The thing is, you can find that playstyle already in other classes. Want to make a crusader who roots out evil? Make a LG fighter and roleplay him being a zealot to fight the enemies of the church. Just one of many examples. You don't need smite for that.
I will vehemently oppose any suggestions that lock out modes of play because someone wants to keep toys to themselves.
What you're saying is "My way of playing a paladin is the one true way, and if you don't like it go play another class or whatever." That's not a healthy outlook.
I want to play a Paladin who can smite evil. You want to play a paladin that can "tank". What's wrong with allowing both? Customization is Pathfinder's entire thing.
Also, it's inherently unsatisfying to tell someone who wants to play a paladin to kick evil butt "Oh, no, paladins are tanks only. If you want to deal damage roll up a fighter and pretend it does holy damage and stuff."
I've played D&D (1E, 2E, 3E, 3.5E) and Pathfinder for years. Choice and customization is what the game is all about. We all want to play what we want to play, and when we couldn't we altered rules so we could. When it comes to paladins, I see them as first, protectors, taking the brunt in battle protecting those who can't or saving their companions, second as evil smiting champions of good, and heroic and charismatic leaders influencing and bolstering their companions. That's the options I want to have. As it sits, the paladin isn't right (yet). That's what the playtest is for.
If I choose to play a paladin, I better be able to protect my friends, giving even the ultimate sacrifice to do so, strike down the BBEG for the good of all, and lead and bolster my companions or forces to victory against the forces of evil.
They need to find a happy median between PF1E version and what they are trying to create here. Perhaps Retributive Strike should be an option within a base class feature that allows that as a choice, and a more overt proactive type of strike like Smite was. They should be able to have both, but allow for choice and customization for those who want to be the big tank protector or a demon destroying smiter. Perhaps something like the initial PF1E Mythic Paths where you can chose from 3 choices, and can gain the others later on as they level up?
Three options
-Evil smiter (something akin to smite)
-Protector (retributive strike)
-Inspiring hero (companion booster)
Just to toss in my two cents. I think the idea of a Paladin being the Paragon and Defender of its Alignment sounds very interesting and fun. A Paladin doesn't just worship a Deity, they worship what the deity stands for. A Paladin of Asmodeous would worship the idea of following the law as written and using it to achieve your goals. Just as a Paladin of Shelyn worships the beauty and creativity of art. A Cleric follows and preaches the teachings, a Paladin defends and embodies what the Deity stands for.
Again, these are just my thoughts on what I would like to see as someone who didn't play Paladins that often but preferred playing the Antipaladins.
Paladins are and should be LG only, period. They are historically and typically seen as the divine champion of LG deities, and they should remain that way. Why, because whether people like them or not, they are special champions of a LG god, and always have been. Just like antipaladins should only be CE champions of a CE god. Those are the two extremes. They should remain special instead of being clumped together under the name "paladin".
That said, I have always liked and agreed with the idea of other alignment "paladins". I think they should follow the old 1E D&D approach (Dragon Magazine 106) or 3.5E (Dragon Magazine 310 & 312), and give other aligned "paladins" a different name. Yes it's semantics, not right or wrong, it's just my opinion. Paladin for LG, Antipaladin for CE.
Now, we don't need to necessarily go with a name for every alignment of "paladin", like they did in the original Plethora of Paladins article (Dragon Mag 106) or the later Paladins of Other Alignments and Blackguards article (Dragon Mag 310 & 312). But they could, because these "champions" of gods of other alignments are just as unique, or should be. I prefer the names used in Dragon MAgs 310 & 312 (Sentinel-NG, Avenger-CG, Enforcer-LN, Incarnate-N, Anarch-CN, Despot-LE, Corruptor-NE), though I am partial to the old ones too from Drag Mag 106 (Myrikhan, Gareth, Lyan, Paramander, Fantra, Illrigger, and Arrikhan). But they may have copyright issues.
Since they are using feats to establish powers for the classes, all they need to do is create a base "paladin" class for the other alignments: good (NG or CG, as Paladins are LG), neutrals (LN, N, CN) and evils (only NE or LE, as Antipaladins should still be only CE). This would save creative space. Then add in different feats to create your different paladins, with unique and varied abilities.
We already have one name for other evil "paladins" that can be used, Blackguard. Any LE or NE "paladin" would be under this name. Sentinel or Guardian for NG and CG, and Equalizer or something for LN, N, and CN.
The point is, everyone needs to stop making "Paladin" the name used as the catchall for "paladins" of other alignments. Paladins are and always have been a unique class, and the other aligned "paladins" should be given the same consideration, because they are worth it. I'd rather be able to play NG or CN "paladin" with unique abilities and name than just be a Paladin with a different alignment.
Paizo has the opportunity to make a true impact on the idea of different alignment paladins, and create unique classes for them based of the alignment's outlook, new abilities, and different niches, to make them as lovable and playable as the regular paladin.
Last comment. I love paladins, they are my favorite class. But I also love the idea of other aligned divine champions, and they should be given the same love and attention in creation and playability as the standard paladin. SO, I am both pro Paladin (leave them alone) and pro Divine Champions of other alignments (make them unique, and fun to play).
Sweet! They're calling it Multiclass Archetypes huh? I wonder if someone came up with an idea with that name before? I want to see Paladin/Cleric, Ranger/Cleric, Wizard/Alchemist, and Rogue/Sorcerer Multiclass Archetype options.
As requested, I am creating this thread for the soul purpose of fans, players, and GM's that use the Multiclass Archetypes in their campaigns as a place to discuss the strengths and weaknesses of the plethora of MCAs that have been developed.
And so, let the discussions begin. We look forward to seeing how our creations have been included in campaigns and inspired players and GM's alike. Good gaming!
Great post Derrick Winters. Those are my thoughts exactly.
One of the big things to remember about playing a paladin is, that while they are required to be Lawful Good, their code only punishes them for doing something evil, not chaotic (opposite of law), which shows that "good" is the primary aspect of the alignment. A paladin is always striving to do the greatest good for all, generally within the structure of the law. That said, a paladin can break the law or do something chaotic or less lawful if the circumstance warrants it. Like the situations mentioned above, a paladin will walk the moral razor edge, ensuring that the greatest good for all is done. Also, when it comes to laws, I believe that his own moral "law" or the edicts of his deity over rule the laws of man/the land in which he lives, especially in difficult moral dilemmas. He has first and foremost, a responsibility to his own moral code, since it was likely what made him a paladin in the first place. If he can't made a decision based on that, then he relies on the edicts and guidance of his deity. If that doesn't work, then the laws of the land, as long as they are not corrupt and evil, can guide him/her as well.
Hello to all our Multiclass Archetype fans! Just posting this to let you all know that the old Wiki info is in the process of being transfered to the PF Community site under the Multiclass Archetypes heading.
Currently, there are a few MCAs uploaded and linked from each primary class.
I've just added all the Alchemist primary class MCAs. As I upload and link each primary class, I'll post the announcement here.
Thanks for your continued support and interest, and enjoy!
Is it just me or does the archive dump end somewhere in the M's?
It appears so, but if you click the Open MCArchetypes pages, it'll open in google drive and it has the entire dump, including all my individual work on archetypes,races, etc.
You can then add the whole batch to your google drive.
OK, so we have done a Wiki Dump of the raw unformatted info onto the PF Community site. Currently there seems to be a glitch. It was working before.
We have also added all the docs the MCA gang used to keep track and organize all the MCAs as pdfs onto the Community site as well.
PF Community MCA Pdfs. If you know the name of a particular MCA and its Primary Class, then you should beable to track down the right pdf for it. :D
Someone suggested a crowd funding of the wiki, but I know nothing about it, so we're looking into it, and the legality of it as this is all nonprofit OGL content. We'll let people know if that happens. Would take care of a lot of things if we can work out something like this.
I've spent along time creating hybrid-style classes. First off, this is overpowered as there are too many class features for a full caster class with even a d6 for HD.
I like the idea of the different astronomical domains and the variant channeling concepts, but its too much. Look at the cleric. She gets 2 domains (spells and powers), full channeling, and full casting.
Dropping to d6 gives you a bit of wiggle room in redesigining, but not much. Dropping to 7d6 channeling (instead of 10d6) is a good start too, but its still doesn't give you enough wiggle room to add in all the bonus channeling feats, 3 domains, and all the hexes as well.
If this is primarily a channeling hybrid class with a bit of hexing, then it should be limited to hexes (no major hexes).
Let me just jump right to it. You have 2 choies...
1) d6, full caster, and reduced features (likely only 1/2 BAB)
or
2) drop to a d8 3/4 caster, which gives you a lot more design room (3/4 BAB).
First let me address option #1
Divine Witch - d6, Full caster, 1/2 BAB:
1) Change the domain ability to function like this: From dawn to dusk, she gains access to the "Sun" domain, from dusk to dawn, she gains access to the "Moon" domain (scrap the Star domain). Could also just tie them to daytime/night time. Tie this also to your variant channeling, allowing whichever domain is in dominance to determine the variant channeling.
Doing this gives the DW access to both domains, but during different times of the day.
2) Next you can tie the use of hexes to the use of channel energy. So, she can expend a use of channel energy to either channel energy, OR use a hex. This ties one class feature to the resource of another, allowing for the use of an additional class feature fairly. Sort of how paladins can channel energy by spending 2 uses of lay on hands.
However, since there is the limiting of a single domain in use at a time, which means spells and domain powers from a second domain are lost, you might be able to get away with a limited number of hexes without being OP, maybe only 3, or perhaps 5. Some testing would need to occur.
3) Then, allow the domain-related variant channeling to be usable x/day. This limits its use, but also again adjusts to which domain is in dominance at the time.
4) Going with 1/2 BAB also gives you a bit more design space, and sticking with the Cleric spell list helps too.
So, with a 1/2 BAB, d6, full caster, domain spells, good Will/bad Fort & Ref saves, you could have something like this.
1st - Aura, channel energy 1d6, domain (changes during day),
orisons, spontanteous casting (domain spells only)
2nd - Hex
3rd -
4th - Channel energy 2d6
5th - Variant channeling 1/day
6th - Hex
7th - Channel energy 3d6
8th -
9th -
10th - Channel energy 4d6, hex
11th - Variant channeling 2/day
12th -
13th - Channel energy 5d6
14th - Hex
15th -
16th - Channel energy 6d6
17th - Variant channeling 3/day
18th - Hex
19th - Channel energy 7d6
20th - Power of the high priestess
For the other, this is my suggestion.
Divine Witch 3/4 BAB, d8. 3/4 casting:
Again this would be a 3/4 BAB, d8, 3/4 casting, good Fort & WIll/bad Ref saves hybrid.
1) Everything as above (class feature-wise), except...
2) The number of variant channeling per day increases to 6/day
3) Gain more hexes and access to major hexes (no grand hexes)
4) Still have domain spells, and spontanteous casting is domain spells only.
So like this
1st - Aura, channel energy 1d6, domain (changes during day),
orisons, spontanteous casting (domain spells only)
2nd - Hex
3rd - Variant channeling 1/day
4th - Channel energy 2d6
5th - Hex
6th - Variant channeling 2/day
7th - Channel energy 3d6
8th - Hex
9th - Variant channeling 3/day
10th - Channel energy 4d6,
11th - Hex, major hexes
12th - Variant channeling 4/day
13th - Channel energy 5d6
14th - Hex
15th - Variant channeling 5/day
16th - Channel energy 6d6
17th - Hex
18th - Variant channeling 6/day
19th - Channel energy 7d6
20th - Power of the high priestess
My homebrew campaign world has changed where gods are concerned over the years and editions. Originally I use a lot of gods from the 2E Deities and Demigods book. As time went by, I renamed, adjusted, and made many unique to my world. The ONLY book related god to survive is Seker, the Egyptian god of light. Now I have about 15 gods, about 1/3 each for good/neutrals/evils, plus a few "dead gods" who are trying to return. With the limited number of gods (15-ish) some of them go by different names among different races. Don't have access to them right now, or I'd post them.
AFAIK, the term "wemic" is WotC intellectual property, which is one reason that wemics seldom make it into new versions and third party works under that name. However, the idea of a "lion centaur" or "liontaur" dates back to Ancient Assyria, with more mentions in medieval and renaissance art (including Shakespeare).
There is no reason you cannot have liontaurs in your game. And I have lots of liontaur stats for D&D 3.5 and Pathfinder.
Because of this thread, I'm going to finish posting my 4 other classes to my site. If anyone wants to try them be my guest. If not, then that's fine too.
I actually did this. You can find three of my seven Wizard School spellcasting classes HERE. I only have the Abjurer, Diviner, and Enchanter posted here so far. just need to add the other four. I made them all 6th level casters instead of full casters to give them a wider range of abilities, and I custom made the spell lists. Each class has full access to their own schools (6th level spells + some appropriate 7th or 8th level spells and some spells earlier than others) plus a smattering of other appropriate school spells to add versatility.
I homebrewed my own Small (light) and Medium (one-handed) versions for an archetype of mine. Elven High Guard. And it has "Elven" in the name for the strict pupose of elves. The Elven War Knife is like unto Legolas's white knives, and the elven war blade is just a one-handed version of the elven curved blade. I really don't know why they never had these versions in the first place, sinceit allows some Dex combatant versatility with elves, which is what elves prefer, vs Strength.
Hey Jon, here's my rewrite. The math is corrected where necessary, tweaked some of the abilities for simplicity, easy of comparison with normal phoenixes, and put it in the proper monster stat block. Also compared to other tiny familiars summoned through the improved Familiar feat, like the Quasit and Imp.
PHOENIX, LESSER (CR2):
A small bird with red and orange plumage sits in a cage. With an intelligence that would surprise some, it has an aura of majesty around it as though it is something to be respected.
XP 600
NG Tiny magical beast (fire)
Init +4; Senses darkvision 60 ft., detect magic, detect poison, low-light vision; Perception +5
Aura shroud of flame (2 1/2 ft., 1d2 point of fire, DC 10)
DEFENSE
AC 17, touch 16, flat footed 13 (+2 size, +4 Dex, +1 natural)
hp 11 (2d10); regeneration 2 (cold or evil)
Fort +3, Ref +7, Will +0
Defensive Abilities immolation, self resurrection; DR 5/evil; Immune fire
Weaknesses vulnerability to cold
OFFENSE
Speed 5 ft. (1 square), fly 60 ft. (perfect)
Melee 2 talons +8 (1d2 –1 plus 1d2 fire) and bite +8 (1d3 –1 plus 1d2 fire)
Space 2-1/2 ft.; [b]Reach 0 ft.
[b]Spell-Like Abilities (CL 2)
[b]Constant—detect magic, detect poison 3/day—see invisibility 1/day—continual flame, cure light wounds
STATISITC
Str 11, Dex 18, Con 10, Int 13, Wis 12, Cha 14
Base Attack +2; CMB 0; CMD 14
Feats Flyby Attack, Weapon Finesse (bite)
Skills Acrobatics +9, Fly +13, Perception +5; Racial Modifiers +4 Perception
Languages Celestial, Common
SPECIAL ABILITES
Familiar Service
Willingly serving spellcasters as familiars, lesser phoenixes play the role of dutiful protectors and sentries, providing information on the road ahead or enemies who venture into the immediate vicinity of their masters.
Unlike other lesser phoenixes, if a lesser phoenix familiar dies again before a years’s time has passed since its last self-resurrection, it does not permanently die. Instead, its master must gather its ashes and carry them with him for 1 week. After 1 week has passed, the master can resurrect his familiar by incorporating the ashes into a special ritual that costs 200 gp per wizard level. Once the ritual is complete, the lesser phoenix familiar immediately self-resurrects. The ritual takes 8 hours to complete as normal. If the lesser phoenix familiar is dismissed or lost, it can also be replaced in the same manner. A lesser phoenix familiar can be self-resurrected multiple times by performing the same ritual. The lesser phoenix does not gain a negative level when resurrected in this way.
In addition, whenever its master is reduced to 0 or fewer hit points, a lesser phoenix familiar can transfer a number of hit points equal to its master’s wizard level to its master, once per day.
A lesser phoenix can be summoned via the Improved Familiar feat by a spellcaster of 7th level or higher.
Immolation (Su)
When a lesser phoenix is slain, it spontaneously bursts into flame. Any creature adjacent to the lesser phoenix takes 3d6 points of fire damage and catches on fire. A successful Fortitude save (DC 14) reduces this damage by half and prevents the target from catching on fire. Each round on the lesser phoenix’s turn, a burning target can attempt a new save to extinguish the flames; otherwise it takes another 1d6 fire damage.
Self Resurrection (Su)
Like its greater cousin, a slain lesser phoenix remains dead for only a short time unless its body is completely destroyed by an effect such as disintegrate. Otherwise, a fully healed phoenix emerges from its the remains 1d4 rounds after its death, as if brought back to life via resurrection. The lesser phoenix gains 1 permanent negative level when this occurs, although most use greater restoration to remove this negative level as soon as possible. A lesser phoenix can self-resurrect only once per year. If a lesser phoenix dies a second time before that year passes, its death is permanent. A lesser phoenix that dies within the area of a desecrate spell cannot self-resurrect until the desecrate effect ends, at which point the phoenix immediately resurrects. A phoenix brought back to life by other means never gains negative levels as a result.
Shroud of Flame (Su)
A lesser phoenix can cause its feathers to burst into fire as a free action. As long as its feathers are burning, it inflicts an additional 1d2 point of fire damage with each natural attack, and any creature within reach (0 feet) must make a DC 10 Reflex save each round to avoid taking 1d3 points of fire damage at the start of its turn. A creature that attacks the phoenix with natural or non-reach melee weapons takes 1 points of fire damage (no save) with each successful hit. The save DC is Constitution-based.
ECOLOGY
Environment warm desert and hills
Organization solitary
Treasure standard
The lesser phoenix is a cousin to the great fiery birds of legend that dwell in the deep, remote deserts of the world. Like their greater cousins, these creatures are rare, but are more commonly seen in the company of adventuring humanoids. Many keep lesser phoenixes as pets, and since they can never truly die, this avoids the heartbreak associated with the deaths of most beloved animals.
TACTICS
Lesser phoenixes are not often seen in combat, but when forced to engage an enemy, they fearlessly attack head on, since they do not fear death. They will often fly as close to enemies as possible, so that when they die, their slayer also takes damage from their immolation ability.
Currently going through the wizard and paladin spell lists. My plan is to put any paladin spells that are also wiz, clr, inq, or similar class's spells at those levels (instead of apaladin), and any paladin spells that are just paladin spells, I'll spread out appropriately. Likely, 1st level at 1st, 2nd at 2nd, 3rd at 3rd and 4th, and 4th to 5th and 6th, depending on where they fit in other class spell level power.
These are all great ideas, and yes on the "arcane guardian who stand in the path of enemy spellcasters or evil arcane monsters". I admit that the "You Shall Not Pass!" was largely meant humorously though it does make for a great image.
"None Shall Pass" can be the capstone. Able to stand toe to to with an arcane beast. Gains BAB equal to level, gains temp hp equal to level or level x2 or something. Becomes fatigued after the battle ends. Able to banish outsiders with his Smite Magic. If he dies standing in the way of a BBEG spellcaster, he returns from the dead as an outsider of some sort, or gains the half-celestial template and becomes a servant of the god of magic. Just throwing ideas out.
But the difference here is I don't feel obligated to comment. This time, I felt like it, and don't feel the need to work everything out. I'm just offering suggestions. :D
Welcome to the 10th Multiclass Archetypes thread. This thread will be a bit different from the rest, in that this thread has been created for the purpose of discussing new MCA concept combinations of all kinds (Core, Base, ACG, etc.), and not necessarily a work space for creating them. Though, if those who participate in this thread wish to do so, they may.
This thread will also be left to the fans of MCAs. Though I am starting this thread, I will be stepping away form the project for a well deserved break. I will likely pop in from time to time. As requested by participants from the previous thread, this thread will be left to them to discuss ideas, concepts, builds, etc, for their own MCAs. Its time for the teacher to step back and let the students work on their own. That was the point of creating the MCA concept originally.
So, let the discussing and collaborating commence.
Well, no sign of Taco Man, so that means Lindley Court is next.
Then after her its Apraham Lincoln, Noro, and then myself, who will be wrapping up the thread.
As I said, don't be surprised if after a long break (maybe summer or after the summer) if you see a 10th thread show up. In fact, it may be likely, as MCAs are in my blood. But the break at least for now is needed. So stay tuned. We could just keep this thread open I suppose? You guys could just keep going for the time being. i may pop in now and then. We'll see. MCAs always suck me back in. :/
Though preaching to friends, doesn't necessarily mean jamming down their throats! At time perhaps, but primarily through their examples. They also know how to prioritize what is the more urgent evil. But, on their way to get the BBEG, they would likely give a hand to someone in immediate need, then go get the bad guy.
It really comes down to the idea that a paladin is just your normal guy (a farm boy, son of lord, street urchin risen to city protector) who has failings, problems, even additions, but is always trying (may not always succeed) to do the right thing, for the good of all.
On the Lawful Good aspect. As has been said, LG is not necessarily law-abiding, but living according the laws of a goodly land, his god, or the dictates of his conscience. Willing to go against an established law/gov't to pursue a higher law of common good, justice, fairness, equity (not necessarily equality), all within the governance of goodness and righteousness.
As I said before, LN is the ardent law enforcer, without compassion, etc. LG is law, tempered by compassion, fairness for circumstance, erring on the side of leniency, punishment according to the circumstance vs. carte blanch punishment, etc. They realize that "man is not made for the laws" but that "laws are made for man" to help them become better, change, and enhance society.
As to the Paladin COde, all it says is he can't perform an EVIL act. Doesn't mean he can't lean towards a chaotic or unorthodox things along the Law/Chaos axis on occasion. A single act, even a few or many minor acts that are stringently tied to Lawful wouldn't necessarily shift his alignment. Big/major acts, after a number of them, would do so. We need to take a more real world look at the alignment shifts thing. I consider myself LG in general, devout, and try to do good things. However, I have my own flaws and problems, and work to overcome them, "repent" of things that I've done wrong, but always trying to be better. That's what paladins do. Keep going, keep trying to be and do better, try to be an example to others by word and deed, and help those around them to better the world at large. When the need arises, they pull out their sword and board, wade into the fray, crack heads, put themselves in harms way, and even sacrifice themselves to get the BBEG if necessary. But they shouldn't be seeking a glorious death outright, as they should realize that they do more good alive than dead. But if the circumstance necessitates it, they willingly (or even begrudgingly, as not everyone wants to die) step in and give their lives for the cause of good.
The reason I love paladins is because I've always loved the hero trope, the one who fights against all odds to make the world better, destroy evil, and bring light again to the world. That's probably why I see people like Capt. John Sheridan (B5), Aragon (LOTR), Capt. America, Superman, etc as the guys who emulate the qualities of what a paladin is and can become.
I've always wanted to play a Paladin, but never gotten around to it. I feel like I could do it really well, and enjoy it, but I don't want to deal with the early eye rolls.
I've felt that the key to playing a good paladin (learned from my players) is to make a character, complete with traits, flaws, goals, etc., who also happens to be a Paladin. Once you have a living, breathing character, you can play the game in such a way that you aren't defined by your mechanical choices, and it becomes more interesting for everyone involved.
Ventnor wrote:
I think the main way a GM can make a Paladin worth playing is to allow the Paladin fail sometimes. Let them have moments of weakness without using the fall-hammer. A Paladin should only fall when they've done something truly unforgivable, and even then give them a chance to atone for it if their Paladin really wants to try and make up for it.
rorek55 wrote:
indeed. There are some people that here that would rather devote their time and games into ways to force the paladin fall, just to see him fall. IDK why. Paladins can make amazing PCs, and memorable ones at that. Hell, my very first character was a paladin, and me and my friends still remember to this day things that happened with him.
Just want to second these fine gentlemen's comments.
Good to see your reply Elghinn, I thought for certain you would have something to add to this thread. Though we have never roleplayed together I have come to respect you and have always felt your demeanor was much like that of a Paladin, at least how I have often considered them.
Well, as lame as it may sound, I try to live my life as much as a paladin would. I pretty much follow your OP when I've played one, and in my daily life.
I've read that Giant's in the Playground entry before. THAT, and what is also said in the quotes of the OP is EXACTLY what a paladin is all about. And that's how I've always played them. They aren't Lawful stupid, or stupidly good. They aren't forcing friends or allies to be exactly like him/herself. They are a shining example to all, living their life the way they do (as shown in the OP) regardless of who or what is around them.
My first PC was a paladin, Odorian Lightbringer (my avatar's father) back in 2E. He was good friends and partners with a LG elf Rgr/Clr, NG human Wiz (Wu jen), and CG halfling (kender) Rog. The wizard had a faerie dragon familiar which made him a bit of a trickster. He got along well with the halfling (kender). The elf was a bit stuffy, and was always about the animals (and he had many).
We were a strange looking crew, but we saved the world on numerous occasions. I never tried to convert them, though the elf was the same religion as me. I simply served my companions, lived my life in obedience to the edicts of good and law. But one has to remember, Law is tempered by good (which is compassion) which is the over-riding aspect of a paladin. If you want a strict law-biter, then go LN. Law without Good (compassion, kindness, etc.) isn't a paladin. He's Judge Dredd - law incarnate.
I never understood why there is such a hate for paladins. They are powerful, yes, but they are also the ones who are meant to throw themselves in harms way, to do all they can to ensure the good for all, protect life, help the innocent, and ensure that goodness in the world survives. My groups have never had an issue with paladins (only with who might be playing them, as they might not be up to the challenge).
Paladins are great for RPing, and make great leaders if they are played right, by allowing their allies to use their strengths as often as possible. "Nope! Paladin!" That sums things up, as does the whole Fallen Paladin entry too. Paladins are willing to do all they can to keep goodness alive in the world (which isn't a bad thing). And yes, like in the OP Fallen Paladin section, they should not be afraid of falling, because if they are doing it right, there may indeed be a time that they deem a threat just too great that they need to throw everything at it to defeat it, including their life, code, etc., for the greater good. But then, if he's doing it all for the greater good, isn't he fallowing his code, as long as he doesn't do something blatantly evil?
Case in point. My paladin and his crew were on a world saving mission, and to succeed, he had to make a pact with a LE evil female githyanki (OGL) knight, because they needed the help of her legion. They fulfilled their common task, and because of my paladin's example and willingness to put all on the line for the greater good, that knight (who had been wanting to flee the control of the githyanki lichqueen goddess) eventually shifted alignment to LN, and eventually LG, and brought with her a bunch of her legion who also joined her in creating a new knighthood on the Material Plane, both in honor of my character's deeds and to serve the greater good themselves. And with his help (and that of my god) they were able to sever their ties to their lichqueen goddess and become free.
That's what a paladin does. Does what is right, regardless of consequences. Making mistakes and failing from time to time as a paladin does not equate to falling. He is still a mortal being, has flaws, good days, and bad days, can be tempted, can make poor choices, but that does not mean he falls. If he fixes those mistakes, then that's part of his code.
I've always been a paladin at heart. Even when I've played a NG or CG character, I've tried to be heroic when the need is required, drawing upon my paladin's heart to guide me. But that's what a paladin is, an exemplar, someone to strive to be like on the Good end of the alignment spectrum - kind, compassionate, etc., while striving to maintain the law. For example, a paladin catches a kid stealing, he can either hand the kid to the authorities, or, give him a lecture about doing good, give him a silver, and go with him to pay for for what he had stolen. Example, example, example, in both word and actions.
"PALADIN!"
OK, that was a lot of text, but I said what I wanted to say. Paladins will always be my favorite, prefered class, even though I've only ever played two of them (class-wise). Though, many of my characters have had paladin-esque qualities, which is the purpose of paladin's being a round, to be an example of how others should act for the good of the world.
OK, here's what I've got for the Persona Shapeshifter. I used the Doppleganger blooodline and included some of the Infiltrator.
PERSONA SHIFTER:
Persona shifters are foremost spies, infiltrators, and deceivers who possess the blood of doppleganger’s somewhere in their family line. More so, their blood marks them as tainted and ever changing, for even in their youth they took to creating disguises to fool others. However because of their ever-shifting personas, there is the risk of losing themselves in the personas they assume. If a persona shifter is not careful–deadly careful–they can lose all understanding of self and truly become the identities they create.
Bonus Skills and Ranks: The persona shifter may select three sorcerer skills to add to his class skills in addition to the normal investigator class skills. The persona shifter gains a number of ranks at each level equal to 4 + Int modifier.
Weapon and Armor Proficiency: The persona shifter is proficient with all simple weapons, plus the hand crossbow, rapier, sap, shortbow, short sword, and sword cane. He is also proficient with light armor, but not with shields.
Spellcasting: A persona shifter casts arcane spells drawn from the alchemist formulae list and the sorcerer spell list. Only sorcerer spells of 6th level and lower and alchemist formulae are considered to be part of the persona shifter’s spell list. If a spell appears on both the sorcerer spell list and the alchemist formulae list, the persona shifter uses the lower of the two spell levels listed for the spell. He can cast any spell he knows without preparing it ahead of time.
To learn or cast a spell, a persona shifter must have a Charisma score equal to at least 10 + the spell level. The Difficulty Class (DC) for a saving throw against a persona shifter’s spell is 10 + the spell level + the persona shifter’s Charisma modifier.
Like other spellcasters, a persona shifter can cast only a certain number of spells of each spell level per day. His base daily spell allotment is given on Table: Persona Shifter. In addition, he receives bonus spells per day if he has a high Charisma score.
The persona shifter’s selection of spells is extremely limited. A persona shifter begins play knowing four 0-level spells and two 1st-level spells of the persona shifter’s choice. At each new persona shifter level, he gains one or more new spells, as indicated on Table: Persona Shifter Spells Known. (Unlike spells per day, the number of spells a persona shifter knows is not affected by his Charisma score.
Upon reaching 5th level, and at every third persona shifter level after that (8th, 11th, and so on), a persona shifter can choose to learn a new spell in place of one he already knows. In effect, the persona shifter “loses” the old spell in exchange for the new one. The new spell’s level must be the same as that of the spell being exchanged, and it must be at least one level lower than the highest-level persona shifter spell the persona shifter can cast. A persona shifter may swap only a single spell at any given level, and must choose whether or not to swap the spell at the same time that he gains new spells known for the level.
A persona shifter need not prepare his spells in advance. He can cast any spell he knows at any time, assuming he has not yet used up his allotment of spells per day for the spell’s level. This ability and cantrips replace alchemy and extracts.
Cantrips: Persona shifters learn a number of cantrips, or 0-level spells, as noted on Table: Persona Shifter Spells Known under "Spells Known." These spells are cast like any other spell, but they do not consume any slots and may be used again. This ability replaces
Doppleganger’s Blood (Su): Somewhere in past generations, a doppelganger infiltrated the persona shifter’s family tree, infusing him with the innate magic of the doppelganger race. At 1st level, a persona shifter adds Disguise to his list of class skills. Whenever a persona shifter casts a polymorph spell on himself, he gains a bonus to Disguise skill checks equal to half his persona shifter level for as long as he remains polymorphed. In addition, he adds the following spell to his list of spells known at the indicated levels: disguise self (3rd), alter self (6th), monstrous physique I (9th), true form (12th), seeming (15th), transformation (18th). This ability replaces studied strike +2d6, +5d6, and +8d6.
Quick Change (Su): At 1st level, a persona shifter can draw upon his doppelganger heritage to assume and change a disguise. Activating this ability is a swift action. A persona shifter gains a +5 bonus on one Disguise check made to impersonate a particular individual and it only requires a swift action to apply his disguise. He can use this ability a number of times per day equal to 3 + his Charisma modifier. This ability replaces trapfinding and swift alchemy.
Mimic Mastery (Su): At 2nd level, when a persona shifter uses disguise self or any polymorph extracts on himself, he is treated as 2 investigator levels higher for the purpose of determining the duration of that extract's effect. He can use these extracts to take the appearance of specific individuals of the type of form he chooses, gaining a +10 to Disguise checks even if that extract does not typically grant such a bonus. Furthermore, these extracts grant the persona shifter a +10 bonus to Disguise checks made as part of his voice mimicry ability. This ability replaces poison resistance.
Voice Mimicry (Ex): At 2nd level, a persona shifter learns to mimic voices and sounds around him. Using this ability requires a special Disguise check, and creatures hearing the voice can make a Perception check to discover the ruse. A persona shifter can attempt to emulate any creature or other sound he's heard clearly for at least 1 minute. The bonuses or penalties to this special Disguise check are modified in the following ways, all of which are cumulative.
• Voice is not your own, but not that of a distinct individual +5
• Voice is that of a different gender –2
• Voice is that of a different race –2
• Voice is that of a different age category –2
• Voice is that of a different size category –5
Also, the creature making the Perception check gains a bonus based on its familiarity with specific voices, just as if it were confronted with a normal disguise. This ability is a language-dependent effect, meaning that if a creature cannot hear or understand what the persona shifter is saying, the ruse fails. Magic items, feats, and traits that affect typical disguises do not affect this disguise check. At 8th level, the persona shifter gains the effects of its master of disguise class feature on this special use of the Disguise skill (no penalty for a voice of a different gender, race, or age category, and only a –3 penalty for a different size category). This ability replaces poison lore.
Mind Reader (Sp): At 3rd level, a persona shifter can read minds as a spell-like ability. This ability acts like detect thoughts, except it lasts only 1 round, it can only be used on a single target as a standard action, and if the target fails its Will save, the persona shifter gains information as if he had concentrated on it for 3 rounds. A persona shifter may use this ability once per day at 3rd level and one additional time per day for every four persona shifter levels he possess beyond 3rd, up to five times per day at 19th level. This ability replaces the investigator talent gained at 3rd level.
Studied Strike (Ex): This is exactly like the investigator ability of the same name, except that the extra damage is 1d6 at 4th level, plus 1d6 every three levels thereafter, up to a maximum of 6d6 at 19th level.
Investigator’s Talent (Ex): This is exactly like the investigator ability of the same name, except that the persona shifter gains a talent at 5t level and every three levels. In addition, whenever a persona shifter gains an investigator talent, he can select one of the following feats instead: Combat Casting, Deceitful, Dodge, Extend Spell, Great Fortitude, Spell Focus (transmutation), Stealthy, Tenacious Transmutation.
Perfect Copy (Ex): At 9th level, a persona shifter can perfectly copy the appearance of specific individuals when he casts polymorph spells or uses abilities which function as polymorph spells on himself. This ability replaces the investigator talent gained at 9th level.
Alter Self (Su): At 15th level, a persona shifter can change his shape into that of any humanoid at will. This ability acts like alter self, except the persona shifter may remain in a chosen form as long as he wants to. This ability replaces the investigator talent gained at 15th level.
True Shapeshifter (Su): At 20th level, a persona shifter gains the shapechanger subtype in addition to the subtypes he already possesses. The persona shifter gains immunity to charm and sleep, darkvision 60 feet (if the persona shifter already possesses darkvision, it increases by 60 feet), and he becomes proficient in all weapons, armor, and shields. Additionally, a persona shifter can use any spell trigger or spell completion item as if the spells were on his spell list. A persona shifter’s caster level for items he normal couldn’t use is equal to his persona shifter level. This ability replaces true inspiration.
A few comments. These will tie into your bad guy, and how to make kobolds a more potent/important race. And I agree, they need more respect than they are given.
1) Your big bad guy should be a warlord of some sort, either a Fighter or Cavalier (or even a Warpriest) who worships the dominant neutral (not evil) deity that happens to be a dragon-god. As such, I'd make it a kobold, a unique variant (only one) that is bigger, stronger, and smarter than the rest of the race, and has been transformed by divine power. Think a kobold on steroids, 5 1/2 - 6 feet tall, great physical stats + good intelligence and Charisma. Maybe even giving it the half-dragon template as well.
2) Kobolds: Make them the favored race of the dominant deity, who has made them to be caretakers of dragonkind's lore, magic, etc. Thus they are given high status in the world as "the blessed children" of the Great Dragon god. As they are a 5 RP race, make them more on par with the humans and other core races.
a) Keep their stats (+2 Dex, -4 Str, -2 Con) but give them a +4 Cha, +2 Int, +2 Wis. So add two Flexible ability score modifiers (+2 Int, +2 Cha) for +2 RP and again (+2 Wis, +2 Cha) for another +2 RP. This puts them at a total of 9 RP.
b) Give them the Linguist racial quality (+1 RP) for a total of 10 RP.
c) Others to consider are Lucky (lesser) defensive racial trait (+2 RP), Arcane Focus magical racial trait (+1 RP), Magical Linguist magical racial trait (+2 RP), or look at the races current alternate racial trats and grant one or two as standard traits.
This way you make them more on par with humans, elves, and dwarves (RP 10-12 or so).
3) Make the Kobolds the eyes and ears and special shock troops of the BBEG, sort of like the uruk-hai are for Saruman or Nazghul for Sauron in LOTR. But, also have some of them be the leaders/instigators of the small rebellion that is rising up. If they've been granted enhanced intelligence and wisdom, then there should be those who can really see where things are headed and the that they are really enslaved to their leader and deity.
The spell list looks okay to me, though I think it might have been missed when I suggested that spell filching could steal arcane spells as a whole, not just sorcerer/wizard ones.
No I didn't miss it. At 2nd+, she can filch any arcane spell from any arcane caster, but only if that spell is on the sor/wiz list. As the ST has its own spell list, I think it's find to limit the filched spells to anything on the sor/wiz list, as that gives her a ton of new spells to access. She can also add those to her spellbook through the normal costs/time.
If she takes the Greater Filching greater exploit, then she can filch any arcane spell (bard, summoner, etc.), but is still restricted to adding only spells from the sor/wiz spell list to her spellbook. I don't want her to be able to add cure spells, etc. to her spellbook, buut anything sor/wiz is appropriate. This way she can gain fireball if she wants it, plus a number of other spells that are on the sor/wiz list.
What do others think? Should she be able to filch any arcane spell at 2nd, essentially making Greater Filching the base ability? Or should I leave it as is?
Welcome to the 9th Multiclass Archetypes thread. Here we are going to focus on new MCAs that incorporate the new hybrid classes as either primary or secondary class, or both.
Again, here's the posting and collaboration process that will be going on in this thread (same as the last ones).
As I said, this thread, while dedicated to new Multiclass Archetypes with ACG hybrid classes, but will also be dedicated to getting the unfinalized MCAs (*) on the Multiclass Archetype Wiki closer to their finalized form. All those who join us in this process, know that it will be greatly appreciated by the members of MCP. Your input will allow us to improve our concepts, as well as your own.
As always, new posters, concepts, and ideas are always welcome. With the unfinalized (*) MCAs from the Wiki, we wish to maintain as much of the core concepts and abilities as possible, but we also are seeking any new and awesome ideas that could improve it, and any feedback on balance issues, or whatever you might see as problematic.
I would like to stress that while not every MCA concept may be to everyone’s liking, this is a collaborative thread, and requires as much collaboration, suggestions, and ideas as possible to obtain the best results for a finalized MCA. So, please, give any and all suggestions you might have.
The posting process will be as follows, so please attempt to keep to these guidelines as much as possible to maintain a cohesive process.
READ
1) Please post "concepts" for new MCAs first (not the whole detailed MCA), as holding places, in the following format.
"Name"
Primary: "X"
Secondary: "Y"
These will be placed in the queue as they are posted (including those from myself or any other MCP member), but will not be looked at until they come up in the queue. So, feel free to work on them alone, or amongst yourselves (or even MCP members) via email or whatever until your turn comes.
I'll give the go ahead with each new MCA just to keep things orderly.
I will also post the new MCA queue every so often so everyone knows what's coming up.
2) Depending on how things progress, two NEW MCAs will be posted at a time, with a wiki MCA revision thrown in every so often. To allow for fairness, if you've recently posted, let someone else post theirs. So, don't post two MCAs in a row. We would prefer MCA class combos that HAVE NOT been created yet, so that we don't double up on already existing MCAs. However, we won't interfere in your creativity process, do as you must, but the previous would be most appreciated.
3) I will post the unfinalized MCAs (*) according to alphabetical order on the Wiki, as this will allow for the most diverse approach, otherwise we may get a little bored working on MCAs with the same primary class over numerous postings.
4) If someone pops up on the thread with feedback on an old MCA, that will becomes the next "unfinalized" (*) MCA that we take a look at, even if it is out of alphabetical order, to address any concerns ASAP.
5) As before, please use the "#" to differentiate between the MCA posts, especially with us working on 2 MCAs simultaneously.
WE could give that a shot! Sort of the wandering plague and illness healer, who hunts down those who willingly spread disease, or if evil, infect those who he deems foes of his church or nation. Or just out of spite.
Have the black blade calling out to two worthy wielders (the PC and his opponent), and have them battle it out for possession. Thus, the sword is the ultimate winner, with the victor being the more powerful and worthy wielder. Hopefully it'll be the PC not the NPC that wins. Create an opponent Magus that becomes the PC's rival throughout the campaign. That's always fun, especially if the NPC loses, and he/she uses her vengeance to fuel encounters that draw the entire party into dangerous situations. Also, if the NPC loses, have him take a different archetype or none at all, thus further fueling his anger towards the NPC.
Perhaps the NPC should be tiefling magus or something like that.
Kevin! I was thinking in a situation where you have a +6 to a stat and only 2 levels to divide it between...+3 and +3, boom odd numbers. lol
You show me a creature that only gets a +6 to one stat and absolutely nothing else, and I will concede. It's more likely that it's going to be +2 at level 1, with all of the other minute abilities the creature has, and +4 at 2nd level.
Yes. Regardless of how many levels you have to break things up into, abilities should always be broken up into multiples of +2.
BTW, just wanted to say I like what you've done/are doing Jeff. I've always been of the mind that monsters should be allowed to be PCs, and their monster levels should be broken down into "racial class" levels if you will. While the old Savage Species had the right idea, I didn't like how they had levels without an increase to HD. Though, they do that with animal companions and eidolons, so there is precedence.
Back in 2E/3.5, we used various monsters as PCs. Minotaurs, Quicklings, and Derro (plus drow, but they've become more common now) were our favorites.
Here's a good base version we can work off of for the Dire Harbinger. Its open to changes of course, but I think this is where we can start. Kept Punishment instead of calling it Wrack, because it was really difficult to use the word wrack in rewriting all the info. Also, included Share Revelations, but we can ditch if you want OSW.
DIRE HARBINGER:
Divinely inspired heralds of pain and adjudication, dire harbingers channel the anger and wrath of their deities in glorious punishment. Able to impart their own suffering to their foes, the dire harbinger can also gift their visions and blessings of power to certain allies to further their divine agency. This power comes at great personal cost–for the path to power can burn the flesh and wrack the soul, and those wishing to share the divine harbingers' benisons must accept the baleful with the benign.
Bonus Skills and Ranks: The dire harbinger selects three oracle skills to add to her class skills in addition to the normal inquisitor class skills. The dire harbinger gains a number of ranks at each level equal to 4 + Int modifier.
Weapon and Armor Proficiency: The dire harbinger is proficient with all simple weapons, plus the hand crossbow, longbow, repeating crossbow, shortbow, and the favored weapon of her deity. She is also proficient with light armor, medium armor, and shields (except tower shields).
Dark Demeanor (Ex): The dire harbinger is skilled at intimidating their foes. A dire harbinger receives a morale bonus on all Intimidate checks equal to 1/2 her dire harbinger level (minimum +1). This ability replaces stern gaze.
Gift of Prophecy (Su): Once per day, a dire harbinger can enter a trance to gain a glimpse of the future. This trance lasts for 1 minute, which must be uninterrupted and during which she can take no other actions. At 1st level, a dire harbinger gains the benefits of an augury spell with 90% effectiveness. At 5th level, a dire harbinger gains the benefits of a divination spell with 90% effectiveness. At 9th level, the knowledge a dire harbinger gains is equivalent to a commune spell. None of these spell effects require material components.
Lore of Insight (Ex): At 1st level, a dire harbinger uses every trick she knows to persuade others to believe in her guidance and warnings. She adds her Wisdom modifier on Bluff and Diplomacy skill checks in addition to the normal ability score modifiers. This ability replaces monster lore.
Mystery: At 1st level, a dire harbinger gains the oracle’s mystery ability and can select any mystery available to the oracle class. The dire harbinger gains the mystery’s class skill and access to its revelation, but does not gain the bonus spells. This ability, gift of prophecy, and oracle’s curse replace domain.
Oracle’s Curse (Ex): At 1st level, a dire harbinger gains the oracle’s curse ability and may choose any curse available to the oracle class.
Punishment (Su): Starting at 1st level, a dire harbinger can produce a punishment on her foes as a swift action. Starting when the punishment is pronounced, the dire harbinger’s target receives a penalty based on the type of punishment pronounced.
At 1st level, a dire harbinger can use this ability once per day. At 4th level and every three levels thereafter, the dire harbinger can use this ability one additional time per day. Once activated, this ability lasts until the combat ends, at which point all of the penalties immediately end. The dire harbinger must participate in the combat for her target to gain these penalties. If she is frightened, panicked, paralyzed, stunned, unconscious, or otherwise prevented from participating in the combat, the ability does not end, but the penalties do not resume until she can participate in the combat again. If the target is slain, the ability immediately ends.
When the dire harbinger uses this ability, she must select one type of punishment to pronounce. As a swift action, she can change this punishment to another type. If the dire harbinger is evil, she bestows profane penalties instead of sacred, as appropriate. Neutral dire harbingers must select profane or sacred penalties. Once made, this choice cannot be changed.
Blunted: The target’s attacks are blunted when directed against the dire harbinger. The target receives a –1 sacred penalty on all weapon damage rolls made against the dire harbinger. This penalty increases by –1 for every three dire harbinger levels she possesses.
Corruption: The target becomes tainted by the divine energies that surround the dire harbinger. The target receives a –1 sacred penalty on all saving throws against attacks, spells, and effects from the dire harbinger. This penalty increases by –1 for every five dire harbinger levels she possesses. At 10th level, the penalty is doubled against curses, diseases, and poisons.
Defenseless: The target is less able to defend himself against the dire harbinger’s attacks. The target receives a –1 sacred penalty to Armor Class against the dire harbinger’s attacks. This penalty increases by –1 for every five dire harbinger levels she possesses. At 10th level, this penalty is doubled against attack rolls made to confirm critical hits against the dire harbinger.
Distracted: The target becomes distracted when focusing his magic against the dire harbinger. The target receives a –1 sacred penalty on concentration checks and caster level checks made to overcome the dire harbinger’s spell resistance (if any). This penalty increases by –1 for every three dire harbinger levels she possesses.
Hemorrhaging: The target becomes susceptible to any slashing or piercing attacks made by the dire harbinger. This causes the target to take 1 point of bleed damage each round as long as the dire harbinger is alive and the punishment lasts. The amount of bleed damage increases by 1 point for every three dire harbinger levels she possesses. This bleed damage does not stack with additional slashing or piercing attacks from the dire harbinger, but it does stack with bleed damage from other sources.
Impeded: The target’s weapons are impeded from bypassing the dire harbinger’s damage reduction. The target’s magical weapons no longer count magic for the purposes of bypassing the dire harbinger’s damage reduction. At 6th level, the target’s magical weapons no longer count as aligned (chaotic, evil, good, or lawful) for the purpose of bypassing the dire harbinger’s damage reduction. The type must match one of the dire harbinger’s alignments. If the dire harbinger is neutral, she does benefit from this penalty. At 10th level, the target’s magical weapons no longer count as adamantine for the purpose of overcoming the dire harbinger’s damage reduction (but not for reducing hardness).
Inaccuracy: The target’s attacks are less true when directed against the dire harbinger. The target receives a –1 sacred penalty on all attack rolls made against the dire harbinger. This penalty increases by –1 for every five dire harbinger levels she possesses. At 10th level, this penalty is doubled on all attack rolls made to confirm critical hits.
Penetrable: The target becomes less resilient to the dire harbinger’s attacks. The target’s DR/magic is treated as 1 less (minimum 0) against the harbinger’s dire attacks. This penalty to DR increases by 1 for every five levels she possesses. At 10th level, this DR includes an alignment (chaotic, evil, good, or lawful) that is opposite the dire harbinger’s. If she is neutral, the dire harbinger does not receive this increase.
Vulnerability: The target becomes vulnerable to the dire harbinger’s energy attacks. The target’s energy resistance against one energy type (acid, cold, electricity, fire, or sonic) is treated as 2 lower (minimum 0), chosen when the punishment is pronounced. The protection decreases by 2 for every three dire harbinger levels she possesses.
This ability changes the judgment ability.
Revelation: At 3rd level and every three levels thereafter (6th, 9th, and so on), a dire harbinger gains a revelation from her chosen mystery. This ability replaces teamwork feats.
Share Revelations: At 3rd level, a dire harbinger can bestow the effects of an active revelation on all allies within 10 feet, even though revelations do not normally affect other creatures. Any ally that leaves the 10-foot area loses the benefits of the revelation. If a revelation has a number of uses per day, granting the revelation to each ally expends one of its daily uses. This ability replaces solo tactics.
Aura of Affliction (Su): At 5th level, a dire harbinger can radiate a cursing aura that causes all enemies within 10 feet to gain the negative aspect of her oracle’s curse (see individual curses for specific effects) as a swift action. She can use this ability for a number of rounds per day equal to her dire harbinger level. These rounds do not need to be consecutive. This ability only functions while the dire harbinger remains conscious, not is she is unconscious or dead. This ability replaces bane.
Greater Aura of Affliction (Su): At 12th level, all enemies with the dire harbinger’s aura of affliction also gain the frightened or sickened condition, as chosen by the dire harbinger when it is activated. At 17th, level the enemies gain the panicked or nauseated condition. All enemies within the aura can make a Fort saving throw (DC 10 + 1/2 the dire harbinger’s level + the dire harbinger’s Wisdom modifier) to negate the chosen condition. This ability replaces greater bane.
Dire Punishment (Su): At 20th level, a dire harbinger can call dire punishment down upon a foe during combat. Whenever a dire harbinger uses her punishment ability, the dire harbinger can invoke dire punishment on a foe as a swift action. Once declared, the dire harbinger can make a single melee (or ranged attack, if the foe is within 30 feet) against the target. If the attack hits, it deals damage normally and the target must make a Fortitude save or die. The DC of this save is equal to 10 + 1/2 the dire harbinger's level + the dire harbinger's Wisdom modifier. If the save is successful, the target is instead nauseated for 1 round per dire harbinger level. Regardless of whether or not the save is made, the target creature is immune to the dire harbinger's dire punishment ability for 24 hours. Once this ability has been used, it cannot be used again for 1d4 rounds. This ability replaces true judgment.
It's real sparse, I hadn't fleshed it out as much as I could've. I might give back the mount to make it more combat-esque, and so you could like strap a drum to the horse (or scorpion or whatever your mount is). I mostly picked the name because of the historical Fife and Drum Corps, there could definitely be something with it in there though. The only problem is that there were multiple people in each Corps historically, generally a couple for drumming and a couple for fifing, because it's hard to do both at the same time haha. I thought about giving proficiency with a firearm, because of the fact that actual Fife and Drum Corpsmen were in fact a part of the regular army and most carried a backup pistol to the front lines, but that feels a little out there. It could be a Bard/Cavalier, the only problem with that really is that I don't want it to be magical, I want it to be "you are a symbol for your men, and your beating of the drum helps your allies with the beating of the enemies".
EDIT: Also a lot of the reason that it's real sparse is because both Cavalier and Bard get a couple of low-level abilities that are supposed to be your bread and butter, and then pretty much nothing between level 6 and level 20. Like, Cavaliers get Greater/Mighty versions of stuff they got at low level, and Bards get new performances and more spells.
@OSW: Yeah, okay, Inspiring Commander is pretty much what I wanted out of this. Maybe a little less "lead from the front", maybe a little more strategic music instead of just inspiration, but it's pretty much it. I actually forgot to mention too in the thing that I wanted to turn Tactician into a performance. That's a big thing that I forgot, oops.
Then are you dropping this or keeping it?
If you are moving forward with it, then I have to agree with OSW on much of what he said. It's a bit too sparse, and the name is much to be desired. Though Fife and Drum could simply be this MCAs version of Bardic performance (to give a nod to the original concepts name), focused on wind and percussion, allowing the player to choose to focus one or both. then he can use his fife or drum to perform.
I also have some ideas for abilities, perhaps even these could be used as separate Orders - one focused on Drums (percussion) the other on the Fife (wind). Think order abilities along the lines of drums of advancing and retreats, drums of panic, drums of haste, other magical wind instrument effects for the other order. Maybe for the fife order, something pied piper-ish he can use against enemies.
Plus appropriate performances of course.
So let me know if we are skipping this one or not.
Still waiting for Astute Sentry – Ftr/Rgr (JonathonWilder)
Well actually given the original fluff for The Whisperer (not Animal Whisper) it includes both... it is just there is less focus on plants then animals. With a bond being formed with animals and beasts but having plants still play a part. More I am taking this from a 2n Edition D&D multiclass. I thought allowing for both to be included would allow for a bit more variety for more focused MCA.
Sooo, what do you think of the first draft Jon? If you want it less specific to animals but more nature, we can rename it the Wild Whisperer or Nature Whisperer. What about the performances?
I'm just going to pipe in quick and suggest that people check out our Multiclass Archetypes wiki. We have over 150+ creations, crafted through mass collaberation. These are all a mash of a primary class base, that swaps in class features from a secondary class (or unique class features to add flavor and uniqueness) using the archetypes mechanic. Very similar to what Paizo has done to create their new Base classes in the ACG (or the Magus too).
We have many of the concepts you guys/gals are suggesting.
1) A prepared spellcasting bard called the Erudite Bard
2) A construct-oriented summoner called the Clockwork Mage
7) An alchemist that gives up bombs and mutagens in favor of poison focus called the Venom Blade
8) A rogue with some bardic performances called the Adept Scoundrel
9) Even a magus/alchemist blend called the Detonator Mage
10) We also have given the antipaladin and ninja some love with our various MCAs (check our Primary Class list)
Plus many concepts people have mentioned here that haven't been done yet. For those, if anyone is interested, you can join me and the rest of us on the Multiclass Archetypes VIII thread and get help building your concept yourself.
Our builds are flexible to individual taste and flavor, and we work with you to make what you want (within reason). We try to stay within the Paizo concepts and rules, but bend some to get the flavor and build the conceptualizer wants. So if you'd like to build your own "hybrid" base class by combining the abilities of two classes, come on over. Love us or hate us, we're here, and have been doing this for 3+ years now.
I went through your list (and the PFd20SRD) and the Ooze summoning table should look like this. Some of yours were off by a level, and some of your IX level oozes were too powerful.
7th Level Subtype(s) Source
Color out of space Ooze B4
Jelly, tyrant Ooze B4
Living mirage Ooze OLP
Ooze, coven Ooze AP72
Ooze, entropic Ooze THC
Pudding, stone Ooze THC
Way back I played a smart but powerful LE human fighter, along side a CE elf Clr/Wiz, and a NE drow ninja. throughout the campaign we went about a lot of things that other adventurers would do - taking jobs, finding treasure, etc, but obviously with an evil twist including stealing things, lying, cheating etc. As things progressed we were approached by an evil organization to join them. We went through a bunch of tasks to prove ourselves. Over time, we did so, and as it goes with evil organizations, made enemies within it. We did one job where we stole the jewels of a powerful duke or something, and killed him, and became hunted and wanted men/women. We eventually exacted revenge on our enemies within the organization, and eventually destroyed it from within, then used our new found power to fulfil our own desires. I decided to take over a nation. As we were wanted people, that was more difficult than it would have been.
In any case, I underwent so changes physically (grew my hair back, changed its color, etc), and started injecting myself into the high society of the nation. Behind the scenes, I was the leader of a new cabal, bent on taking over the nation. I had undergone a lot of things to gather followers, gain a secret headquarters, and started creating problems within the nation. Among the high society, I portrayed myself as a champion of right, and eventually worked my way into the government, and was given charge to end many of the bad things going on (which I was covertly behind of course) Over time I worked my way up to becoming a Baron within the nation, keeping the lands I was placed over safe, keeping the people happy, while injecting my most trusted men and followers into positions of power under my command.
Again, after a while I was given the rank of Duke, and continued to infiltrate the government and military with my men, until eventually, I was in a position of being the most trusted advisor of the King, who had no heirs. He had arranged it that I would become his heir once he was gone. As my old drow ninja partner was a part of my secret organization (and her own ninja clan allied with me), I ranged the king's assassination, and I became the leader of the nation. As time passed, I became a powerful dictator, changing the lows, creating my own secret police, and ensuring obedience, loyalty, etc. My nation prospered under my leadership, and it became one of the strongest in the lands.
It was a lengthy campaign, and a bunch of the latter stuff took place out of campaign time, separate form my other players, as each of them also wanted to fulfil their own dreams too (creating a ninja clan, establishing a wizards tower, and creating an undead army to take over the world). One of the best things to do when running an evil campaign and wanting to take over a nation is to ask your players what their goals are a players/characters, and work off of those to create and develop situations, encounters, etc. to help them accomplish those goals.
OK, finally got the Wyrmkin Shaman put together.Its a wall of text, but I think it work out nicely. Very dragon-y with a unique bond and the incorporation of official druid abilities.
*With alignments, I'm wondering whther we should include a blurp about the dragon patron always being within one step of the Wyrmkin Shaman's alignment, allowing for evil gold dragons, and good green or red dragons? I can't remember of if Paizo has relazed the whole alignment thing with dragons or not? They are no longer "Always X alignment" afterall.
WYRMKIN SHAMAN:
Primary: Druid.
Secondary: Sorcerer.
Alignment: Any.
Hit Dice: d8.
Bonus Skills and Ranks: The wyrmkin shaman may select three sorcerer skills to add to her class skills in addition to the normal druid class skills. The wyrmkin shaman gains a number of ranks at each level equal to 4 + Int modifier.
Weapon and Armor Proficiency: The wyrmkin shaman is proficient with the club, dagger, dart, quarterstaff, scimitar, scythe, sickle, shortspear, sling, and spear. The wyrmkin shaman is also proficient with all natural attacks (claw, bite, and so forth) of any form she assumes with wild shape (see below). The wyrmkin shaman is proficient with light and medium armor but is prohibited from wearing metal armor; thus, she may wear only padded, leather, or hide armor. A wyrmkin shaman may also wear wooden armor that has been altered by the ironwood spell so that it functions as though it were steel. The wyrmkin shaman is proficient with shields (except tower shields) but must use only wooden ones. A wyrmkin shaman who wears prohibited armor or uses a prohibited shield is unable to cast druid spells or use any of her supernatural or spell-like class abilities while doing so and for 24 hours thereafter.
Spellcasting: The wyrmkin shaman casts spells drawn from the druid spell list and adds the following spells to that list at the indicated spell levels: 1st level–mage armor; 3rd level–fly; 4th level–fear; 5th level–spell resistance; 6th level–form of the dragon I; 7th level– form of the dragon II; 8th level– form of the dragon III; 9th level–wish. The wyrmkin shaman otherwise prepares and casts spells as a druid equal to her wyrmkin shaman level.
Dragon Bond (Su): At 1st level, a wyrmkin shaman forms a bond with a dragon patron within a specific terrain (see Table: Dragon Patron). This dragon serves as the wyrmkin shaman’s patron, granting her a number of abilities. As part of this bond, a wyrmkin shaman begins play with a special dragon mask from her dargon patron at no cost. This mask is not made of any special materials, but is always masterwork quality and crafted in the image of the wyrmkin shaman’s dragon patron.
A dragon mask is badge of honor and respect within the wyrmkin shaman’s culture. When the mask is worn, it magically bonds to the wyrmkin shaman’s face and can only be forcibly removed if a dispel magic spell is cast on the mask, or if she is unconscious or dead. The wyrmkin shaman can wear or remove her dragon mask as a move action that does not provoke attacks of opportunity. A dragon mask immediately becomes inert if it leaves the wyrmkin shaman’s possession, reactivating as soon as it returns to her keeping
A non-wyrmkin shaman who attempts to wear or use a dragon mask must make a Will save (DC 10 + 1/2 the wyrmkin shamans level + the wyrmkin shaman’s Wisdom modifier modifier) or become fascinated by the mask’s powerful magic—a non-wyrmkin shaman can never gain the benefit of a dragon mask, but a wyrmkin shaman can gain the effects of another wyrmkin shaman's mask if she wears it. (Although if the other wyrmkin shaman commands the mask to stop functioning, the effects of the “stolen” dragon mask immediately cease. At the GM’s discretion, the dragon patron of “stolen” mask’s may exact some form of retribution upon the perpetrating wyrmkin shaman for attempting use another wyrmkin shaman’s mask, though doing so should warrant good cause.)
While the dragon mask is worn, the wyrmkin shaman gains the following abilities:
• Cast speak with animals (lizards only) at will.
• Low-light vision
• Darkvision 30 feet. If she already has darkvision, it increases by 30 feet.
• Gains a +4 bonus on Initiative checks and Knowledge (geography), Perception, Stealth, and Survival checks in her dragon patron’s terrain.
Table: Dragon Patron
Terrain Dragon
Cold white
Desert brass, blue
Forest forest, green
Jungle forest, green
Mountains copper (hills), magma, red, silver, sky, sovereign, white
Plains gold
Swamp black
Underground crystal, magma, underworld
Water brine, bronze, sea
As the wyrkin shaman gains levels, she gains the following mask powers. These powers can only be used while the dragon mask is worn.
Dragon Claws (Su): At 3rd level, a wyrmkin druid gains the dragon claws bloodline power from the sorcerer’s draconic bloodline.
Dragon Resistance (Ex): At 5th level, a wyrmkin druid gains the dragon resistance bloodline power from the sorcerer’s draconic bloodline.
Dragon Communion (Sp): At 8th level, a wyrmkin shaman can use her mask to contact her dragon patron and ask questions that can be answered by a simple yes or no. This functions as the commune spell and can be used once per week.
Dragon Breath (Su): At 11th level, a wyrmkin druid gains the breath weapon bloodline power from the sorcerer’s draconic bloodline.
Dragon Wings (Su): At 17th level, a wyrmkin druid gains the wings bloodline power from the sorcerer’s draconic bloodline.
Dragon Might (Su): At 20th level, a wyrmkin druid gains the power of wyrms bloodline power from the sorcerer’s draconic bloodline.
A wyrmkin shaman can add additional magic abilities to his dragon mask as if she has the required Item Creation Feats and if he meets the level prerequisites of the feat. The magic properties of a dragon mask, including any magic abilities added to the mask, only function for the wyrmkin shaman who owns it. If a dragon mask's owner dies, or the mask is replaced, the mask reverts to being an ordinary masterwork item of the appropriate type.
If a dragon mask is damaged, it is restored to full hit points the next time the wyrmkin shaman prepares her spells. If the dragon mask is lost or destroyed, it can be replaced after 1 week in a special ritual that costs 200 gp per wyrmkin shaman level plus the cost of the masterwork item. This ritual takes 8 hours to complete. Dragon masks replaced in this way do not possess any of the additional enchantments of the previous mask. A wyrmkin shaman can designate an existing mask as his dragon mask. This functions in the same way as replacing a lost or destroyed mask except that the new magic item retains its abilities while gaining the benefits and drawbacks of becoming a dragon mask.
Spontaneous Casting: This is exactly like the druid ability of the same name. In addition, whenever a wyrmkin shaman casts summon nature’s ally (either as a normal spell or through spontaneous casting) she can summon one of the alternative creatures of the dragon type instead (see Dragon Summoning Options below). The wyrmkin shaman may only summon a dragon of her patron’s type.
4th Level Subtype(s) Source
Wyrmling black dragon Dragon B1
Wyrmling brass dragon Dragon B1
Wyrmling brine dragon Dragon B2
Wyrmling underworld dragon Dragon B3
Very young crystal dragon Dragon B2
Very young white dragon Dragon B1
5th Level Subtype(s) Source
Wyrmling copper dragon Dragon B1
Wyrmling green dragon Dragon B1
Wyrmling magma dragon Dragon B2
Wyrmling sea dragon Dragon B3
Very young black dragon Dragon B1
Very young brass dragon Dragon B1
Very young brine dragon Dragon B2
Very young underworld dragon Dragon B3
Young crystal dragon Dragon B2
Young white dragon Dragon B1
6th Level Subtype(s) Source
Wyrmling blue dragon Dragon B1
Wyrmling bronze dragon Dragon B1
Wyrmling cloud dragon Dragon B2
Wyrmling forest dragon Dragon B3
Wyrmling red dragon Dragon B1
Wyrmling silver dragon Dragon B1
Wyrmling sky dragon Dragon B3
Wyrmling umbral dragon Dragon B2
Very young copper dragon Dragon B1
Very young dragon Dragon B1
Very young magma dragon Dragon B2
Very young sea dragon Dragon B3
Young black dragon Dragon B1
Young brass dragon Dragon B1
Young brine dragon Dragon B2
Young underworld dragon Dragon B3
Juvenile crystal dragon Dragon B2
Juvenile white dragon Dragon B1
7th Level Subtype(s) Source
Wyrmling gold dragon Dragon B1
Wyrmling sovereign dragon Dragon B3
Very young blue dragon Dragon B1
Very young bronze dragon Dragon B1
Very young cloud dragon Dragon B2
Very young forest dragon Dragon B3
Very young red dragon Dragon B1
Very young silver dragon Dragon B1
Very young sky dragon Dragon B3
Very young umbral dragon Dragon B2
Young adult crystal dragon Dragon B2
Young adult white dragon Dragon B1
Young copper dragon Dragon B1
Young green dragon Dragon B1
Young magma dragon Dragon B2
Young sea dragon Dragon B3
Juvenile black dragon Dragon B1
Juvenile brass dragon Dragon B1
Juvenile brine dragon Dragon B2
Juvenile underworld dragon Dragon B3
8th Level Subtype(s) Source
Very young gold dragon Dragon B1
Very young sovereign dragon Dragon B3
Young blue dragon Dragon B1
Young bronze dragon Dragon B1
Young cloud dragon Dragon B2
Young forest dragon Dragon B3
Young red dragon Dragon B1
Young silver dragon Dragon B1
Young sky dragon Dragon B3
Young umbral dragon Dragon B2
Juvenile copper dragon Dragon B1
Juvenile green dragon Dragon B1
Juvenile magma dragon Dragon B2
Juvenile sea dragon Dragon B3
Young adult black dragon Dragon B1
Young adult brass dragon Dragon B1
Young adult brine dragon Dragon B2
Young adult underworld dragon Dragon B3
Adult crystal dragon Dragon B2
Adult white dragon Dragon B1
9th Level Subtype(s) Source
Young gold dragon Dragon B1
Young sovereign dragon Dragon B3
Juvenile blue dragon Dragon B1
Juvenile bronze dragon Dragon B1
Juvenile cloud dragon Dragon B2
Juvenile forest dragon Dragon B3
Juvenile red dragon Dragon B1
Juvenile silver dragon Dragon B1
Juvenile sky dragon Dragon B3
Young adult copper dragon Dragon B1
Young adult green dragon Dragon B1
Young adult magma dragon Dragon B2
Young adult sea dragon Dragon B3
Adult black dragon Dragon B1
Adult brass dragon Dragon B1
Adult brine dragon Dragon B2
Adult underworld dragon Dragon B3
Mature adult crystal dragon Dragon B2
Mature adult white dragon Dragon B1
Bond Abilities: Starting at 2nd level, a wyrmkin shaman gains one of the following abilities according to her dragon patron’s terrain. These abilities are permanent, and are not dependant on whether the dragon mask is worn.
Aquatic Adaptation (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the water terrain gains an insight bonus on Initiative checks and Knowledge (geography), Perception, Stealth, and Swim checks equal to 1/2 her wyrmkin shaman level in aquatic terrain, and she cannot be tracked such environments.
Icewalking (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the cold terrain suffers no penalty to speed or on Acrobatics, Climb, or Stealth checks in snowy or icy terrain or weather conditions and can walk across snow crusts or thin ice without breaking through.
Marshwight (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the swap terrain gains a bonus on Initiative checks and Knowledge (geography), Perception, Stealth, Swim, and Stealth checks equal to 1/2 her druid level in swamp terrain, and she cannot be tracked in such an environment.
Mountaineer (Ex): The wyrmkin shamans of the mountain terrain gains a bonus on Initiative checks and Climb, Knowledge(geography), Perception, Stealth, and Survival checks equal to half her druid level in mountainous terrain, and she cannot be tracked in such an environment.
Plains Traveler (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the plains terrain gains a bonus on Initiative checks and Knowledge (geography), Perception, Stealth, and Survival checks equal to 1/2 her wyrmkin shaman level in plains terrain, and she cannot be tracked in such an environment.
Sandwalker (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the desert terrain suffers no penalty to speed or on Acrobatics or Stealth checks when moving through sandy or desert terrain.
Tree Leaper (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman can move easily from tree to tree so long as their branches are within reach. When the distance between trees exceeds twice the wyrmkin shaman’s reach, however, she must make a leap of faith. When climbing or using the Acrobatics skill, the wyrmkin shaman can make an Acrobatics check to leap to another location. If she can move at least 20 feet before leaping (without doubling back), set the DC as though she had a 20-foot running start (don’t double the DC). If the wyrmkin shaman fails her Acrobatics check by 5 or more, she falls as normal. If the wyrmkin shaman fails by less than 5, she can attempt a DC 15 Reflex save to grab a ledge, branch, or wall 5 feet below her target location, so long as some protrusion exists there. A wyrmkin shaman that succeeds on any Acrobatics check (not just a tree leap) must immediately attempt a Acrobatics or Climb check, as appropriate, to land in a climbing or balancing position. The DC for this check is +5 higher than normal. A failure gives the same results as a failure on the Acrobatics check.
Tunnelrunner (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the underground terrain can move through areas of rubble or narrow passages that require squeezing at her normal movement rate and without penalty.
Woodland Stride (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the forest terrain may move through any sort of undergrowth (such as natural thorns, briars, overgrown areas, and similar terrain) at her normal speed and without taking damage or suffering any other impairment. Thorns, briars, and overgrown areas that have been magically manipulated to impede motion, however, still affect her.
At 4th level, she gains one of the following bond abilities according to her dragon patron’s terrain.
Arctic Endurance (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the cold terrain ignores the effects of a cold climate as if using endure elements. She is also immune to being dazzled.
Desert Endurance (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the desert terrain ignores the effects of a hot climate as if using endure elements. She also has a reduced need to eat and drink, as if wearing a ring of sustenance (though normal sleep is still required).
Forest Endurance (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the forest terrain gains a +4 bonus on saving throws against the spell-like and supernatural abilities of fey. This bonus also applies to spells and effects that target plants, such as blight, entangle, spike growth, and warp wood.
Nature’s Oceans (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the water terrain gains a swim speed equal to half her land speed. In addition, the wyrmkin shaman of the water terrain gains a +4 bonus on saving throws against spells of the water type or the exceptional or supernatural abilities of creatures with the aquatic or water subtype.
Savanna Ambush (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the plains terrain gains concealment whenever she is prone in natural surroundings, and can make Stealth checks at no penalty when prone and not moving or at –5 when crawling. A wyrmkin shaman of the plains terrain can stand up from prone as an immediate action during a surprise round.
Spire Walker (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the mountain terrain does not lose her Dexterity bonus when climbing. A wyrmkin shaman of the mountain terrain is immune to altitude sickness and ignores the effects of a cold climate as if under the effects of endure elements. She also suffers no penalty to speed or on Acrobatics or Stealth checks when walking across steep slopes, rubble, or scree.
Subterranean Endurance (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the underground terrain gains a +2 bonus on saves against extraordinary, supernatural, and spell-like abilities of oozes and aberrations. In addition, the wyrmkin shaman cannot be detected with tremorsense.
Swamp Rat (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the swap terrain suffers no penalty to speed or on Acrobatics or Stealth checks in bogs and undergrowth. In addition, the wyrmkin shaman of the swap terrain gains a +4 bonus on saves against disease and the exceptional, supernatural, and spell-like abilities of monstrous humanoids. A wyrmking druid of the swamp terrain also gains DR/— equal to half her wyrmkin shaman level against attacks by swarms. If this damage resistance prevents damage, the druid is unaffected by distraction or other special attacks of the swarm.
Torrid Endurance (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the jungle terrain ignores the effects of a hot climate as if under the effects of endure elements. She also gains a +4 bonus on saves against disease and the exceptional abilities of animals and magical beasts.
At 8th level, a wyrmkin shaman gains the one of following bond abilities according to her dragon patron’s terrain.
Camouflage (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the forest terrain can use the Stealth skill to hide in forest terrains, even if the terrain doesn't grant cover or concealment.
Canny Charger (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the plains terrain can charge through allies’ squares without difficulty (whether mounted or afoot) and can turn up to 90 degrees once during a charge, provided the last 10 feet toward the target are in a straight line. She also gains a +4 dodge bonus to AC against enemy charge attacks and a +4 bonus to damage with a readied action against a charging foe.
Mountain Stance (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the mountain terrain gains immunity to petrification and receives a +4 bonus on saving throws or to CMD to resist any attempt to push, pull, bull rush, or drag her, or to resist any other effect that would physically move her from her position (e.g., repel wood, reverse gravity, or being blown away by high winds). This does not protect her against being tripped, grappled, or overrun.
Photosynthesis (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the jungle terrain feeds upon nature’s raw essence. Her need to eat and sleep is reduced as if wearing a ring of sustenance, and she gains a +4 racial bonus on saving throws made against poison and sleep effects.
Seaborn (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the water terrain gains the aquatic subtype, the amphibious trait, and a swim speed equal to her land speed. She also can endure cold climate effects as if using endure elements.
Shaded Vision (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the desert terrain becomes immune to blinding and dazzling effects and gains a +2 bonus on saving throws against gaze attacks and illusions of the figment and pattern subschools.
Snowcaster (Su): The wyrmkin shaman of the cold terrain can see normally in ice storm, sleet storm, or similar natural snowstorms. In addition, she can prepare any druid spell with the fire subtype as a cold spell, with an identical effect but inflicting cold damage instead of fire damage.
Tremorsense (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the underground terrain gains tremorsense 30 feet.
Venom immunity (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the swamp terrain gains immunity to all poisons.
At 14th level, a wyrmkin shaman gains one of the following bond powers according to her dragon patron’s terrain.
Deep Diver (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the water terrain gains DR/slashing or piercing equal to 1/2 her wyrmkin shaman level. This damage reduction also applies against spells and spell-like abilities that inflict damage by grappling or crushing (e.g., black tentacles, crushing hand). She never takes pressure damage from deep water.
Dunemeld (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the desert terrain can assume the form of a swirling mass of sand at will. This is equivalent to gaseous form, but the wyrmkin shaman gains a land and burrow speed of 10 feet rather than a fly speed. While in this form, the wyrmkin shaman gains a circumstance bonus on Stealth checks made in desert terrain equal to her wyrmkin shaman level.
Earth Glide (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the underground terrain gains the earth glide universal monster ability and can use it to travel at her full base speed through sand, dirt, clay, gravel, or similar materials. If protected against fire damage, the wyrmkin shaman can even burrow through lava. The wyrmkin shaman can burrow through solid stone at 1/2 her base speed.
Evasion (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the plains terrain gains evasion when wearing light or no armor and carrying a light load. This functions as the rogue ability of the same name.
Flurry Form (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the cold terrain can assume the form of a swirling column of snow equivalent to gaseous form at will. While in this form, she gains a circumstance bonus on Stealth checks made in cold terrain equal to her wyrmkin shaman level.
Forest Walker (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the forest terrain can cast tree stride at will.
Mountain Stone (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the mountain terrain can transform her body into a weathered stone outcrop and back at will. This effect functions as statue.
Slippery (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the swamp terrain gains continuous freedom of movement.
Verdant Sentinel (Ex): The wyrmkin shaman of the jungle terrain can cast tree shape at will.
This ability replaces woodland stride, resist nature’s lure, venom immunity, and a thousand faces.
Wild Shape (Su): This is exactly like the druid ability of the same name except that the wyrmkin shaman’s effective druid level for the ability is equal to her wyrmkin shaman level –2. A wyrmkin shaman cannot use wild shape to assume an elemental or plant form. When taking the form of an animal, the wyrmkin shaman can only assume the form of a crocodilian, dinosaur, lizard, or snake creature. At 6th level, a wyrmkin shaman can use wild shape once per day, plus an additional time per day at 8th, 12th, 14th, and 18th level.
In addition, at 12th level, the wyrmkin shaman can assume the form of a Medium dragon of her dragon patron’s type as if using form of the dragon I. At 14th level, she can assume the form of a Large dragon of her dragon patron’s type as if using form of the dragon II. At 16th level, she may assume the form of a Huge dragon of her dragon patron’s type as if using form of the dragon III.
Can we get a repost of the current writeup El? I'll try to take a look today, but my final final finalist exam for my degree is tomorrow morning, so I should really be studying...
I've gone and cleaned up some of the language and tweaked a few abilities to coincide with already establshed abilities and mechanics
In the Summon Natre's Ally ability, I decided to base the alternative use of that ability on the paladin's channel energy. So, by spending 2 uses of his summon nature's ally ability, he can gain the effects of the wild shape ability (the 1 hour version), but with vermin shape, and usable only up to 4/day.
HIVEMIND:
Hiveminds are strange, sometimes feared, bastions of vermin congregations. The hivemind overpowers his enemies with a brood consisting of aggressive vermin that will defend him to the death. Such broods seem to have been bred in strange ways that they exhibit monstrous features, and in some rare cases, magical affinity. The kinship of these vile creatures is strong, showing loyalty as if the hivemind were their monarch and following his will without unquestion.
Bonus Skills and Ranks: The hivemind may select three druid skills to add to her class skills in addition to the normal summoner class skills. The hivemind gains a number of ranks at each level equal to 4 + Int modifier.
Weapon and Armor Proficiency: The hivemind is proficient with all simple weapons, the scimitar, and with all natural attacks (claw, bite, and so forth). The hivemind is proficient with light armor but are prohibited from wearing metal armor; thus, they may wear only padded, leather, or hide armor, or even natural armors constructed from chitin plates or vermin exoskeleton. A hivemind may also wear wooden armor that has been altered by the ironwood spell so that it functions as though it were steel. The hiveminds is also proficient with shields (except tower shields) but must use only wooden ones. A hivemind who wears prohibited armor or uses a prohibited shield is unable to cast hivemind spells or use any of her supernatural or spell-like class abilities while doing so and for 24 hours thereafter. Like any other arcane spellcaster, a hivemind wearing medium or heavy armor, or uses a tower shield incurs a chance of arcane spell failure if the spell in question has a somatic component. A multiclass hivemind still incurs the normal arcane spell failure chance for arcane spells received from other classes.
Spellcasting: The hivemind casts divine spells drawn from the druid spell list, but adds the following spells at the indicated spell levels: 1st level–charm person, daze monster, expeditious retreat, feather fall, life conduit, poisoned egg, rejuvenate eidolon, summon minor monster, unfetter, web bolt; 2nd level–create pit, evolution surge (lesser), restore eidolon (lesser), spider climb, summon eidolon, vermin shape I, vomit swarm, web; 3rd level–black tentacles, charm monster, devolution, evolution surge, giant vermin, life conduit (improved), locate creature, rejuvenate eidolon, restore eidolon, spider climb (communal), stinking cloud, summon nature’s ally IV, thorn body, toxic gift, venomous bolt, vermin shape II; 4th level–awaken, evolution surge (greater), hold monster, purified calling, summon nature’s ally V, summoner conduit, transmogrify, wall of thorns, web cloud; 5th level–animate plants, cloudkill, creeping doom, hungry pit, ironwood, life conduit (greater), liveoak, rejuvenate eidolon (greater), summon nature’s ally VII, swarm skin; 6th level–charm monster (mass), control plants, shambler, summon nature’s ally VIII.
Vermin Brood: At 1st level, a hivemind must select one of the following creatures: ant (giant), bee (giant), beetle (giant), centipede (giant), cockroach (giant), crab (giant), crab (king), fly (giant), frog (giant), gecko (giant), leech (giant), mantis (giant), rat (dire), scorpion (giant), scorpion (greensting), slug (giant), snake (viper), solifugid (giant), spider (giant), spider (scarlet), toad (giant), wasp (giant). Once chosen, it cannot be changed. Any creature of the animal type now becomes a creature of the vermin type. When the hivemind summons his eidolon, it has the base form and associated base statistics of this creature (including any special attacks or qualities). Regardless of the creature chosen, it is always of Small size and adjusted by Table: Eidolon Base Statistics.
As the hivemind gains levels, he can summon additional eidolons to his side. At 2nd level, instead of a single eidolon, a hivemind summons two Small eidolons to his side, each less powerful than the single eidolon of a standard summoner. At 5th level, he can summon four Tiny eidolons. Regardless of the number of eidolons in the brood, each eidolon has the same base attack bonus and base saving throw bonuses, but the rest of the eidolons’ base statistics must be divided between the eidolons, including Hit Dice (minimum 1), skill points, number of feats, armor bonus, Str/Dex bonus, evolution pool (but see below), and maximum number of natural attacks. Individual eidolons in the brood must purchase evolutions separately. Once a hivemind decides on the forms and abilities of his eidolons, they cannot be changed until the summoner gains a level. Example: A 2nd-level hivemind can summon two eidolons. Each eidolon has 1 Hit Dice, BAB +2, +3 on its two good saves and +0 on its bad save. The hivemind decides to give the first eidolon 4 skill points, one feat, a +1 armor bonus, a +1 bonus to Strength, 2 points from the evolution pool, and a maximum of two attacks. The remaining 4 skill points, +1 armor bonus, +1 bonus to Dexterity, and 2 points from the evolution pool go to the second eidolon, but it gains no feats and can have only one natural attack.
At 4th level, a hivemind gains a number of evolution points for his evolution pool. Points from this pool can be spent on a wide variety of modifications and upgrades that add new abilities, attacks, and powers to his eidolons. Whenever the hivemind gains a level, the number in this pool increases and the hivemind can spend these points to change the abilities of the eidolons. These choices are not set. The hivemind can change them whenever he gains a level (and through the transmogrify spell). The number of points in a hivemind’s evolution pool is equal to his hivemind level –3 (to a maximum of 17 at 20th level). Evolutions are applied to each eidolon within the brood, giving each eidolon the same evolutions. However, Tiny eidolons lose 2 evolutions to compensate for their size bonuses. The hivemind may not select evolutions that duplicate her broodling's base abilities (such as Poison on forms already capable of poisoning, or natural attacks like claws and bite that already belong to the base form), nor can she select the Celestial Appearance, Dimension Door, Large, or Incorporeal Form evolutions.
The hivemind must dismiss all of his eidolons at one time. Likewise, all of the eidolons in a brood are banished if the hivemind is unconscious, asleep, or killed. However, each eidolon in the brood is sent back to its home plane individually when its hit points are reduced to a negative number equal to or greater than its Constitution score. This ability otherwise functions as the broodmaster summoner archetype’s eidolon brood ability and replaces the summoner’s normal eidolon ability.
Summon Nature's Ally (Sp): This is exactly like the summoner’s summon monster I ability, except that the hivemind can cast summon nature's ally I as a spell-like ability a number of times per day equal to 3 + his Wisdom modifier. He can only use this ability when his eidolon (or brood) is not summoned. He can cast this spell as a standard action and the creatures remain for 1 minute per level (instead of 1 round per level). At 3rd level, and every 2 levels thereafter, the power of this ability increases by one spell level, allowing him to summon more powerful creatures (to a maximum of summon nature's ally IX at 17th level). The hivemind also gains Spider Summoner as a bonus feat, even if he does not meet the prerequisites, and all summoned creatures gain the vermin type regardless of their creature type.
Alternatively 7th level, a hivemind can spend two uses of his summon nature’s ally ability to turn herself into a Small vermin and back again once per day. This functions like the druid’s wild shape ability, except that the options for his new forms include all creatures with the vermin type. This effect functions like the vermin shape I spell, except that it lasts for 1 hour per hivemind level, or until he changes back. Changing form (to vermin or back) is a standard action and doesn't provoke an attack of opportunity. The form chosen must be that of a vermin the druid is familiar with. The hivemind can use his vermin shape ability an additional time per day at 11th level and every four levels thereafter, up to a maximum of four times per day at 19th level.
As a hivemind gains in levels, this ability allows the hivemind to take on the form of larger and smaller vermin. Each form expends two daily uses of his summon nature’s ally ability, regardless of the form taken. At 9th level, a hivemind can use wild shape to change into a Medium vermin. At 11th level, a hivemind can use wild shape to change into a Tiny vermin. When taking the form of a vermin, a hivemind's wild shape now functions as vermin shape II. At 13th level, a hivemind can use wild shape to change into a Large vermin.
This ability otherwise functions as the druid’s wild shape and replaces summon monster I.
Vermin Empathy (Ex): At 1st level, a hivemind gains the durid’s wild empathy ability, but can affect the attitude of creatures of the animal and vermin type, including swarms. This ability replaces life link.
Bond Senses (Su): This is exactly like the summoner ability of the same name, except that the hivemind can only share the senses of one eidolon in his vermin brood at a time.
Resist Vermin's Malice (Ex): Starting at 4th level, a hivemind gains a +4 bonus on saving throws against the spell-like and supernatural abilities of vermin and swarms, including poison and disease effects. This ability replaces shield ally.
Swarm Master (Sp): At 6th level, as a standard action, a hivemind can cause one of his vermin brood eidolons to become a swarm of his choosing. This effect functions as swarm skin, except that it transforms the chosen eidolon into a swarm instead of the hivemind. The hivemind can command this swarm as if it were one of her eidolons. He can use this ability once per day at 6th level, plus one additional time per day every four levels thereafter. This ability replaces master's call.
Toxin Immunity (Ex): At 8th level, a hivemind gains immunity to all types of poison, as well as the disease effects of vermin and swarms. This ability replaces transposition
Create Hive (Sp): At 12th level, a hivemaster can create a hive that provides him with cover. This functions as the web shelter spell, except the hive has a hardness of 6, and 5 hit points for every 5-foot square of web surface area. Each eidolon in his vermin brood grants the hivemind a +2 shield bonus to AC if they are Small or a +1 shield bonus to AC if they are Tiny. This ability replaces greater shield ally.
Brood Bond (Su): At 14th level, a hiveminds life becomes linked to her brood. This functions as the summoner's life bond ability, except the hivemind can only transfer damage to one eidolon in the vermin brood at a time. If that eidolon takes enough damage to kill it, all excess damage remains with the hivemind, killing him instead. This ability replaces life bond.
Brood Form (Su): At 16th level, as a full-round action, a hivemind can touch a single Small eidolon (or two Tiny eidolons) from his vermin brood and take its form. This form is exactly like that of the eidolon touched, except that the hivemind is of the Medium size category instead. All effects and spells currently targeting the hivemind are suspended until she resumes his normal form. The hivemind can use this ability for a number of rounds per day equal to his class level. He can end this effect at any time as a swift action. This ability replaces merge forms.
Summon Greater Vermin (Sp): This is exactly like the summoner’s gate ability, except that the hivemind can summon a single elder worm or froghemoth.
Greater Brood Form (Su): At 20th level, whenever the hivemind uses his brood form ability, he no longer needs to occupy one of his eidolons in order to attain his new form. Alternatively, he may choose to sacrifice a single Small eidolon (or two Tiny eidolons) from his vermin brood to instead increase his form to Large size while using his brood form. This ability replaces twin eidolon.
The following new evolutions are restricted to the hivemind multiclass archetype.
2–Point Evolutions
Disease (Ex): With this evolution, any creature that strikes a vermin brood eidolon with a touch attack, unarmed strike, or natural weapon must make a successful Fortitude save or contract a disease as the contagion spell. The save DC is equal to 10 + 1/2 the eidolon’s Hit Dice + the eidolon’s Constitution modifier. If the creature makes its save, it is immune to the effects of that eidolon’s evolution for 24 hours. The hivemind must be at least 6t level to sleect this evolution.
Ooze Appearance (Ex): A hivemind's vermin brood eidolons take on the appearance of ooze and slime creatures. Spells and effects that target creatures with the ooze subtype or have specific effects against such creatures affect the vermin brood eidolons as if they were an ooze. The eidolons gain a +2 bonus on saves against poison, sleep, paralysis, polymorph, and stunning effects.
At 7th level, this bonus on saves can be increased to +4 by spending 2 additional evolution points. Whenever a vermin brood eidolon is hit by a slashing attack, the hivemind can choose to split it into two eidolons of one size category smaller. The vermin brood eidolon cannot become smaller than Tiny.
At 12th level, the vermin brood eidolons gain immunity to poison, sleep effects, paralysis, polymorph, and stunning effects, as well as critical hits, flanking, and sneak attacks by spending 4 additional evolution points (in addition to his 7th level costs).
4–Point Evolutions
Larger Brood (Ex): A hivemind can expand the size of his vermin brood as if they had gained the Large evolution. This allows him to summon two Medium eidolons of his vermin brood, four Small eidolons, one Medium eidolon and two Small eidolons. The hivemind must be at least 8th level to select this evolution.
If 6 additional evolution points are spent, the brood instead gains the Huge evolution. This allows the hivemind to summon two Large eidolons of his vermin brood, four Medium eidolons, eight Small eidolons, one Large and two Medium eidolons, or any other combination where two eidolons are equal to one eidolon one size category larger.
Alright, everyone can look over that as I start working on the Blackthorn. I relly see the Blackthorn as a sneaky rogue of the forests (or what ever terrain he's in). As such, I think the capacity to choose favored terrain or the camouflagerogue talents will play a key role. Plus sneak attack. Then incorporate in woodland stride, trackless step, and resist nature's lure, possibly a ranger's version of the nature bond (animal companion only), plus 1/2 casting. Sort of a ranger-y/druid-y rogue.
1) Use the terrrain, can't swing a 2-handed weapon in a narrow passage, of which there are many.
2) Combine above with kobolds/goblins wielding two weapons, and create a mini boss from said race(s) that is a warren champion (Small) and able to fight in narrow passages. Deck him/her out with toys like a haste potion, appropriate feats, bull's strength potion, etc.
3) Mass opponents. Use the narrow passages again, and have a warren of kobolds/goblins attack them from above with rocks, weapons, nets, etc.
4) It's the underdark. Use drow! Drow fighters, drow wizards, a high level priestess, use darkness spells, deeper darkness spells, levoitation, etc., as suggested above...as I did with a group many years back, put the FEAR of the drow and underdark in your party. Have them get captured, stripped of all their stuff (make sure they can regain them though), tortured, etc. Then, if they can't break free, have a contingency, someone who is against the captors who helps to free them and wants them to aid them in their cause against the drow.
5) Traps, pits, natural dangers...the underdark is supposed to be a scary, dangerous place, especially for surfacers and those without darkvision. Use that to your advantage. If the Fighter (or any of them) can't see, they can't do much of anything. No light in the underdark caverns = the Blinded condition, unless one ha darkvision or light spells.
6) Neolithids are always fun in the UDK. Psionic creatures are another, and as magic is often required to survive down there, spellcasters are always another great challenge.
I always viewed GMing as if I were an opponent player with limitless resources (within the level range of course). I needed to have fun too, and the bad guys can be just as decked out as the good guys when it comes to magic and equipment. Customized villains meant to challenge specific heroes isn't a bad thing. Especially if that foe isn't defeated, and is a reocurring opponent.
If you're doing a premade adventure, then this sort of thing is a bit more difficult, but you get the general idea.
Welcome Tabletop! Might want to check out our wiki if you haven't, there's over 100 MCAs to be found. You can search according to Primary class or alphebetically.
