You couldn't be suggesting Pathfinder is not realistic could you?
If you think that is bad the original A D & D rules has rounds a minute long, in which time you normally get one attack. I have done years of martial arts and I can throw out at least 12 attacks a second.
That is around 720 a minute and 72 in 6 seconds.
You couldn't be suggesting Pathfinder is not realistic could you?
If you think that is bad the original A D & D rules has rounds a minute long, in which time you normally get one attack. I have done years of martial arts and I can throw out at least 12 attacks a second.
That is around 720 a minute and 72 in 6 seconds.
If Pathfinder used your abilities for the rules, EVERYBODY would be playing monks! Hahahaha!
By the way, clarification on a ruling here: I just realized, sleeping people based on what the RAW says for the sleep spell: "Sleeping creatures are helpless. Slapping or wounding awakens an affected creature, but normal noise does not. Awakening a creature is a standard action (an application of the aid another action)." (Bold added). I won't apply it for the current combat, but in the future I believe that the act of jostling someone enough to tie them up, not to mention that when one tightens the knot it is going to cause some pain (slapping/wounding), will wake them up and give them a possible reaction towards someone trying to tie them up. Feel free to comment and/or discuss.
Have any of you ever been tied up? I have! When I was younger, my older brother and I used to take turns tying each other up and seeing how easily and/or quickly we could get out of the the knots. Believe me, my brother did NOT make it easy! When that very first knot gets tightened it hurts! And yes, on occasion we would even do it were any pulling on the rope caused it to tighten around the neck! Of course we always stayed there to supervise and make sure no one actually got hurt, but ...
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In those days, initiative was also modified by weapon speed, and those who used the missile attack rules found they were attacks per segment, instead of attacks per round. Movement and melee attacks were assumed to be per round, with many attacks thrown and blocked, but only a few having the opportunity to land and do real damage per round. Movement assumed you were picking your way across the battlefield defensively (before the days of AOO) and was also round-based.
We had archers 120 feet away shooting at us and tried to charge them. Two rounds of movement equaled two minutes, and 2 minutes (20 segments) of missile weapons cut us down with dozens of arrow hits...Whereupon we decided to discard the obviously flawed system and us simple initiative, much like it is done today in Pathfinder (and in DnD v3+).
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Ideas for tying a sleeping enemy...
Relevant text from d20prsrd:
If you have your target pinned, otherwise restrained, or unconscious, you can use rope to tie him up. This works like a pin effect, but the DC to escape the bonds is equal to 20 + your Combat Maneuver Bonus (instead of your CMD). The ropes do not need to make a check every round to maintain the pin. If you are grappling the target, you can attempt to tie him up in ropes, but doing so requires a combat maneuver check at a –10 penalty. If the DC to escape from these bindings is higher than 20 + the target’s CMB, the target cannot escape from the bonds, even with a natural 20 on the check.
I would say it is reasonable that this would wake someone up, although they would need to wait until their next turn to react. I suppose if you are rough enough to do damage while starting the tying up process, you might wake the individual and end up in a grapple.
I see it as kind of a game balance thing. You don’t want to make it so much harder to restrain someone than to coup de grace them that you force the PC’s (or enemies) into certain murderous tactics...
Stormstrider, I'm going to argue with you on the sleeping/tying up thing, for two reasons. One, the Sleep Spell, calls out that it is a standard action, specifically an application of the Aid Another action, to wake up someone. Obviously I'm not going to be "aiding" an enemy. Which means that waking an enemy would fall under that "slapping or wounding." Which is the second reason for my argument, slapping or wounding an enemy in Pathfinder happens very specifically, via the loss of HP. Might it "hurt" when you tie someone up in real life? Sure, but as the most recent discussions have very well proven, the rules of Pathfinder are not even remotely designed to simulate reality. They are rules for a game wherein the players do their best to approximate an alternate reality. There are no rules that say binding a person with rope causes them to lose hit points. If you would like to make such a rule, I would not be opposed to that, because it would mean that if our characters were likewise knocked unconscious and attempts were made to tie them up, then we would wake up and could combat our own capture just as easily.
More specifically, slapping someone in Pathfinder would be an application of the unarmed strike rules, and wounding someone, in general, I would think is simply a clarification of what it means to lose HP. If, however, we want to look for specific situations in the rules that discuss wounds, the most thorough place is the Heal Skill listing. This skill has two applications that have the term "wound" used. One for wounds taken from caltrops, the Spike Growth spell, or the Spike Stones spell. All those entries are specifically in relation to the speed of a character being permanently changed because of wounds suffered during HP loss. The other instance is the "treat deadly wounds" entry, and that actually does specifically say that a successful check to treat deadly wounds is accomplished by the restoring of hit points.
I realize, sometimes, as a DM it can be frustrating to have NPCs knocked unconscious through magic, and then bound against their will, but also, as a DM, sometimes having the PCs knocked unconscious through magic, and bound against their will, is a necessary tool to further the story. Reality may agree with your assertion on the matter, but the rules do not, at least insofar as my reading of them goes.
That's my 2cp anyway. :) Thanks for reading.
Thanks as always for your input Mended! You make some good points. I shall take some time to meditate upon it.
Personally, I miss the "Use Rope" skill from 3.5. I know, this is NOT a popular opinion! But to me that was more realistic as far as to how 'good' - or knot! not- knot, get it? Sorry, couldn't help myself! ;-) - at tying someone up, and a good target # for getting out of it. It was balanced and VERY variable on both sides of the equation.
AND I find it interesting that no one else has answered the "Have any of you ever been tied up?" question. Perhaps people don't want to admit to some bondage roleplaying with their significant others? :-O ;-) Hahahaha!
I cannot recall ever being tied up... O.o
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Sorry for the bad mood. I pre-ordered Pathfinder Kingmaker PC game for $45 more than a YEAR AGO! I knew it was going to be a while, but now it has been released (9/25/18), I still have not received a passcode or ANY other info from them about how to download my game, AND they have not answered neither the email nor the Facebook message I sent them. I realize that being launch day, they are most certainly busy, AND MANY people spent a LOT more money for this game then I did (They raised well over $1,000,000 - well, some must have backed out, cause now the site says $909,057 [quite a difference!] on their kickstarter and that does not include my $45 since I had to do it as a pre-order! So how many others pre-ordered as well and their $'s are not included in that number?) but now, without ever having made a post in their forums, or speaking ill of them in any public manner, I have been banned forever from their website? (I have a copy of the screenshot to prove this statement.) So, right now I am quite pissed off, and I AM SPEAKING ILL OF THEM TO EVERYONE I KNOW.
BEWARE, STORMSTRIDER MAKES STORMS WHERE HE STRIDES.
I did have a good thing happen to me come to think of it. Making another backup character for my tabletop Pathfinder game. Rolling 4d6 and subtracting the lowest for my ability scores, I rolled: 16, 15, 17, 12, 15 & 16!!!!! I made sure I took a screenshot of that and sent it to my DM! (Using dice-roller in Hero-Lab.)
As I said to another friend, with Stats like that, I can play ANY class I want! :D
I cannot recall ever being tied up... O.o
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I have no comment on this discussion.
I did have a good thing happen to me come to think of it. Making another backup character for my tabletop Pathfinder game. Rolling 4d6 and subtracting the lowest for my ability scores, I rolled: 16, 15, 17, 12, 15 & 16!!!!! I made sure I took a screenshot of that and sent it to my DM! (Using dice-roller in Hero-Lab.)
As I said to another friend, with Stats like that, I can play ANY class I want! :D
With those rolls, I might suggest a monk (unchained variety, preferably). Possibly a dwarf.
Monks are hard to play because you need a wide array of good scores. You need good STR, DEX, CON, and WIS.
For the dwarven monk I would do:
STR 17 <-- at level 4 put a point here
DEX 16
CON 17 (15+2 race)
INT 15
WIS 18 (16+2 race)
CHA 10 (12-2 race)
Use a Sansetsukon two-handed as your main weapon. At 1st level you will hit at +4 and do 1d10+4 damage, and you can flurry with it.
I have no comment on this discussion.I cannot recall ever being tied up... O.o
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Neither do I.
And I don't know what Japanese Rope Bondage is. And am not even aware of the concept.
Stormstrider- I think you post in game about shooting when it isn't indicated is a bit OTT. Not wrong, just OTT. It is quite easy to mix things up in PbP.
That is very rough. And explains the odd mistake.
Can you two take a bit of time for a good sleep and to cool off. I am enjoying the game and would prefer what should be a very minor incident not get in the way.
Can we kiss and make up? Perhaps with the help of some Japanese Rope Bondage. Whatever that is. :)
Again, my apologies to all, but especially Sama, for my rude outbreak last night. Please forgive me. Amazing what a few hours of sleep can do. Sama, I sincerely hope you are able to get some sleep and that things go better for you at your job and life in general as well.
Also, when I woke up this morning, I found a generic email from Owlcat games giving the registration keys for all that had pre-ordered the game. It was NOT a an answer to my email. There has not yet been an answer to my email or either of my Facebook messages to them. But at least they have finally sent the info how to download - MORE than 24 hrs later than it should have been, but done. So ... slightly appeased on that end. We shall see how the game is. Still downloading, only at 10% right now, so going to be a while ... And I have my tabletop Pathfinder tonight? Oh my ... priorities, priorities, which will mine be?
How is the new job going Stormstrider?
Boudacia, my new job is going ... okay? Still waiting for computer access to the main program they use for taking the calls, so I am still in 'training mode', just sitting there listening to other agents on the phone. That is supposed to be changing soon, probably today. And still VERY slow and boring! But hey, I'll be glad to let them pay me to be bored.
My guess is that, if Stormstrider got Kingmaker up and running. We won’t hear from him for a while...
;o)
I will admit that is typically a fair statement when there is a new video game I'm getting. However, be it known that when I got home from my tabletop game last night, I first checked in on my PBP games and made any updates needed, before getting into the game! And the same thing this morning after only about 4 hrs of sleep! There have also been a copule of rather lengthy PM's with Mended/Aldy (about other things, not really our game). Putting my 'responsibilities' first. And I plan to get a decent nap this afternoon before work, because I could not make myself sleep later this morning. ... Now, off to Pathfinder Kingmaker!!! :D
So, on the whole - does trying to tie up a person wake them up or not issue; I believe that in RL, yes, it does wake them from normal sleeping usually, but a drug-induced or chemically assisted sleep? Maybe, maybe not, depends on the drug etc., etc.
So for simplicity sake, normal sleep, you will most likely wake someone up (situational circumstances, blah, blah, blah), magically induced sleep, you will not. So someone sleeping due to Boudacia's hex, will not be woken up from tying (unless there is some sort of rare situational modifier, but I can't think of any such case?!?). Fair and simple enough?
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On regularity or frequency of posting; Since this was originally started saying that daily posting was expected (or I should be notified as soon as your able to), I believe I am going to rule that if approximately 48 hrs have passed from when I announce it is your turn in the initiative, and there has been no activity from you in the gamepost section, then I will Bot your turn. I believe that is fair. Does anyone have an issue with this?
EDIT: Considering many of you do not seem to post on weekends, I will keep this in mind when considering the time frame.
That said, Gansu has not made a game post since Tuesday, going on 3 days now. So I am going to go ahead and Bot him this time.
*** In case any are curious about the hour of this post, I had a bad migraine, called in sick today. Slept most of the day. Better now.
Hello folks.
I'm afraid I've been bedridden for several days. My stomach is still in knots but I'm starting to feel better and I hope to catch up soon.
Bot me in the meantime if necessary.
Sorry to hear that Gansu. I figured something was up, not normal for Gansu to go that long without posting. Hope your back up and swinging that Nodachi soon! - And that was only small centipede poison, not giant Uriel! Hahahaha!
I would like to clarify, I am NOT very familiar with Golarion and the entire Golarion 'universe' so to say. So, when I chose my DM alias name as The All-Seeing Eye I had no knowledge of this deity! I simply meant it as 'I can see everything you do' type of thing! (Aldy, this is NOT a spoiler! So far, the game has nothing actually involving this, it was just mentioned in passing.) When I came across this reference in the Pathfinder Kingmaker video game I was like ...Hmmm, maybe I should check this out and clarify to my players I didn't mean this! :-D
My character was all prepared for the arrival of further bandits, with a readied action to neutralise one. But I am in the wrong place and facing the wrong way.
My character was all prepared for the arrival of further bandits, with a readied action to neutralise one. But I am in the wrong place and facing the wrong way.
Yep. I thought of that when you specified that you were still on Gansu's shoulder. Sorry.
Hey it is not your fault Stormstrider. Just a bit unfortunate.
The good news is: I can log in and see/read/post things on here from work. I just don't have the info to the module, so I probably won't be able to make any actual game posts from work, but at least I can read and think about my responses ...
And regrettably I cannot open the battle grid here at work either.
Also, it currently takes the big, black banner from the bottom of the page and somehow it comes up when I scroll down and so it blocks the screen behind it so I can't read it. For example, a post that I can only guess is from Aldy, the only part I can currently see is something or other about a dagger auto crit, so since Aldy was holding his dagger to the throat of the blue bandit I'm guessing that is who the post is from, but I can't even read the rest of it because of Paizo's banner blocking the view!!! GGGRRRR!
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Work is going fine and boring. Finally have my own desk and taking my own calls. Being Monday AND the first of the month it has been a little bit busier, so I did take some calls today, but still not many. Currently 12:18am, since 10:00 pm I have received 1 or 2 calls is all. And that seems to be very normal. I think I may have taken a total of 15 - 20 calls for the WHOLE day so far? (English callers do get more calls, but not many more at this hour.) How does this company make a profit?!?!? I sure don't understand it.
So from home I am able to read Aldy's post just fine. That was weird! I hope it was just a temporary glitch.
Hello folks.
I'm afraid I've been bedridden for several days. My stomach is still in knots but I'm starting to feel better and I hope to catch up soon.
Bot me in the meantime if necessary.
Currently I have no idea if Gansu is feeling better or not. I certainly hope so! ... In the meantime, it was 7:20 AM central yesterday when I posted his initiative is next, so he still has approximately 26 hrs left to post. Since his choices could prove important at this point, I really don't want to bot him. I think if he has not posted by 8:00 AM Central on Thursday, 10/4 then I will say he delays for the time being. Unless the whole party votes against waiting until then, and wants me to dealy him now, and move on.
Hey guys. I'm back and trying to get caught up on my games.
If you have to invent a poison DC on the fly you can always use the creature's CR or HD as a baseline.
Poisons that are the result of monster bites use a formula that is 10 + (0.5 x the monster's HD) + Ability Score bonus (usually CON for natural poisons)
Note that this is a general rule for save DCs overall. It works basically the same way for spells too.
The problem is the intensity of a poisoned item like an arrow or dagger will not have anything to do with the wielder's CON score. So you have to "wing it." Note though that poison is also treasure. So it also depends on how expensive you want the poison to be. The stronger it is, the more valuable.
If you have to invent a poison DC on the fly you can always use the creature's CR or HD as a baseline.
Thanks for trying to help, but the module does not even tell me what creature the poison is from, so I can't base it off of the CR or HD either.
What I am using is some vials of poison that are found in another room on this level. Just ruling that since they actually have vials of this poison, then maybe that is what these guys are using.
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Nothing to do with the game. Someone else posted this elsewhere saying, This is how Bards fight! and I enjoyed it enough I thought I'd share.
First of all guys, Happy Thanksgiving if any of you happen to be in Canada.
If you are in the US, I guess I could say Happy Columbus Day (or as I prefer, Happy "Guy who was looking for China and found Puerto Rico" day)! :)
Secondly, moving this from the main thread.
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Know what... I apologize too. My tone wasn't very helpful, and and I should have waited to cool down before posting. I regretted it after I posted.
Know what... I apologize too. My tone wasn't very helpful, and and I should have waited to cool down before posting. I regretted it after I posted.
Thanks for saying that Gansu. I regretted my posts as well.
And Happy Canadian Thanksgiving Day!!!
And, as Gansu said, Happy "Guy who was looking for China and found Puerto Rico" day to us Americans! Hahahaha! That's funny Gansu, I'm 'borrowing' it! :-D
Okay, so call me confused or whatever.
First, I know I have trouble remembering the rules. I'm, sorry. For whatever reason, my brain just has trouble retaining those. Not to mention that there are so many of them!!!
Second, I know I sometimes have trouble separating what makes sense in reality, from the way the RAW is written.
The second one is giving me issue again. I cannot seem to find anything in the RAW that specifies if you can make an AoO while holding a readied action or not. If any of you knows something in RAW, please share it and that will settle this. No need to read on. Otherwise:
To me, readying an action means that you might stand in a specific pose or position or manner, holding your weapon in the most advantageous position for the action you want to take (in the case of readying an attack of course) or doing whatever is the most advantageous for the action you are readying, thus the term 'readying' = you are getting 'ready' to take a specified action. So logic says if you are specifically doing something to get into a 'readied' position, and then decide to do something else, such as attacking a different target in a different position, then you have to move out of that 'readied' position you were in, and would thus no longer be 'ready' for that other action. Does that make sense?
Am I missing something in the RAW? Or is this just one of those 'gray' areas not clarified in Pathfinder? And if it is one of those 'gray' areas, then what do you all think please? If RAW does not specify one way or the other, than it would seem to be up to DM interpretation correct?
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Okay, so call me confused or whatever.
First, I know I have trouble remembering the rules. I'm, sorry. For whatever reason, my brain just has trouble retaining those. Not to mention that there are so many of them!!!
Second, I know I sometimes have trouble separating what makes sense in reality, from the way the RAW is written.
The second one is giving me issue again. I cannot seem to find anything in the RAW that specifies if you can make an AoO while holding a readied action or not. If any of you knows something in RAW, please share it and that will settle this. No need to read on. Otherwise:
To me, readying an action means that you might stand in a specific pose or position or manner, holding your weapon in the most advantageous position for the action you want to take (in the case of readying an attack of course) or doing whatever is the most advantageous for the action you are readying, thus the term 'readying' = you are getting 'ready' to take a specified action. So logic says if you are specifically doing something to get into a 'readied' position, and then decide to do something else, such as attacking a different target in a different position, then you have to move out of that 'readied' position you were in, and would thus no longer be 'ready' for that other action. Does that make sense?
Am I missing something in the RAW? Or is this just one of those 'gray' areas not clarified in Pathfinder? And if it is one of those 'gray' areas, then what do you all think please? If RAW does not specify one way or the other, than it would seem to be up to DM interpretation correct?
The RAW text for readying an action does not say it keeps you from making an AOO. The RAW text for AOO does not say readying an action stops you from taking AOO’s. As far as I can tell, that is all you need to allow it.
To get a bit deeper, there is nothing in readying an action that indicates you have to do anything special to ready the action. It is a standard action you sacrifice on your turn so you can take a standard action that interrupts another’s action if a triggering event occurs. We add flavor to it to make it fun—like saying the sword is poised to strike—but that’s not part of RAW.
Nothing about the game. Just me talking about my job.
So, how bored am I? I just sat here available, waiting for a call, for 3,589 seconds (59 minutes and change if my math is right?) And finished with the call in only 75 seconds (1 minute & 15 seconds).
Only so much Mahjong, Solitaire, Backgammon, Checkers, etc., I can play before getting bored. Can't get on Youtube, Facebook, or any videos.
Suggestions?
I use this as a time waster when I'm too tired to concentrate on things.
The RAW text for readying an action does not say it keeps you from making an AOO. The RAW text for AOO does not say readying an action stops you from taking AOO’s. As far as I can tell, that is all you need to allow it.
I can see why this would be a conundrum as it "feels" like an AoO ought to interrupt a readied action. Technically Uriel is right but you could house rule it if you want.
Nothing about the game. Just me talking about my job.
So, how bored am I? I just sat here available, waiting for a call, for 3,589 seconds (59 minutes and change if my math is right?) And finished with the call in only 75 seconds (1 minute & 15 seconds).
Only so much Mahjong, Solitaire, Backgammon, Checkers, etc., I can play before getting bored. Can't get on Youtube, Facebook, or any videos.
Suggestions?
Do you have a tablet? Some classic CRPGs can now be played on tablet (e.g. Baldur's Gate).
I don't have a tablet, and they would not be allowed at work anyways. But thanks for the suggestion! Not even allowed to have a book. And technically we aren't supposed to use the internet either. I would literally go insane though if I had to just sit there 'twiddling-my-thumbs' all night!
Baldur's gate?!? available on tablet? Then surely they could also be played on my laptop?!? I MUST search this out! Just getting to play those again would be a slice of paradise for me!!!
BeamDog studios released an updated "enhanced edition" that you can get on tablets and play on laptops.
They also remastered BG2, Planescape: Torment, Icewind Dale, and Neverwinter Nights.
BeamDog studios released an updated "enhanced edition" that you can get on tablets and play on laptops.
They also remastered BG2, Planescape: Torment, Icewind Dale, and Neverwinter Nights.
THANK YOU!!! THANK YOU!!! THANK YOU!!!
Uuuuuhhhh!!!!! Now, how in the world am I going to have time for all of this?!?!?
Stormstrider, I don't want to start an edition war here, but, this very discussion is one of the things that I very much like about how 5e is streamlined for combat. In 5e if you use your action to ready any kind of action, when the trigger for that action comes, you must have available your reaction. If you have used your reaction for any other thing, like say an OA (that's what they're called in 5e), you then LOSE the readied action, though you could "reset" the ready action by using your action again on your turn in the initiative. As you say, that seems much more realistic. Of course Tabletop RPGs and realism are two things that mix about as well as oil and water. :P Just thought I'd point out one of the reasons that, as a DM, I left Pathfinder... almost a year ago now(!), and have never looked back. :D
Also! Storm-meister. I sympathize and empathize with your boredom at work. Thankfully my job does not put restrictions on what I can do on my computer. :D However, back when I was actually concerned about job security (read: didn't watch Netflix on company time :P) I turned to reading books in my browser as a way to deal with the hours spent without something proactive to do. This website has a consortium of public libraries that all have selections of electronic books, many of which you can read right in your browser. If you have a library card at one of the libraries in the consortium, you can check out the electronic books and read them right on the computer screen (if it's available in browser read format). If that doesn't work for you, there a NUMBER of online creative writing communities, a place for amateur authors to submit their work for feedback and constructive criticism. One such, the Den of Amateur Writing, has a decent section of fantasy fiction to take a look at. They have other categories of material as well, but fantasy is my favorite genre, for obvious reasons. XD Hope that helps you combat the boredom.
Thanks Mended! Edition war? Nope, not even going there. Too much invested in Pathfinder already.
But the reading stuff, sounds great! I've tried that a little, but somehow what my library listed as books to read on-line, only came up as audiobooks?!? And I can't listen to them at work. I'll check out the info you provided when I'm at work tomorrow night.
And the stuff to be able to update Hero Lab for 5E, apparently needs to come via email? Sending you a PM. By the way, that comes from ... uumm? What was the northern Barbarian character we had for a bit at the beginning? Anyhow, from him!