Griffon

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Ok, short and sweet, are sneak attack damage dice doubled when you score a critical hit?
I can't for the life of me find a ruling about this
Thanks!


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Really? I mean, we did have thosee moments in mid or high level pf1 when we rolled high and declared "my attack is about twenty/thirty highyish" and the GM would just say "ok, you hit". But now modifiers are much much simpler, there's less buffs, it just feels easier to know exactly how much you rolled. I haven't played higher than lvl 7, though, so maybe that's it


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NemisCassander wrote:

I have filled out all of the surveys, even though my group has stopped the playtest due to lack of interest, and the chances of playing PF2E when it launches is basically nil.

I will say, though, from someone with a background in how to write (and analyze) survey questions, the devs need to seriously work on writing their survey questions. Without imputing nefarious intent, it is very clear (to me, at least) the expected response to most of these questions, and I would guess that the survey results are biased because of this.

Again, I am not imputing blame here, and I doubt the devs are even aware of the bias in their questions and selected answers.

Should the designers wish to discuss this, I am easily reachable here.

Can you provide a few examples of this, so someone who does not have any training on this can see what you mean?

Thanks!


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My group has decided to use the hard DC of the enemy that damaged you (if more than one enemy, the highest one). The rationale is that a higher level enemy has more powerful weapons or causes more vicious injuries, and it parallels nicely with the recovery DC when dying


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ClanPsi wrote:

Penn: Yeah, but that only solves the problem specifically for Goblins taking that specific racial feat. Everyone else is screwed.

Actually, It doesn't really solve the problem. Goblins could already select a wolf; both cavalier dedication and Steed Ally (paladin) have the caveat that for cultural reasons a GM can allow a different kind of animal, and goblin lore points to them hating horses. It's not really a problem if your GM is reasonable.

The problem is that the wolf still does not gain the mount trait, so it cannot use any non land speed while you mount it. Why do you care? Because paladin mounts gain the ability to fly


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Nah
High level combat takes 20 minutes IF you are an experienced player. 5 noobs (including the dm) that have to look up rules in a pdf in the middle of combat take a lot more time. And that is what's happening, we're all noobs in pf2


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Hey, there. This is just a long rant with little in the form of analysis or suggestions. This just the tale of a goblin and his dog

So, I made myself a goblin paladin for a homebrew campaign. I'm still level 2, but I'm planning my build up to 20.
On level 3 I'm going to pick steed ally, but as goblins hate horses, I'm picking a goblin dog (technically a wolf, but it's supposed to stand in for any canid). The problem is, it doesn't have the mount trait, and there is no way for it to gain it.
There is only one mount (the horse), and it's an animal goblins are known to hate. I've looked for solutions, but to no avail:

1-there are goblin dogs and riding dogs in the bestiary. They don't have the mount trait

2-there is a goblin ancestry feat that looks tailor made for this fluffwise, but it fails crunchwise because it doesn't give your mount the "mount" trait:
ROUGH RIDER FEAT 1
Any creature that will bear your weight can
become your loyal steed, and you know how to coax even the
strangest beasts into service. You gain the Ride feat, even if you
don’t meet the prerequisites. You gain a +1 circumstance bonus
to Nature checks to Handle a goblin dog or wolf mount. For more
about the Nature skill, see page 152.

3-There are many paladin class feats that empower your steed, including the option to have a specialized companion. (As an aside, specialized companions gain by default +2 to their int bonus. The paladin exclusive specialization, auspicious, gives +2 to their int bonus. By RAW, your steed gains 4 to int bonus and reaches companions the equivalent of an intelligence of 10/ end aside). So, lucky me, there's a specialization just for this: Racer, but IT UNBELIEVABLY DOES NOT GIVE THE ANIMAL THE MOUNT TRAIT

Sooooo, it kind of feels that the game is fighting against the concept, and it really really shouldn't, because goblins are kind of paizo's thing. They wanted them to be core. They are little and angry and funny and ugly and scrappy and they love fire and they hate horses and dogs. I'm not usually uptight about respecting the canon fluff, and in fact I usually don't even read it. But this time you (paizo) succeeded! I actually care about goblins and want to play as a goblin and want it to feel like a goblin. And the damn rules won't let me!

Proposed solutions, because I'm not just going to rant:
A- first of all, please clarify that auspicious does not give +4 int bonus. Or clarify if it does

B-please just do one of these:
1-just give the wolf the mount trait
2-add the mount trait to the benefits of Rough Rider
3-add the mount trait to the benefits of theracer specialization
4-add the mount trait to one benefits of one of the paladin steed feats
4-add a riding saddle item that lets you add the mount trait to the animal

Any of these would do. You got me good, paizo. I'm hooked on your silly, horse hating goblins. Just let me play that concept.
You will make a goblin and his dog very happy


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Qazyr wrote:

I'm curious how having a problem with /ˈdiːmən/ and /ˈdiːmən/ and not with /koʊm/, /bɑm/, and /tuːm/ makes us silly.

It's just a joke because they are written the same way and they are pronounced differently, while demon and daemon would not be pronounced differently if English just had a systematic way of translating letters to sounds


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shroudb wrote:

you, as a player, don't even need to know, but as a DM it's a very, VERY handy table to keep open in front of you at all times.

This is kind of off topic, so I'm sorry about this, but I just found this reasoning very very wrong. I'm only writing this because the designers seem to share this notion that I find really weird, and with really impractical consequences in the way information is organized.

I need to know the dcs when I'm making a character. I need to know precisely how much of my scarce resources to allocate in each thing I'm going to try to do.
If my concept is of a great crafter, good swordsman and mediocre swimmer, for example, I need to know how to organize my skills/abilities/whatever so as to actually be a great crafter, good swordsman and mediocre swimmer. If, for example, a modest resource allocation on "swimming" can only get me to the level of "lousy swimmer", then maybe I don't want to build my pc that way, because I rather be a mediocre performer than a lousy swimmer. And all these decisions are made at character creation, so the dcs should not be in page 330 in the DM section.
Dcs being hidden in the middle of the book only accomplishes longer times when creating characters
/end rant, carry on


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Flames of Chaos wrote:

So in Pathfinder 2, you can only use your animal companion on a turn you want to access their abilities? (action 1, handle animal, action 2 command animal, action 3 animal companion gets their 2 actions)

Nono, the worst possible reading still gets you to spend 2 actions (one to Handle, one to Command) to get two animal actions in return.


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Alchemaic wrote:
Rameth wrote:
Chess Pwn wrote:
It seems via the twitch stream last Friday that a shield with hardness 3 blocks an attack that deals 3 damage it takes a dent. And if the shield is used to block and the attack would deal 6 damage the shield is destroyed (2 dents) and the user still takes 3 damage.
In the stream he didn't actually clarify what we've been talking about. So we still don't know which way it works. All he did was restate what was already in the book. He didn't talk about reduction in damage first or after the fact or not at all.

I believe he did say that the shield gets dented and the rest of the damage passes through, which would be "hardness isn't applied to the shield at all". The problem is pinning down that exact line in a 3 hour livestream.

And I just managed to find it. Timecode is 2:47:05 at https://www.twitch.tv/videos/301012575

JB: Alright so you shield block?
EK: Yep.
JB: He is going to do 9 points of damage, so that's reduced by the hardness of the shield.
EK: Which is 5.
JB: Which is 5.
EK: Which means I'm going to take 4 points of damage.
JB: So you take 4 and the shield is dented.
EK: Correct.

As an additional bonus, I also got my question answered which is if you can shield block with the knowledge of how much damage you're going to take. Just need that noted in the rules now.

I did not expect that. This means that hardness is actually hp for the shield (and not what we usually refer to as hardness, that is, a damage reduction), and "number of dents" is just an hp multiplier.

This makes shields worse than the alternate way some (most?) of us were running it. I haven't played in high level combat yet, but at lvl 7 a Sturdy Shield with hardness 10 would have been dented by pretty much every single attack, which means that after 2 rounds (when it's broken and you don't want to risk having it destroyed) the only thing it does is prevent you from wieding a bigger weapon


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Arachnofiend wrote:
Blueskier wrote:
Arachnofiend wrote:
Mark Seifter wrote:
Arachnofiend wrote:
All I want to know is: Did the healer Barbarian have the Cleric multiclass archetype?
Yep. Some of you guessed it right away because I described her as unhealthily obsessed with Gorum.
Cool, so martial classes are dead then. If you don't have spells, you can borrow them from a class who does. Sigh...

Nope

Mundane character concepts are dead. Which is good. Being non-magical is not a character concept that is level appropiate after lvl 5

Yes yes, caster fans are always happy when other people get their toys taken away because their way is the only right way to play, I'm fully aware by now.

Don't put words in my mouth, it makes it look like you are arguing in bad faith.

All my characters in 10 years of pf, except for an alchemist in like 2010, have been martials. That means their primary method of combat resolution was to stand in front of the biggest enemy and sword them in the hit points. What martial does not mean is that they have no access to magical effects or ways of interacting with of magic. A barbarian that can dispel with his axe or a fighter that can enchant his weapon with x-bane are martial characters.
Having a character that cannot interact with magic except by failing will saves is not a character concept that is level appropiate after lvl 5. Yes, I know I said it before, but I'm repeating it because that is what this conversation should be about, instead of you misrepresenting my argument


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Arachnofiend wrote:
Mark Seifter wrote:
Arachnofiend wrote:
All I want to know is: Did the healer Barbarian have the Cleric multiclass archetype?
Yep. Some of you guessed it right away because I described her as unhealthily obsessed with Gorum.
Cool, so martial classes are dead then. If you don't have spells, you can borrow them from a class who does. Sigh...

Nope

Mundane character concepts are dead. Which is good. Being non-magical is not a character concept that is level appropiate after lvl 5


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I'm playing a fighter right now. Mutation Master 13. It's pretty cool: I wield an elven spear with a shield, because I have 3 arms; I can fly very fast, cause the mutagen keeps my dex really high so I can use a light armor and still have good ac (36 with mutagen on); I am the face of the party, albeit my skills aren't very good, I'm just better tan the rest; Cut from the air & smash from the air let me use my 11 attacks of opportunity per round to cover my party when they are wounded; Warrior spirit lets me have bane on demand, but also Greater Distracting, Planar, Heretic, Treasonous & Mimetic, all of them situationally great weapon qualities. I can sneak, trip, attack at range, ignore dr and lock down casters (disruptive + spellbreaker + greater disrupting) all with moderate success.

All in all, I like my character and I don't get bored because I can do a bunch of different things. I'm not a batman wizard, of course, but it's nice.

However, that required going through a bunch of different books, spending hours scanning for useful feats & weapon qualities, choosing a weird weapon (reach + finesse) that determines my race (elf) and so reduces my hp and my dpr, because 1d8 20x3 is not very special.

So my point is that you can make an interesting fighter, but the cost in time and effort is really tough. And you still can't do anything overtly significant. I can't teleport to the other side of the world, I can't créate a demiplane, I can't heal, I can't overcome a trapped door. Stamina points are a joke; they don't do anything, just a bit more damage here and a bit more damage there. Advanced armor training it's also kinda bad. Apart from the one that gives you skills and the one that lets you craft magic arms & armor, the rest just don't do anything.

So, yeah. I don't think the fighter is in an disadvantageous position compared to the other martials. I don't think paladins, rangers & barbarians are head and shoulders above it. So, in this respect, I think fighters are done. Fixed.

Of course, casters are another story. M/C D, etc.


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I've had a deathmage 10(3rd party gish)/paladin 1. No, not paladin 2, just one level


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I don't know about you, but using a jingasa was fun for me. Splat surfing is fun. Navigating through an endless amount of useless items until I find one that is not crap is fun, because I get to experience a kind of "player level up" (as opposed to a "character level up"). Everytime a char of mine bought a jingasa I felt good, because I had found out about a cool, powerful option.

In contrast, everytime I buy a ring of protection or a cloak of resistance (items with the same dominance in their respective slots) I feel like I'm being forced to buy an uninteresting item just so my char doesn't die. Nerfing the jingasa while leaving the big six unscathed seems like a terrible move IMO


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If "Starts a ridiculous penis measuring contest by dismissing a fellow gamer's char" was an option for flagging a post, all moderators would have to work overtime


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Knitifine wrote:
Pixie, the Leng Queen wrote:
I mean, what does it hurt if your charavters DOESNT suck at everything AND has character.
By restricting your characters only to the hypercompetant you close off at least as many character types as you open up. Thus good characters are sacrificed on the altar of optimization in order to feed your own ego trip. And if another player in the game has decided to play one of those characters you run a high risk of invalidating the things they are good at simply because you made a character who's good at everything.

So, the fighter with 20 STR invalidates the fighter with 16 STR, just like the latter invalidates the fighter with 12 STR, who invalidates the fighter with 8 STR. Optimization is not binary, it is a scale. You and your group get to choose where you stand.

That has two important corollaries. 1- it is arbitrary and consensual. 2- it is not an indication of your personality. It does not determine whether you are good guy or someone bent on "harming the game".


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When mantaining a swordmaster Tiger trance, how exactly do you resolve the charge? What kind of action is the CMB check?

My guess is that you can check as a free action once per turn. If you succeed, you can pounce. If not, you can do whatever you want. There is nothing RAW to support this interpretation, I know, but "seems" right, because the way it's currently written you get to make as many checks as you want, even many times against the same enemy, because

Core wrote:
Using an extraordinary ability is usually not an action because most extraordinary abilities automatically happen in a reactive fashion.

The other sensible possibility is that you make the CMB check as part of the charge, and you get to pounce if you succeed and if you fail you make a normal charge. This is, however, vastly inferior.

So, what do you think?

Tiger Trance:
Ex: The swordmaster pounces upon her opponents, striking with the ferocity and brute force of a wild tiger. While in this trance, a swordmaster can make a combat maneuver check against an opponent within charge range. If she succeeds, she may charge that opponent and make a full attack against that opponent.