Cork's page

Thanks for the input. Ill check them both out 8)

Ive arranged (at my local gaming store) to put together a Pathfinder campaign/ adventure.

The Chronical campaign guide was out of stock (Insert official "grr" here. (Why I did not think to order from this site... I shall never know), but I ordered the older Gazateer, along with the Osirion source book (Also older). Not knowing alot of the world, Osiaria seems like a decent starting point, easy to imagine with lots of options. LeastI hope so :P

Im getting familiar with the machanics, as is my daughter.

Now, here is my question, if the community would be oh so kind 8)

As of now, the only people who play RPG's are pure 4E folk. Though I received some interest, the couple I spoke of are not familiar with 3.5 at all, and except for myself, have never heard of Pathfinder.

Im thinking a lavish and rich detailed campaign may not be the way to go, whilst introducing folk to a system they are not familiar with. Or, maybe Im wrong, as Ive only played with peope who were familir. I also havent Dmed in quite some time. Other then begining to run a 1 on 1 campaign with my daughet to familirize both of us with the rules and mechanics.

Ahh, before I ramble too much, let me simply ask.

What do any of you think? Simple dungeon crawl after creating charactors as a way to introduce the system and game world? Or perhaps an introductory adventure with pre generated charactors? Or the first session simply an overview of the game, and classes and charactor creation?

Im not shy to start, but I have a couple of things Im thinking of. I dont want the first session to be mundance and rules oriented so that players may not enjoy themselves, and my other thought, is that by a more in depth introduction, I may show a richer game and world with more charactor creation and a feeling of individuality then they may be used too.

Thoughts? Suggestions or opinions?

Much appreciated 8)

Now, a couple of days ago, I did a big thread on 'How to Tame your Dragon' and blah blah blah basically I did an Igor and had a Geek Meltdown over that movie.

Cutting through my usual few paragraphs of palaver, how would a Campaign go in which Casters are rare (PC casters are very rare and have a much-reduced choice of Caster-Classes, and hybrid classes such as the Ranger, Bard and Paladin change over their magic spells for supernatural abilities and/or greater skills longer uses of extraordinary abilities.) and casting spells deals either non-lethal damage based upon the caster level x spell level to the Caster or their number of high-level spells-per-day is dramatically reduced fare against beasties with their normal alotment of spells, say the PC party against a Dragon or other Monster with decent spellcasting?

What about Weapons and Armor? Suddenly a suit of Dragon Hide is worth a bundle as it's naturally granting the player a set amount of elemental damage reduction, a Longbow made from a Treant's heartwood allows the player to imbue the arrows with the bane ability against Abberations and Undead, the Spear tipped with a Unicorn's Horn deals Holy Damage against Evil Outsiders etc etc. I am quite keen to add the abilities from Dragon #358 to the mix in lieu of the more traditional Magical Enchantments, while putting various magical abilities in at three times their normal cost (but the same actual enhancement bonus) to reflect how hard it is for the PC races to actually perform magic.

Dwarf-Crafted items would grant an additional 10 hitpoints and 2 additional points of hardness than a standard item of the same type, but could only be applied to Medium and Heavy Armors, Metal Shields and mostly-metal Weapons.

Elven-Crafted items would grant an additional +1 to AC while fighting defensively and +2 when taking the Full Defence action or using the Combat Expertise feat, but can only be applies to light weapons and bows and light armor.

Orc-Crafted items would grant a weapon the ability to increase...

I wont have much information for you, as I am newer, and getting ready for my first Pathfinder campaign. (Used to run old DnD campaigns in 1/2 E)

However, low magic settings have always been my style, with wizards being rare, and magic itself being something most folk have not seen, having only heard the stories and rumors. Something I much prefer over the common folk (And hero's) being unimpressed with seeing magic. Reminds me of a LoTR feel, where you know magic exists, yet not readily available and creates a unique atmosphere.

Personally, I like your idea. Lower magic then I used to do, But something, once Im used to running the game, Ill take to heart.

Ill be watching this thread to see where it goes 8)

Sorry I lack decent imput, Im just now getting familiar with Pathfinder mechanics :P

I hate "Adventure Paths". To me, "sandboxes" are the only way to go. So, as much as I always admired the abilities of the Paizo creators -- artists, writers, editors and everyone else -- I never much used Paizo material.

Then came 4E and a brief flirtation with trying to like it.

Once I recovered, I went back to 3.5, running a campaign in a "d&d-ified" England at the fall of the Roman empire -- sort of a "pre-Arthurian" campaign. It's been going pretty well, despite a few niggling issues with 3.5 (not least of which -- advancement rates).

Then, a friend sent me an email. "Seen this?" it asked, with a link to Kingmaker. I clicked and you had me. Sure, it might have taken a month or so of hemming and hawing, but you got me anyway. I subscribed. I purchased the ginormous* Pathfinder core book and have started my "shopping list" of other Paizo products (Critical Hit/Fumble Decks -- yur next!).

So, thanks, I guess. When I realized 4E was nowhere near my speed, and getting people to play 1E was harder than it should be, I figured I was safe from buying anything. After all, i had all the 3.5 material I'd ever need. Right? Riiiggghhht.

So -- You Got Me. Go on. Gloat.

*I really wish you would have split it into 2 books.

Welcome aboard 8)

Im pretty new here myself, coming from older versions of DnD (From way back). Did the same, got the 4E books, but it wasnt quite what I was hoping it would be (Not knocking it, just not for me). Found Pathfinder, and am making a few purchases to get me going. Ive been very impressed in both the game as a whole, and, though new, the community here thus far (Though I lurk and read more then I write)

Welcome abaord, and many fun adventures to you 8)

So the party kills off an enemy wizard and finds his spell book. The PC wizard's eyes sparkle...

Now, from how the rules read, while it might take a bit of time, it sounds as if the entire contents of the enemy wizard's spellbook could just be copied into the PC wizard's spellbook. Sure rolls need to be made, perhaps the wizard needs to wait another level to get more spellcraft ranks, etc. But the end result is that it sounds as if the PC wizard can basically get a bunch of spells for free and then sell the enemy wizard's spellbook for half price.

How do people deal with this little nuance of party distribution of wealth and power?

From your post, it seems as if you want to add a bit of flavor to the scenario, rather then simply let the wizard copy then make a profit. Or maybe this was really about wealth :p

On the thinking that it may be about flavor and not just wishing this to be simply a free spells and then some gold for the party, the DM can easily throw some things into the mix that makes having the spellbook not such an easy thing to have.

Rather then just have the copy sell scenario, the pages could be difficult to read, allowing the wizard some benifit, yet keeping the book from being simply marketable. Perhaps there is more too it and further studies reveal that they must return to the original enemy wizards lair and search for more information or scrolls that will give clues as to the spellbooks origins and language. Perhaps he (insert evil wizards name here) had a strong apprentice who, before there is a chance to sell the book, is able to steal it back (Still giving the wizard some time to gain some benifits to having it in his possession). Or, even if sold, enter the wizards master who has the power to use the party to get the book back. Maybe the merchant reveived a curse and the party is made (Or, if good, accepts the fact that the evil book is there responsibility) and thus has to buy the book back or take it someone to be destroyed.

Simple wealth is easy enough, but if the DM is not happy with such simple solutions, simply throw things into the mix that further adds to the situation and creates both benifit and/ or hardship 8)

I may be off from what I understood the post to be, so Im just adding my 2 cents to the mix :P

Sometimes I just have to say something, even if its not relevant 8)

Hello and welcome

First, I'd like to point out that the best way to keep the thread eating monster at bay is copying the post before you hit the submit button, which works on any browser.

Second I'm glad that you've come here as your posts are quite enjoyable. I personally ply both pathfinder and 4E (and Star Wars Saga) and enjoy tthem all, but if I want to play the D&D, I really play Pathfinder now. 4E didn't do the continuation trick for me, but still it's a good way to have some mini-based fun.

I hope you enjoy your stay here and your play at home ;)

Star Wars. I remember seeing the original in a Drive In theater with my neighbor, loved it. So does my daughter. When I first started looking at DnD, I found posts about Star Wars as an RPG (Not the upcoming mmorpg, but the pen and paper your talking of)... soon as I found it, I read that it was being discontinued... Had I began to invest in that, I would have been most frustrated :P

The Pathfinder Chronicles book is ...

pulp fantasy (good)
optimized for playability (good)
very high-concept overview (good)

I will not say it is like the old F.R. stuff. It isn't worse, nor is it better. Well, it may be a little better, but only because it is really written for how a campaign world should be played instead of simply run and published.

I love the book, but I don't think it will replace early F.R. for you. Maybe because you can't replace a campaign setting. Give Golarion (the chronicles setting) a look with fresh eyes. Buy it, and if reading any given nation doesn't want to make you set a game there, then you can take it out on me.

"Fresh eyes" is what brought me to Pathfinder 8)

I think thats part of the hype for me... Its all new with a fresh feel yet it feels the same... bah, I dont even know if that makes sense.

Im really looking foreward to the setting. The reviews are all good and from what Ive read, lots of areas that are unique to be explored and used.

Howdy

and ys Golarion is more Realms than the Realms is now

by a wide margin, delving into Golarion is a lot like my first foray into the old grey box

I think my best times were back in those old FR days 8) I havent even had a chance to check out the campaign world for Pathfinder, but I have read some reviews. Really looking forward to checking it out!

I was old school, and was totally put off by 4E initially, and understand your sentiments, although I still play it. As to finding more people to play pathfinder, that were introduced via 4E, that should be pretty straight forward as the concepts remain the same, but the mechanics differ. But as others stated they both pretty much rely on grid based combat, as least I have always used grid based combat even when playing 1E. If you are willing to DM it will be even easier, as I find that is the hardest part to bring a solid group together.

Welcome to the board.

Actually, Dming is what I enjoy more then playing. Love to write and create (Hobby of mine, so RPG's are a perfect way for me to have a reason to write 8). Ive bombed a few times, but really enjoy it when the group gets into things and the hours passed and everyone was just into it and involved.

With a fun group, Id play many games. Between our (very) old group, we had traveler, DnD 1/ 2E, An old game about Atlantis (Very good game, least I thought so), original Middel Earth, and quite a few others. Most of it was in DnD and the Realms, but there were lots of games back then. We kept up in those days before video games, and though I have played MMORPG's in the past, I dont think it compares to the sit down with friends and delving into those stories where anything can happen!

**

Ill check out the meetup groups and see if I can find them in town, its a great idea, and Ill stop by the local game store (I know they play 4E there) and see if I can get some interest or maybe find someone who already plays.

Again all, thanks for the warm welcome 8)

Cork, welcome to the Boards!

I was gonna say "Hi" earlier and mention that your 4E story is the best one I've heard in a while but didn't want to start a flame war.

Regarding your last post, lots of people here on the Boards spent a good year lashing out against WotC, others defending WotC. As a result, Paizo actually had to create policy for rude posters and even make "sticky" posts on some Threads asking people to be civil.

Some long-time Paizo posters even left the Boards because the angry posts were too much.
(For the record, I was a pretty big "anti WotC" mouth)

Anyway, your last post, innocuous as it may have been intended, is pretty hot on the Boards here, figured I'd give you a "Heads up." Nothing intentional, I'm sure, we're just a little sensitive on the subject.

Uh, welcome to Paizo.

Stay for Lilith's cookies.

Who can resist the tempation of cookies!

On a more serious note, I had no intention of fanning an ember of a heated debate 8( I only wished to describe what I felt upon 4E after being gone from gaming for awhile! If I knew it was such a subject, Id simply have left out anything I might have thought about 4E (Insert tear here).

Pathifnder, as well as what Ive read of the Campaign world in Chronicals (Galorian?) just seems to catch me with a flood of hopefully soon to be enjoyment. Ive ordered the Campaign world and am anxious to begin delving into things. My creative juices are flowing

Thanks for the heads up, and welcome 8)

I'm glad you decided to actually buy 4e and make up your own mind on the game. And even gladder that you were able to return the books when you found it wasn't for you.

I did try to determine what exactly it was about 4e that made it lose its D&D feel to the old school players, but it doesn't seem to be any single consistent thing, it all depends on the player - for some it was Vancian magic, for others it was the fact that Gnomes, Bards and Druids were moved to the PHB2 etc. I would be curious to hear your reasons why 4e didn't feel like D&D.

**

Thanks again everyone for the welcome 8) And for the recovery of post tips!

To answer your question about my reasons for the 4E lack of feel.

When I first read the PHB, the first thing I noticed was this concept of balance. Im not sure why there was a reason for balance in a DnD table game. It seemed to be stressed that no charactor could be more powerful then the next. That was the way I perceived it. There was the initial missing gnomes and druid class, and monk, (my personal favorite). Though from what I read it was also introduced later in the game.

In our old campaign (90's) we had a die hard have to own everything DnD guy in our group. So we introduced quite a bit. So 1/2 E was what we played. Lots of charactor options and new things to learn. Just seemed that the possibilities were much more open to people when creating a charactor, and playing. Then the magic. I didnt spend a lot of time learning the rules of 4E, but magic seemed to be more limited as well. So if creating a PC or NPC, it had the feel of lacking if that was the direction you wanted to take.

Minis! Back in the day, we had our collection of painted minis (Im not sure if people paint there own anymore). We just had them. On some encounters, we would use a loose lay out of the encounter and then place the mini's on the table if needed, as some encounters it made things easy. But reading through 4E, there seemed to be a huge emphasis on mini's. Too much for me, anyway. So when going through the charactors and then combat and battle grid, the way I felt is that the Battle Grid system was core to the game. It made it feel as if playing the game, story was second and designed to play out battles on the grid system, rather then encounters being second to the charactors, theme and overall experience.

I also looked through the Forgotten Realms book, and wasnt happy either, to be honest. I enjoyed FR for quite some time. In changing the realms the way they did, it somewhat was the final piece in a puzzle of the directions Wizards took DnD.

Thats my basic take on how I saw things, anyway. If I had to sum things up, Id say 4E was an expanded basic game, rather then a deeper feel game. I dont even know if that was a good use of words.

If I found a group that was die hard 4E? Sure Id play. Id be able to enjoy the game. People more then the system make for the fun. But, given the choice, and having compared the rules in my hands, Pathfinder just seems to have the feel of what I remember more then 4E. Id never say its a bad game, just one that I wasnt able to associate with my own minds version of the creativity of older DnD.

I wont knock 4E, Im sure it can be enjoyable. And bringing in newer, younger players can only be a good thing. Even bringing on older players who never had a chance would be a good thing. I just personally think that, after going through the rules, it seemed they tried too hard for the concept of balance and battle grids to give the game a certian feel.

Hope that made sense 8)

8)

I didnt expect such a warm welcome! It is very much apprecaited! Nothing like being made to feel welcomed, getting some virtual cookies, some info, and hello's 8)

Ill check out the campaign world, though I dont think I would be able to wait until later this year :P Its my flaw, Im impatient. Now Im a bit anxious to explore the campaign world and delve right on in!

Looking forward to talking to you all and talking about this world and game! The most enjoyment, after all, is the people!

Thanks again all 8)

Ahh, the disovery of the Pathfinder game.

Old gamer here. DnD original blue box game, followed by, when married, 1st edition. Our group had a die hard 2nd edition player, and some of that was implemented. Fun times indeed!

Always held that love of a good story, as Im sure many here do as well. And there is nothing like being a GM, and watching your friends interact in your world and enjoying themselves.

So here I am. After my years of DnD, I moved onto MMORPG's EQ1, LoTR, and WoW, I decided that mmorpg's were ok, but I missed that real RP feel and creativity. And, truth be told, I stopped enjoying the MMORPG community as much as I once did. I missed in person with friends gaming with creative charactors and a story driven campaign.

I checked out DnD to discover a new edidtion. I researched, but did not truly listen. A trip to a local gaming store and I heard how much 4E was like my older days of DnD. I asked about this Pathfinder game that crept into review after review, but none heard of it. I read some very controversial reviews about the direction of Wizards. I didnt listen. So, on there recomendation, I decided on 4E. I read the rules. Echoes of my conversation in the gaming store went through my head. I read the rules again. I wasnt sure if I had bought the DnD game. I mean that with sincerity. I was a little confused about what I was reading. Seemed as if I bought a mini battle game, played with board and miniatures, with little real zest. For me anyway. I went back to the reviews. Forgotten realms reviews brought me to Pathfinder, I read about MMORPG playstyle (Which, after looking at my books, does seem to have some validity). I didnt want to make a Death Knight in a leet speaking combat grid battle game. I missed in person creative charactors and RP and interaction in a thought out world with people who enjoy a variety of gaming styles.

Now, anyone who works at Borders Book store... Kudos to your store! Ill even go so far as to clap my hands and applaud! (Though I feel guilty for not placing a note in the books I returned in fair warning) They took my DnD products back. Its on the shelf again. And, seeing a copy of the Pathfinder game, I picked up a copy. I need not say more. This was more of a feel of what I remembered. Honestly, after checking out the 4E game, I was relieved that they took it back. Im not knocking anyone who enjoys it, but I can honestly say some of the reviews feel right. Its not DnD, and it is a game more catered to a younger crowd who is used to mmorpg's, and not the game I remember. Maybe Im wrong in my assesment. But that is what I discovered.

So, I rambled (As I did in my first post that never appeared)

Im looking at the Chronicals campaign guide. Ive read that it is much more like the original FR realms from DnD long ago. IS this so? I would have to order online, as there are no places in my area that offer anything more then the Pathfinder core rule book. But the reviews seem very good. Any honest opinions from folk who may understand where I am coming from?

Also, one more question. Nobody in my area has heard of Pathfinder. I can see that, to someone who truely enjoyed the original DnD in its various editions, Pathifnder seems much more viable for an old school feel campaign. Ive been going over the rule book (I did own the 3.5 core books and FR books, I just never got much of a chance to play) and I can already envision a campaign and what Id like to run. So, heres the big question. Anyone have any insight as to how to introduce the game to people who have only heard of 4E and previous editions of DnD? I dont know the people in the store, I just talked to them. Im just not shy 8) My daughter, who is older now, wants to try the game after hearing stories of myself and her mother who used to play, and about what it was like. So, I know nobody other then her who plays, yet Id like to simply start a game with people I dont know. Would anyone have any recomendations?

Appreciate any feedback and the time it took to read my far too long post 8)

Typos? Im on a laptop at the moment, and my fingers just feel to big to type on the thing.

Anyway, if I made sense, Im happy. Any insight, Id really appreciate it.

Im off to read more and more about you all have to say about my new discovery in Pathfinder 8)