EDIT 2: Because of how area fire works, there is literally no reason to use anything except for advanced weapons if you're specifically going for area weapon. Weapon proficiency doesn't matter at all for area fire, and advanced weapons are straight-up more powerful than simple and martial weapons.
This!
In one of my field test playthroughs I changed how Area Fire works and it felt better.
Instead of straight up class DC, Area weapons used 10 + Weapon Proficiency of the weapon + Tracking + CON.
This would fix the advanced weapon issue and make it so only a Fighter with +3 Con (and maybe an Operative with +3 Con) could compete with a Soldier when using Area weapons. The Fighter/Operative would have to sacrifice their +3 Str for +3 Con and then they'd have a DC 18 whereas the Soldier would have a DC 17. This would fix the 'Int/Charisma being good for area weapons) because AS IT IS, a Human Wizard with +4 Int can fire an area weapon as good as a soldier (not including primary target).
This makes no sense that a wizard or a bard could use area weapons the same DC as a soldier.
With my change:
Simple Area Weapons:
Soldier, Level 1, +4 Con: DC 10+1(lvl)+2(Prof)+4(Con) = DC 17
Fighter, Level 1, +3 Con: DC 10+1(lvl)+4(Prof)+3(Con) = DC 18
Kineticist, Level 1, +4 Con: DC 10+1(Lvl)+2(Prof)+4(Con) = DC 17
Wizard, Level 1, +3 Con: DC 10+1(Lvl)+2(Prof)+3(Con) = DC 16
Martial Area Weapons:
Soldier, Level 1, +4 Con: DC 10+1(lvl)+2(Prof)+4(Con) = DC 17
Fighter, Level 1, +3 Con: DC 10+1(lvl)+4(Prof)+3(Con) = DC 18
Kineticist, Level 1, +4 Con: DC 10+4(Con) = DC 14
Wizard, Level 1, +3 Con: DC 10+3(Con) = DC 13
Advanced Area Weapons:
Soldier, Level 1, +4 Con: DC 10+4(Con) = DC 14
Fighter, Level 1, +3 Con: DC 10+1(lvl)+2(Prof)+3(Con) = DC 16
Kineticist, Level 1, +4 Con: DC 10+4(Con) = DC 14
Wizard, Level 1, +3 Con: DC 10+3(Con) = DC 13
Honestly, give Soldiers either Expert in Simple/Martial Area weapons, or at least trained in Advanced Area weapons.. let them be the area weapons guy.
We played a one-shot using Weapon Proficiency + Con, felt good. Had numerous players with area weapons (custom-built ones using the examples as guides), and they had an absolute blast, especially when they could get a 2-3 enemies in the area of effect.
One was the Soldier and they really enjoyed everything. Then I gave the alchemist a custom-built flamethrower and they loved it. Using Con as the reflex save, it helped make Con more useful - the alchemist was using 18 int, 16 con which you don't normally see.
At level 1, a DC of 16-17 was manageable for the enemies. Obviously low-reflex ones got wrecked, but the more nimble ones were able to avoid it unless they rolled low.
I'm building a level 5 one-shot with some different perimeters to feel slightly higher level play, also different kinds of area weapons.
Yeah I think you're right regarding fighter-level proficiency.
But I do like the Con mod + weapon proficiency so far.
When it comes to the Stellar Cannon, non-martial-trained characters will have a harder time using it properly, since it is now based on weapon proficiency.
That does mean fighters will have a leg up on the DC due to their high proficiency, but also they don't have full Con like the Soldier does.
And of course, they're missing out on key abilities like Primary Target.
Area attacks made from area weapons/automatic fire would use the weapon proficiency of the user + Con modifier (instead of dex/str) + tracking of the weapon. This would represent the wielder using their toughness to stabilize the heavy weapon or heavy recoil of these weapons.
The Soldier gets expert and fighter-level progression on area weapons, including automatic fire.
In the end, this would make a fighter (Who's con will be between +3 and +5 at best) have a DC 46 to his area attacks (+36 modifier)
A Soldier would have a DC 47 (+37 modifier), or the equivalent to a fighter's single-target, but only when using area weapons, but a +35 when using other weapons (like a normal martial).
This would mimic the Gunslinger's mastery of guns/crossbows, but instead with area damage. It would also mean the Soldier is hands down the best at using area weapons, because their key modifier (Con) is also their attack with them.
There is only one additional alien faction, else I'd agree - the Reptoids are allied with the Grays and simply work as the ones infiltrating the town. Whereas Book 4 has Mi-go contending with the Dominion, not to mention rogue aliens, this one has just one faction - one that happens to also oppose the Mi-Go and Dominion.
The problem with replacing the Mi-go with Reptoids in book 4 is that Reptoids are all about infiltrating society; that wouldn't be possible in the Scar of the Spider. Vise-versa would have it difficult to have the Mi-go allied with the Grays (and others). If the Grays and all of the aliens are outright replaced by Mi-go, then it makes the mi-go too repetative, having them be in two adventures. One is enough, and with my plan you can face a whole host of interesting and bizarre aliens working together for the worse of humankind.
While yes, there are other technologically oriented towns out there (Torch, for example, which I did look at), that could work for "We want the tech beneath your town, I feel that Iadenveigh is PERFECT due to its isolated, secular nature. With outside contact relatively rare, the Grays can have much more freedom with what they have in store for the town.
The goals of the Grays/Reptoids are as follows: A) Abduct specimens for biological research; B) Replace important individuals within the town to gain power over it, and to ensure that (A) can be done with more impunity; C) Learn and understand the humans better so as to be better at (B); and D) Gain eventual control of the town through subtle manipulations and use its resources for other ends. The Grays know there is a tech ruin beneath the town and want access to it as well - but they don't want to be the ones to brave the dangers within it. The players fit perfectly into their hands with this.
I've made some changes to the adventure since I made the original post. Redfang is no longer a Reptoid in disguise, and is in fact one of the few leaders who isn't one; he acts as an anchor to the town for the players, helping them want to help the town. He assists in delving into the Aurora as well.
Later, after faux-Ivek and the other main Reptoid infiltrators try to ambush the players as they are preparing to leave the Aurora, Redfang rallies the town. After one last attempt to regain control of the town (by trying to abducting Redfang and the players at night via a special-ops team of Gray Psychics, all Psi-Tech Disciplined), thats when they attack the town.
The main goal of the adventure is to show that 1) Aliens are seemingly drawn to Numeria due to its technology, 2) They pose a threat just as much as Unity does, though not as severe as one, and 3) To better include Iadenveigh in the story, as it barely sees any action in Book 3 normally.
I've heard about that, but I'm not gonna use it. I'm building this one specifically for IG book 3. One of my players who was in an IG until it fell apart early on said that his old GM said he might've used it, though.
I intended to use the being in space as a way to terrify them; they're trapped aboard an alien vessel with no way to control it, thousands (Tens of thousands, technically, if you use Earth as an example) of miles above Golarion. The nearest living creatures all want to kill them/experiment on them and have control of the ship, not to mention are utterly alien in all possible ways.
I've already told my players that my modified book 3 will feature a short hop into space, and they're really excited. A minor spoiler to be sure, but it was used as a way to get them excited, and eventually as a way to terrify their characters :D
So, as there have been a few mentions that The Choking Tower doesn't quite fit in with the rest of the campaign (Not that its a bad adventure by any means!), I'm taking the effort to completely rework Book 3 into something that not only features Iadenveigh more directly, as well as tying the adventure directly into Book 4, and the entire campaign to a lesser extent.
The following outline is spoilered partially to protect my players from accidentally stumbling upon it in case they are looking at my posts, and partially to keep the post tidy and organized.
Adventure Outline:
Following clues gained from Scrapwall, the players head towards the secular town of Iadenveigh to seek out the Android Oracle known as Cassandalee. However, as they arrive, they find that the town is having problems of its own that delay the player's search for Cassandalee.
Between mutilated livestock and pets, sightings of strange lights in the night sky and half-remembered nightmares of close encounters of the third kind, the entire town of Iadenveigh is panicking as they are unable to find the source of these strange phenomenon. As the players arrive seeking information of their own, they are quickly hired on by a man named Redfang to investigate the disturbances in exchange for whatever help the town can offer in searching for this 'Cassandalee'. The players are joined by a conspiracy theorist named Lorentian Kairn, who arrived one day ahead of the players and is also investigating the disturbances. In reality, this man is a Technic League Spy who not only is spying on the town, but is also genuinely interested in the ongoing disturbances.
The players investigate numerous examples of livestock mutilation, crop circles, and interrogate an eccentric local who claims to have been touched by "Those from Beyond", only to find that their trail grows cold. It isn't until later that a small mechanical bird is shot down by one of the hunters that the trail picks back up and leads towards a group of Varisians camped within the town; confronting the troupe reveals evidence that they were the ones causing the disturbances and are thusly arrested.
In thanks for their part for finding out who was causing these disturbances, the players are told about a hidden spaceship beneath the town. (Cue Part 2: Into the Aurora) At the end of the Aurora, their trail of Cassandalee goes cold. (There is no Invisible Stalker at the end of the dungeon, and no clue leading to the Choking Tower). However, as they try to leave the Aurora, they are confronted by Redfang and a number of townsfolk, who open fire on them claiming that “They have seen too much”. After the battle is over, the townsfolk that attacked them are shown to be reptilian humanoids in disguise - creatures that Lorentian dubs “Reptoids”. He claims to have been right about these aliens all along, and that the players can trust no one in the town before they can figure out who are real and who are Reptoids in disguise.
However, before they can truly figure out who is who, the next day they are charged for the murder of Redfang and numerous other citizens by Ivek Gunnette, who tells them to stand trial. If they try to prove themselves innocent, they have the chance to oust Ivek (And numerous other councilmembers) as being Reptoids in disguise in front of the entire town. However, now that their subtle efforts are blown, the aliens launch an assault against the town in order to subdue it. After defending the town from robots and alien creatures, they discover a trail that leads them to a spaceship landed a few miles outside of town. Boarding it and taking out its crew of small, gray aliens, they are rewarded by becoming stuck on the ship as it lifts off and heads into orbit to dock with its mothership.
Hilarity ensues and the players get the chance to explore and wreck things on the mothership, crewed by alien Grays, Reptoids, and other aliens, before confronting the cybernetically enhanced gray that serves as the captain. While exploring the ship, they discover information about another alien presence in Numeria (Dubbed “The Enemy” by the Grays) in a region known as the Scar of the Spider; information on these aliens is that they have discovered some sort of important artificial intelligence and that liberating this technology is next on the Gray’s list of actions. In truth, this AI is Cassandalee - exactly who the players were looking for. However, by confronting the captain and slaying him, the players are unable to control the ship *The captain was psychically linked to the navigational computer) and it finds itself performing an emergency crash landing in Numeria. As it so happens, it lands relatively near the Scar of the Spider, allowing the survivors to continue their journey, possibly after salvaging tech from the crashed ship.
What do you guys think? I’m still working on the crunch and the minute details, but I feel that Book 3 being about aliens fits right in with Book 4’s theme, allowing the middle section of the Iron Gods’ trilogy to be all about aliens.
Plus the players get to go to space, if only for a short time. Miiiight see if I can include a space walk somewhere in there.
As far as the Choking Tower goes, I feel it would be better served as a stand-alone adventure, since it doesn’t quite mesh well with the rest of the campaign. Furkas Xoud is an awesome foe and the tower itself is a ton of fun, though.
Once finished, I fully intend to post links and maps so others can enjoy this adventure as well. Inspiration for the adventure is from X-files, general alien conspiracy theories, and of course, XCom.
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Alien Races Involved:
Grays: The Grays are the leaders of this cabal of aliens; it is their ship they use, they perform most of the experiments on specimens and they’re the ones who often go and collect specimens for examination and experimentation. They use a number of high-tech weaponry and technology, many of which differ from the Androffan technology found in Numeria in ways that allow it to interact with the psychic abilities of the Grays. They are lead by a cybernetically modified Gray known as a “Zeta” that is psychically connected to the ship itself and controls it; without the Zeta’s assistance, the ship cannot be controlled except by a more powerful ship. As a result, killing the Zeta forces the ship to either go on lockdown mode, making it effectively inert although most of the processes on the ship continue to function (life support, experimental facilities, etc), or perform an emergency landing (the latter happens in this case)
Brain Moles: Although not necessarily ‘alien’ per-say, Brain Moles are used by the Grays to collect psychic energy that the Grays can then extract and store. The Brain Moles are lead by a Brain Mole Monarch that has created an alliance with the Grays, providing them with psychic energy in return for not only safety, but plentiful food sources.
Emotion Ooze: A number of Emotion Oozes are held captive in the Gray’s ship in order to allow the Grays to study the effects of various psychic emotions on humans. The Grays themselves are curiously immune to the effects of the Emotion Oozes, but nevertheless have taken precaution with containing the oozes; each ooze is kept in a secure vat that can psychically block the emotion aura of the oozes, allow a limited amount of it to leak out, or to allow its aura to penetrate it fully, at the command of the Grays.
Griefgall: A small number of Griefgalls have aligned themselves with the Grays and help the aliens study emotions and psychic emanations; One such Griefgall infests a Lashunta Psychic that leads the study of the Emotion Oozes.
Reptoids: A number of Reptoids are amongst the aliens, although most of them are now amongst Iadenveigh’s population, having infiltrated and replaced numerous citizens. Unlike the Grays, who prefer to interact with the humans as little as possible or at least do so from a hidden standpoint, the Reptoids are focused on infiltration and learning more about the humans through direct interaction, as well as focused on locating suitable targets for experimentation, not to mention studying the curious fertility of the town. Although they keep what little technology they bring to the town a secret, they maintain constant contact with their allies in the ship above the village.
Thorgothrel: A single Thorgothrel accompanies the Grays, acting as biological scientist to assist in studying the humans. The Thorgothrel doesn’t much like working with the Grays or Reptoids, but nevertheless has been convinced to cooperate provided it can genetically regress a few specimens here and there, to which the Grays agreed.
Robots: A number of robots assist the Grays onboard the ship and elsewhere. These range from guardians, to medical drones, to scouts, to psychic-amplifying support robots. They differ from Androffan Robots in that they often project a psychic force-field and can store and even use psychic energy. One such type of robot is the “Robotic Mage”, a variant Clockwork Mage with the Robotic Subtype that uses psychic magic.
Other: A number of alien plants and other creatures are kept as specimens for study and research, including at least one Rhu-Chalik and a few Flumphs. Others include numerous Lashunta and Shobhad kept in stasis as trophies of sorts. Some of these captive aliens can be rescued as allies, while others might be antagonistic, even to their rescuers. One captive in particular, while not alien, is a Tyrannosaurus Rex that was taken from the Mwangi and kept in stasis.
Just a quick example of one of the robots that I'll be including in my adventure that I mentioned above..
Robotic Mage:
Robotic Psychic Mage
------------------------
CR 9 - 6400 xp
Variant Clockwork Mage
N Medium Construct (Robot)
Init +9; Senses: Darkvision 60ft, Low-light Vision, Superior Optics; Perception +17
-------
AC 23 (Touch 15, FF 18)(+5 Dex, +8 Natural)
Hp: 117 (15d10+20[Construct]+15[Toughness]), Force Field (45 hp, Fast Healing 9)
Fort +5, Ref +12, Will +7;
Defensive: Hardness 10; Immune: Construct Traits
Weaknesses: Vulnerable to Critical Hits, Vulnerable to Electricity
-------
Speed: 30 ft
Melee: 4 Slams +18 (1d4+3/x2)
Ranged: Integrated Plasma Pistol +20 Touch (1d8 Fire/Electricity/x2/50 ft) or Semi-Automatic Fire +18/+18 Touch (1d8 Fire/Electricity/x2/50 ft) or Rapid Fire Semi-Automatic +14/+14/+14 (1d8 Fire/Electricity/x2/50 ft)
SA: Wand Magic, Robotic Caster
Psychic Magic (CL 9th, Concentration +9)
15 PE: Detect Thoughts (1 PE, DC 11 Will), Magic Missile (1 PE), Anticipate Thoughts (2 PE, DC 13 Will), Mind Thrust II (2 PE, DC 13 Will), Irradiate (3 PE, DC 14 Fort)
-------
Str 16, Dex 21, Con --, Int 10, Wis 14, Cha 1
BAB +15, CMB +18, CMD 33
Feats: Point Blank Shot(1st), Rapid Fire(3rd), Deadly Aim(5th), Improved Initiative(7th), Toughness(9th), Combat Casting(11th), Precise Shot(13th), Improved Precise Shot(15th)
Skills(30)(30[Base]): Perception[15] +17, Knowledge(Engineering)[5] +5, Knowledge(Arcana)[5] +5, Knowledge(Local)[5] +5
Languages: Aklo (Can’t Speak); Telepathy 100ft
SQ: Superior Optics
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Robotic Caster (Su): Thanks to highly advanced pseudo-organic components, Robotic Psychic Mages cast all of their spells with the Logical Spell and Intuitive Spell metamagic feats. This does not increase the PE consumed and does not increase the casting time. In addition, their spells are cast in the same way wands are; as a result, they do not provoke attacks of opportunity when cast.
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The Plasma Pistol is one of a series of weapons I'm working on that are alternate from the Adroffan-created weapons in the tech guide. Although basically the same, they instead lob bolts of plasma that deal half fire and half electricity damage. Variants include the Plasma Pistol, Plasma Rifle, and Plasma Cannon. Their damage die is the same as the laser/arc/zero variants, and since all tech items are minor artifacts in my games (thus they don't have a gold piece value), I haven't figured out their value. I figure its similar to their laser alternatives.
I'm changing up the entirety of the Choking Tower and effectively removing it, myself.
Instead, the adventure will be set entirely in Iadinveigh and will deal with a string of paranormal activity that is plaguing the town and freaking out the citizens. The players, having arrived there from their clues from Book 2, will end up assisting the town in uncovering the cause of the activity, which also happens to help lead them to the Valley of the Brain Collectors and gain the trust of the village.
In the off chance my players are looking at my posts:
The string of paranormal activity is caused by an alien ship crewed by Grays that have come to experiment on humans, having been drawn to this paricular region due to the presence of Androffan tech. The ship plaguing Iadenveigh is one of many around Numeria, though the players only end up interacting this one.
The players end up investigating crop circles, mutilated cattle, and abducted persons. They are assisted by another investigator who recently arrived (who is also a Technic League Spy) who is investigating the activity for her own selfish reasons. With her aid, they are able to locate the cause of the activity and board the ship; a dungeon crawl amid the (now floating) Gray spaceship ensues, culminating in them deactivating the ship by killing its psychic pilot, who is the only one who can pilot it (due to a series of unsalvagable, psychically-attuned cybernetic implants).
I'm still working on how EXACTLY it ties in with book 4, but I'm aiming to have it be something like information found on the ship leads them to believe that they weren't the first to discover Casanadlee's body - they they are forced to follow clues leading to book 4. The Grays are wary of the Nethuggalu and aren't allies of them.
On one hand, that still feels fairly 'fillerish' just like the Choking Tower, so I'm trying to figure out how to better fit it in better. Worst-case scenario is that the ship, after losing its pilot, auto-pilots to the Valley and crashes there; that way I'm effectively 'forcing' the players to go the right direction, but I'm not sure.
I had a pre-campaign roleplaying session at the Tooth and Nail the afternoon after the Night of Ashes; I used this session to recruit my six players here on the boards. Ended up having one of the players I chose organize a post-prelude, pre-campaign meeting at her abode. Great way for all of the players to meet each other, and we explained that although she invited numberous other characters, the only ones who decided to attend were the ones I picked for the campaign.
I also later had Rexus state that he spied on the meeting, which is why he chose to contact them for the protest. Worked out perfectly.
I do all my campaigns online - Roll20 is a beautiful, beautiful thing.
If I ever get the chance to do a table-top game again, I'm gonna see if I can hook up a laptop (a player's one) to a TV to get roll20 displayed - had a player hook his up once before and it worked out real well. Need to do that more often..
This blog has excellent points for building encounters to fit 6 players or to modify existing encounters to fit more than 4 players.
I'm running HR with 6 players myself, and until level 2 or so I'm leaving it as-is since none of them are particularly amazing in combat this early on (all of them are 3/4s BAB except one, who's 1/2 - but they're all casters).
I've added a ton of fun stuff later on though - if yer interested on what changes I've made for 6 players let me know and I'll message you them.
As far as loot goes, I'm keeping everything roughly the same - mainly because I'm using the Automatic Bonus PRogression rules in this campaign and thus require less loot than before. With 6 players and me removing the +1 stuff, it evens out.
There are rules for it in each of the books explaining what to do if you don't want to use 'em, so its most certainly possible. Takes so much fun out of the campaign though in my personal opinion - but to each group their own.
I definitely agree that they could and even should bet ailored to each individual group and have some sort of message to go along with 'em. This helps show the players that the city is truly thankful for what they've been doing so far and makes it so that they wan to liberate it even more.
As for my own changes, I'm going with a bit of a darker path. In my own campaign, silvered weapons (And silver-alchemical goods like weapon blanches) are far less common despite one of the city's exports being silver - my figure being is that Thrune has outlawed such items (or more specifically in my campaign, all of Cheliax in general has outlawed such items in the wake of Martial Law). Such items become black-market commodities and thus are available - for a price.
In addition, those who blatantly summon good-outsiders in public might be arrested on charges of working with the 'enemy'. One of my players is a Hidden Priest Cleric of Milani with a summoning focus so this'll be interesting ;)
And lastly I've been modifying the campaign to work with the Automatic Bonus Progression rules from Pathfinder Unchained - so far I'm greatly enjoying these rules and my players are looking forward to them as well. A few NPCs got minor buffs while others stayed roughly the same.
My players better not try and look at this!:
I also turned Azvernathi Raul into a Warpriest - he's decidely more dangerous now. Here are his stats if anyone wants them. Do remember he has +1 to all resistances due to the ABP rules - feel free to give him a cloak of resistance in your own game if you aren't using those rules, or give him back his +1 mace (though make it light, as it works better with him!)
Theres also another named NPC down below who leads the Redactors - an Unchained Monk 1/Cleric of Asmodeus 3 named Shiyanah Varth. Since I have six players, I added her and quite a few more redactors to even up the odds - she also is in control of numerous zombies upstairs and has one down below guarding her bedchambers.
Lots of other changes but in case my players sneak a peek, I don't want to spoil it. Its spoilered in case they're looking at my posts for whatever reason (dang stalkers).
So.. it turns out that um.. bumrushing the Holding House at level 4 is a very bad idea. How bad of an idea? A very very bad one. Luckily these are all playtest PCs, and no actual players' characters were hurt in the making of this bloodbath.
Name: Margo, Kella, Pellius
Race: Human (Chelaxian) x3
Class: Unchained Monk 4, Warpriest of Milani 4, Arcane Duelist Bard 4
Alignment: LG, CG, CG
Adventure: Turn of the Torrent
Location: Holding House
Cause of Death: Ghenemahl.. and co.
The Gory Details:
So, my testpcs are not the most subtle of group. With the last group (Milani rest their souls) having been butchered by Nox, the lone surviving member of the original group (Rutilus the Sorcerer) recruited a group who were much more militant. Nox wasn't a problem for this second group.
As it so happens, a few weeks later after having made contact with Octavio, the group learned that they needed to infiltrate the Holding House and rescue the four armigers held there. Against Rexus's, Lara's, and Octavio's recommendations, the group decided on a daring 'bash in the door' rescue (in broad daylight). This was after a failed attempt at rescuing an armiger from doghousing (though the entire group got away alive then). Nevertheless, the group took a few days to gather consumables and right before they kicked down the Holding House's front door, hit themselves with as many buffs as they could muster.
They were prepared.
Mostly. Except against the Kyton.
With three guards in their jimmies, spending the first minute tossing mail over their private bits, the group started off to a great start, taking out the first two guards within seconds and following up by dropping Sabo down a pit after she beat up the monk. Rutilus, for his part, got a little pit-and-grease-happy, slowing combat to a crawl while the group picked away at the guards. However, when Ghenemahl joined the fight, things took a turn to the worst. She opened combat with an Order's Wrath that did little damage (none to the monk), follwed up with slicing the warpriest into near-oblivion. When a pit was dropped beneath her, she jumped to safety on the far side of the pit - giving her time to heal up almost to entirety (the Warpriest had a Holy Strike Blessing on her greatsword and was ripping through the Kyton's defenses)
A few rounds later, after Sabo's pit disappated, she was taken out by both the warpriest and monk (who was also rocking a holy strike blessing from the warpriest). By then, all of the pits began to disappate and battle resumed in full, with Ghenemahl teaming up with a guard to knock out the monk, who stabilized shortly after. Another guard, fighting the bard in the hallway, got a lucky crit and killed the bard on the spot. Not one round later Ghenemahl, pursuing the now-fleeing warpriest (who was at 5 hit points), crit with her lancet and also killed the warpriest on the spot.
Rutilus, having been in the back, ran until he couldn't run any longer. The entire fight lasted just under two minutes.
Margo the Monk, although he survived the battle, did not survive the tender lovings of Ghenemahl later that night. Sabo survived thanks to timely medical aid from a guard. Four guards died (+4 notoreity) while a 5th nearly died. A total of 14 notoriety was gained (1d6+4 from the attack/slain guards, 2d6 from Ghenemahl interrogating Margo), and Rutilus will need to recruit yet another team.
tl;dr: Don't assault the Holding House, or you're gonna have a bad time.
I have yet another question, but this one has to do with the Rebellion Rules. I've got them understood for the most part, but one thing has been brought to my attention:
The Disguise skill. How does it interact with Notoriety, especially in the later books when players are assumed to be recognized from time to time?
I have a few players in my Hell's Rebels campaign that are going to be using the skill extensively (especially since three of them are well respected nobles or well-off citizens that don't want to damage their reputation or, in the case of an Aulomaxa, piss off their parents).
My best guess is to apply the notoriety score to their disguised aliases. But I'm not sure. I've never had to use the disguise sklil before >.>
Oh and can a player make a disguise check for another player? Help them apply makeup and whatnot? Kinda vague about that.
Righteo. Well I am trying to portray Hell's Rebels as dark and gritty so it might fit in quite well in this instance. It is indeed a powerful spice but oh-so delicious of one. Plus just replacing the skum/aboleth with it should be sufficient for the entire campaign, rather than sprinkled all over the place.
And yes I'm definitely excited for Strange Aeons - I'm going to want to try and get in as a player for once, but that'll probably be unlikely with my luck hah.
Would it make sense in any way shape or form to turn the Skum in the Lucky Bones into Deep Ones? Perhaps even change the ABoleth in Book 3 into an Elder Deep one? a cleric necromancer of some sort?
I mean, I know Deep Ones are highly religious, while Aboleths are not, so it wouldn't probably make much sense for them to work for an aboleth.. but I'm honestly not interested in Skum at all, and Deep Ones are just so.. so.. Lovecraftiany.
Technically the CCG have family and friends in the city too - they're normal citizens who are loyal to Thrune/disgruntled at the defiant nature of Kintargo and thus have formed a militia to support Barzillai. But they're still Kintargans through and through.
If you look at the CCG thugs, they're Lawful Neutral, not evil. Some of the Dottari in later books are the same way. Neither are unredeemable - the CCG in particular are just misguided and believe that Barzillai is here to help.
That being said, playing some of them off as conflicted is not a bad idea by any means. Many might be loyal, but once Barzillai starts forcing them to do more and more violence, theres certainly going to be a few who might turn against him. ...if they aren't caught by the inquisitors first of course! :D
Gotcha. I definitely won't disagree with you that the skyline art looks amazing. Its still a bit tough for me to register the killing fields between each set of walls, as it just looks so much like one big wall, but I'll work with it. Thanks for the input!
The only reason I'm being picky is because I like to try and get as much detail in for descriptive posts here on the boards, so I tend to over-analyze maps and art >.>
On that note, I asked this earlier but got no response from anyone - the map of the Red Jills' hideout is also confusing, namely the map for the orphanage (not the church). I'm assuming that theres a ladder leading up to a balcony of sorts on the south side of the orphanage? Is that what that is? And then theres some sort of gate or door leading from said balcony to the roof itself? Maybe I'm the only one having that problem seeing it but I'unno.
Details on Kintargo's walls appear on page 61 of Pathfinder #97. The walls are 20 feet tall and 10 feet wide, with a "trench" between them that's about 80 feet across that allows for guards on the outer wall to fall back to the inner wall, or to serve as a "killing ground" in an invasion (fill it with burning oil or monsters or whatever). They are patrolled....
I think the map is off-scale. I was able to replicate the map on Roll20 almost perfectly to scale (almost) based on the ruler down near the bottom, and the gray area between the walls is only about 50 ft.
Plus I'll admit, I thought the two 10ft walls were crenelations for the wall itself, which was the entire gray portion. I didn't read the bit about the trench originally, but at first glance they just look like really big walls.. or really out of scale ones.
Also in that side-view of Kintargo (which looks awesome by the way), they don't look twenty feet high o.O. That being said, maybe the other bulidings are just MASSIVE in that picture in comparison. That Temple to Asmodeus certainly is impressive..
*Edit* I still think that they look like normal (very thick) walls. I cannot in any way see them as anything else. And they look almost exactly like the walls of other cities, say Highhelm. Which -are- thick walls.
In addition, look at the gates - theres no road leading through the 'killing field'. It leads under it. I'm 100% positive that either the map-maker didn't draw the map according to the description in the book or the description in the book didn't bother checking out the map. Probably 1).
Also why would they need an additional set of killing fields for the noble quarter? And that pointy bit south-west of the Alabaster Academy? o.O
In my playtest I personally did it as one week per mission (or one mission per week). In my playbypost I'm probably going to do it the same - for a tabletop game, that can essentially be one week/mission per game session unless a mission doesn't take long or your games run long.
Thats my personal opinion and there are no definite rules on it though. Its just as it so happens, there are 6 missions.. and 7 weeks for Rexus to translate the documents.. so on that 7th week, when he translates it, they can hit up the Fantasmagorium that week.
Its likely that he had a thing against his brother's turn from a tomboy to an actual boy(man), sending him to the church. That right there would have alienated him from his parents - perhaps to a degree that he never knew about their relation to a certain group. That would leave him woefully out of the loop - perfect for a player, as a result.
I personally turned away any direct members of Victocora in my recruitment - I did allow one player to be a semi-distant relative (Cousin to Rexus), so theres far less of an issue there, and since he only came to Kintargo to figure out what happened to his aunt/uncle/cousin, he wouldn't know a thing about their true affiliations.
While it doesn't say how the Victocoras became nobles or whatnot, they did own and operate the Kintargo Opera House (although they didn't build it). Because of their association with a certain group, one would assume thats also how they built their wealth - although outwardly it would've been the Opera House.
Personally - nothing against Richard Pett. He is a great writer, but he is the same guy who thought CR3 tiny flying D6 bleeding mosquito swarms was a great idea to use as random monsters against level 3 characters in Skulls and Shackles - just check the obituary thread back there for some of the consequences of Mr. Pett thinking something is a "fair encounter" ....
My players.. completely avoided those encounters in Skull and Shackles. How? By burning the field. Yep. They're that kind of group. Thats how they tend to live so long.. heh.
Pett's just a deliciously brutal designer who likes to throw a few twists and turns at players to bring them out of their comfort zone. Heck, in that very same book, I nearly had a player die to the very first skill-based encounter in it. The rogue was not prepared for climbing.
And while I do agree about the meek followers bit with the Stormtroopers of Cheliax (Love that comparison), Kintargo itself has always been kind of 'freedom loving' - as a result, the Dottari, though now under the direct control of a Thrune, were likely a bit more free-willed than standard Dottari from other cities. Why? They're Kintargan natives too, after all.
Actually, Book 3 assumes the players go into the event knowing its a trap (or suspecting it is), thus preparing for it. Glamored Armor, Hats of Disguise(Greater or not), and the like will all help with allowing even heavily armored PCs to look like they're dressed up.
Book 3 is probably the most linear of the books, but book 4 is no where near as such. Any of the targets in book 4 can be attacked in any order - except for the final target, as thats the hardest nutshell to crack and is basically the last target.
As for book 3... linear it may be, but its still got some VERY interesting encounters. Richard Pett is one of my favorite adventure Authors, ever since playing through his "The Wormwood Mutiny" Adventure at the beginning of Skull and Shackles.
That being said.. there is a lot of combat on top of the large amount of investigative bits. And for Iron will being sprinkled around the dottari.. its probably to avoid overly cheesy Charm and Domination builds. (That being said, Iron Will doesn't negate those, it just makes them a little more difficult to work with, even if this is a humanoid-heavy campaign) And think of it from a roleplaying perspective - you would NEED an iron will to survive being an agent of Thrune or even a city guard for Cheliax ;P (Although why the Dottari have such high wisdom scores is beyond me. They might as well be clerics or warpriests!)
Eh, this is a GM thread... spoilers aren't a problem. ;) I started my subscription on book 2, btw, but went back and got book 1 last month. I had already paid for the PDF, so I already knew what was coming.
There was at least one player who poked in here to say his thoughts on it too, sooo. Plus no where does it say its a GM thread, so I wanted to avoid spoiling someone.
In my own campaign I'm running Core Races + Tiefling and Tengu (both of which are common and/or visible enough) as open to anyone. Any other races, if not taken precautions to hide their unusual race, will find the Silver Ravens' notoriety increasing a little bit more than standard (+1 Notoriety each time notoriety is gained).
Got the idea from someone else on the board and I think its a fantastic way to allow other races with adding a 'tax' for using them.
As for halflings.. was already answered heh.
That being said, having a renegade halfing from another region in Cheliax might be a good hook to add additional encounters to the campaign.
When I first heard about it, I was mildly intrigued because it was set in my favorite nation, but didn't think I'd like the whole CG Rebellion thing.
Hooo-boy was I wrong. After checking out the books I must say, this is a FANTASTIC campaign. I'm prepping to DM it and have playtested the first book, and so far its just amazing.
Even though I suspect I'd have a very hard time getting into it as a player, playing as Cheliax itself is just the kind of thing I love - combined with the interesting mechanics and lots of roleplaying possibilities, this is going to be an awesome campaign to run, and I can't wait to start it.
I believe the encounter specifically states that you can choose any non-important NPC for the task - Forvian Crow works perfectly as a result. I agree that it might make more of an impact since the players were the ones who actively saved him - and now he's 'apparently' betraying them. Crow has no other use in the campaign - his team isn't even a unique team XD.
Go for it! :D
...if my players have rescued him by the time the Imp does her bit of sabotage, I might just use this myself.
Got three more deaths to round out the end of book 1! Well, one death, but two players were knocked unconscious and stabilized.. at the mercy of Nox.. so they're basically dead and I'm writing them off as such.
Name: Channady Aulorian(Again), Marcellano, Valeria
Race: Human (Chelaxian) x3
Class: Cleric (Hidden Priest) of Milani 3, Swashbuckler 3, Unchained Rogue 3
Alignment: CG, CG, CN
Adventure: In Hell's Bright Shadow
Location: Many Steps Monastery
Cause of Death: Nox, Mephry, Random Lemure (Lets name him Bob)
The Gory details:
After having a tough time with more Redactors (Seriously, Unchained Monks are tough!) but ripping through The Lout, the players had a few rounds to heal up before Nox challenged them to a fight, along with her pet Hellhound Mephry and Bob the Lemure.
The fight started off poorly for the group with Mephry charging in and lighting up the cleric and swashbuckler with his breath weapon - the swashbuckler took half while the cleric got the full brunt of it. Nox used her first round to cast Rage on Mephry, and then followed him in to begin attacking with her polearm.
The whole fight lasted a mere six rounds - Nox, in three rounds, took out the Swashbuckler first (instantly killing him with a near-max damage hit after Mephry burnt and bit him), then 1-shot both the Cleric and Rogue each (not killing them, but nearly doing so) - they both stabilized on their own. The Swashbuckler, for his part, did attempt to parry the attack - but he failed miserably and was cut down as a result.
Bob the Lemure mostly just gurgled and flapped his fat arms at people, not doing a thing except getting hit in the face with holy water and acting as a meat shield for Nox. (For a reference to how strong Nox is, she attacks at +9 using Power attack, dealing 1d10+14 damage.)
Rutilus, the Sorcerer, was completely out of spells for this fight, having used up most of his spells earlier against Yilliv (who was a PAIN IN THE ASS for this group), then again trying to sleep more redacters (performing admirably against one group, sleeping 4 of them).
Having stood back, Rutilus was able to escape - he will be rebuilding the Raven's with three new members to tackle the place again, though by then Nox will have brought in more redactors.
..I'll try round 2 of the Many Steps Monastery tomorrow. Nox is a tough bugger! She didn't even get hit once.
Slight error in Nox's statblock. It says when power attacking, she only gains +4 to attack; This isn't true, as she's using a two-handed weapon, thus should be getting +6. Nothing huge or anything, but it was enough to 1-shot my test group's rogue..
..and swashbuckler..
..and cleric..
She hits hard lets just say that :D (Plus the Hellhound softened up the cleric and swashbuckler for her)
Got my first death of my playtest.. all PCs are controlled by me so I can get a feel for the campaign before I run it with my normal group.
Name: Channady Aulorian
Race: Human (Chelaxian)
Class: Cleric (Hidden Priest) of Milani 3
Alignment: CG
Origin: Kintargo, born into the Aulorian family
Adventure: In Hell's Bright Shadow
Location: Hocum's Fantasmagorium
Cause of Death: Azvernathi Raul, Redactors
The Gory Details:
During the assault on Hocum's Fantasmagorium, the players ran face to face with a group of 4 Asmodean Redactors and their leader, Azvernathi Raul. In my playtest I had modified both a little bit; the redactors were Unchained Monks with similar (But slightly better) stats overall. Azvernathi removed Combat Casting in place of Weapon Finesse, had his +1 Heavy Mace be turned into a Masterwork Light Mace, and had gained +1 to all resistances due to my use of the Automatic Bonus Progression optional rule.
Anyhoo, during the fight, Azvernathi had already been invisible thanks to the players' loud combat against zombies; he and his redactors waited in hiding but failed to ambush the players. With the Swashbuckler rushing in, followed by the cleric, they were surrounded by three of the four redactors; the fourth attacked the rogue. Behind the 4th redactor was Azvernathi, remaining in hiding for a round as he hit himself with Copycat and then summoned a Spiritual Weapon against the swashbuckler.
The Redactors worked to flank the Swashbuckler, but also ended up getting some lucky hits on the Cleric, knocking her unconscious before all but one died themselves.
With the Sorcerer having completely failed to put anyone to sleep, he decided to administer a Potion of Cure Moderate Wounds to the downed cleric; but, after doing so, saw her get curb-stomped back down to -5 hit points by a lone surviving Redactor who refused to die - at least until the rogue broke off from fighting Avernathi (after taking a beating from him, yet resisting both Hold Person and Command) and sneak-attacked him into oblivion.
With his original target having fled, Azvernathi closed in on the group, one mace in hand, and unleashed his Burning Hands spell on the Sorcerer, downed cleric, and a dying Redactor. All three of them failed their saves and alas, both the redactor and cleric passed into the Great Beyond.
Azvernathi was killed soon after by a vengeful rogue and swashbuckler tag-team flank-crit combo.
The Cleric will soon be replaced by a more militant Warpriest of Milani.
I'm still sort of confused on how the map for the Threat of the Red Jills works, mainly due to lack of description in the text about it - and the map is all sorts of confusing.
I understand perfectly about the chapel: Roof thats 20 ft above the ground, bell tower thats 10 ft higher than that, sloped roof and the little access-ladder from a trap door in the building beneath it. My assumption is that the doors to the inside are on the west.
But the orphanage is whats confusing me. First off, the map presents the 'roof' as a room with walls and a door, yet with a rope ladder that apparently goes through the walls. My best guess is that its a flat, open roof with short walls around the edges and some sort of gate; Is that ladder along the southern wall leading up to a balcony up there? How high is the roof from the ground? Is the balcony (if thats a balcony) at the same height? The stairs that have collapsed, where are are they, or did they simply not lead up to the roof in the first place? Is the door into the gutted building on the west side, beneath the assumed-balcony?
I assume any description that was in there about it was cut out due to word-count, since the church is the main focus in this encounter, but as someone who likes a description of what he's seeing so I can write about it, its bugging me XD
What're your guys thoughts? How did any of you play it?
Yeah I could see that happening if it comes up. My own test-players are made up of a swashbuckler, hidden priest cleric of Milani, Unchained rogue, and sorcerer. The only silver weapon they had was on the cleric; though the swashbuckler had a vial of silversheen.
Imps can cast Invisibility as much as they want - its purely At Will (But only themselves).
She has an 18 CMD and a +7 CMD. Grappling her is an option, but not a sure-fire one. The groups (now) 3rd level Swashbuckler has only 17 CMD and a +4 CMB, so she's technically a better grappler than anyone in my test group.
Hm.. good point, that should've been obvious but I overlooked it. Still, using Invisibility after she's been spotted, she can hide behind a crate, dismiss her Invisibility, then use the scroll - although doing so would cause her to be spotted again, at least she'd have time to cast it from the safety of cover.
In my test run she failed her UMD check anyways, so it was a moot point hah. ...she also ended up rolling a natural 1 when trying to use her wand, so that was a bust too.
So.. my previous statement of the tooth fairies being a brutal fight was a bit premature.
Blosodriette.. now SHE'S a tricky little bugger.
So we have an Imp (who are notoriously difficult to pin down due to their invisibility, DR, and fast healing), given rogue levels, a higher AC than normal, more potent poison that can be applied to her blowgun and/or shortsword as a swift action, and the ability to use her various magic items at her disposal, not to mention the ability to summon 1d3 rat swarms.
What do we have? A strong case of a pain in the player's asses. (Excusez mon Français)
So, her tactics. With a +21 stealth check combined with Invisibility, she's neigh undetectable when she doesn't want to be, abling her to guarantee sneak attacks. But not just any sneak attacks - no, she can sneak attack with a poisoned blowgun at range (sniping, anyone?) or sneak attack with her Wand of Acid Arrow. Yes, she can sneak attack with a ranged touch attack that deals 2d4 acid damage (plus an extra 2d4 on the next round!), providing she can make a DC 20 UMD check. Such a check is not difficult with her +11 UMD bonus; she'll succeed a little over half of the time.
But wait, theres more!
While invisible, she can use UMD to summon a creature from the Summon Monster III list; there are a few good (Ahem, Evil) creatures from this list, including an Augur Kyton if you're using the Monster Summoner's Handbook. These buggers last 5 rounds and will provide her with much needed (not really) support; if she can succeed on a DC 25 UMD check.
Then you have Misdirection. Cast it on a nearby non-magical crate, and suddenly she's immune to spells such as Detect Evil, Detect Law or even Detect Magic, provided she stays within 30 ft of said object. There goes one method of detecting her while invisible, provided she can succeed on a DC 23 UMD check. *Edit* Forgot about the will save to ignore the effect; the DC is only going to be 13, so its not all that hard. But it still offers a means of protection that she can apply to herself while invisible, especially if the players start scoping the hideout with Detect spells. It lasts for 3 hours, so she can easily keep herself safe for the time it takes them to search her out, at least on one occasion (after that she can't resort to this defense again, being out of scrolls).
Next up is Touch of Idiocy. With a melee touch attack all but impossible for her to miss, she can more than easily reduce the mental facilities of any annoying spellcasters; all she has to do is succeed on (two, one for each scroll) UMD 23 checks.
Barring all that (and her ability to summon 1d3 swarms of rats from the nearby sewers, should she want to go that route), she has a +12 attack with her (poisoned!) shortsword and +6 with her (poison-loaded) stinger, each of which do fully lethal damage unlike previously mentioned toothfairies. Being surprisingly resilient in melee (2 Fast Healing, 18 AC, and DR 5/Silver or Good), she can go to town on a lone player, having snuck up on him (+1d6 damage right there) and begun stabbing him. Due to her increased HD and Constitution, her poison goes from being a DC 13 Fort to a DC 15 fort - and she can apply it twice per round (once from a swift action applying it to her short sword, and once directly from her stinger). Although it only requires one save to remove, it can get nasty real fast.
In the end I must applaud Crystal for creating such a wicked little beasty - since the players are unlikely to have See Invisibility or Glitterdust by the time she becomes a nuisance, they're going to have a horrendously difficult time with her.
My own Test PCs got lucky in the fact that I had the Swashbuckler buy a vial of Silversheen with some of his money earlier in the campaign (not realizing how UNGODLY USEFUL it was going to be), and the Cleric wielding a Mwk Silver Mace she found elsewhere. They were able to corner her as she poisoned the rogue into oblivion (She went from 16 dex to 8 Dex and nearly fell unconscious to stab wounds) and get a lucky crit from the swashbuckler and a hit from the cleric onto her. This brought her down low enough to surrender; they then banished her after making her give up her magic items (excluding the pipes).
Before he applied his silversheen, the swashbuckler couldn't hurt her (1d6+1 damage); the rogue was all but useless, and the sorcerer found out the hard way she was immune to Sleep (due to her 5 HD) and then proceeded to bombard her with magic missiles (that were all but negated due to her fast healing). The cleric, meanwhile, being slow in her bulky armor (Seriously, she's the slowest one of the bunch - the rest are flightly little shits), kept trying to keep up with the rest of them. She had herself protected and buffed with Protection from Evil and Magic Weapon, along with giving the rest of the party Bless. But being able to move at less than half the speed of Blosodriette.. she couldn't do much.
If it wasn't for a few lucky hits and me deciding to have her be a bit more bloodthirsty with melee than her tactics said she'd be, I could foresee her wittling away at them until they collapsed from poison damage.
Can anyone who has the book either PM me or spoiler-post me why the 'Devils Bells' at the Church of Asmodeus ring seemingly at random? Its apparently revealed in this book but I don't have it yet and I'm intensely curious as to whyyyy. I couuuuld just wait till I have the book but I'm prepping to run the campaign and I'm impatient, hah.
I mean, they've made so many references to it, it HAS to be something good. I hope.
