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Ok, so... where to begin.

After a few years of hopping over to the 5e train, I was invited to go join my old pathfinder group I used to run while I'm back for about a month over the holidays. My DM is a good friend and used to be one of my regular players. He's the kind of guy who would show up to the table having taken a week-long Adderal fueled SRD dive and have some sort insane paladin/synthesist or magus/swashbuckler explosive crit combo character and break the game 5 ways from here to sunday.

It's not like he runs his games much differently than that though. He's allowed all 3rd party on the SRD. Let me repeat: All. 3rd. Party. That means feats, classes, races. Everything. Monster feats too. Worth mentioning that Power Attack and Combat Reflexes are just free feats every character gets. He's also allowing prestige classes to no longer be gated by the skill rank requirements, though all the other prerequisites are necessary. Also just the cherry on the top: everyone just gets a free +2 to one ability score.

So, it's been a few years since I've played pathfinder 1e, I've unlearned some of the rules. Given what I've told yall, how do you think I should proceed in starting the nuclear arms race that will be my character?

We're level 4, and I already rolled up my stats. They're pretty solid:

17, 17, 14, 12, 12, 12

Edit: As an aside, he's been actively challenging players to show up with broken characters, especially me, so I'm not actually working against the spirit of this game if it wasn't clear by the insanity of character creation.

So my DM gave me 50 point-buy to work with because we're bringing in a totally overpowered character for a few sessions (it makes sense for story reasons, this character is fast approaching godhood), but I'm curious how the point buy table would function past 18 in an ability score. Do you guys happen to have any ideas on what this would look like? Any advice is much appreciated.

That is amazing. It's a shame it takes till level 7 (if you are a human) to really come online though.

Avoron wrote:
Talonhawke wrote:
Avoron wrote:
And the target would end up prone, which is nice.
Well they can make an acrobatics check to negate that and reduce the damage so not everything will.

Nope, that's only for when you intentionally jump down.

Acrobatics wrote:
When you deliberately fall any distance, even as a result of a missed jump, a DC 15 Acrobatics skill check allows you to ignore the first 10 feet fallen

Exactly! Now correct me if these don't stack but if you take the feats improved bull rush, merciless rush and a level in Siegebreaker you can add twice your strength +2 to any bull rush that succeeds by more than 5 as well. (it might be 3 times your strength damage? I'm not really clear on siege breaker's wording)

So, so long as you succeed by 5 and you're burrowing on hard ground, or earth gliding in stone, and they dont have 4 class levels in monk (slow fall) you get twice your strength damage plus a little extra for falling and the siegebreaker bonus damage and you knock someone prone. That's not a bad deal for a single combat maneuver. If you succeed by 10 and you aren't directly underneath (5 feet adjacent to the target, but still underground) you can still push them 5 feet in a direction and get the damage, prone and the benefits of a normal bull rush, albeit they only moved 5 feet. Placed well that could be deadly if you say, knocked them prone in between a bunch of your allies.

It's also super funny to me which is the main thing compelling me to try this.

So let's say you've got a burrow speed and you get under your enemy. Could you bull rush it from underneath and knock it straight up, or into an upward diagonal? It would be a real cheese build but it sounds so fun to basically only rely on falling damage to wound enemies.

Yeah the more I look at it the more it seems like ranged is probably the best option for me. Are there any benefits at all to other ranged weapons than bows or crossbows? I like the idea of a blowgun for my little brownie but I'm guessing it's laughably bad.

Fuzzy-Wuzzy wrote:

I'll point out the obvious by noting that flaming/frost/shock/corrosive weapons' extra damage is not size-dependent. Put on burst versions and be a crit-fisher and you'll be putting out pretty good average damage.

Any specific magic items you can think of which are worth taking a look?

I had a bard Dawnflower Dervish I ran as a npc for a while so I know how much pain it can deal at low levels, but it's getting quite a bit of its bite from the bardic performance. Dunno if those same feats would hold up as a choice for a mid-level hunter.

James Gibbons wrote:
the Bladed Brush can get you a finesse reach weapon, which you can then plop slashing grace on. That way you don't have to enter enemies squares to attack them

DAMN! ok, now that is cool. Might go that route. It's a shame that it's four feats to really get it up and running though (I understand the whole game balance thing though.)

Da Goblin wrote:
Dervish Dance feat to add DEX to damage maybe?

One less feat is really nice compared to the fencing grace route, but I tanked INT to 5 so those two ranks in dance are really gonna hurt me.

I should suppose I should mention that I'm basically planning on having my brownie hang out inside the T-Rex's mouth (getting in a couple of good hits from cover with and using the shield ally teamwork feat) or hidden within its armor most of the time. It's super silly but that's what drew me to this build.

about 60k. We're playing an "epic fantasy" evil campaign so its almost too much to really know what to do with, except we've got a few stipulations like we can't spend more than half on any one item. Disposable items might be the way to go here though. I do think I want to grab me a dire collar for the dino though.

It's such a big part of the game but wands have been something that i've never really found myself digging too deep into. I think my last character in this campaign had a couple wands of cure wounds but that's it.

Edit: Would agile maneuvers, weapon expertise, and a garrote get enough use out of the really high sneak or would that be the absolute wrong way to go? it's a pretty niche investment for such a feat intensive route but it seems like it could be really fun. Being an evil campaign and all it seems like it would give me some versatility to be able to kill quietly. I may have an issue justifying the two foot tall brownie garroting someone's neck height even if it was mechanically reasonable.

I'm building a brownie hunter and I'm curious if there are any solid ways to make her just a little more threatening than just her T-Rex animal companion (Which is plenty threatening, honestly.) I know the game isn't really built for tiny or large races but every once in a while you want to do something different and your DM gives you the go-ahead. We're playing 8th level characters and we've got a pretty large stipend of gold to spend on equipment. Feel free to think outside the box, but i'm mainly thinking about weapons and equipment here.

Jhaeman wrote:

Here's # 3. As the "Con" indicates, this is a tough one to implement giving that Pathfinder has so many moving parts, and a GM would have to do a lot of work on the fly to adjust things.

3. Action Speeds: Many actions take time to complete. The speed of an action is a number that is subtracted from a character’s initiative count. The larger the number, the longer it takes the action to be completed. On a character’s initiative, he or she declares the action and the character is assumed to be in the process of undertaking it, but the action isn’t completed (and has no effect) until the speed-modified initiative count is reached. Light melee weapons have a speed of 1, one-handed melee weapons have a speed of 3, and two-handed melee weapons have a speed of 6. Thrown or ranged weapons have a speed of 4. A character with multiple attacks (whether from iterative attacks, natural weapons, or two-weapon fighting) takes one attack with the listed speed modifier and must then subtract from that modified initiative account the speed modifier for each subsequent attack. Spells that are standard actions to cast have a speed of twice their spell level, spells that are swift actions to cast have a speed equal to their spell level, and spells that are full round actions to cast are not completed until the caster’s initiative result on the next round. If a caster is injured or otherwise distracted while casting a spell, they must make a Concentration check as per the rules or lose the spell. Spell-like abilities and supernatural abilities have an action speed of 5. Activating a magic item as a standard action has a speed modifier equal to half the caster level of the item (rounded down). Movement, extraordinary abilities, free actions, immediate actions, and anything not discussed above have action speeds of zero. A character in the process of undertaking an action cannot take attacks of opportunity or immediate actions. If an action is begun but cannot be completed because of an intervening change...

I have a thread on this and like 90% of people hate it lmao. I think it's wonderful though. You certainly created a more complex system than mine though.

So I have this idea for a magic weapon which is kind of silly and needs some work, but I think it could be a fun gimmick.

The weapon is a discus (probably uses the chakram's stats (but is a nonlethal weapon) which when thrown imposes a -10 penalty or something similarly difficult to hit a creature with. Upon missing, the discus continues to sail into the sky with no sign of stopping, and the PC's watch as it flies out of view. Then, maybe many sessions later, at a point when s+~& is going really bad for players (such as a pc death or TPK) the discus returns, unerringly striking down a single creature for a decent amount of nonlethal damage and stunning a creature upon a successful save or knocking it unconscious if the creature does not save. The players probably have to be outside fighting a creature for this to work, it would be exceedingly silly for this item to be able to navigate through the halls of a dungeon to strike a creature... though I don't completely hate the idea of that happening.

I'm thinking the trigger mechanism for the discus returning is any time a player character goes unconscious the DM can roll a percentile die with a 10% success rate OR this can simply be the DM's decision.

The spells used to create the discus are probably some combination of spells like true strike, magic missile, and miracle with a particularly high caster level.

It needs work, but I feel that it could be fun to give players a get out of jail free card. It wouldn't be particularly reliable, and identifying it's exact properties should be pretty difficult, to avoid players thinking they could waltz in and take on the big bad because this discus is going to come in and save them. But, I want to know what you guys think! What should the exact statistics on this item look like? What should the save be to avoid going unconscious? Should I nerf its abilities a little?

Mondragon wrote:

To 1:

Gifts to on timers, but not xp; a free re roll for example. Hero point or something tasty.

I like the free reroll idea. That seems like a nice balance.

blahpers wrote:
3 minutes of discussion before every round? Yeah, no thanks.

3 minutes maximum, though. Most of the time they finish this before the timer is up by a margin of a minute or two. I dont have a faster timer or I may have considered using that. When you take into account players who aren't ready to make decisions when using the standard initiative system, I think it roughly works out to about the same time frame. It certainly doesn't feel slower, and thats my main worry.

There's certainly the possibility of combat becoming too complex to run this properly at higher levels, but I've played at higher levels (9th was my highest level character) and I don't foresee that happening. I'll watch out for it though, and if it becomes an issue I'll report back. Some of my players leveled to 4 today.

J4RH34D wrote:
Another issue with the 5% bonus is that you can end up with pcs on different levels very easily.

Is that inherently a bad thing? If you are running a west marches style game, this is perfect (and something i'll probably institute in the future.) Can we get a few more to parse tonight? One isn't going to do it for me and these guys are gonna keep posting their own house rules lmao.

So i've been doing this system basically since a week after I introduced this post, and I think most of my players seem to like it more. Nobody has asked to return to the original system or expressed really any concerns about it, other than to keep making it better. I actually had a DM who is usually one of my players apologize to me for not using it, which I think speaks volumes to it's playability (his campaign started before we began using this system, and we hadn't played since, and so he made the decision to keep the old system as a couple of players had taken classes with initiative features and the improved initiative feat.) I actually thought it was kind of silly he did that (it's his campaign after all, and I believe the ultimate arbiter of who decides what goes is the DM) until I sat down to write about it right now and thought about what that meant towards this system.

The thing about it being clunky or slow is basically on you as a DM. What I do to keep it fast paced is at the "discussion phase" I set a 3 minute timer in which players have to sort of race to decide what they want to do, declare and roll. Thematically, I feel this discussion phase is appropriate as the PCs are better fighters than us, and are somewhat attuned what decisions in combat their party might take, so the discussion phase is representative of a unspoken understanding with each other. After the round begins, players roll initiative and follow their set actions or make adjustments as their turn comes up. We only ever pause for crosstalk to look up rules. It's pretty intuitive if you assume things set at the same initiative order are happening simultaneously and if necessary you can do sub initiative rolls to decide how the turn will go down (say in the case that two people roll the same initiative and one is trying to run away and another is attacking.) I also just ask players to specify what they are holding their turn for if they want to delay so that I avoid the "delay to the end of the round every time" thing someone brought up in this thread. It's also worth having all the initiative rolls somewhere all the players can see to avoid confusion (I keep them on a white board behind my head.)

Honestly one of the things it does the very best is it keeps movement dynamic. Most people are going to fight the same way, unless their target moves from them first. Because of this, chase sequences and moving past someone's maximum range increment to get into melee combat with them becomes extremely fun. Ultimately, yeah It might not be factually accurate to what weapons actual speeds are, but I don't know that it really detracts from verisimilitude all too much. If this system gets anymore complicated we might as well just play second ed and give every weapon an initiative speed or however it is they did that.

I get that it's not for everyone though, I may have come off as if this was the greatest thing to ever hit dungeons and dragons, and it's not. It's not even particularly new, there was a similar version of this in 2nd ed as I already said. It is however something I appreciate though and I think it's a good house rule to have. I think SmiloDan, if you played this and felt it was shutting down your options to pick what to do on the fly, it's possible you weren't allowed to add dice to your roll after actions changed and your turn came up? that's a really big part of what makes this work. Nobody at my table has expressed any frustration with not being able to do what they want to do, except when it plays to the nature of the game (like a kobold ran away before they could attack it with a two handed weapon)

As for how to do improved initiative or class features, I gave improved initiative a 8th level prerequisite and it counts as -2 to your total. I do really like the idea of getting to roll a smaller count dice for each roll for improved initiative though, I may consider that, but it's not something I'll have to worry about for at least five more levels. Class features typically count as half the negative initiative of the system (with a minimum of -1) Generally this seems to work pretty well.

All in all I like it better than the typical system, but it just comes down to me feeling it's more dynamic. I have played as a player in this system by the way, and I like it just as much as I do as a DM, and I've also played as a player using the original system since I started this endevour and I can feel the drag that made me change to this in the first place more than ever. I honestly don't see myself ever running it the original way again. There are definitely some quirks that you have to houserule on the fly and you have to have a good handle on crosstalk (shutting it down if necessary) but overall it has a nice pace that seems about the same as a typical battle which is really neither faster or slower. Overall, I think it comes down to personal preference, I'm not going to say that this is for sure BETTER, and it definitely wont be the very first time it's run considering all the work I've done trying to get a handle on it.

It's worth a few games of trying it out though. Think of it like one of the marvel netflix shows, those always start out slow, and usually they get pretty good, depending on personal taste and who is behind the helm. But, much like trying to get someone into a show you swear is really good but drags the first few episodes, some people are never going to get past the initial drag or their preconceived feelings about it and that's fine, if not a little disappointing. I'd love to try to keep this thread on the subject of people who want to try this, people using it (which might just currently be me on this forum) and people who really get the rules helping to troubleshoot this system and make it work, but it's the internet so, y'know, that's probably impossible.

You should read gunnerkrigg court or american gods, it sort of deals with the same idea.

Why should it fake being a god? Assuming there's some method of ascension in your world, it's totally possible to become the real deal.

I think this individual should seek out a group of worshippers of diverse backgrounds. You'd definitely want to appeal to the bards and skalds because their regaling of the wonder of this being is going to draw in more believers. (i'm assuming this dieties become more powerful the more people believe in them) Bards, Skalds and other artists would also be useful in collecting texts and philosophies around the world and organizing their themes to fit in with the dictates of the leader. Getting them on board first is probably the first step, because the leader could sell them on the idea of creating the worlds greatest work of art (a god, literal perfection, seemingly what artists try to create in the first place.)

Bards are also useful because this endeavor is going to take money. Lots of it. And they can pull in the financiers with the deepest pockets.

Obviously with spells you can do a lot, so bringing in a couple level 10+ casters is going to be important, but you may also want to focus on the alchemists, mechanists and engineers of the world too. One thing that you can do, that gods are seemingly incapable of doing is maintain a physical presence in the real world, so perhaps constructing the perfect vessel for the new god is one way to go about showing what this being can do for you that others cant. There's no reason an egregor or tulpa can't posess this vessel and walk around amongst the faithful.

The occult caster better get used to the idea pretty fast that things are out of his control though, because he's creating a being greater than himself. There are plenty of stories of tulpas deciding they don't like strictly following the orders of their creator. If he gets with the program, he could potentially be a pope of a new world order. If he doesn't, you can read Frankenstein and amp up the stakes by about one thousand percent for what might happen to him.

The end result would be visible if this new god has the capability of bestowing divine power and spells on it's clerics and paladins, otherwise you've just got a very powerful entity.

So I ended up having a lot of fun making these. Potentially too much fun. Hangman is especially weird because I built her around some homebrew ideas made from other classes achetypes that do a similar thing and that might really overpower her.

So all the players can choose whom they want to challenge if any at all (though if they come under the pretense of fighting, at least one person is fighting one of these guys) They can also gather intel on each of these creatures fighting styles, if they look for that sort of thing, which may lead them into not making hasty decisions on who to challenge.
There's also three CR 3 creatures I have not made yet (one is a halfling bard with a pipe of the sewers, and two are ratfolk twins (a swashbuckler and a gunslinger) who fight together because being twins means you are bloodbound.

Anyways, does this all look too hard? I may have gone overboard with "interesting" features rather than "beatable." I could probably tone down some of the creatures ability scores if that seems necessary. Also I might have done some class stuff wrong, there are a lot of rules.

(oh and "Sage" is my world's lingo for "magic user." Also anything that refers to initiative you should ignore because I'm using a weird homebrewed version based on Mike Mearl's initiative system. The "At sea or camp" bits are for taking all these guys on at once, which honestly will probably end in a TPK if they don't run.)

CR 2
XP 800
Steel-Breaker Brawler 3
LE medium humanoid (orc)
Senses darkvision 60

AC: 14
Hp: 26
Fort: +5, Ref +3 Will +0

Speed 20 ft.
Melee 2 unarmed strikes +3 (1d6 +8), or unarmed strike +7 (1d6 +8) or Flambard +7 (1d10 +8) or swordbreaker dagger +7 (1d4 +4)
Ranged: Dayrunner (-2 to all ranged attack)
4 uses of Martial Flexibility, Flurry of Blows, Sunder Training,

Stats: Str 20 Dex 10 Con 14 Int 8 Wis 8 Cha 8
Base Atk: +3 CMB +8 (+12 sunder, +8 for brawler’s flurry, +16 for swordbreaker dagger against blades, +16 for flambard against weapons made wholly or partially out of wood) CMD 15
Feats: Power Attack, Improved Sunder, Combat Expertise, Will use martial flexibility to gain the benefit of exotic weapon proficiency (swordbreaker dagger) or (flambard) but may also use it to gain the benefit of improved steal.
Skills: Handle Animal +4, Ride +8, Swim +5,
Languages Common, Orc

“Snapper” will only ever fight an enemy once they are entirely rid of their weapons and armor.
At camp or sea: “Snapper” will attempt to sunder the weapons of every individual, then moving to sunder their armor. He will not stop trying to destroy the enemies’ weapons or armor even at less than 0 health when staggered. He will attack the enemies with flurry of blows once they are otherwise disarmed.
In single combat: “Snapper” will attempt to break every weapon on the person of the combatant, then moving to sunder their armor with flurry of blows. He will not stop trying to destroy the combatant’s weapons or armor even at less than 0 health when staggered. Only when the combatant is totally disarmed of weapons and armor will he attack them, using flurry of blows.

Hangman and Walter:
Masie “Hangman” Mountainstone
CR 2
XP 800
Rustler Rogue 1 Druid 2 (but no spells, kind of it's own thing i made up)
LE medium humanoid (dwarf)
Senses darkvision 60

AC: 16
Hp: 27
Fort: +4, Ref +7 Will +6

Speed 20 ft.
Melee masterwork rope noose +6 (1d3 +1 nonlethal), Knife +3 (1d4+1),
Hangman’s Noose, Sneak attack (1d6)

Stats: Str 12 Dex 14 Con 12 Int 7 Wis 14 Cha 5
Base Atk: +2 CMB +3 (+6 grapple with masterwork rope noose) CMD 14
Feats: Weapon Finesse, Weapon Focus (rope noose), Undersized Mount
Skills: Handle Animal +4, Ride +8, Swim +5, Profession (Sailor) +6
Languages Common, Dwarven

Hangman’s Noose (Ex)
Maisie “Hangman” Mountainstone can wield a rope noose as a net or whip or lasso, at the same time. Upon a successful hit, she can decide whether or not this applies damage or the entangled condition upon the target.

If the target is entangled Masie can use a standard action, to use the rope noose to grapple, gaining the benefits of Improved Grapple with it. she takes no penalty on combat maneuver checks with the noose for having the noose in his hand, but she still doesn’t add any bonuses he might have with a net or whip (such as weapon enhancement bonuses or benefits from Weapon Focus) on the check. He can spend 1 minute to weave a magical or masterwork net or whip into a noose, thereafter gaining these benefits with it.

CR 2
XP 800
Animal companion 1
N animal (walrus)
Senses low light vision

AC: 14
Hp: 26
Fort: +5, Ref +4 Will +2

Speed 20 ft. swim 40ft
Melee gore +3 (1d6 +4)
Combat trained, Riding,

Stats: Str 14 Dex 13 Con 14 Int 2 Wis 13 Cha 9
Base Atk: +2 CMB +4 CMD 15
Feats: Power Attack, Diehard
Skills: Handle Animal +4, Ride +8, Swim +5,

Masie will move to the water at the first opportunity, riding upon Walter. She will attempt to entangle, then grapple her opponents at reach and pull them into the ocean. Regardless of whether or not this is possible, Walter will attack at close range.
In single combat: Masie will move into the difficult terrain ocean surrounded by jetsam, reducing Walter’s move to 20 ft.
At sea or camp: Maisie jump off the boat or camp riding Walter, and then will try to pull anyone who Juk has poisoned with his debilitating venom into the sea.

The Crippler:
Juk “The Crippler”
CR 2
XP 800
Grippli Poison Darter Ranger 3
LE Small humanoid (grippli)
Senses darkvision 60

AC: 16
Hp: 28
Fort: +4, Ref +7 Will +6
Favored Terrain: Water (-1 to initiative)

Speed 30 ft.
Melee dagger +0 (1d3 -3)
Ranged blowgun +7 (1d3 + poison), Net +7
Debilitating Venom x6 (DC15, 1d3 dex, 1/round for 4 rounds), Bloodroot x2 (onset 1 round, DC 12, 1 con 1 wis damage, 1/round for 4 rounds)

Stats: Str 5 Dex 18 Con 12 Int 7 Wis 18 Cha 7
Base Atk: +3 CMB -1 CMD 10
Feats: Iron Will, Point Blank Shot, Endurance,
Skills: Climb +8, Knowledge Arcana +1, Knowledge Geography +6 (untrained), Perception +6, Profession (Sailor) +8, Stealth +6, Survival +6, Swim +4,
Languages Common, Grippli

On ship or camp: Do not assume all his debilitating venoms are prepared. Juk will locate a sage and attempt to put them out of commission using his poisons. He will then begin to target those who have been dis-armored by “Snapper”
Single combat: Juk will attempt to challenge any sages he sees. Juk will have prepared all his debilitating venoms for this battle. Juk will throw a net, then begin making his way to the wall while shooting his dex poison at the enemy until it takes. If the enemy is a sage, and the dex poison has taken hold, then he’ll start using an appropriate poison targeting their casting ability score. If they are not a sage, he will just shoot debilitating venom darts at his enemy until he runs out. He will drag anyone unable to move to the water and have them drown.

Gerbo “The Untouchable”
CR 2
XP 800
Goblin Acrobat Unchained Rogue 3
LE Small humanoid (goblin)
Senses darkvision 60

AC: 19 Touch 16, Flat Footed 12
Hp: 19
Fort: +1, Ref +9 Will +1

Speed 30 ft.
Ranged repeating crossbow +8 (1d8)
Sneak attack (+2d6)

Stats: Str 8 Dex 22 Con 10 Int 7 Wis 10 Cha 5
Base Atk: +2 CMB +2 CMD 17
Feats: Roll with it, Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Repeating Crossbow)
Skills: Acrobatics +18, Climb +18 Swim +6
Languages Common, Goblin

At sea or camp: Gerbo will hold back and take potshots at enemies.
In single combat: Gerbo will refuse to take on any sages or characters who look proficient in ranged weapons, instead opting to take on the melee fighters, even challenging them directly. Gerbo will try to stay as far as he can from the other combatant. If he does get attacked, he’ll use his roll with it ability to attempt to negate any damage taken, and move as far from his enemy as possible.

CR 2
XP 800
Catfolk Bounty Hunter Slayer 3
LE Medium humanoid (catfolk)
Senses low-light vision

AC: 17
Hp: 20
Fort: +3, Ref +8 (+10 when using catnip) Will +1
Sprinter: +10 speed

Speed 30 ft.
Melee two claws +8/+9 (1d4/+1)
Studied Target, Dirty Trick, Sneak attack(+1d8)
Catnip (-1 to initiative and +2 to reflex saves)

Stats: Str 10 Dex 20 Con 10 Int 10 Wis 8 Cha 10
Base Atk: +3 CMB +8 (+9 when replacing sneak attack damage) CMD +15
Feats: Agile Maneuvers, Extra Slayer Talent
Skills: Acrobatics +13,
Languages Common, Catfolk

Jasper will always use acrobatics when moving through threatened squares. He will also consume a dose of catnip before battle.
At sea or camp: Jasper will attempt to get flanking on any designated target. If he can not get flanking, he will attempt to blind targets to deliver a sneak attack during his next attack. Do not assume Jasper has studied the target.
In single combat: It is safe to assume Jasper has taken a move action to study his target during single combat. Jasper will use a blinding dirty trick before every attack and try to sneak attack his foes. His second sneak attack will always be another attempt to blind opponents with dirty trick. If foes are not currently blinded, he’ll run (use withdraw and the +10 speed to get out of there) and try to blind you from range, before moving back in to strike.

Just a Nilbog:
Wennie “The Unkillable” (Nilbog)
CR 1
XP 400
NE Small humanoid (goblinoid)
Init +1; Senses darkvision 60 ft.; Perception +5
Aura spatio-temporal reversal (20 ft., Will DC 11)

AC 15, touch 12, flat-footed 14 (+3 armor, +1 Dex, +1 size)
hp 5 (1d8+1)
Fort +3, Ref +1, Will -1
Defensive Abilities damage reversal

Speed 30 ft.
Melee morningstar +1 (1d6)
Ranged javelin +2 (1d4)

Str 11, Dex 13, Con 12, Int 10, Wis 9, Cha 6
Base Atk +0; CMB -1; CMD 10
Feats Alertness
Skills Perception +5, Ride +5, Sense Motive +1, Stealth +9; Racial Modifiers +4 Stealth
Languages Goblin
Gear studded leather armor, morningstar, 3 javelins

Damage Reversal (Ex)
When struck by any attack that would normally damage the nilbog, it actually gains hit points equal to the damage the attack would have otherwise dealt. A nilbog gains any extra hit points above its normal total as temporary hit points, though it can never have more than twice its normal hit points. (Excess hit points are simply lost.). The nilbog can only be damaged through the use of curative magic and effects (cure light wounds and healing potions, for instance). Curative magic deals damage equal to the amount it would normally heal.
Spatio-Temporal Reversal (Ex)
A nilbog constantly emanates an aura of confusion in a 20-foot-radius. A creature in the area must succeed on a DC 11 Will save or be affected as if by a confusion spell (caster level 4th). The save DC is Constitution-based.

Oh and because everyone's been asking about the arena, it's a floatilla on the sea surrounded by the arena walls. Some of it is uneven terrain because it's made of jetsam, but some of it is walkable. A 40 feet circle of it is "ground" consisting of some uneven terrain, surrounded by 10 feet of loose debris which the players can fall into (and uneven terrain for water, causing higher swim checks and lower swim speeds), another 10 feet is a water channel, surrounded by a ring of 5 feet of more loose debris and 5 feet of walkable terrain, which is bordered by the arena wall. Drawbridges lower the combatants onto the walkable inner portion of the arena, raising before the battle has begun. Also there is a net which is pulled taught 15 feet above the arena, so flying isn't especially useful. If the fight takes longer than a minute (10 rounds), the people running the battles will start dropping large numbers of rats into the arena, until about a minute an a half (15 rounds) when they coalesce into a rat swarm. (the arena doubles as the "Camp" in case the players feel up to the challenge of taking them on at once.)

Hey guys, I'm building a fourth level combat bard (probably a halfling) and I need some suggestions on what spells I should use as well as if there are any archetypes I should look at. I'd rather not use the dervish dancer or dervish of dawn archetypes because I'd like the versatility of being able to buff my teammates.

The goal here is to build a bard that can hold their own in single combat though. He's starting out with the pipe of the sewers, so he gets the benefit of rat swarms to help him. I'm thinking he may be built around demoralizing opponents, so are there any good feats to make that work?

What ways are there to make a combatant who is primarily a melee fighter interesting? A grappler? A tripper? I currently have a slayer who uses dirty tricks to bolster his sneak attacks, so maybe not that.

I'm thinking CR 3 or lower.

Dirty trick seems pretty open ended from the way it's written on the SRD. If I wanted to throw sand or mud at someone to use the blinding dirty trick on someone, could I do that at range? Would it be an improvised weapon or a ranged touch attack roll to determine if it even hits?

I'm building a catfolk slayer with the deadly scratch talent, and he's basically only useful when he's doing poison damage in combination with sneak attack. So, for your money, what are some of your favorite poisons to use in combat?

Yorien wrote:

ColbyMunro wrote:
I have a monk with two natural attacks, one primary bite and one secondary tail slap, with an extra ki punch does he really get four attacks, with three of them being at his full attack bonus?

Considering your monk is "chained", you can't spend the ki point that way, since it only applies to attacks made under a Flurry of Blows. Flurry of Blows is an (ex) ability that demands a Full-round action, so if you flurry you cannot make extra natural attacks since you already spent all your actions for that round.

If you do not use Flurry of blows, you can, as a Full-attack action, make as many iterative unarmed strikes as you get based on your BAB, plus two secondary natural attacks (the bite and the tail slap)

Oh I meant unchained monk. Honestly if the DM allows it I don't know why anyone would play the "chained" monk, rogue or summoner. (there's definite benefits to "chained" barbarian, like the cmb/cmd bonuses from strength)

I was definitely considering basing individual fighters around a single combat maneuver, like a rogue, ninja or slayer who is all about using feints. I'll have to look into dirty tricks.

I'm bumping this, but I acknowledge that it is an absolute wall of text. Any responses here would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you SlimGauge. You are a great human and I appreciate you.

Alright that is all very helpful and more explanatory than d20pfsrd could give me. I promise I tried to figure this out on my own. I should really read the book more often.

So I have some players, level 2 to 4 who are coming up on a thunderdome sort of scenario soon, and I'm looking for some unique one on one fights that will challenge them, but if they're smart about it, not kill them (I tend to lean on the side of making creatures more difficult because I can always fudge monsters hp from behind the screen). Summoners, druids, rangers, shamans, wizards and witches are allowed to bring their companion creatures as they are "Blood bonded" and therefore count as one being (and if they're really smart about it, they might be able to bluff their way in to the stadium with two players, convincing the enemies that they are blood bonded.) It's an anything goes, deathmatch style fight. What creatures and classes would you bring to fight. How would you arm them? They should probably be sentient, and generally humanoid because that's sort of the genre I'm going for here.

It's also more than likely the players will get frustrated and simply try to storm the place, but I'm hoping for a few good fights.

Monsters with class levels are perfectly acceptable.

So, regarding full attack action and natural attacks, I have a pretty simple question. If you are making a full attack action, can you add all your natural attacks into the mix? If so, is the only difference between primary and secondary attacks the attack bonus? Is there a limit to how many natural attacks you can have this way? I have a monk with two natural attacks, one primary bite and one secondary tail slap, with an extra ki punch does he really get four attacks, with three of them being at his full attack bonus? Cause that feels like a lot for a fourth level monk.


can you only add secondary attacks into your full attack action?

any help would be appreciated on this topic.

So, I have a question regarding double move which seems hard to define exactly but you wizards probably know the answer.

So, if you want to use two move actions in a round that isnt moving a creature twice as far, can you? Let's say you want to move to a square and activate a style feat with unchained monk. Can you do that in one turn?

Alternatively, let's say you have the master siege engineer feat, which lets you load the siege engine with a move action instead of a full round action. Can you load your siege engine twice as fast by expending two move actions?

basically my question is, is the second move action actually your standard action under a different name, or can you replace your standard action with a second move action? Might be confusing wording. Sorry.

Shouldn't they move faster then their typical move action allows considering gravity and what not?

So I'm running a sort of piratey aquatic homebrew campaign, and I think it's sort of on theme to have pirates riding down on some special ropes from one location to another, but I'm having a little difficulty deciding how that works in the action economy. I'm thinking maybe it's a full round action to take a bent metal bar and hook it around the rope then jump. I'm also considering having a DC 15, acrobatics check, that on any roll below a 5 they fall (into water below), and anything above that they fall prone at the landing site.

This is an excellent cursed item. Make it appear to be boots of haste, then hit them with the slugginess when they put them on.

Also as an aside, this would be stupid but also amazing: if I have greater called shot can I use it with siege weapons? Please say yes.

I'm assuming you can use a deed and a called shot at the same time, but i'd like to make sure. Would it matter if you have the Improved Called Shot feat?

A statue of a small halfling bearing a shortspear stands perfectly still until you move to strike it, attempts to dodge and returns your attack with a quick jab.

Pawn Construct
CR 1/3
XP 100
N Small construct
Init +0; Senses darkvision 60 ft., low-light vision; Perception +2

AC 10, touch 10, flat-footed 10
hp 5
Fort +0, Ref +0, Will +0
Immune construct traits

Speed 10 ft.
Melee shortspear (1d6)
Special Attacks Retaliation, En Passant

Str 10, Dex 10, Con —, Int —, Wis 10, Cha 10
Base Atk +0; CMB -1; CMD 9
Languages —
SQ Pawn Move, Capture, Captured, Promotion


Any time a Pawn Construct is attacked by a creature in it’s reach though a method other than capture, the Pawn Construct it will make an attack roll at that creature as an immediate action.
If the Pawn Construct is white, it will never take a retaliation.

En Passant
If another Pawn Construct of the opposite color takes its first move, moving 10 feet (and two tiles) forward and ends adjacent to the Pawn Construct, a special move becomes available to it. On the next King’s Game turn, the Pawn Construct may move diagonally, ending it's movement behind the opposite colored pawn and capturing it in the process.

Pawn Move
A Pawn Construct has only a few move options available to it. If it has not yet moved, it may move 10 feet (and two tiles) forward. It may also move five feet (and a single tile) forward. It may never capture another construct of the opposite color moving in this way.
If a Pawn Construct is diagonally adjacent to any opposite colored construct (or creature designated as such) it may move 5 feet diagonally and initiate a capture.

If a Pawn Construct initiates a capture on an opposite colored construct, that construct is instantly destroyed.
If a Pawn Construct initiates a capture upon a creature designated as an opposite colored construct, it makes an attack roll on that creature. Whether or not the pawn construct deals damage, the creature’s tile falls out from underneath it and that creature must make an acrobatics check to get to the nearest tile or be submerged in acid. Immediately after this, a new tile rises from the acid, and the Pawn Construct moves onto that space.

Any time an opposite colored construct ends its movement on the Pawn Construct’s tile, the Pawn Construct is instantly destroyed.

If a Pawn Construct moves into the eighth rank (the opposite side from where it began) The pawn is promoted as a new construct. This can be either a Queen, Bishop, Knight or Rook Construct.
Alternatively, if the Pawn Construct is white and a creature designated as either a Queen, Bishop Knight or Rook Construct has fallen into the acid, that creature is lifted onto the Kings Game and may continue in it’s stead.

A statue of a broad shouldered man stands perfectly still until you move to strike it moves it’s shield to deflect your blow, then initiating a bash forward.

Rook Construct
CR 1
XP 400
N Medium construct
Init +0; Senses darkvision 60 ft., low-light vision; Perception +2

AC 12, touch 10, flat-footed 10
hp 15
Fort +0, Ref +0, Will +0
Immune construct traits

Speed 40 ft.
Melee heavy shield +3 (1d8+2)
Special Attacks Retaliation,

Str 14, Dex 10, Con —, Int —, Wis 10, Cha 10
Base Atk +1; CMB 2; CMD 12
Feats Improved Shield Bash
Languages —
SQ Rook Move, Castle, Capture, Captured,


Any time a Rook Construct is attacked by a creature in it’s reach though a method other than capture, the Rook Construct it will make an attack roll at that creature as an immediate action.
If the Rook Construct is white, it will never take a retaliation.

Rook Move
A Rook Construct may only ever move straight along the cardinal directions on any given turn. It can not move through any other creatures spaces.

If a Rook Construct and the King Construct (or a creature designated as king) has not taken a move in this encounter, there are no constructs between them, and the King Construct is not in check, they may initiate a special move called Castling. The King Construct moves two tiles towards the Rook Construct, and the Rook construct either moves two or three tiles, depending on how close it is to the King Construct. In either case, the Rook Construct moves past the King Construct, ending it’s move on the next adjacent tile to the King Construct.

If a Rook Construct initiates a capture on an opposite colored construct, that construct is instantly destroyed.
If a Rook Construct initiates a capture upon a creature designated as an opposite colored construct, it makes an attack roll on that creature. Whether or not the Rook Construct deals damage, the creature’s tile falls out from underneath it and that creature must make an acrobatics check to get to the nearest tile or be submerged in acid. Immediately after this, a new tile rises from the acid, and the Rook Construct moves onto that space.

Any time an opposite colored construct ends its movement on the Pawn Construct’s tile, the Pawn Construct is instantly destroyed.

A statue of a small halfling riding a pony stands perfectly still until you move to strike it, then the two moving in perfect unison deftly recoil to avoid your attack, while striking at you with it’s halberd.

Knight Construct
CR 1
XP 400
N Medium construct
Init +0; Senses darkvision 60 ft., low-light vision; Perception +2

AC 10, touch 10, flat-footed 10
hp 13
Fort +0, Ref +0, Will +0
Immune construct traits

Speed 15 ft.
Melee halberd +2 (1d8 +1/x3)
Special Attacks Retaliation

Str 12, Dex 10, Con —, Int —, Wis 10, Cha 10
Base Atk +1; CMB 2; CMD 9
Languages —
SQ Knight Move, Capture, Captured,


Any time a Knight Construct is attacked by a creature in it’s reach though a method other than capture, the Knight Construct it will make an attack roll at that creature as an immediate action.
If the Knight Construct is white, it will never take a retaliation.

Knight Move
A Knight Construct will only ever move straight ten feet (in any cardinal direction) and then five feet to the side in either direction, or straight five feet and ten feet to the side. The shape of this movement always looks like a capital “L.” It means moving straight two tiles and over one tile, or vise versa. Unlike any other constructs, the Knight Construct can move through other creatures to reach their destination.

If a Knight Construct initiates a capture on an opposite colored construct, that construct is instantly destroyed.
If a Knight Construct initiates a capture upon a creature designated as an opposite colored construct, it makes an attack roll on that creature. Whether or not the Knight Construct deals damage, the creature’s tile falls out from underneath it and that creature must make an acrobatics check to get to the nearest tile or be submerged in acid. Immediately after this, a new tile rises from the acid, and the Knight Construct moves onto that space.

Any time an opposite colored construct ends its movement on the Pawn Construct’s tile, the Pawn Construct is instantly destroyed.

A stone statue of an elderly man clad in robes stands perfectly still until you move to strike it, then moves with an unerring grace and lets loose a magical discharge in your direction.

Bishop Construct
CR 1
XP 400
N Medium construct
Init +0; Senses darkvision 60 ft., low-light vision; Perception +2

AC 11, touch 10, flat-footed 10
hp 10
Fort +0, Ref +0, Will +0
Immune construct traits

Speed 50 ft.
Special Attacks Retaliation, Reach Retaliation

Str 10, Dex 12, Con —, Int —, Wis 10, Cha 10
Base Atk +0; CMB 0; CMD 11
Languages —
SQ Bishop Move, Capture, Captured,


Any time a Bishop Construct is attacked by a creature in it’s reach through a method other than capture, the Bishop Construct can cast shocking grasp as an immediate action and make an attack roll on that creature.

Reach Retaliation
Any time any black construct is attacked by a creature outside of it’s reach, a black Bishop Construct will retaliate against that creature as an immediate action by casting Magic Missile as a spell like ability. If the creature that provoked the retaliation has total cover or total concealment, the bishop will target a random creature currently on the board. If all creatures have total cover or concealment, the Bishop Construct can not take a retaliation.

Bishop Move
The Bishop Construct can only ever move diagonally on any given turn, and it must move in a straight line. It can not move through other creatures spaces.

If a Bishop Construct initiates a capture on an opposite colored construct, that construct is instantly destroyed.
If a Bishop Construct initiates a capture upon a creature designated as an opposite colored construct, it makes an attack roll on that creature. Whether or not the Bishop Construct deals damage, the creature’s tile falls out from underneath it and that creature must make an acrobatics check to get to the nearest tile or be submerged in acid. Immediately after this, a new tile rises from the acid, and the Bishop Construct moves onto that space.

Any time an opposite colored construct or creature designated as an opposite color construct ends its movement on the Bishop Construct’s tile, the Bishop Construct is instantly destroyed.

The imposing statue of a queen holding a flambard does not move, yet her cold stone eyes seem to track your every move. When you move to attack her, she moves with a speed unnatural to a statue, attempting to dodge out of the way then immediately returning your attack with a quick strike of her wave-like blade.

Queen Construct
CR 2
XP 600
N Medium construct
Init +0; Senses darkvision 60 ft., low-light vision; Perception +2

AC 14, touch 10, flat-footed 10
hp 20
Fort +0, Ref +0, Will +0
Immune construct traits

Speed 50 ft.
Melee flambard +3 (1d10+1/19-20)
Special Attacks Retaliation,

Str 12, Dex 14, Con —, Int —, Wis 10, Cha 10
Base Atk +2; CMB 3; CMD 15
Languages —
SQ Queen Move, Capture, Captured, Promotion


Any time a Queen Construct is attacked by a creature in it’s reach though a method other than capture, the Queen Construct as an immediate action can make an attack roll against the creature that attacked it.
If the Queen Construct is white, it will never take a retaliation.

Queen Move
The Queen Construct must always move in a straight line, but can move either diagonally or forward along any cardinal direction. She may not pass through any other creatures’ occupied spaces.

If a Queen Construct initiates a capture on an opposite colored construct, that construct is instantly destroyed.
If a Queen Construct initiates a capture upon a creature designated as an opposite colored construct, it makes an attack roll on that creature. Whether or not the Queen Construct deals damage, the creature’s tile falls out from underneath it and that creature must make an acrobatics check to get to the nearest tile or be submerged in acid. Immediately after this, a new tile rises from the acid, and the Queen Construct moves onto that space.

Any time an opposite colored construct ends its movement on the Queen Construct’s tile, the Queen Construct is instantly destroyed.

Black King:

The black statue of a king holding a royal scepter stands perfectly still until you move to attack him, then attempting to dodge out of the way, striking you with his scepter and moving away from you. He wears royal robes and a crown, but most of the front of his torso is obscured by a large, stone door emanating strange and powerful magic.

Black King Construct
CR 1/2
XP 200
N Medium construct
Init +0; Senses darkvision 60 ft., low-light vision; Perception +2

AC 11, touch 11, flat-footed 10
hp 10 (1d6+10)
Fort +0, Ref +1, Will +0
Immune construct traits

Speed 10 ft.
Melee quarterstaff (1d6/x3)
Special Attacks Retaliation,

Str 10, Dex 12, Con —, Int —, Wis 10, Cha 10
Base Atk +0; CMB -1; CMD 9
Languages —
SQ King Move, Capture, Check, Check Mate


Any time a King Construct is attacked by a creature in it’s reach though a method other than capture, the King Construct gets to make an attack roll as an immediate action.
In addition, as part of the King Construct’s retaliation, it may take a five foot step in any direction it likes, though this is not required if it is not tactically advantageous. This does not count as part of the black constructs’ turn.

King Move
A King Construct generally only ever moves five feet in any direction.
However, once per encounter a King construct can make use of a Rook construct’s special move ability. If a King Construct and a Rook Construct have not yet taken moves, there are no other constructs between them, and the King Construct is not currently in check another form of movement becomes available to the King Construct. The King construct may move ten feet towards the Rook Construct, and the Rook construct may move past the King Construct, ending their moves adjacent to each other.
No movement the King makes ever provokes an attack of opportunity.

If a King Construct initiates a capture on an opposite colored construct, that construct is instantly destroyed.

If a King Construct initiates a capture upon a creature designated as an opposite colored construct, it makes an attack roll on that creature. Whether or not the King Construct deals damage, the creature’s tile falls out from underneath it and that creature must make an acrobatics check to get to the nearest tile or be submerged in acid. Immediately after this, a new tile rises from the acid, and the Pawn Construct moves onto that space.

If a king is threatened by the white constructs next move, and no other construct can move in the way or white capture the construct that threatens it, the king must move.
If a creature designated as a white construct moves to threaten the king in a way that is atypical of it’s designated construct’s move, it may take a retaliation.

Check Mate
If the Black King Construct is threatened by the white constructs next move in such a way that no other construct can move in the way, capture the white construct that threatens it, or move out of the way, the game is won. All pieces remain on the board until the game is reset by all creatures designated as white constructs leaving up the stairs.
In addition, a door on the torso of the black king construct opens, connecting that threshold to another location in space similar to the spell Gate. (the location of where gate goes to varies on the difficulty of the game)

These constructs are only the pieces for the first difficulty of the puzzle/combat. I'd like to give them more abilities as the difficulty increases, so if you guys have any ideas, I'm all ears. Besides hp and raw attacking power, one thing I know will happen at higher level difficulty is increasing the caster level of the bishop's magic missile. I also really like the idea of giving the rooks Force Push as an SLA for their retaliation.

The opposed knowledge nobility check for low risk play starts at +1 at the first difficulty, then +5 at the second, and moves up by +5 every following difficulty level. As the creatures get locked into the final difficulty, they can not use low risk play for this final challenge.

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So this is meant to be a centerpiece for a 20 floor megadungeon-esque tower (meant to be routinely visited throughout the game) and players are meant to return to this puzzle-fight multiple times. The ultimate goal is to put the king into checkmate which opens a portal like door to treasure rooms. The players must be able to navigate to him, or it was all for naught. It's probably broken to all hell, which is why I'm posting it here and asking for the expert's advice. So, my main questions are these:
-If you were a player how would you break this (keep in mind that nothing past the basic rules of the "King's Game" will be made aware to the players, and even then they must roll a DC 11 Knowledge (Nobility) skill check for their characters to understand the rules) and everything else must be found out through trial and error. It's important that the players be rewarded for their cleverness in "cheating" but it shouldn't be easy or without cost.
-As a dm who is probably more experienced than I, what would you change to make this flow more smoothly? What problems do you see arising from it being played as described?
-I currently only have the stats for the first level of the game. How would you increase the difficulty of the constructs as the levels progress, aside from having them hit harder and have more health.

The King’s Game Construct
At the top of the tower of the moon is an unusual forty foot square construction. On the western side, is a forty foot wide by five foot long stairway leading down to eight alternating black and white five foot square tiles, starting with black from the northernmost corner. A 35x40 foot acid pit is the rest of the square.

Starting Placement:
Stepping onto the western tiles can activate a number of Construct Pieces ranging from 35 to 28. It will also create 28 alternating 5 foot tiles of black and white. Eight of these tiles will be immediately adjacent to the western tiles. 16 tiles will be on the eastern side of the acid pit.

16 of these construct pieces are black. These pieces are eight Pawn Constructs, two Rook Constructs, two Knight Constructs, two Bishop Constructs, one Queen Construct and one King Construct. These constructs are placed in this order; 8 pawns in the second to easternmost row from top to bottom, in the easternmost row from top to bottom is Rook Construct, Knight Construct, Bishop Construct, Queen Construct, King Construct, Bishop Construct, Knight Construct and Rook Construct.

15 to 8 white construct pieces will activate depending on how many creatures step onto the first row of tiles. These constructs mirror exactly the constructs on the east, save for the fact that any creatures that step on the westernmost row to begin the Kings Game at approximately the same time will be “counted” as their constructs and will not generate white constructs for that tile. To activate the King’s game, at least one creature must step onto the white King Construct’s starting tile.If any creature steps into a western tile designated for a Knight Construct Piece, three of the five foot alternating black and white tiles will appear exactly two rows east of it.

Movement and Actions:
Movement in the Kings game works like this; Any creature (that is not a kings game construct) may move to any placement on the board available to them. However if they move to tiles not designated to their piece, some strange things happen (see below.) If a creature designated as a white construct has a move speed that is short of the total move it takes to reach the tile it desires to reach, the black constructs will wait for it to move to that location, delaying a turn. The creature who took the white King’s position may call out moves to any white construct on the board it’s movement allows (Using phrases like “Knight to F3 or Rook to B5”.) If a construct or creature designated as a white construct moves to a space occupied by an opposite colored construct, it will instantly destroy it.

Creatures may also take moves not typically allowed to them in chess. If any creature attacks a construct not within it’s capturable space, the black constructs takes their next turn as an immediate action. In addition, any black constructs will also return an attack if it is within their reach. White constructs may also be attacked. If a white construct is attacked, they do not retaliate, however the black constructs will take their turn.
On each white turn, all possible moves that creatures designated as constructs can make as their construct type raise the tiles out of the acid. This means that creatures can make movements not typically allowed for them (they can either walk to another tile, if the tile is adjacent, or make an acrobatics check to jump onto an available tile.). As soon as a creature does this, as an immediate action, the black constructs will take their next move. After this is resolved though, the creature may move with their normal designated construct’s movement without the black constructs taking a turn.

- Creatures may also stop in places which are not typically allowed movements in the King’s Game. If a Creature who took the place of a knight, stops one or two tiles short of a knight’s move, the black constructs will wait for them to move a the space they are supposed to move to. Here they may either take an attack on a construct, or wait out the timer and end their turn here. If the creature makes an attack on a black construct here, the black constructs take a retaliation and a move. If the creature attacks a white construct here, the black constructs take a move. If the creature waits out the timer the black constructs take their move.
- Any time a creature with the designated construct as a bishop moves onto a tile that is the “wrong color”, the black constructs will take their next move. The black constructs will take their move even if the creature designated as bishop moved onto a “wrong color” tile the last turn. Tiles will also not raise for a creature designated as bishop until it moves onto a white space.
- If a construct is attacked by range from a creature outside the King’s Game board, a black bishop construct will attempt to retaliate, and black takes a turn.
- Flying for more than six seconds will trigger the black constructs to take their turn. Landing after this will also trigger the black constructs to take their turn.

Unless the black constructs are taking a retaliatory action, they always move in their designated way after a white construct or creature designated as a white construct takes its move. If they capture a white construct, they attack it, destroying it, and they move into that construct’s square. If they capture a creature, the construct makes an attack roll against the creature. The creature’s tile then falls out from under it, but they may roll an acrobatics check to move onto an available square as the tile disappears underneath them (use the rules for jumping without a running start.) If the “captured” creature moves onto another tile, the black constructs will take another turn.

It should be noted that the constructs move with unnatural grace and speed, and can take multiple moves in the span of a split second, even if creatures try to move at the same time. If this happens, have the creatures roll initiative to determine which creature moves first.

Captured Creatures and Acid Pit:
A creature designated as a construct that is not the white king does not take acid damage when it is captured or falls into the acid pit. The acid instead moves around the creature with a subtle grace, protected by an abjuration effect similar to mage armor. Other creatures above the acid pit may note the effect of the acid moving around the creature with a DC 20 perception roll. This effect will not generate if all the white pawns have been captured or destroyed, and the creature will take acid damage as normal.

Swimming through the acid at this time is impossible as there is no mass to push against. If they wish they can attempt a DC 20 will save to negate this effect, but they will immediately begin to take damage. If a pawn becomes promoted during this game, the creature gets to take it’s place. If more than one creature became captured and fell below the acid, only one creature may take the promoted pawn’s place.

After the game ends or is forfeited the protective effect ends, and creatures may attempt to surface and swim to safety at this time, taking damage for each turn they must swim (as well as rolling swim checks)

The Kings game has Seven settings, each unlocked with a different key, except for the easiest setting which needs no keys to be unlocked. Upping the difficulty of the Kings Game alters a few portions of the game, including the intensity of the acid pit, timer to make each move, the health points and damage output of each individual construct piece, and the location for which the gate spell takes you, although the win condition is always the same (which is to put the king into “checkmate” and be able to enter the black king’s gate-door.)

At all times, the north, east and south walls are bordered by a spell similar to wall of force. This can be be bypassed by any object or creature moving with enough speed; which is about 100 feet per second (any attack roll over 14 can be assumed to be moving at this speed. It can also be assumed that they draw their weapons back fast enough that it does not get stuck in the wall of force unless they specifically request to try leaving their weapon in between this force.) Spells, also have no issue passing through this wall of force (and therefore disintegrate can not destroy it). If any creature that is captured attempts to leave the game using the stairs the west wall will generate a similar wall of force effect, just long enough to prevent it from leaving, sending it falling into the acid. Otherwise, (except on the hardest difficulty) it may leave onto the stairs, resetting the game and dropping all constructs and creatures into the acid.The DC to dispel this wall of force is 31 and Mage’s Disjunction will deactivate the entire board, preventing the Black King’s Gate door from connecting to it’s location.

Low Risk Play:
Creatures may also attempt to to beat the kings game by placing only one creature into the king’s position and keeping them close to the west boundary. Playing this way takes 1d4 hours playing a number of different games until success or defeat (it’s assumed that every time a creature comes close to defeat, they step off the game, resetting it.)
They can roll an opposed knowledge nobility check or an intelligence check at -10 against the Kings Game Construct in this way. For every 5 feet the creature in the King Construct’s position is willing to move away from the western border to achieve victory they add a +2. This leaves them this many spaces away upon a victory, and must use acrobatics to return to safety or fall into the acid (again, use standing still rules for this jump.) Creatures not playing may use the aid another action for this way of playing. A tied roll in this case means a stalemate.

Winning this way may not actually get the desired result, as the black king construct could very well be on the other side of the board. The door on the hatch will open, but if the creatures can’t find a way to enter, they can not get inside (though they will likely get to see what’s inside the door). To achieve a win condition of being able to enter the King Construct’s Door, by driving the king to their side, their check must exceed +5. If a second creature with the ability to fly takes a white construct piece and spends the game in the air, this check must exceed +2.

While this is a low risk way of playing, it is not a no risk way of playing. It is possible to make an oversight and become checkmated even when taking caution. If the check fails by 5 or more, the Black Queen Construct places the creature designated as the White King Construct in checkmate and takes an attack, then sending them into the acid. Make an attack roll as the Queen Construct, then roll acid damage for every turn the creature must take to swim to safety and then climb out.

The puzzle was inspired by this youtube video.

So let's say you cast invisibility on a covered wagon while you are inside. Would you disappear with it as if you were it's gear? (harry potter invisibility cloak style) My gut says no, and it simply becomes an old school wonderwoman invisible jet scenario, but I wanted to know if there was a hard ruling on this and I can't tell by the spell description.

Goddity wrote:

I have a few questions or points to consider. It's an interesting concept, it just needs some refinement.

So the creature only takes the damage 1d4 hours later? Is that the intended effect?

How would you describe this to the players from their character's perspective? Just describing terrible wounds opening in their sides? How do you make it clear it was the monster and not some new effect?

Can the temporary hit points be dispelled or disrupted in some fashion? If so, could the monster really do damage by dispelling the granted hit points to do huge damage in one hit?

It sounds like this monster should be based around manipulating life force. Would it have healing spells for example? Be undead? Deal negative energy damage?

Tracking hits individually might work for you, but as a GM that sounds like too much work for me. Consider coming up with a simpler optional system for the lazy people. Perhaps also not rely on random durations, or make the durations closer together. Maybe 4d6 x 10 minutes (~140 with a bell curve)?

What does the perception check notice fluff wise? I don't think a will save makes sense here.

What good would blocking healing effects be if the party isn't taking damage apart from making the next few fights difficult?

How does this creature survive in the wild? Does it feed off negative energy with each hit, and flee when full? Is it undead/construct and doesn't need to eat or reproduce/reproduces through the spawn ability? Does it attack, flee, and then follow it's prey until they drop? Does it hunt in a pack?

How big is it?

And most importantly: what is the target CR?

Whoo, quite a few critiques, but good questions to ask. Ill answer in order.

1.) So technically the party already took the damage they were going to take, but yes it would appear as if they were taking damage from an unknown source 1d4 hours later.

2.)That's a good point, which would have to be written into the monster's abilities description. There are two ways to go on this one, either yes it can do a ton of damage at once if it's dispelled or disrupted, or maybe if the temporary hit points are disrupted the damage becomes nonlethal? Otherwise, if it's dispelled, perhaps you simply just get your hit points back. I'm not sure. My gut is that perhaps there are two variety of this monster, one which is much more dangerous and has the ability to cancel the temporary hit points all at once as a full round action (or multi round action) that provokes attacks of opportunity and requires concentration.

3.) I don't really have a good explanation for what this creature is, it's really more in the realm of a game mechanic than a fleshed out creature at the moment. Though I really like the idea of a teddy golem, I feel like the creature should be physically attacking the party members for reasons i'll explain next.

4.) A laziness option sounds good to me, I just think it would be really cool if the party starts to realize that all the attacks they took from that lame creature earlier are starting to affect them now. (Say the creature is some sort of extraplanar or ghost swordsman, and all the cuts you described them taking, which seemed harmless enough in the previous battle start appearing on them later)

5.) So maybe in battle with this creature they are only feeling split second aches, but the more perceptive characters can feel a pain masked by a warm numbness. A good sense motive check will probably reveal that it seems hungry and that it's looking at you like you are food. I think a heal check would result in the realization that this temporary well being won't last for long.

6.) That would be one issue, but also to make the party scramble once they've realized what's been done to them, and that they can't heal up the way that they normally do because this creature is still working it's ability on them, waiting for them to die from afar.

7.) All good explanations in question form. Like I said earlier, I don't really have a great explanation for this. There's likely a good reason it needs to resort to this sort of duplicity to be effective. My gut instinct is telling me that it feeds upon every strike, and unless something has starved it or manipulated it in some way it usually will just do a few points of damage here and there to passing strangers instead of going for an outright kill. An alternate explanation is that it's some sort of guardian of the threshold type creature, and it's simply preparing you for it's master.

8.) literally no idea. I will defer to others judgement on this one.

So I came up with basically one mechanic that I would think would be cool to build a monster around, and I was hoping we could all build off of it and make one together! Any ideas you guys have are welcome.

It's entirely possible that i'm not the first person to this idea, but i've not been through the entire bestiary so please tell me if it exists.

Basically the core mechanic of the creature would be this:

-every time the creature scores a successful attack against another creature, they deal damage normally, but for any amount of damage the attacked creature sustains, the attacked creature gains back the same amount of temporary hit points that last 1d4 hours. (I think it would be beneficial to track each attack's timer individually so that hit points drop off in a semi-random fashion after combat )

Two mechanics to make it especially nasty:

- it takes a decent perception or will save to notice that this is happening. (perhaps the creature's attacks come off as silly, non threatening or are stealthed in some way)
- the creature bestows a secondary effect upon a failed will save of the attacked creature that blocks conjuration (healing) effects (perhaps for 1d4 hours?).

This is just an inkling of an idea, and I really don't know how to build this creature out from here, but I think there is something really interesting here. How would you make this creature work, from lore to mechanics?

blahpers wrote:
I'd allow it, so long as it's a boat suitable enough to call a place. Skull & Shackles pirate ship--sure. Canoe--not unless you're a termite.

Exactly the reason I was asking :)

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It's a lot more powerful if it can be applied to some sort of moving vehicle. How would you rule that at your table?

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I have one thing to add to this discussion which hasn't been brought up yet. I have absolutely zero tolerance for any sort of rape or sexual assault storylines or role play. It's actually really weird that that has to be stated but sometimes we have new players (friends of friends) come in that I havent had a chance to properly vet and they don't know the etiquette?

Tl;dr, it's not game of thrones guys.

So I think a player in my campaign just broke the game. He'd been saving up gp for some big construct project for a while, and then dropped his intentions on me only recently. Which is to make a cutlass spider and drop his black blade into it. It's gonna take him like a week and a half in game to finish his work on the Cutlass Spider, but I have absolutely no idea how to let him use it?

I mean, it's too cool to not let him do it.

so I cant figure out if cleric domain powers provoke an attack of opportunity or not. Especially those that replicate the effects of a spell in some way like the growth subdomain.

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Kirth Gersen wrote:

2. Battlemaps, grids, and moving around dolls.

They're not dolls they're action figures, mom!

So as an update, we played this with some new players and some players who have been playing the typical one initiative roll system for the entire d&d/pathfinder experience. Everyone liked it, though it was a bit clunky to run in the two combats we played, just cause I implemented it off the cuff after getting nervous the week before and running the game as normal.

There was however some dissension that one player felt that they should be able to add dice as soon as something in combat changed what action they were capable of taking. After the game we had a short discussion (more like a best friend debate) and ended up resolving it. He ended up agreeing that only adding dice when your initiative dice comes up works if, and only if there is no talking to other players on your actual turn. This is my intention with this system anyway, so it was really just me and him agreeing that things need to run smoother. Everyone sort of agreed that as we get more familiar with it, it's going to move faster.

The most consistent praise was that it was dynamic, and it definitely changed the flow of battle. A kobold rolled really low and made an escape which let him trigger a trap ending up in a collapsing ceiling. Honestly, one of the better combats ive ever run (i'm a fairly new dm though)

I ran weapons of different types with differently weighted die and that was a change to this system I absolutely think is worth implementing. Also, spells are d6 to cast, when it gets to your turn you can cast a cantrip immediately, and have to wait the spell level in initiative to cast anything else. strategically, it makes spells harder to use, and gives a little bit of versatility to lower level spells. This might be tough at higher levels though.

Oh and also the UA for 5E came out on this, if anyone would like to take a look.

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lmao nevermind they got in a inter-party bar brawl that lasted two hours so problem solved.

I have about half the party playing tonight, and I'd like to keep them around the town for story reasons. Does anyone have some good short encounters that make sense for low level players that will keep them engaged, but essentially be little side quests? This is a little time sensitive so I appreciate any replies a lot.

The town is a fishing villiage. They don't necessarily need to be combat encounters by the way, just something to keep them busy and having a good time.

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