Oskar Metalsound's page

I've been looking through the Bestiary 2 and thought it was odd that they are the only big outsider from 1e that's not in yet. Did they get the Inevitable treatment where they got folded into another outsider type?

I wouldn't mind a reprint of most of the character options from the APs, since it's a pain to reference them if you use multiple options from them.

"Nocticula showed up like a straight up bro and a real sweetheart."

CorvusMask wrote:

Mekkis wrote:

What I would like to see in the Bestiary is a "Lore" section that provides knowledge DCs and their results.

Similar to what was found in Monster Manual IV and Monster Manual V from 3.5e.

The return of Bear Lore?

Not sure what that is. This is what I mean...

Monster Manual IV wrote:

Characters with ranks in Knowledge (The Planes) can learn more about cyclonic ravagers. When a character makes a successful skill check, the following lore is revealed, including the information from lower DCs.

DC15: This creature composed of howling winds is obviously an elemental. This result reveals all elemental traits and the air subtype.

DC25: This creature is a cyclonic ragager, an avatar of Yan-C-Bin, Prince of Evil Air Elementals. Its transparent body is made only of violent wind.

DC30: The cyclonic ravager's command of air allows it to move its opponents and allies around the battlefield.

DC35: A cyclonic ravager can tear a creature apart with blasts of wind, but creatures immune to critical hits take far less damage.

Bear Lore was an old joke from the first CRB for 4th edition where an example of a Ranger's Nature check on bears revealed some rather... obvious things about bears. Basically, for a DC 15 Nature check, it would tell you that cave bears prefer to live in caves. At DC 20 it would tell you that bears use their claws to kill things.

So, similar to the chart you posted, except all the information was really, really obvious.

GM Rednal wrote:

If you think there's an uh-oh here, you're overthinking it. ^^ The feat has a calculation to get you a new effective caster level (for overcoming SR, etc), and a calculation to get you a new effective Kineticist level (for damage). Both of these matter, because Kinetic Blasts are supposed to have those values.

I know and I seem to be failing to explain to you that their Effective Kineticists Level already tells you their Caster Level. Because we all know thats what that means. So Why mention it in the Feat? I can't make it any clearer at this point. Sorry I failed you.

My guess as to why it is mentioned in that feat is to clarify that the composite blast created by that feat uses both the average level for determining damage and the average caster level for determining effects that require a caster level. As to why they had you use the caster level as a way to determine the average Kineticist level, I can't be completely sure. However, even that ability states that the damage is based on the Kineticist effective level, which in this particular case is equal to an average of the two caster levels.

Personally, since this is the only ability that uses caster level in any way to determine the Kineticist Level for figuring out damage, I think the more likely solution is that this feat was not fully thought out, rather than literally every single other instance referencing Kineticist Level rather than Caster Level.

The Interweave Composite Blast feat is essentially a corner case where the wording would allow the altering of a caster level to potentially effect damage. However, as pointed out earlier in the thread, you can't reduce the caster level of a blast because they always have an effective spell level equal to half the Kineticist level, meaning you can never reduce the Caster Level to the point where it would effect the damage, as the minimum caster level would always be an odd number where you previously received an increase in damage.. Theoretically, you could *increase* the caster level via some method to increase the damage, but you can't reduce it. So I was wrong earlier when I said that rule had no bearing on this situation. In this one specific situation, it does, but only in doing literally the exact opposite of what you want.

TrinitysEnd wrote:

Mars Roma wrote:

Up to until the post about Kinetic Blasts having an Effective Spell Level, I was discussing how the existing rules worked.

did you not read my last post, did you not read the suggested Errata I made? Not hard for someone who has read the entire thread to gleam what can be done from there. Here, Just take this and repurpose it for a FAQ. Sorry I made an example, thought it would make things simpler.

The fact that you'd need Errata to make it align with what you want means that the rules don't support that reading. No one is trying to attack you, we are trying to explain to you why it doesn't work the way you want it to. We've quoted the rules, given all the arguments, and more, but it's still not enough apparently.

I'm going to bow out of this as the answer has been stated a dozen times. And there is no point continuing it again and again. I wish you luck on getting the Errata you want Mars, but please take a breather. Grab a cup of cocoa and please stop viewing every post as daggers trying to enter your spleen.

In this post, I have already Conceded that it doesn't work, because someone cited a rule. I was RELIEVED when someone finally did that. Instead of pointing at the same thing I did and just saying "that's not how it works" when I explained why it does within the rules. Just because you agree that they're right in saying I'm wrong doesn't mean I didn't make the effort to point out why I am right.

It's weird people think I feel attacked, just Irritated that their post has no rules citation that proves me wrong. Which it didn't, everything I cited up to that point, was right, effective Spell Level is part of the rules I cited up to that Point. If not for that, you could lower Kineticists Blasts Damage by the rules. Sorry I didn't think of...

I find it hilarious that a post regard effective spell levels, which have no bearing on Kinetic Blast damage, convinces you that you are wrong because it "cites a rule", but directly quoting the part of the Kinetic Blast rules that say the damage is based on Kineticist level proves nothing.

Your basic point is that since Kinetic Blast Caster Level is based on Kineticist level, the two are (almost) always equal. Therefore, they are interchangeable. Therefore, if you lower the Caster Level you also lower the effective Kineticist Level. This isn't true. KL to CL is a one way street. Any adjustment to Caster Level does not effect an individual Kineticists level. Since, per the rules of Kinetic Blast, damage is 1d6 + 1d6 per 2 Kineticist levels, any adjustment to Caster Level has no effect on damage.

As Far as I see it, I have, sorry its so hard to explain something like this to other people. If you or anyone else has a problem grasping the concept of what i have explained thus far, Then I'm stumped. I've even gone through the trouble already of explaining further Class Level and Caster Level being more closely related than before. I told you to keep up man and yet you fell behind again. Sorry if I offended you, and that your offense distracted you from reading my previous post between then and now. I would have PM'd you to keep up and not post it in the forums, but I can't, you wont let me and that's your right to do so.

As I said before, I understand your argument. It is wrong. Class level and Caster level are related, but they are not the same thing. If Kinetic Blast damage was supposed to operate off of Caster Level, then the rules would say that it does. Other classes that have abilities like this will specify when an ability works off of Caster Level and when it doesn't. They say it operates off of class level. I don't care how well connected Class level and Caster level are, they are different concepts and are handled differently by the rules. I don't know how much clearer this could be. The rules state in plain black and white exactly how this works and it does not match up with what you want.

Look, if you want to house rule that it does or your personal DM agrees with you and wants things to work that way, that's fine. But you asked if you could lower the damage of a Kinetic Blast by using the rules for lowering the Caster Level of a spell. You can not. Rules as written say that you can not, because Kinetic Blast damage does not operate off of caster level. Just because Class level and Caster level are often the same does not mean they are interchangeable. If all of my AC is derived from Dexterity and Dodge bonuses, that doesn't mean that my AC and my touch AC are the same thing, even if they have the exact same number. They have a different name for a reason.

EDIT EDIT: Glad you caught up Oskar, now keep up.

Maybe save your quips for when you're proven literally anything at all supporting your point.

According to RAW, waiting stealthily for the guard on duty to go relieve himself in the bushes (and thus be occupied or at a disadvantage when you make your move) will be a long wait, as nobody does that sort of thing. Tons of things aren't covered by the rules text. Therefore, they never happen.

No, things that aren't specifically covered in the rules are handled by the Game Master. They don't just "never happen." Instead they go to arbitration. Just because the rules don't define every single kind of interaction possible doesn't mean they aren't permissive. You want to do something, you check if there is a rule. If there is, it defines what you can do. If not, the Game Master arbitrates what is done in that situation and has final say in how things are handled.

True, I can't make it any clearer at this point as to why I'm confused. when SLA's say they are both a Spell and not a Spell and when something says CL has some degree of bearing on damage. That you all look at the points I've made but not the lines I've draw between them. I understand that Caster Level and Class Level are different, but the only thing i asked you all to prescribe to is that since Kineticists are solely dependent on SLA's and nothing else. That the Rules that apply to SLA's apply to them as well.

It's at this juncture that I should point out that me bringing up the CL = HD would cause some problems if they Multi-classed. So i was wrong to do so. But that's why when I found Interweave, it showed another layer to the CL Discussion regarding their Importance to their damage. Not to mention Caster level Equals Class level.

So with all that, I have to concede, and ask only for clarification on whether or not a Kineticists Can lower their Damage. I presented a Solution, Why It should work already, and a way to avoid changing the rules in Kinetic Blasts damage being CL based. Which their damage Shouldn't be based on CL, It would cause too many problems and leave open room for abuse.

You have to understand that I was a bit put off by people who only chimed in with scarce disapproval, Contributing nothing more to the Conversation. I only Ignored some people, but not TOZ and Graystone, I tried to respond to each of your rebuttals you had about my interpretation of the rules. Oskar Clearly didnt read everything as was apparent with a few others. Hence my need to repeat my self. Pointing out what you may have missed like I believed Mark missed because he seemed unsure of all the rules. Highlighting my need to go over them just in case there was something that would suggest that you could.

I haven't Given up, I still think that rules are written say that you can, everything is there. So don't give up on me yet, things are Fun when we are talking about something that does less damage and...

Look, we all understand the argument you are making. Spells do damage based on caster level. SLA function like spells in most regards, so they also deal damage based on caster level. A spell caster can lower the caster level of their spells, so they can also lower the caster level of their SLAs. Lower caster level means less damage. Since Kinetic Blasts are SLAs, you can lower their caster level, which should result in less damage, since that is how it works for all other SLAs and spells.

Here is where you get tripped up. The specific wording of Kinetic Blast says that the damage is based on Kineticist level. This supersedes how SLA damage is normally calculated, which is via Caster Level. That is why Caster Level doesn't matter, because the rules specifically state that the Kinetic Blast SLA calculates damage differently. I can't make it any clearer.

And yet they're both Shapes.

KB are SLA's--->SLA's Function Like Spells---> Spells CL can be Lowered--->SLA without CL = HD--->KB has a CL--->CL can be Lowered because its effectively a Spell.

@Val'bryn2 sorry I'd delete it but i cant anymore. I apologize, I just feel attacked because everyone else isnt seeing the lines I've draw out for them and it looked to me like it was because of what Mark said. Also Can rogues only use some of their sneak attack? Probably not, but they can certainly chose not to do Sneak attack when they can. These are two different cases, solely based off the fact that Sneak attack isnt a SLA.

And regarding Metamagic feats. True. But Spell Focus effects SLA's.

I understand what you are saying. You are ignoring the fact that the damage isn't based on Caster Level. When damage is based on Caster Level it is specifically stated. Kinetic Blasts damage is based on Kineticist level.

Lets just, for the sake of argument, say that everything you typed up there is true. I'm a 9th level Kineticist and I use a blast. I decide to lower the caster level from the theoretical CL9 to CL5, for some reason. According to the rules, I still do 5d6 damage because regardless of what I change my caster level to, my Kineticist level remains unchanged.

Let me ask you this. If my hypothetical 9th level Kineticist multiclasses into a Prestige class that lets me stack my Caster level in a previous class with the new class levels, would my blast damage go up? No, it would not because this new class is not a Kineticist and does not give me a more powerful blast.

How is it when something Functions like something else but isn't subject to the same rules that effect the original? Why is it when you can Lower your Caster level for a spell doesn't apply to SLA's when they functions like Spells and spells function based on CL and CL can be lowered to effect their variable damage and range like a spell because they seem to me to function just like a Spell which they do because its stated that they do.

Oskar Metalsound wrote:

None of that really matters though because Kineticist damage is not based on Caster Level, it's based on Kineticist Level. So a 9th level Kineticist can lower their caster level as much as they want, the ability still does damage as a 9th level Kineticist, because that is their level.

and graystone questioned why i had to repeat myself. When I have gone to such great lengths to explain why I think this way.

Squares are Rectangles but Rectangles are not Squares. The description of Spell Like Abilities specifically states that SLA are similar to, but not the same as, spells. SLA's can't be counterspelled like Spells can. They don't use any components. They can't have metamagic applied to them the way spells can. Lastly, it is stated that their caster level is fixed and not always based on the hit die or casting ability of the creature in question. They do not always function like spells and adjustment of caster level is a grey area. There is no hard rule saying that this can or can not happen, so we need to interpret the rules that we do have to try an figure out what fits.

I feel like this is relevant because you keep trying say that because certain things are calculated the same way, they are functionally the same thing. This is not true.

In cases where Caster Level is relevant to damage, it will specifically state that a Caster Level is used. 1d6 per Caster Level. No where in the Kineticist description for it's damage does it say Caster Level. Damage does not function of Caster Level, it does not effect damage what so ever. Even if an SLAs caster level can be lowered, it would change the blasts damage. It could effect getting past SR or similar situations, but it would not effect damage because the damage is not based on Caster Level.

except I did when I explained that SLA's work as spells and thus can have their Caster Level lowered to deal less damage.

SLA's are not spells, they function like spells. Lowering caster level is something that is done while casting a spell, it never mentions Spell Like Abilities in that section at all. It is a somewhat grey area and I could see it being ruled either way, but as I'm seeing it the rules don't appear to allow you to modify the Caster Level of an SLA the way you can a spell.

None of that really matters though because Kineticist damage is not based on Caster Level, it's based on Kineticist Level. So a 9th level Kineticist can lower their caster level as much as they want, the ability still does damage as a 9th level Kineticist, because that is their level.

In response to the Sphere of Annihilation arguments made earlier, I would argue that since the Tarrasque gets his regeneration specifically from being a spawn of Rovagug in Pathfinder, said regeneration allows for the Tarrasque to return via the "acts of Gods can restore a creature killed by a Sphere to life" portion of the artifacts text. Essentially, Big T's "always regenerates from any kind of death effect" power is a constant miracle sustained by his connection to the Rough Beast.

So, my party had just gotten back to the Cathedral of Minderhal with all the items they needed for the ritual to relight the forge, except for the Dragon breath in the fire geodes. Speaking with Etena, the group learned about the Dragon up in the tower and the Inquisitor that lives below it. Deciding that it might be easier to negotiate with the Dragon, the group decided to sneak into a tower. But they didn't want to fight the Inquisitor. And thus was born a wonderful, horrible plan. But first, some backstory.

Backstory: Our Sorcerer(Weaver) attempted to bluff his way past a Hill Giant patrol by claiming to work for Ogreclease, who at the time of this first bluff was supposed to be a powerful local Ogre boss, but overtime, he evolved into a minor God. He then proceeded to crit basically every bluff check to convince the (rather stupid) Ogres and Giants that Ogreclease existed. So by the time they got back, the ground work for the cult of Ogreclease had already been done.

So, our characters decided that, during one of the Minderhal sermons, one character would be invisible and provide a distraction while the rest of the group used Spider Climb to climb up to the Dragon. The Warpriest/Monk(Mariah) decided that they would be the distraction. So the rest of the party sneaks out of the Cathedral and wait for the sermon to start. When Urathash started to speak about Minderhal, the Warpriest used Enthrall to distract the crowd. While the Stone Giants and Urathash weren't fooled, the Ogres and Hill Giants were easily captivated. Mariah then used Stone Shape and Light to simulate a miracle of Ogreclease. Urathash attempted to sway the crowd, but he wasn't very successful. Eventually though, he cast See Invisibility and found Mariah behind the statue. This lead to Urathash calling Mariah out for 1 on 1 combat. Cut to the tower.

Weaver climbs the tower with the rest of the group (a Magus named Markus, A Barbarian named Grunyar, a Hunter named Cyrus with his lion Tala and a rogue named Thykk) reached the top of the tower. Everyone else hides while Weaver bring the Fire Geodes up and attempts to convince the dragon to light them on fire with it's breath. This naturally confuses the dragon, who attempts to find out what's going on. This leads to the line "Quite trying to change the subject and light my balls on fire."

Unfortunately, the Dragon is 1) Not stupid and 2) able to perceive the other members of the group (except Thykk) so he pins Weaver and calls out the rest of the group. They attempt to negotiate with the Dragon, but negotiations break down when they refuse to give him Angrimosh. The battle began when the party attempted to taunt the dragon into breathing on them. He does not fall for this. The Hunters lion then charge/pounced it for over half it's health and, after a few minor hits from others, Thykk Sneak-Attacked the Dragon to death. So they now don't have the fire breath they need.

Cut back to the Cathedral, where Mariah and Urathash spend a few rounds posing and buffing each before Mariah charges and fails to hit with all her flurries. Urathash then proceeds to one shot her with hammer blows. So the session ends with Mariah unconscious and everyone else on the top of the citadel with no way to know this.

Subplot: Two of our characters are Dwarfs and Thykk, who got this from her brother (a previous character), believes that Dwarfs are rare on the surface because they don't breed well and need to be bred by outsiders. So, with help from her brother, she has 75 Elixers of Love that she has been drugging the dwarfs with. Neither of them failed their saves all night, but I got Thykk's player in the end by having Grunyar make his final Elixer of Love will save while looking at her.

967. You can not, under any circumstances, Smite Neutral. Even if you shout "PICK A SIDE" when you do.

So, some of the players in my Giantslayer game aren't setting nerds like me, so they wanted some context for the area they were going to be starting in. As such, I present to you the post I made on Facebook.

Totally Accurate History and Background for Belkzen and Trunau

There are many places on Golarion where it would suck to live. Unlike most places, which started out fairly okay and then had horrible s*%$ happen that made them suck, Belkzen has the distinction of being pretty g~&!@+n s!$+ty before stuff happened to make it worse.

Belkzen is bordered by Varisia (Land of adventure and gypsies) and the Mindspan Mountain Range on the left and Lastwall (Land of Keeping Liches Locked Up) and Ustalav (Transylvania as depicted by Hollywood but also somehow worse) on the right. To the north are the Realm of the Mammoth Lords (As in, riders of mammoths, not just super fat people) and the Worldwound (Demon Yo!). To the south is Nirmathras (Land of I Forget, so no fancy title for you).

Belkzen was “founded” by an Orc, also names Belkzen, who united his people against the Dwarves and managed to take over one of their giant fortresses. The Orcs then went about breaking into tribes and killing each other with much gusto. Their passion for murdering each other was outshone only by their passion for mating with each other and their passion for killing (and sometimes mating with) other races, mostly humans. Due to these finely honed murder skills, the Orcs of Belkzen have been used by outside forces as a powerful army with which to conquor and murder many people. Most famously, the Horde was roused to battle by the Blue Dragon Kazavon, who was so deadly his bones can kill you, and by Tar-Baphon, also known as the Whispering Tyrant, a lich who was strong enough to look at Aroden, God of Humanity, and think “Yeah, I could take him in a fight.” It was the battles against Tar-Baphon that ended up founding the nation of Lastwall, where the Lich is currently sealed away.

The Orcs have, on occasion, made major pushes to expand their borders, mostly southward as it is the easiest direction to push. Lastwall has attempted, and often failed, to stop this expansion. The most recent major push occurred 200 years ago, where much of southern Lastwall was overrun. Many of the farmers and villagers fled, but not all of them. This brings us to the town of Trunau, where you start your adventure.

When everyone else decided to run, the people of Trunau said “F@~% that noise, bring it you green skinned bastards!” The town has remained standing to this day, weathering many an orc raid. The people of Trunau are close knit and always ready to spring into action to defend their town. Children are taught to fight as soon as they can and not adult goes about unarmed. Every citizen, once they come of age, is given a dagger called a Hope Knife, which they must be ready to use on themselves or their loved ones should they ever be taken alive by orcs.

As fate would have it, your adventure beings on the day of one such coming of age ceremony for the daughter of the Leader of Trunau, Chief Defender Halgra of the Blackened Blades. Her daughter, Ruby, will be presented with her Hope Knife in a ceremony and will then take part in numerous festive games to celebrate her transition into adulthood.

Trunau is located in the southern part of Belkzen, close to the borders of Lastwall and Nirmathras, with which they do a good amount of trade. If you have any questions about fitting your back story into the area or just have some additional questions, let me know.

So, how much Steel do I need to burn to do that coinshot?

I have been given the blessings of Lightning and Fire in my veins by the living God Razmir and I shall break House Thrune as an offering to him.

So, I'm horribly evil.

We have three character engaged in a sort of love triangle. We have a Samurai named Shin that is being pursued by a female Barbarian named Karin (most known for stabber her own eyes out attempting to heal a Blindness spell) and a male Gunslinger/Inquisitor named Cherard (most known for being ridiculously gay). Cherard's player couldn't make it, so I was tasked with playing him.

We had just entered the hut and were trying to identify all the neat things we found. Cherard, having some ranks in Spellcraft, managed to be the only character to identify the Elixer of Love. The GM, feeling that it would be interesting to have only me know this, passed me this info in a note. I sent a text to the player informing him that he obtained this and was told that if I could get Shin to drink it, I would become his new god. Challenge accepted.

Opportunity struck a bit later when we engaged with the Bone Golem. Cherard was stuck in the cage with no real hope of getting out until the golem died. Shin, being our Samurai, is our main "takes hits" guy. Previously, we had given him some Potions of Enlarge Person that we found to make him even stronger. So I, as a player, bluffed that I had forgotten one that Cherard had on him. I convinced another character to give Shin the potion and requested that he look at me when he drank it, since Cherard claimed that he was going to die in the cage (which he almost did).

Shin drank the potion, but didn't look at Cherard. He looked at the Bone Golem. After all, he had just challenged it and needed to concentrate on it. It was at that point that I announced to the party that Shin was in love with the Bone Golem and the table exploded with laughter.

Unfortunately he made the will save needed to resist the effect, but I really kind of wish he hadn't. Either way, that was probably the most epic prank I ever pulled on the party.

Oh boy.

So, I previously told a story in another thread about the Barbarian that decided to stab her eyes out to cure the magical blindness, only to find out that the

In addition, we have 2 running jokes in our campaign. 1) Druids did it. My character, a Halfling Gunslinger named Dart, made the observation when we noticed the magical winter starting, the magical weather change, weird animal patterns and other strange things could only be the work of Druids. After all, they have nature magic and can control animals. Makes perfect sense to me. Given that Dart is not all that smart, nor from the Irresen area, he has continued to assert that Druids are responsible for all the problems. Witch is obviously a term for "Evil Northern Druid."

2) Trolls did it. In this case, we had just killed the Winter Guard at Waldsby (which we mishead as Wallsby... where the wall be.) Not wanting to cause much trouble for the town, we took all the guards stuff, carted their bodies out of town with us and randomly threw them in the woods with signs around their necks proclaiming "We did this. -Trolls". As I explained to the party, someone has to fail the Sense Motive check at some point. Now whenever we commit blatant murder (justified because our alignment has a G... usually. While their alignment has an E... usually.) We leave behind something to indicate that Trolls were responsible. Except when we kill Trolls. Druids are responsible for those.

So those are my stories of the incredibly dumb things we did in Reign of Winter.

That is a Spelljammer and no one can convince me otherwise. This is going to rock.

Oh, I have one. So, my group is running Jade Regent with my Half Orc Bard, a Half Elf Paladin, a Tiefling Witch and a Human Fighter. We're exploring a keep in order to rescue a guide across the Crown of the World. We have mostly cleared the top level of the place out and are heading deeper into the basement, when we come across two trolls acting as guards. Thinking quickly, I decide to get these guys out of here without a fight by luring them off elsewhere.

So I run into the room screaming at the top of my lungs "By the Gods, there you two are. You're needed upstairs. There are 10 adventurers up there just destroying the rest of us. I'll get everyone else, you guys go support our fellows." Roughly a 26 Bluff check later the Trolls are gone. The party moves on past and we kill everything else down there.

Once we get down to the end of the dungeon, were facing off against an Oni (I think) with a huge Tetsu-Bo. In one round our fighter gets crit and 1-shot, ruling that his chest gets caved in. Now, we was a half-brother to the Half Elf Paladin, who was having none of this. Laying down a Rage Fueled Smite Evil to end all Smite Evils, she basically solos this end boss on her own, all for her brother.

Now, after this fight, we are down our big strong character and have a s&#%-ton of loot to haul back to town to sell. At first we think we have to leave some behind, but then I remember the Trolls from earlier. Searching the area for them, I find the two and spin a huge lie about how the adventurers snuck past us, killed everyone and left to rest at their camp. Not wanting to let the murdering scum get all of our leaders stuff, I convince the trolls to help us haul it all back to town. One day out of town, I take the two aside and give them about 1000gp each. I told them that they were good men and didn't deserve to get hunted down. They should head out into the wilderness, lay low for a while and use the gold to start a new life for themselves.

I hope those trolls are still alive, honestly.

I like the floating +2, mostly because it allowed my Half-Orc Bard not to be completely crippled.