baphon's ultimate fate, i would point the discussion towards the lack of a proper third act for book 6.

As I've said before, this section is lacking: we don't get any map of the Cairnlands, nor for the single fights with the Cairn king or Naraga. The leader of Absalom forces, Rothos of the First Guard, is also faceless (thought, probably he's got covered in the society scenarios).

Also, while the frustration mechanics is quite funny, at the end of the book Baphon appears to fight not only the pcs, but also the leaders of 2 of the three armies that he's facing. Deep striking in the enemy line to assassinate their leadership seems hardly a move made on the fly, and would probably have happened regardless the pc tauntings.

However, Baphon actually coming "almost alone" is strange nevertheless. Since the gated daemon could teleported by itself on the pyramid, the Tyrant could have well arrived with an entourage of "lesser" undead, like a gallowdead honor guard or similar, just to "make this funny". I know that the reason is one of meta-gaming (to allow pcs to "stand a chance" into ... touching him?), but this seems quite strange, expecially considering that the Pcs are intended to "win by losing".

To rationalize this, maybe the Pcs actions have also the effect to sprone Baphon to action before he can regroup with the opportune forces for such strike. By killing several minions, he's forced to delegate to lieutenants certain parts of the army, and therefore cannot appear with an honor guard of gallowdeads, or similar things.

I'm also perplexed why he uses a wish to blast an hole in a pyramid, when he's got not only disintegration, but many other funny spells, like mythic meteor swarm! By using a wish, and before that a gate and the a teleport, he starts this battle not only "Hornless", but also without 2 very flexible level 9 spell.

Yet, most damning of all, we don't get any boastful shout from the card calling villain of pathfinder. This was surely due to page limit, but almost all of the final bosses got some text line before their final battle. And he surely need some quotes! In this case, any Dm is free to image what the Tyrant will say to their ultimate doomed Pcs.

I'm going with ...

"Rejoice, bloated Fools!" the Tyrant says, his voice a rasping sound that digs deeply in your hears, poisonous whispers of dread malice "Death has come for you! Soon you shall know her blessings ... in the everlasting servitude within my grasp! "

Or a more generic.

"If the Tyrant feels things are going in his way, he boasts about his grand plans while casting silent spells using his rod. He taunt any pcs who overcame his aura of terror by calling them "Good puppets of the slave queen of the desperate, now ruined and forever broken", and that "He'll put them into good use again after choking their life from their carcasses" ... or similar Saturday morning villain quotes.
I mean, he's the WT, after all!

To sweet a bit this thread, I invite you all to follow up with a few quotes from dear Tar Baphon which are to be said during this book, or possibly the whole ap.
Or should we make an apposite thread on "Baphon's funny rantings?"

I'll try to answer that.

Indeed, the campaign sees a lot of women in a position of power which are either antagonistic to the pcs or can become such. I can also enumerate many female npc (Shersen, Laira, Lady Docur, Blodsoriette, the npcs from Vyre and the elf village). This trend goes however away in book 5 and 6, were we got female npcs but on a more even ratio (of the bosses of book 5, one group is of hags, and another is from slavers guided by a female half orc monk, while the others are monstrous beings).

This is probably due to author's intent, to better express the peculiar and progressive reality of Kintargo (and to be true, of the whole Cheliax) regarding female roles and power. This could also be a way to compensate for the heavy presence of "hell" in this adventure, since until recently Pathfinder's hell was presented as quite misogynistic, while nowadays we get a fair amount of female devils.

This, however, does not lead to a lac of male npc, both helpful and antagonistic. A better build Tombus could have been a long them foil for the Silver Ravens way more than any of Barxillai's underling, as written.

Regarding Barxillai's case, I believe that is also a choice (of the character, yet also from the writers) to have him assisted by an entourage of powerful women who all wear pants, or that cannot be seen by him as feminine. Barxillai got a strong grudge with his (unnamed) mother, and this is reflected on how much he despises what he, as a cheliaxian nobleman, perceive as feminine things, such as luxuries or fine clothing. A theory of mine is that he never went to the Ruby Masquerade in person because he didn't want to subject himself to such environment in the first place.

So, yes: lots of interesting female npcs in position of power. I see no reason to mitigate this, but if your pcs find the situation a bit stressing or repetitive, i would suggest to make Rivozair an entirely different, male dragon (a corrupted bronze dragon with a sad backstory that was becoming blue in my case), and to had a few more npcs, or switch focus over other elements.

For example, in my game I've almost not used Trex, since she was somewhat the same as Lucien, while I've introduced from book 2 a swashbuckler styled vampire from Shadowsquare who was basically Aluceda's first son and that during the first week of the revolutions was preying over the ladies at the school of Lady Docur, who basically was away from the city until book 3 just to keep her students save.

By getting this lad in Shadowsquare, not only the Pcs got an ally in Lady Docur, who otherwise justs shows up in book 3, but also made the conflict with Lady Aluceda quite personal.

Regarding this book, other than the ending, my sadness is also due to how, since the pcs are required to take part to a fight that they cannot win conventionally, we cannot see the full effect of the pcs victory. Absalom may be save for now, but what about Lastwall? Without Tar Baphon's leadership, what does happen in the kingdom from which the pcs are probably from? And what about the whole Ustalav? Surely, this was not written down due to page limit and the uncoming arrival of the "Lost Omens World Guide", but leaves too many questions unanswered.

Moreover, the fact that the last part of book 6 gets a meager 6 pages, with only 1 map, and no art of the final npcs that will fight together with the Pcs, confounds me. This is mostly because i found almost no reason for the existence of the first part of the book except for give this heavy undead ap a bit of variation.

To summarize, we get 9 pages that explores how the radiant fire can "force" the first world on the material plane, or somehow emulate the living beings from there, by "spontaneously generating small dinosaurs and tapirs", but also living cr 15 or higher beings. Also, the sole reason the pcs are given to explore this forest, which should be no more than 2-3 miles wide, is to gain intel (and possibly recover a few bodies) over "the defenses" of Hammer Rock, which sadly amount to 2 traps, whose effects could be a challenge for a level 9 to 11 party, but surely not for a level 16 one.

While i find pretty the chase with the wild hunt, i would have preferred 15 or more pages dedicated to the "siege of Absalom", possibly with some named antagonist outside from those met (and probably slaughtered) at Hammer Rock.

For example, i would have found way more epic if, riding Naraga, had appeared the fabled Malyas, first general of Tar Baphon and anti-paladin of Urgathoa, send to avenge the (almost sure) demise of the daughter of the dead.
Or we could have gotten something truly horrid, like a "bodak legion" quickly creating itself in the middle of the battle, guided by a Vrolikai demon, which forces the pcs to actually decide if target the undead legion or the fleeing troops to stop the dying from turning into new troops. Instead we get a bunch of powerful, yet "nameless" foes until it's time for the WT to make his entrance.

In the end, what i would have liked is - also - some final words from Gildais, since he was "the" npc from which desires much of the AP sprout from. Two or few lines would have been enough, like: "If Gildais is still "alive" when the Tyrant's about to lose control of the radiant fire, he starts laughing, and opens his arms, welcoming his ruin and much awaited freedom". His role was, in the end, lost in the ending of this Ap, a labour whose content were ambitiously spread into many sources, and that only by bringing said content together (pathfinder society 10 23 and 10 99) will grant a GM like me the narrative options i would require to give 1 edition the greatest send off we can.

Another observation came from the pagecount of this book. The first part of this adventure is around 8-9 pages. The second part is 39 pages, and the third part - and the final of this adventure, is just six. Moreover, the first and the third part almost lack of any maps, except for the pyramid near which the last stand takes place.

My problem is now that, after a second reading, part 1 of book 6 is a big "wait sign". While mechanically interesting, it forces the pcs to pass through a new formed forest which, following the rules of the explosion of the radiant fire, should be no more than 3 mile wide, and offers no mechanic reasons to be traversed except to "look for the bodies of the precedent shout team".

I find this section could well be entirely skipped by flying above it (a feat quite possible for 16th level characters). Also, since the forest as been recently traversed by an horde of thousands of undead guided by a trigger happy lich, there should be a wide path of destruction to follow to reach Hammer Rock, a "whispering way of unlive" whose general area should not be able to sprout life of any kind.

But most damning/amazing of all: Radiant fire explosions cause, apparently, the "spontaneous birth of small dinosaurs and tapirs"... Best nuke ever!

Jokes aside, To justify this exploration, i would well make so that this forest "cannot be skipped" since, due to a mythic wish made by Baphon, this lands now belongs to the feywild, controlled by some higher being of which the blight is a manifestation, and that by gaining this foothold in the material basically shields any magical invasion of Hammer rock, making it some kind of "Nightmare realms" or something, which can be traversed only by it's makers and those made by it. If you fly over it, you find yourself over a "spooky" forest which end at the other side of the ring, never reaching Hammer rock! By befriending the wild hunts, the Pcs gets the unique chance to understand the rules of this place, and then, by killing the blight, the entire forest returns completely into the material (goodbye fey tapirs).

Without this kind of justification, i cannot see why devolve 9 pages for a challenge that could be completely avoided, which also doesn't move the story much. The first team only use for the pcs, except be rescued and entombed, it's a generic information on maybe 2 traps active in Hammer Rock, whose effects can be easily avoided or countered by a party of level 16 characters. What I see - maybe a bit biased - is 9 pages of thematic variation that weight heavily over the ending of the book, with find itself at the short part of the stick, and not at the "climax" of the story.

I've realized that i've written much regarding the ending, while the topic of this thread was about "how his" the Ap.
While I've made clear why i find this Ap ending weak, overall I find the first 4 modules quite appealing.

Dead roads is a pleasant out of body experience, quite interesting and with much dept.
Eulogy is also, to me, well crafted and gives players motivations and a sense of dread and mystery that helps build around the pc's peculiar conditions, but also the effects of a weapon such as the Radiant fire.
It's in book 3, however, that we reach the peak of this adventure, in which the characters got a clear goal, and they achieve it, only to be overwhelmed by a tragedy they could have not stopped, and yet they still fight to make the difference.

In those three modules, the pcs are still not only the central stage, but also the primary forces of the plot. They interact with npc who are either in need of their intervention or in conflict with them. Those bonds and those grudged will matter.

The situation, however, switches to me in book 4. While I like the concept of the involvement of Arazni, and her presence is well foreshadowed, I find her quest puts the pcs on a level of conflict which derails a bit their quests (namely survive, regroup and then "figure something out", possibly by gaining intel). They ability to teleport entire armies of quick spawning undead through teleportation cycles, for example, is to me as much as deadly that the radiant fire itself, yet is somehow overlooked in this book. The Libertine council dynamic is also a bit off to some, since it contradicts previous canon (a god queen being jailed by her own knights, the leader of which does indeed posses a "divine blessing" from Arazni herself), and further derails the focus of the plot from the pcs actions.

This choice also puts the pcs away from any useful interactions with others npc from Lastwalls, and while their action in book 3 come to matter at the end of book 4, much of whatever was built (which is also "what the pcs are fighting for" at this point, which is not given, to me, proper focus).

Book five also force a radical tone shift, since it's basically a (necessary?) forced trip to another country, far away from both the story and the setting that was until them established. And while the pcs actions will matter in the long run in the nation of Xopalt, the immediate payoff is a bit weak since (necessary soul destruction aside), what they get is a minor boots. Again, in this book the pcs solve someone else problem, losing sight of their main goal (the fight in Avistan) while giving them a bunch of (quite interesting) npc interaction that will necessary conclude at the end of the book.

Book 6 is also somehow uneven. The first 2 parts of the book are quite dynamic, well crafted and with good roleplaying actions (I love the oathammer, and find it way more epic that a certain raven headed mace), but the moment the Pcs reach Absalom they get into "a war without faces", except for 2 npc (which existence is mostly due to buff the pcs against an apparently AP 8+ challenge, with a DC 39 un-makable save) and possibly a well crafted undead which doesn't get to show off much.

While this is realistic, cause war is poetic only in fiction, this also weakens the story to me. There are almost no maps, except from Sunscarab keep, which seems something that could have been well "recycled" from the book before (a step pyramid with an hole on hit, which strongly reminds that of book 5). This is certainly due to page limit and, most of all, the necessity to run this module and the PFS ones that detail the other side of the attack. The full lore is there, yet - as an event comic - is divided between the mediums.

Obviously, the main problem of this ending is how much uneven it seems.

The pcs get obliterated, body and soul, from the explosion of the radiant fire. No afterlife, no judgment. Nothing. This is because they got a shard of wood that drains magic inside their body that has stitched their soul to their bodies. This shard is "super charged" with positive energy, and for now gets them able to overcome negative energy effects with ease, but in the long run will ... i dunno?

Regardless this point, which could be interesting in another topic, the main complain is that Tar Baphon is in the exact situation of the Pcs, but when his shard, stitched to his soul/body is destroyed, he's not obliterated. He just "regenerates after 1d10 days".

Now. He's a mythic lich, so he's got is artifact level phylactery (which may or may not be the Jewel of everlasting gold), and therefore simply obliterate his main body does nothing to his soul, normally ... but in this case, when got a very rare "soul erasing" weapon, which detonates "inside" one's soul/body.

Yet, no prediction (or mention) is made of how this defeat weakens the WT. By the pcs ability to perceive things, they sacrifice themselves in order to stop (or postpone) Baphon's siege of Absalom, removing the head of the army for "a bit" (5 days medium). While it's clear how much the tyrant's assault on the city is made "in haste" (I'm unaware if the society scenarios prove something different), while stopping the undead threat is a great victory, it doesn't really impede the lich to "try next week to get his ticket to godhood, this time with more wraiths".

I mean, what's stopping him on day 10 after his destruction to just open a gate in front of the Starstone Catedral, blow up all the bridges, and then mythic wish to "not get perceived" while he tries the test?

Moreover, while the pcs sacrifices removes the Tyrant's option to use the radiant fire forever ... by this point, TB's got around 5-6 shots left. Which still is an horrible prospective, but in reality - numbers at hand - he cannot put the world in hostage. He can certainly destroy 4 to 5 capital cities (Absalom, Sothis, Oppara and Highhelm maybe?), but after that ... he's done. He'll face the unite force of the inner sea region (which now consiste also of heavy guns such as Sorshen) and he'll get wrecked.
And he knows this. This is why he's trying to siege Absalon asap, to gain godhood and become personally untouachable.

What - to be - should have been made clear, is that with the tyrant's temporary demise 2 things happens:

1) All his minion directly controlled by him suddenly become independent. This causes ... everything to happen. They either start fighting each-other over grudged repressed from centuries, try to rush the Tyrant's hideout to neutralize him and become the next tyrant, of simply commit suicide - an action forbidden to them by the tyrant. This sudden freedom should have been explored a bit, but since the pcs souls get obliterated, their players don't get an epilogue in which they can weight down the effect of their sacrifice. This possibility should have been made clear by Gildais, which "through abuse and necromantic domination" has been forced to serve Baphon: should the WT be out of commission, even for an hour, all his forces would immediately devolve into hateful anarchy, as happens inside the castle were the two thirds of the book take place.

2) Tar Baphon soul should have been shredded. He should have suffered the same fate as the pcs, only to somehow, very slowly and painfully, getting back together thanks to the phylactery plus other contingencies, in a process that should have required not days, but months or years. This is his first true defeat since he's become a lich, and it should impact him WAY MORE personally that the defeat at the hands of Arnisant. To me, this should have made clear: the pcs are giving themselves up to stop Baphon from becoming a god (even thought he's to yet set food on Absalom) and "use the obols" (not just "be near him when he triggers the explosion) to "destroy his shard, and possibly his soul", aware that there is a chance that the lich will never return, suffering their same fate. Why this doesn't happen it's another story, possibly related to Urgathoa's intervention.

To make this more intriguing, Pathfinder 2E should have kept the information regarding Baphon's survival a secret, such as the ultimate fate of Arazni. After all, any grim looking skeleton can put on the Horns of Naraga and claim to me "The Whispering Tyrant" and set shop on the Isle of Terror. The fear of Baphon's return, while not backed up by proof, is on the long run more effective to any creature trying to feel the WT shoes (boots of teleportation, to be precise), Tar Baphon included.

Basically, my critic is that he's too detached from the main plot, and most importantly from the characters themselves.

So, in book 5, when he loses one of his most icon minions (the black dragon ravener) ... nothing happens!

Let us make some parallelism. Book 5 of Tyrant Grasps is a breather of a book, which is - as many book 5 - build around a "needed change of scenery" to allow the pcs to "get stronger" to face the challenges of the final book, by also gaining a macguffin. In some ways, it reminds me of Book 5 of Runelords, in which the pcs are directed to a secret demiplane, in order to grind a bit and gain a few weapons directly made to kill wizards. In this book we get the grinding, and the macguffin (thought, its a bit weak one, i might add). However, in Runelords we also get a few words with the main villain, that uses high magic to possess a golem and try to fell the pcs just when they got the weapon upgrade that will make fight him more easily.

In Tyrant Grasps, Tar Baphon sends a powerful minion to "gain lore over the tree from which the Shield of Aroden was made". Immediately, it become clear - to me at least -what's TB endgame here: to discover the tree properties, in order to mass produce fake shards, hoping to keep the entire world under pseudo nuclear threat. This is grave news, but it's not made explicit. There is not a "we must hurry, so that the WT doesn't get +1000 uses of radiant fire" threat in the air. But this is beside the point.

My point is that, after the ravener demise, we get it's gold, artifact level, plating rotting away, depriving pcs of further loot ... and then nothing. There is not reprise from the WW, who just lost one of his first and greatest slaves, and the ability to possibly gain more uses of the radiant fire, not linked by necessity to the few shard he has. He doesn't even scry on the scene to gain insight over the status of operations ... silence.

While the pcs and Tar Baphon are in the exact situation, both having a shard of the artifact inside, there is no other relation between them. They don't get to feel when Baphon activates the radiant fire, nor can they perceive any of his impressions or emotions.

Just think what could have been. What if, in book 4, when the pcs with the simulacrum of Tar Baphon, such construct could have called them by name, saying how "They" (alluding at the horrific possibly dozens of more "tyrant simulacri" being around) "heard their cries". Had the "shard-bearers" be more connected, able to feel or perceive each other state, that could have been a great scene, with the Tyrant just mildly amused how somehow someone survived from his widespread destruction, maybe even taunting them, calling them Araznis pawn, and even declaring his intentions just because he's certain they are gonna become undead under his control in a few minutes.

However, my biggest problem with this ending is ...
(continue to post 3)

Rysky wrote:

I don't see performing a heroic sacrifice as insulting.

And nor would it have been if you'd actually acheieved something.

The real problem here was the choice of BBEG. In making it one the company were never going to allow to be killed off they made the players sacrifice nothing more than a holding action ... This AP is the ultimate in being precious with the monster.

Ending aside though, it's generally quite terrible, easily the worst AP Paizo have produced.

Regarding this topic, i feel the same, regarding the Whispering Tyrant role over the entire story. While he's the ultimate instigator of the plot, as a character he's quite stagnant. I'll try to elaborate, by english is not my first language, so i could sound a bit dull.

Basically, my critic is that he's too detached from the main plot, and most importantly from the characters themselves.

He's also driven by very generic motivations: revenge, pride and pure destruction. He doesn't seem to want to "reclaim" Ustalav, nor he seem to plan much far ahead, since he leaves much of his current strongholds in the region barely occupied, to throw himself literally against one of the greatest cities of the world (and i might add, using a level of mobility never showed during the shining crusade), just in the hope to overwhelm it and "get stronger" by gaining divinity through the Starstone.

While he's a menace, and an horrifically powerful one, he certainly lacks any inventive or charisma that is shown during the adventure itself, or that the Pcs can testify.

And there may be is a reason for it, which may be easily be overlooked: he's enraged, perpetually enraged by his imprisonment, and most importantly, by the energies of his own obol.

For centuries, he suffered from a "magic draining artifact" fused with his soul, that he could not remove without, probably, either losing his magic or destroying the whole of Gallowspire from the inside. And while it's remarkable how he has changed the cause of his demise into a gamebreaking ability, this is - in my view - never properly "hyped" by the campaign itself. Nor is the Tyrant's shard, and its effects over Baphon, even be described. On this topic, when book 6 cover was out, i was lead to believe by the quite different artwork of the WW that we would have witness some kind of "change" in the WW, who could have got some side effects from repeatedly using the Radian Fire, but there were none of those.

But returning over the WW lack of involvement, this become apparent in book 5 ...
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Destroying his body does nothing to free the shard. It's as bound to him as the obols are to the PCs; that bond is the only thing that allows him to even use the Radiant Fire in the first place. After all, he's a lich, and the thing is described as causing him continual pain - don't you think he's tried to remove it? It already somehow managed to stay fused to his body even after he was defeated in the battle that created the shattered shield of Arnisant in the first place, when it should have been left behind then with all his other equipment.

I'm sorry, but I'm under the impression that Baphon was never destroyed during the battle against Arnisant, but simply choose to retreat from that skirmish after an artifact shard was logged inside his hand, causing him either psychical pain or giving him "artifact related problem" in casting spells.

Greetings.
I've got my copy of the Ap, so lets us say something.
First edition, I salute you! You have given us great stories, and so much to mix-max without getting into 3.5 territories.

Changing the subject a little, i'm curious about the state of dear old Absalom after Baphon's attack. Do we get to see and appreciate the wholesome slaughter that an horde of the undead can bring to a metropolis?

And most of all, how much will this adventure impact on the landscape itself? Do some section of the city get properly nuked/utter destroyed/filled with undead for the all 2° edition of pathfinder?

On another topic, i've realized something about the black dragon Ravaner's Arcane plating. While it's quite convenient and fun that such plating is a bit aztec themed, the idea that it somehow "crumbles to dust" after's Istravek's demise is to me a bit poor.

But, with a bit of hindsight, it could work if made somehow relevant to the WT past and actions. Considering that those plates look like of pure gold, they could well came from the fabled Xin - Grafar, the city of golden death created by Tar Baphon while he was alive. This city was not only made of solid gold, but cursed so that "no one could carry it's gold outside" without the Tyrant's permission. I would see fit that the ravener's bodily possession would simple "float back" to the golden city after its demise.

However, i would also suggest to give this moment some kind of gravitas, by either having Tar Baphon's own voice reclaim such treasure, like saying "The spoils of a slave belong to his masters", or to actually have the WT scry over the corpse after the battle and comment over it's slave demise, and how poorly it has served his master.
By my understanding, Istravek's trip was meat to investigate on the possibility of recreate new shards from the Kumaru tree, in order to allow Baphon to spam the Radiant Fire over each of Golarion's capital city, or something like that. It's actually not spelled clear, but i believe this is the most immediate reason, since by now the WT as got half the "bullets" he started this war with. By having Baphon actually castigate the carcass, expressing such rage and contempt, would also explain why he doesn't simply mythic wish the dragon back on his feet (now or at a later point): he's not worth the honor/the cost.

This would, incidentally, not only allow the pcs to "hear" Baphon's voice for the first time, and possibly be seen and inquired about by the lich, but to allow the pcs to gain insight on the Lich's agenda. Taunts and declarations aside, this would mirror's Karzoug's "appearance" in Book 5 of Runelords, and allow the Pcs to both see and be recognized by their enemy as some kind of menace.