Nethys

Patrick Chamberlin's page

** Starfinder Society GM. 9 posts. No reviews. No lists. No wishlists. 8 Organized Play characters.



3 people marked this as a favorite.

Wow! I didn't expect this many responses!

Thank you Rysky for the previous thread link! Thank you, both James and Mark, for responding. I'm super excited for the release of the core game and for the upcoming GMG! Gladdened to hear there will be a chapter on how to change stuff like Alignment. Can't wait to read the whole book!

Despite the modular nature of PF2, I'm always somewhat hesitant to remove or adjust mechanics that touch on such a wide breadth of the game. Too afraid to break everything. That's why it's nice to see official suggestions on how to adjust it from people who have a much deeper understanding of the system than myself.

As for the rest of the thread- My short answer is: I save myself from having any of these alignment arguments by removing it entirely in the vast majority of my games. I most often use a home-brew setting. If alignment is too integrated into a system be easily removed, I try to adjust all the words away from moral and ethical concepts.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

I was wondering if there was going to be official suggestions on how to remove it. That won't be the case. I'll still be doing it for my own game. Most likely by divorcing the verbiage of Alignment from ethics and morality. Again, don't want to start a debate about Alignment nor it's usefulness. Those have been done to death and back again.

My group and I are extremely excited for PF2nd and that's what matters.


3 people marked this as a favorite.

PF2 isn't as math complex as PF1, which I think is a good thing. Only a few of my players enjoyed wrangling up all the floating modifiers and tracking all the different numbers to get them as high as possible.

It's more meaty than 5e though. I love the new action economy and the new monster designs. "Everything is a feat" is kind of confusing but I find that players have more available to them to customize their characters than 5e.

Also: Can't go wrong with supporting Pazio. Pazio pumps out quality adventure content, character options and other goodness monthly. I really hope finalized PF2 wins over some of the ol' PF1 grognards and all of the people burned by the Playtest.

So... Yeah, check it out when it's out.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Greylurker wrote:

I wanted a better version of 1E.

at this point it's pretty clear I'm not going to get that so my best option is to steal a couple of things that I feel work well and be done with it.

Mark also talked about survey responses that said they wanted changes to be reverted back to 1e, such as the Bard and Sorcerer. The 10% of people who responded that they wanted it to be "like 1e" tended towards that same answer across each question phrased that way. Those sorts of changes are pretty likely to stay.


10 people marked this as a favorite.

Goblin Scuttle is level 9, but Skittering Scuttle is also level 9 and requires Goblin Scuttle as a pre-req. Can't help but feel one of those numbers are off.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

I do hope most of the Ancestries mentioned in the Survey make it into subsequent books, including Pixie and Centaur. They don't have to be Large creatures. Plus, horses are awkward on stairs but a sentient humanoid does not have to be. Dealing with the animal lower half would make for interesting dungoneering challenges.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

I'd prefer if Paladin's were tied to knightly orders and their Oaths. Such orders and oaths could be tied to the deities, countries or alignments. Even Hellknights could be factored in that way.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

The fighter is billed as a master of weapons in the Playtest. Someone who can perform impossible feats with weapons that are matched by no other. Athletics and feats allow for several interesting melee fighter actions. There are several melee options to use the Open -> Press and Enhancement systems. While the power of any of this is arguable, they are still far more interesting than what is on offer for a ranged weapon specialist.

Other systems, including PF 1e, allow for daring feats of Archery. Archer PF1 Fighters can choose one trick shot to Sunder, Feint or Disarm at third level. After 11th, they can bull rush, trip or grapple too. 5e Battlemasters can push, trip, intimidate enemies or command allies while shooting.

What do PF2nd Ranged Weapon Fighters get?

Baseline- Only three really useful actions. Stride, Strike and reload if using a crossbow or sling. Most battlemats tend to be within 50 feet, so Longbows are at quite the disadvantage. Should have a backup melee weapon, even though we want to be using our favoured ranged weapon. Can't use our crowning baseline feature Attack of Opportunity.

1st level- Point-Blank Shot: Only feat useful for a ranged weapon user. An Open and Stance attack for those systems. Removes the volley penalty for Longbows or gives +2 damage to other weapons. An interesting feat if we use the Open-Press or Stance systems. Feels like a feat tax otherwise.

2nd level- Assisting Shot: Only feat useful for a ranged weapon user. Using Assist at weapon range. Opens up another action for tactical usage. Fairly interesting.

4th level- Double Shot: Reload fighters don't get anything at this level. Might as well multi-class. Bow users, declare Strike on two targets for better bonuses. Doesn't apply multi penalty so third declared strike is at -5. If you weren't bored of declaring Strike for four levels, you can now use a different name. The new Ranger action is more interesting. Boring.

6th level- Exotic Weapon Training: Want to throw Shuriken or use a Halfling Sling? Go ahead.

Improved Bravery: If something fears you out at range, you can be less scared. Boring but might be useful.

Triple Shot: Using a Crossbow? Might as well ignore this tier too. Thought Double shot was boring? Add to it by declaring Strike three times under a different name. More powerful than three strikes? Yes. More interesting? Nope!

8th level- Incredible Aim: More interesting than Double and Triple Shot. Add another action to Strike to ignore concealed/screened/cover by 2 or add 2 if they don't have those conditions. Not amazingly interesting but better.

Slippery Shooter- Another Stance means we can start weaving between them each turn. It's another Opener but we have no Press yet. You don't trigger AoO or reactions triggered by ranged attacks. You can now use AoOs but they are within 5 feet. Rather boring still. If you want to disrupt spellcasting or shoot at a marked area, you still need to use two actions to Ready a reaction.

10th level- Agile Grace: You're much better at Blowdarts, Darts and Shurikens. Woe betide you if you grabbed those Double or Triple Shots as a Shuriken thrower.

Blindfight: It's only to adjacent targets.

Combat Reflexes: If you took Slippery Shooter, you can AoO twice in melee range with a ranged weapon. Fun /s

Debilitating Shot: After 10 levels, you can now interact with the Open-Press system! Follow-up shot that can cause Slowed 1 or Flat-footed for a turn. Neat! Might be able to help out a sneak-attack user or capitalize with the next Strike. Rather interesting.

Disruptive: Would be great if we could AoO at range. We can't.

Unyielding Fortitude: Useful if you face a ton of fortitude saves at range.

12th level- Desperate Finisher- You know that Press attack we just got? We can use a bonus Debilitating Shot nearly every round since we don't have much use for our AoOs. Depressing that this feat is so useful because we don't have much use for one huge mechanic of our class.

Incredible Follow-up: Another Press attack. It's a basic strike that ignores concealed, screen or cover. /yawn

14th level- Determination: Likely going to have plenty of spells slung our way. Interesting enough.

Stance Savant: We can start each fight in Slippery Shooter, I guess.

16th level- Multishot Paragon: Remember those boring Double and Triple Strikes? They are better now. You can even use Stance Savant to enter this. Doubling down on Double Shot.

18th level- Impossible Volley: Longbow only. Not bored of 18 levels of saying "I use Strike on two of the mooks"? Now you can say "I use Strike on ALL of the mooks! (within 10 feet of each other)"

Savage Critical: Crit success on 19-20. Took 18 levels but now rolling dice is slightly more interesting. 5e Champions get this at level 3.

20th level- Weapon Supremacy: Not bored of Strike? Now you can always Strike an additional time in combat. Fun?

As you can see, almost nothing here comes close to the narratively interesting things you can do in other games including PF1. No hitting their weapon to disarm them, no pinning their clothing to a wall, no knocking them off the bridge with a well-placed shot. I do hope those extra pages in the final PF2 edition have some more interesting ranged options or an Archer archtype. Dedicated masters of the Bow are going to have some pretty boring times in PF2 otherwise.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Raven Gravehart wrote:
Denim N Leather wrote:

This is a huge fumble. Huge. We forked over good money in good faith for a product that can be downloaded for free, to have zero tracking info, zero amount of real feedback, and just a disappointing ‘oops’ email.

I ordered the book because I don’t like large PDFs. I like books. I ordered a book. There is no book, at least no this week. I suspect this won’t be sorted until after GenCon.

Major, major disappointment here. I will not make this mistake again, more fool me.

The fault lies with Amazon, not Paizo. I'm not surprised that it happened because Amazon has been messing up their shipments more and more often lately. And it hasn't just been shipments. Their site will show that they have more than enough of an item to ship it and get it to you by their standard delivery dates but then for some reason it is suddenly out of stock a couple of weeks later and you don't get what you ordered for at least a month. Next time maybe instead of ordering via Amazon, try your nearest gaming and hobby store if they are doing preorders.

I ordered from Pazio. They chose to work with Amazon. My LGS is tiny and wasn't going to get any collectors editions of the playtest.