**Lots of things**
As it were, the whole bonded-soul thing came around relatively late in my background-planning stage, so it wasn't too hard to edit out. Even then, it was more of a cool idea than anything major in their stories, so I figured they'd appreciate not being put through the ringer.
As for Shift, sounds cool. I appreciate it. As is, I'm not 100% sure how my characters will develop (I like to let it flow organically, with only a basic idea at the start), so it may end up being that Sylvia never goes down the tree- but I get the problem with letting Shift apply to that feat tree, now.
As for the Sindarin, thanks for the tip. I'm not really used to Elvish (I haven't done too much translating, and just thought it would be a cool nod.), so sorry about that mistake. I also like the Gwaihir idea. I might go with that rather than Herutelthoron. It's much more of a direct reference.
Also, as I'm fleshing out my followers, I'm realizing more and more how much deeper they are than just "Darivan's minions." A lot of them have independent goals and motives, their own story arcs, etc. Could I switch some of them out, as time goes on, and sort of "send them off," so to speak, allowing them to transcend the normal follower limitations, advancing off-screen as NPCs whose story arcs have separated from Darivan and Sylvia's (for you to use or ignore at will)? Just as an example, I have a dwarf smith-turned-warrior whose village was destroyed by a dragon, and has now sworn vengeance on said dragon. It just feels like the natural progression for the dwarf to reach level 4 or 5, then continue his journey, wandering the land, continuing his training elsewhere. Mechanically, I would just dismiss the follower and replace them, which isn't technically allowed by RAW (so far as I can tell), but it seems like it should be possible.
(Actually, come to think of it, I'm assuming that I can level-up the followers, rather than just recruiting new, higher-level ones, which is what RAW seems to suggest. Do correct me if I'm wrong there.)
Well I Believe everything is good here. The only thing that I'm not all that confident about is the gold. I know I have quite a bit leftover in trade goods, I'm just not sure if my (Bad) math is close to correct or not.
I just want to spend a Lil more time on the background for these two, Winnie and William (Formerly talon, too 3dgy 5 me. Don't know why I liked that name at first thought.) Lawsrick with their two daughters Lonie and Arien.
Draco and his cohort is about done. Draco doesn't really apply to any of the campaign traits. But he has a region trait. Would that work?
Looking at your stats, I see you have Varisian Tattoo, which, as a racial trait, fulfills Wyrm's requirement of
Traits: 2, 1 must be Racial or Kingmaker; +1 from 1 Drawback.
(Italics mine for emphasis).
So your trait selection is good.
And Here's Winnie. I spent SIGNIFICANTLY less time making her build than Williams, but the way I'm imagining her I'm just falling in love with.
A bubbly genius with a strong bond with her kids and a love for vampire novels and horror stories. It's why she (in a rare moment of poor decision making) moved to the northern border of Ustalav after all.
Her moving sets in motion the events that are the relevant sections of William and hers back story!
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P.s. This has actually been the most fun I've had making characters in a long time. I dont usually make characters with this level of detail and I appreciate you setting these expectations of us as to make the best possible group. This is honestly one of the nicer recruitments I've been in and I must say good job sir GM!
Is there anything more you require from Legacy players Wyrm?
Make sure you've updated your character re: the additional attribute points and such, update yourself on the tracking sheet, and you're good to go. Discussion and RP pages have been created for the legacy characters. Speaking of which ...
Actually, I have a bard I'd like to apply, let me just alter him for this game.
Here Is the alias. I'm working now so I won't be able to work on him for a little bit. I already have some Backstory set out for him.
Right. I'll answer your other questions later on in this post, but though you do have to reapply, things WILL be weighted in your favor, i.e. I'm significantly more likely to accept your character. 's what comes of being a legacy player, right? ;)
... I'll keep it at +1 and try to provide at least some guidelines of its advancement.
Sounds good, and ...
Since I believe once you add a special property you cannot remove it afterwards (i.e. no saying it's adamantine now and removing the adamantine property next level just to fit the price for a +2 enchantment) ...
Even if you could remove properties afterwards, since adamantine is not so much a property but the actual material the sword is made of, I am assuming you would not be able to do that anyway.
You are both absolutely correct.
Will you be capping followers like the leadership chart does or will you be expanding upon it?
Mmmm, expansion.
While I saw somewhere (I can't remember where) the fact/idea/suggestion/concept that followers are limited to 6th level max, and of course the chart only goes up to a Leadership Score of 25, I don't go with that - either of them. You do have to lean in that direction to achieve a Leadership score of 30 in order for your cohort to manage to make 19th or 20th level (presuming you took that appropriate feat, mythic or otherwise); why should you be restricted to a maximum of 163 followers?
I am using, and am going to go by, the Hero Lab past-25 results for followers. I will, in addition, be expanding the top end; if you throw everything you've got at gaining followers and all, then followers and all you will get. And before someone asks, let me ask the question:
If my Leadership score says I can have a follower of a level at or above my own or my cohort, do I get the follower(s)?
Yes - yes, you do. As stated above, however, they are not willing to traipse along with you into the Emerald Spire superdungeon or whatever craziness you get into; these are people who are movers and shakers themselves, who believe in the same things you believe, who are impressed by you in specific and are therefore backing your play. They might be able to provide, at cost or at minimal markup, goods and services, but it is vanishingly unlikely that you'll get such a level of follower. Right now, for example, you'd need a LDR Score of 22 for a 6th level follower, 26 for a 7th, and 29 for an 8th. While I do expect your characters to have boatloads of followers when they hit the top end, it is incredibly unlikely anyone will manage to get more than a 12th-14th level follower.
Also, as I'm fleshing out my followers, I'm realizing more and more how much deeper they are than just "Darivan's minions." A lot of them have independent goals and motives, their own story arcs, etc. Could I switch some of them out, as time goes on, and sort of "send them off," so to speak, allowing them to transcend the normal follower limitations, advancing off-screen as NPCs whose story arcs have separated from Darivan and Sylvia's (for you to use or ignore at will)? Just as an example, I have a dwarf smith-turned-warrior whose village was destroyed by a dragon, and has now sworn vengeance on said dragon. It just feels like the natural progression for the dwarf to reach level 4 or 5, then continue his journey, wandering the land, continuing his training elsewhere. Mechanically, I would just dismiss the follower and replace them, which isn't technically allowed by RAW (so far as I can tell), but it seems like it should be possible.
(Actually, come to think of it, I'm assuming that I can level-up the followers, rather than just recruiting new, higher-level ones, which is what RAW seems to suggest. Do correct me if I'm wrong there.)
I am entirely in favor of there being a certain amount of 'ebb and flow' when it comes to followers. I do not, however, believe in 'dismissing followers'; you can do so, of course, but if you do so you will not gain a replacement. Followers, like cohorts, are not puppets of your PC; they are people in and of themselves. They are people who have chosen to offer you their service; if you dismiss them from your service, you don't suddenly find someone else wanting to work for you.
RAW, your followers never gain in level; you simply gain new ones of higher level.
Followers don't earn experience and thus don't gain levels. When you gain a new level, consult Table: Leadership to determine if you acquire more followers, some of whom may be higher level than the existing followers.
This to me has always seemed exceedingly stupid, and I allow followers to advance even as the player does. Coalhouse, for example, has a 3L Zen Archer monk follower who is somewhat more dedicated to his cohort sister. When said sister gains her leadership feat in two levels, the ZAM will become her 5L cohort. To replace her, an elder sibling (Ghent Maston) who is 2L now would not only progress as a 'prime follower', but also take the ZAM's place as one of the top-leveled followers.
Therefore, such people will always remain your follower to a certain extent; this means you can / will have to bring them back at some point, whether at the same level or a higher one is immaterial, within a character level or two of your own. (Unless, of course, you've decided they died - but then you should tell me that too, and I can cackle madly and rub my hands together, because Plot Point!!) In cases like this, yes, you gain followers who replace them, but that's because there's an IC reason that you've OOCly spent time and energy thinking about, developing, and putting into motion. As a consequence:
House Rule
You cannot send a follower off unless you have, for at least three of your own levels, 'evolved' the follower through their own storyline and in doing so developed a reason for the follower to depart. After another three levels, either the follower must return to your service or have an explanation as to why they will hereafter be away from it - brainwashed by a cult, taking care of their aging parents, maimed (though this one does not necessarily prevent returning as your follower - and should, in fact, earn them some consideration from you), or death.
I am looking into this but I got a couple questions,
A, where can I find story feats and do I really need to take one? I don't even know what these are (never was a big one for supplements myself).
The link has been given; yes, you need to take one, as it is and becomes a driving force in your characterization.
B, in the 3.5 dmg there is an example witch spell list. Could I use that spell list with an otherwise standard sorcerer? Fits the the bg I currently have in mind better and I never liked the PF witch (which isn't allowed anyway, though since I don't know why, I don't know if a better witchy spell list would be bad).
As I don't have the 3.5 DMG, I can't say yes. If you want me to make a positive decision (i.e. one in your favor), you need to provide me with information.
However, in general
Anyway, I figure on using the noble house Devilbane I created previously, but in this case a member of one of the branch families that doesn't get much, thus runs a mercenary/militia company of outcasts that aims to demostrate that not all individuals of certain races are evil (such as orcs, kobalds, etc. Tieflings of course because they are a major part of Devilbane history). The main character using her name and influence to get opportunities for her company to do good work and build a reputation of being honorable despite being a company with several traditionally outcast races.
The main pc seeing this as a chance to get all that should have come with her name as well as furthering the goal of her company.
How fascinating. Sounds wonderfully and completely inappropriate, since 'the noble house Devilbane (you) created previously' doesn't exist in Brevoy, does it?
Okay, that was snarky. I don't mind people coming up with new and interesting things. Usually I can blend them into my game pretty easily, should it seem interesting enough, and should the player seem flexible as well. So sure, go ahead and make your character a scion of the (non-Brevoy) noble House Devilbane. Just remember that once you submit the character, your control over House Devilbane in my game vanishes into my hands. Everything you want to have taken place, all of the attitudes and actions of House Devilbane, unless it's available at character acceptance (and not necessarily even then), leaves your control - which means there's no 'oh, House Devilbane wouldn't do that' coming back from you, because like I said in the first post and in the campaign information, you play yourself and your cohort, and whatever of your followers you care to pose; I play the rest of the world.
So sure, go ahead - but be forewarned.
For story, I'm thinking I'd be a druid from a circle in either the Narlmarches -- or maybe the Thousand Voices -- who would have a vested interest in the elimination of banditry in the region via the desired 'update' to the sixth freedom, especially with so many raiding groups using the forests as hideouts. Does this sound like something that would work and I could/should expand on?
Overall, the concept is just fine; I admit I'm not insanely concerned over group balance, so 'what I am/become' isn't of exceeding concern to me. I would be interested to discover how a druid in the Narlmarches or the Thousand Voices would be in Brevoy only a month (in the winter!) after this 'push to colonize' announcement was handed down. ;) On the other hand ...
For Everyone
When developing your backstory, realize that it is winter. In the Golarion locale equivalent of Poland. Which means (if you're snooping and looking at the brand-new gameplay page) not only is there snow on the ground, there's something like three feet of snow on the ground, with drifts up to fifteen feet tall here and there and maybe blocking the road. This means that for all intents and purposes, your character(s) basically need(s) to have been in or very near Brevoy for the winter - 'very near' being within 5 miles of a small town that itself is within 25 miles of Brevoy.
Yes, it is possible to have long-distance transmission of information as well as teleportation of people and goods; if you REALLY really want to have done that, the cost for moving all your people is going to come out of your starting gold, since it'll have been a Very Recent Expenditure, and not something that's part of the Standard Adventurer Background Package. Despite magic and all, though, news, people, and goods in Golarion still move via standard methods - typically traders and travellers, if not specific messengers.
So basically, if you don't live there, come up with a reason you're wintering in Brevoy.
*** 'Nature' characters and stuff ***
This is entirely up to y'all. I can recommend groups if you would like, but if it gets down to that, it'd come after I determine who is actually going to be in the game. Remember, however, that nature is red of tooth and claw, and there is nothing whatsoever that requires you to know the others - or even be well-disposed towards them.
I forgot it can do that. Really not enough to justify its exorbitant price but it does affect three different attacks. So there's that.
Well, standard-wise, hand it to a monk and turn their entire body (headbutt, fist, shin, foot, elbow, etc.) into a magical weapon that is much more difficult to take away. So ... while it may be difficult to justify the expenditure for your critter, the item's usefulness for that class is pretty darn good. ;)
I will do that. Changed to Asura-spawn. For abilities I picked the following three ...
You receive: Cloud Alignment
You are aware of and can choose the result of any attempt to detect your alignment.This replaces the 'Darkness / Hideous Laughter' ability.
... vampire novels and horror stories ...
Good things:
Background people. I like how one of them is a nursemaid for the kids.Community supplies. It's good that you grabbed the basic idea / permission and ran with it.
Bad things:
Vampire novels. AFAIK, and I would presume with the exception of the very largest and most cosmopolitan cities, vampire novels don't exist, per se, in the Pathfinder world. You have to be relatively well-off (servants and the like) to be able to afford books for leisure in a medieval world; that and considering that vampires are real, they would definitely not be any kind of romance, gothic horror or not.
6550 gp worth of trade goods. Where, may I ask, are you sleeping? What are you feeding your wolf if/when you can't hunt? Look at Coalhouse and Alysandra for my idea of a decent list, or check out Packing Your Covered Wagon for a pretty well researched example of what you need when you're about to walk out into the wilderness for the rest of your life. (Heck, neither Coal nor Aly have the really needful things, like a wood axe ...)
Please, people, refer to point #3, 'realism', in the 'About Myself' section. That includes letting you freeze to death in the middle of a Brevoy winter for not having bought shelter and cold-weather clothing ...
Hi,
Given that you are going to cut our starting unspent gold over 250 to 1/20, I took the freedom to purchase a lot of the expedition expenses on advance, even though we still have a month till the oathtaking ceremony. Is this allowed? And if it is, once we get down to 250 gp, how are our expectations on living expenses? I mean, I suppose I am not expected to buy a house with my initial money, but how much should we expend monthly and, more important, how much do we earn?
Also, is this more or less what we are aiming for? I think I grabbed many more things than your links recommend :)
Supply Wagon 300 gp
Covered Wagon 500 gp
Tent, Pavillion 100 gp
Silk Ropex3 30 gp
Grappling Hookx3 3 gp
Hooded Lanternx3 21 gp
Oilx12 1.2 gp
Sunrodx20 40 gp
Journal 10 gp
Scrivener's Kit 2 gp
Ink 8 gp
Axes and Shovels (2 each) 4 gp
Sackx2 .2 gp
Chest, Mediumx2 10
Bucketx2 1gp
Chain 20 ft. 60 gp
Climbing Kit 80 gp
Cooking Kit 3 gp
Fishing Kit .5 gp
Grooming Kit 1 gp
Healing Kitx2 100 gp
Mapmaking Kit 10gp
Mess Kitx5 1 gp
Mwk Artisan's Toolsx2 110 gp
Set of Cards and Dice 1 gp
Waterskinx3 3 gp
Gear Maintenance Kitx2 10 gp
Signal Whistle x4 3.2 gp
Torchx10 .1 gp
Blanketx6 3 gp
Refresh Horse (heavy)x2 400 gp
Food and Drink for Animals and People worth 1200 gp (not sure if this is too much or too few)
Total gp: 3003.8
Once again, thank you for your patience - I thought better ask first than lament later.
I'm toying with the idea of creating an amnesiac due to a traumatic event, giving you total control of what background eventually ends up uncovered and to what extent. Any thoughts?
I found this. For those interested these are a few different types of wagons. It does include the price for a covered wagon, which is 500gp and they comfortably hold six people. I assume that number is for the people in the wagon as it is traveling and not the drivers. If I am wrong please let me know.
Great Recruitment Wyrm, super detailed! Good luck to those chosen Wyrm is a great player and I am sure will be a responsive and dynamic DM.
Please, people, refer to point #3, 'realism', in the 'About Myself' section. That includes letting you freeze to death in the middle of a Brevoy winter for not having bought shelter and cold-weather clothing ...
Gotta buy more shit now. Question though. If I have cold resistance, do I need to worry about cold weather?
Please, people, refer to point #3, 'realism', in the 'About Myself' section. That includes letting you freeze to death in the middle of a Brevoy winter for not having bought shelter and cold-weather clothing ...Gotta buy more s@~& now. Question though. If I have cold resistance, do I need to worry about cold weather?
By RAW cold weather deals untyped damage (Ain't that a kicker) but published material such as Reign of winter seems to infer otherwise with certain encounters that couldn't happen if it DID work that way.
Far as I know there hasn't been an official answer but the community seems to think so.
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Then the halfling needs a winter coat but the tiefling is good in underwear in all weather conditions.
Vampire novels
Yeah. Twas more a joke than anything. I do however disagree with you about only the rich having access to books. Librarys exist in most moderately sized citys and a smart person such as Winnie would definitely make use of them.
6550 gp worth of trade goods. Where, may I ask, are you sleeping? What are you feeding your wolf if/when you can't hunt? Look at Coalhouse and Alysandra for my idea of a decent list, or check out Packing Your Covered Wagon for a pretty well researched example of what you need when you're about to walk out into the wilderness for the rest of your life.
Thanks for the advice. I also looked at it again and apparently 1000gp of trade goods weighs roughly 1ton... Yeah so I spent a lot more on a few more animals, some gear for the cold, more food (And meat for the wolf), and a magic item.
Hope that helps things.
Then the halfling needs a winter coat but the tiefling is good in underwear in all weather conditions.
That seems to be the way Paizo plays it. *Shrugs* GMs call though, I'm no authority.
Given that you are going to cut our starting unspent gold over 250 to 1/20, I took the freedom to purchase a lot of the expedition expenses on advance, even though we still have a month till the oathtaking ceremony. Is this allowed? And if it is, once we get down to 250 gp, how are our expectations on living expenses? I mean, I suppose I am not expected to buy a house with my initial money, but how much should we expend monthly and, more important, how much do we earn?
The 'expecdiction expenses' look fantastic; exactly the sort of thing I am encouraging people to do.
In regards to the timespan, realize that the game is not starting at the time of the posting of the Declaraion; the game is starting the day before the party and oathtakings, as seen in the current Gameplay thread (set up for the legacy players to have something to do for the next 3-4 weeks. ;) ). Even so, though, considering that most people live on 1 GP or less a month ... I think you'd manage. ;)
I'm toying with the idea of creating an amnesiac due to a traumatic event, giving you total control of what background eventually ends up uncovered and to what extent. Any thoughts?
I'm toying with the idea of not picking the character.
Seriously, it's a bad idea. You're trying to establish a personality for the character, the GM is left trying to figure out what that personality is and WHY it got that way. I can't honestly think of a nastier thing to do to a GM in a game this size.
It does include the price for a covered wagon, which is 500gp and they comfortably hold six people. I assume that number is for the people in the wagon as it is traveling and not the drivers. If I am wrong please let me know.
Gave that link earlier. The number of people indicated is the number of people, including the driver, which it transports. Also, I believe I went into the actual weight that each point of cargo actually represents, but I'm not completely positive; I may still need to decide that. Anyhow.
Vampire novelsYeah. Twas more a joke than anything. I do however disagree with you about only the rich having access to books. Librarys exist in most moderately sized citys and a smart person such as Winnie would definitely make use of them.
Review what I said - books for leisure. Libraries as we know them today, the 'public library', doesn't exactly exist. They're research libraries, and you have to pay for access, and the more valueable/rare the work, the more you have to pay.
I'm certain that in Absalom or the few other Golarion cities over 25,000 there are 'trash tracts', crappy writing printed on crappy paper, sold for a couple coppers a copy. In general, though, only in a city that size can such an industry provide sufficient sales for a living to be made at it. In general, storytelling is where it's at.
Then the halfling needs a winter coat but the tiefling is good in underwear in all weather conditions.That seems to be the way Paizo plays it. *Shrugs* GMs call though, I'm no authority.
The GM's call is 'exposure is more than just heat/cold.' IMO (and thus IMR, in my ruling), resistance is to sudden damage, not to gradual environmental factors. It will help ... prolong the agony of freezing to death, perhaps; call it a +1 to your save against environmental damage for every 3 full points of appropriate resistance you have. But you can only walk out into a blizzard in your underwear if you are well and truly fully Immune to Cold, or handle desert heat if you could take a bath in lava. Beings whose native plane is that sort of thing - elementals and the like - but where the sheet doesn't actually have 'immunity to X' would be considered to be immune to Material Plane environmental effects of that nature - though not to their home plane's version of whatever-it-is.
There is a lot in this thread. After work I will look for that post. Thank you
AFAIK, the closest printing presses to Brevoy are in Andoran or Galt, and they mostly print political literature. Part of the reason the Pathfinder Society is so popular/powerful is that they're one of the main publishers of entertainment nonfiction—which our characters, being wealthy, can probably afford/obtain far more easily than their followers.
I will be drawing up a pack mule fighter, with a ranger cohort. My idea is that they move valuable goods (salt) and contraband with a heavier focus on security than speed. My one big question before I start drawing these guys up is this: for my fighter, I really like the idea of a middle-aged or old dwarf, with a penchant for taking troublemakers from small towns under his wing in his convoy, providing discipline and escape from small town life. Mechanically this will make him much worse as a martial, a little better in social situations, and is a net loss of 3 stats across the board with a -3 on all his physicals. Provided that he takes no levels in any spellcasting classes, are you ok with this TWO? I fully understand that by doing this I am putting the consequences firmly in the hands of you, our esteemed GM, and that it will surely bite me in the ass sometime down the line.
3.5 spell list: I'll type it up if I don't find a link when I get a chance, probably tomorrow night.
House Devilbane: I fully expect you to take and incorporate it and add your own flavor. Also, I specifically didn't tie the house to a location (aside from being a more wilderness district) so that I could drop them where ever needed. I've got plenty of material on them I'll write up. Do you want it here or in a pm?
How fascinating. Sounds wonderfully and completely inappropriate, since 'the noble house Devilbane (you) created previously' doesn't exist in Brevoy, does it?
What exists in Brevoy is what you accept as existing in Brevoy. :)
On a more serious note, is every noble house already named and listed or something?
Just remember that once you submit the character, your control over House Devilbane in my game vanishes into my hands.
As expected, so no problem there.
... like I said in the first post and in the campaign information, you play yourself and your cohort, and whatever of your followers you care to pose; I play the rest of the world.
Hey, another me! :)
A major part of my preferred style is that the world is a character run by the gm.
So I think I'll enjoy playing in your game, if I get in.
One question I have from an in-character standpoint is "Why on Golarion would Chalm send out exploration teams to claim the Stolen Lands in the middle of winter, for Gozreh's sake? Why is he sending us off in early Calistril, and not, say, the middle of Sarenith, or even late Desnus? Does he want us to freeze to death?"
From a more mechanics standpoint, given the fact that we're going off to explore/claim a vast wilderness territory, will it be even possible to bring a cart along? As you said that there would be some 3+ feet of snow basically everywhere, and blocking the roads, how feasible could it actually be to genuinely bring along a cart full of your gear as we explore the Stolen Lands? Would we be better off with a sled and a dog team? (I feel like I know the answer to that one.)
Also, since all this talk of pioneers has made me think of wagon caravans, are the wagons from Jade Regent available?
The impression I've gotten (and correct me if I'm wrong, TWO, as there is a lot of material here and I'm still reading) is that Noleski Surtova is essentially trying to beat Rostland to the punch in settling the Stolen Lands. Issia (led by Noleski) and Rostland are in something of a cold-war situation, and part of what is holding Rostland back from fighting for their independence is the threat of the Stolen Lands at their back - they are sitting between two threats, and can't deal with both. So the leaders in Rostland decided to try to entice people (with no previous affiliation with Issia preferably) to settle there, with the backing of Rostland, so as to calm that side down and hopefully establish someone friendly at their backs. They get to settle down a violent neighboring territory, establish a new friendly alliance, and they get to do it all without expending their own resources to do it.
Noleski, I gather, responded to this development by jumping on it instead of trying to stop it. Makes sense - people will do about anything to get titles and land, so it would be hard to stop. So instead, he hopes to establish someone there loyal to him instead of to Rostland, so that the same situation will present itself. He wants Rostland stuck between a rock and a hard place, and the best way to do that at this point is to steal their play for himself. In order to do that, though, he needs to act quickly, or it will be too late.
Ok got my concept, working on backstory and crunch!
Leader- Odinkar, Human Barbarian(Unchained) 7, a young and likable second son of a Kellid outcast and a minor Issian Noble. He goes to the river kingdoms to make his fortune and live in a free land like his mother's people. Along for the ride is,
Cohort. Olo Green, Odinkar's tutor and familial adviser. A worrisome elder Halfing Bard(archaeologist.)
Stats and backstory to come!
Quick question: Is it okay if my cohort is a goblin?
Sorry I didn't reply to this - meant to, forgot to.
Leader Races: Core primary. Featured races may apply, but I will select at most 1 Featured race out of every 5 characters. May take Paizo alternate racial traits but what it is a replacement for will be strictly observed.
Cohort Races: As PC, including 1 Featured per 5 characters.
So yes, your cohort could be a goblin - but it may significantly lower your chances, and may especially (since the cohorts don't have a minimum CHA requirement) screw you over in the social settings if the cohort is not only a 'monster race' to make it awkward to start with, but also socially inept to boot.
But the risk is yours.
AFAIK, the closest printing presses to Brevoy are in Andoran or Galt, and they mostly print political literature. Part of the reason the Pathfinder Society is so popular/powerful is that they're one of the main publishers of entertainment nonfiction—which our characters, being wealthy, can probably afford/obtain far more easily than their followers.
This is essentially true - and again, it's nonfiction, or rather, 'the events of Expedition X into the Y of Z.' I am in no way saying that printing doesn't exist, or that a wide variety of books aren't printed. In RL, the woodblock printing press (printing from carved wood blocks) is more a millenium old; the movable-type (Gutenberg) printing press nearing its 600th birthday. While I personally believe that what thunderbeard is talking about is the Gutenberg press (most of which presses likely get destroyed by the government as soon as they're discovered), the woodblock-style press is still going to print hundreds or thousands of copies of their books. The thing is, doing so is a laborious undertaking when it comes to creating the blocks (each sheet must be independently carved out), and as a consequence such things would only be commissioned by relatively wealthy people/groups - either because they want to rise in popularity (the Pathfinder Society), or because they are patrons of an artist (poetry, plays, etc.).
Long story short, while books for entertainment may appear in private hands, they're generally expensive things. Believe you me, one of the major eruptions in social structure is when the movable-type press gets its legs under it ...
I will be drawing up a pack mule fighter, with a ranger cohort. My idea is that they move valuable goods (salt) and contraband with a heavier focus on security than speed. My one big question before I start drawing these guys up is this: for my fighter, I really like the idea of a middle-aged or old dwarf, with a penchant for taking troublemakers from small towns under his wing in his convoy, providing discipline and escape from small town life. Mechanically this will make him much worse as a martial, a little better in social situations, and is a net loss of 3 stats across the board with a -3 on all his physicals. Provided that he takes no levels in any spellcasting classes, are you ok with this TWO? I fully understand that by doing this I am putting the consequences firmly in the hands of you, our esteemed GM, and that it will surely bite me in the ass sometime down the line.
I have no problem with people playing older characters and taking the attribute hit. My foresighted issue with the character concept isn't with that part of the idea, or even the 'get stir-crazy kids out of small towns' concept (which I think is a gem). The real problem will come with you selling me (or, rather, your character selling the king) on a smuggling operation.
For Everyone
(I keep doing these. :P ) As a reminder, while I'll be accepting each of y'all on you and your character's individual merits, Chalm Kowalskiy will not be. He will be accepting individuals who have already proven they can work within a group, because they're part of a group. He'll also be looking at those people's reputations - what they are known for, and how they are organized, and how they work among the populous, and that sort of thing.
So when developing a backstory, consider how, no later than 5th level, you would get together with two or five people and go out and gain a reputation - and a good, positive reputation, even if you yourself are a bit of a 'meh, true neutral' individual.
3.5 spell list: I'll type it up if I don't find a link when I get a chance, probably tomorrow night.
... crud, I never finished the rest of that statement.
What I meant to say is this: however, in general I am not likely to allow an nonstandard spell list drawn from a non-Paizo source, even if that source is D&D 3.5's DMG. I would have to do my very level best to go over it with a fine-toothed comb for balance and abuse potential, or simply (and more likely, considering the scope of the reviews I will have to do the week before Christmas) state that it's disallowed.
House Devilbane: Do you want it here or in a pm?
I don't want it anywhere until and unless you get accepted, to be honest.
How fascinating. Sounds wonderfully and completely inappropriate, since 'the noble house Devilbane (you) created previously' doesn't exist in Brevoy, does it?What exists in Brevoy is what you accept as existing in Brevoy. :)
That probably didn't come across the way you wanted it to. While the GM is the master of his campaign world, the play location (the Paizo boards), the campaign (a Paizo-published adventure path, however modified), and the campaign's world (Paizo's Golarion) all combine to create expectations between the GM and her prospective players - meaning everyone else applying, not just you. One of those expectations is that the GM is going to work with most of what has been provided about the world - that the shorthand of 'okay, you're in Brevoy and the River Kingdoms' allows the players to make a very large variety of assumptions that they can reasonably expect to be true.
Throwing stuff into that mix (such as 'House Devilbane') kind of murders that assumption in the alleyway outside, and can create disaffection among the other potential players.
On a more serious note, is every noble house already named and listed or something?
That definitely didn't come across the way you wanted it to.
House Garess - "Strong as the Mountains"
House Khavortorov - "We Won't Be Saddled"
House Lebeda - "Success Through Grace"
House Lodovka - "The Waters, Our Fields"
House Medvyed - "Endurance Overcomes All"
House Orlovsky - "High Above"
House Rogarvia - "With Sword and Flame"
House Surtova - "Ours Is the Right"
These are the major noble houses of Brevoy - yes, 'major'. But do you notice the difference between these House names and 'House Devilbane'? And have you really read anything about the politics of Brevoy? I suspect - or rather, I expect - the answer to at least the latter is 'no'. Either way, what you've been saying and how you've been saying it has enabled me to make a decision about 'House Devilbane'.
If 'House Devilbane' and everything you've written about them is absolutely necessary for your character, thank you for expressing interest, and I trust you will find some other GM to admit your character into his campaign; 'House Devilbane' and your writeup for it is not permitted. If, however, you can find it in your character to come from a cadet branch of the major Houses (Chalm himself is one such individual), or be able to say simply 'House Zlaboli' ('Evil-hurt') and give a handful of basic facts about them ('They're into mining in the Icerime Peaks, their patron is House Orlovsky' or whatever), they by all means continue to put together an application.
A major part of my preferred style is that the world is a character run by the gm.
The world isn't a character, though, is it ...
Interesting tidbit - the name of 'Gronzi Forest' in House Medvyed territory is likely a tweak of the Slovenian word for 'terrible', grozni...
One question I have from an in-character standpoint is "Why on Golarion would Chalm send out exploration teams to claim the Stolen Lands in the middle of winter, for Gozreh's sake? Why is he sending us off in early Calistril, and not, say, the middle of Sarenith, or even late Desnus? Does he want us to freeze to death?"
Am I missing something about this? Is there a reason Chalm Surtova is stacking the odds against his chosen champions, rather than simply waiting a few months? Is there really a situation that pressing that we aren't aware of?
The impression I've gotten (and correct me if I'm wrong, TWO, as there is a lot of material here and I'm still reading) is that Noleski Surtova is essentially trying to beat Rostland to the punch in settling the Stolen Lands. Issia (led by Noleski) and Rostland are in something of a cold-war situation, and part of what is holding Rostland back from fighting for their independence is the threat of the Stolen Lands at their back - they are sitting between two threats, and can't deal with both. So the leaders in Rostland decided to try to entice people (with no previous affiliation with Issia preferably) to settle there, with the backing of Rostland, so as to calm that side down and hopefully establish someone friendly at their backs. They get to settle down a violent neighboring territory, establish a new friendly alliance, and they get to do it all without expending their own resources to do it.
Noleski, I gather, responded to this development by jumping on it instead of trying to stop it. Makes sense - people will do about anything to get titles and land, so it would be hard to stop. So instead, he hopes to establish someone there loyal to him instead of to Rostland, so that the same situation will present itself. He wants Rostland stuck between a rock and a hard place, and the best way to do that at this point is to steal their play for himself. In order to do that, though, he needs to act quickly, or it will be too late.
The decision to act at this time is entirely political. While dwilhelmi is correct about the 'stealing a march / their thunder' aspect, it is not, by any stretch of the imagination, complete. By all means, however, please - everyone can absolutely talk about this, try to figure out WTF is going on here, etc. :D Be far more fun to do it ICly, I admit, but ...
Huh. That's a thought ... hm. Have to think about that for a bit. Be far more easy with both a) an up-to-date list of players and submissions, and b) having people grouped ...
(Seriously, though, the link is to a Google Docs spreadsheet. Put in your character's name, a link to them if you can, your name, their race / gender / class ... vote on the use of Prestige & Fame and Honor rulesets ... and that's all you have to absolutely do right now. Seriously helpful for me!!)
From a more mechanics standpoint, given the fact that we're going off to explore/claim a vast wilderness territory, will it be even possible to bring a cart along? As you said that there would be some 3+ feet of snow basically everywhere, and blocking the roads, how feasible could it actually be to genuinely bring along a cart full of your gear as we explore the Stolen Lands? Would we be better off with a sled and a dog team? (I feel like I know the answer to that one.)
A sled and dog team can carry supplies for movement for maybe two weeks. You'd want a sleigh, or runners for a wagon. And yes, in fact, I do happen to have a price guide for conversion kits that include the runners: half the price of the wagon itself, so 25 / 35 / 50gp for light / medium / heavy wagons.
However, if you have a number (a large number, which you do/will) of people and horses leading the way, snow drifts won't likely be an issue.
Also, since all this talk of pioneers has made me think of wagon caravans, are the wagons from Jade Regent available?
Death's Adorable Apprentice gave the link to those wagons earlier - I'd actually posted about it, but never gave a link. (Good job, DAA. ;) ) For runner conversion kits for these wagons, make it 150 gp, or 1,000gp for the armored or prisoner's wagons. (Different runners and more extensive reinforcement on them, due to the weight of the armoring.)
This is the cohort, I could always stick a point or two in diplomacy.
EDIT:there, a trait and a few ranks later and he is no longer useless in social situations.
Okay, I've now read the player's guide (and some other research) and I see where the comment about Devilsbane not being a Brevoy noble comes from, but I've also got inspiration for an even better motivation for my character.
The idea is that House Devilsbane is in Numeria bordering Brevoy and the river kingdoms. Though the House is more of a nominal rather than solid control, given Numeria's less structured government, they are seen with a bit of suspicion because their use of magic in the out of the way tribes, but they have mostly earned the mild trust of the locals from their efforts on the behalf of the people in healing, aiding the crop fields, and organizing defense.
The relations between House Devilsbane and the various tribes outside the House's two townships are that of mild trust and "Countess" Celia hopes to ally with Surlova as an alternate trade route, benefitting Surlova to have goods passing to and from the river kingdoms and the Sellen river unhindered by the Rostlands, especially should the civil war break out. This benefits House Devilsbane by bringing more trade and hopefully better food through the House's townships.
My character is basically acting as the contract binding instead of the more common marriage, mostly as a comprimise since House Devilsbane is ruled by women (only one male child having ever been born to the family) vs Brevoy's more male dominated structure.
Surlova might, possibly, also see House Devilsbane as having more experience in dealing with the river kingdom natives.
The real problem will come with you selling me (or, rather, your character selling the king) on a smuggling operation.
Challenge accepted.
By all means, however, please - everyone can absolutely talk about this, try to figure out WTF is going on here, etc. :D Be far more fun to do it ICly, I admit, but ...
Also maybe think about "why is YOUR character willing to leave Brevoy, immediately, in the middle of winter?" (Definitely works well with my background, though)
Oh, no worries, he has a solid 12 cha even with his ugly mug. Where he lacks in social skills he makes up in explosive. Plus he won't be talking to any lords. Draco is smart enough to disguise the goblin when he can.
Heh. Repulsively charming - an innocent maniac, as it were. Interesting.
However, to correct an assumption - he would, in fact, be in close (as in two feet away from) association with a large number of nobles in the near future. The cohort gets (more-or-less mandatory) invited to the Party as well, remember?
Okay, I've now read the player's guide (and some other research) and I see where the comment about Devilsbane not being a Brevoy noble comes from, but I've also got inspiration for an even better motivation for my character.
Why would House Surtova - not 'Surlova' - bother trying to ship goods overland and put caravans at risk by trying to get to the Sellen through Numerian Kellid barbarians, the Technic League, and all the other issues that would require, when they're firmly entrenched on the Lake of Mists and Veils, and have at their sub-rosa command a large number, if not the majority, of pirates and corsairs along that great lake's southern coastline for the 200 miles between Port Ice and Chesed in Numeria?
Plus, you're stretching a minor - if not entirely rogue - pseudo-House across at least 200 miles of unpleasant border, the majority of which a) has been commanded by Your Future King against the Kellid barbarians you're suggesting your House has been providing a buffer against, and b) is under the influence of Houses Garess and Lebeda.
And then there's the fact that your motivation of coming here to form an alliance with House Surtova is ... going to do absolutely nothing to get you into the game, since it is REALLY not taking place in Brevoy, and is functionally peripheral to the politics happening inside that country.
Your House Devilbane idea is no doubt a cherished brainchild of yours, and I can really, really appreciate that, believe me. But considering I have TOLD YOU that House Devilbane is disallowed, I'd very much recommend that if you still want to apply to this campaign, you roundfile both the House and the character in relation to this campaign, re-read the Kingmaker player's guide, consider the fact that the game STARTS with everyone leaving Brevoy pretty much for good, and come up with a new character and background. You've had your two posts of 'convince me' in regards to House Devilbane, and you've failed. Let it go.
Right now, however, you're doing #4 and #5 of 'How To Waste Your Time
And Mine'.
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Well, his diplomacy is now based off of Intelligence, so no matter how ugly he is, he can talk as well as most rogues.
And Draco has a hat of disguise. He lends it out to Ginks on occasion. If he really needs to, he will even aid the goblin with magic. Again, a bard is skilled enough to explain to the king and any lords why he is in the company of a goblin. Especially since his reknown is because he's an entertainer. Simple enough to say he's a performer. Simpler yet to say he is just a sideshow, which is not a lie.
I'm sure I could explain that away.
My bad, it's an Ioun stone, not a hat.
Too true. Just wanted to make sure you remembered, is all.
Hello, Jereru here. This is Tomas Dusek's cohort.
A question:
Associated Domain: Nobility.
Replacement Power: The following granted power replaces the inspiring word power of the Nobility domain.
Inspiring Command (Su): As a standard action, you can issue an inspiring command to your allies. The inspiring command affects one ally plus one additional ally for every three cleric levels you possess, who must all be within 30 feet of you. Affected allies gain a +2 insight bonus on attack rolls, AC, combat maneuver defense, and skill checks for 1 round. This is a language-dependent mind-affecting effect.
I can't see an indication about how many times per day this power can be used. Anyone knows?
A good question, apparently. It has not yet been FAQ'd. GM's decision is that you receive it the standard number of times per day for a domain power, '3 + your Wisdom modifier'.
(Reasoning: as Inspiring Word affects one person for (Cleric Level / 2) rounds, since Inspiring Command affects 1 + (Cleric Level / 3) people for 1 round, they effectively balance with each other, and thus should have the same number of uses per day.)
Seems fair to me, thank you.
So far, I haven't posted in the spreadsheet because I haven't submitted a character yet, and my ideas for what to build keep fluctuating. Do you want incomplete entries in the spreadsheet, with player name and tentative character info with no link?
I somehow missed your earlier response (just prior to my last post), looks like you posted it while I was typing and I didn't look to see if I had been ninja'd. I apologize for that.
Not sure how I was being a loner though.
Also where are you getting your info? The wiki and player's guide don't have a lot of what you just mentioned or implied you have access to.
Also, the map I have places that border much shorter and I noticed a lot of maps, even the seemingly official ones, tend to vary quite a bit, so it'd be nice to make sure I'm running on the same map. Though it might just be a miles vs kilometers mixup in this case as my map has it as 200 km.
I don't mind not getting that backstory, it wasn't even cherished or special, I'm just good at weaving things together. Of course I need stuff to do the weaving with.
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So I can't use the spelllist, okay, but here is a link to a thread with it should you feel like looking it over someday.
After all, I found it, may as well share.
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?274073-How-abusable-is-the-Wi tch-from-Dungeon-Master-Guide
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Now I'm off to see what I can salvage from those campaign traits. Don't really like them all that much, but I'll see what I can work out.
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Hey does anyone know of a spontaneous nature based caster? I don't do that prepared casting stuff.
Hey does anyone know of a spontaneous nature based caster? I don't do that prepared casting stuff.
Hunter
Jade Regent uses caravans with wagons of various attributes - armored, prisoner, fortune-teller's, supply, and finally covered, which is what you would want. A covered wagon houses and carries 6, though its cargo capacity is reduced from 10 (that of the supply wagon) to 4, and consumption (number of horses) goes from 1 to 2. Hmm.
I'm going to stick with the cost (500 gp); the weight left for cargo is a tough call, because Jade Regent varies from 50 lb per cargo unit to 500 lb per cargo unit (to 56 cu. ft. per cargo unit). Not that PF wagons are especially accurate (as a Conestoga wagon is designed to carry 8 tons - 16,000 lbs - as compared to the 4000 lbs the 'heavy wagon' has the capacity for). Hm. Treat this as a Medium wagon, with 3/5 of its carrying capacity removed, so it can now carry an additional 800 lbs of stuff.
Ok, found it. So just so that I make sure I am correct before I spend the gold. the covered wagon is a medium wagon and can carry 800 lbs of cargo and only six people?
Would I be able to carry more people if I had a covered wagon that did not carry any cargo?
Are you going to be using the caravan rules from Jade Regent?
And you said that that the followers will level with us, something that I love! It's weird that by the rules they do not. I just wanted to say that I like that in this case you are saying the rules are bad :D
Hey does anyone know of a spontaneous nature based caster? I don't do that prepared casting stuff.Hunter
Oh, I didn't realize they'd flipped it. Cool. Kinda sad to have the animal companion bit to deal with though. I don't normally use archetypes but for that I'll need to so I can get rid of the pet. In this case though the Feral Hunter archetype has abilities akin to what I want so it isn't too bad. And hunter adds that touch of martial ability as well.
Now I'm off to see what I can salvage from those campaign traits. Don't really like them all that much, but I'll see what I can work out.
Traits: 2, 1 must be Racial or Kingmaker; +1 from 1 Drawback.
If you don't like any of the Campaign traits, just take a Racial one instead. They provide similar flavor and some of them have quite nice mechanical benefits as well.
Also a nature mystery oracle would work.
Okay, concept skeleton,
I like the name Myrza so I figure on using that.
So Myrza is a rather unusual dwarf. She was raised in the river kingdoms by a lady that lived on the fringe of society but had grown a bit of reputation for her minor magic items and potions.
She passed this knowledge on to Myrza as well as her spellcasting. As Myrza grew older she ended up doing some jobs as a guide and guard and gained a bit of a reputation, at first mostly because of how unusual she was for a dwarf, but her skill and capacity mixed with her loyalty to the contract made that reputation a positive one.
Eventually her mentor died and Myrza took a job for group heading to brevoy that had lost several guards and needed more for the rest of their trip. Myrza was fascinated with the city being her first time in one. She found a place teaching magic of an entirely different form from what she already knew so she decided to stay and study this new style for a while. She continued to take local jobs for groups needing guards and wilderness guides. She created a company of guards and took on larger jobs to keep on paying for her studies. Her unusual style was also appealing to a handful of beginning students who asked to be taught her way of magic. So she has them join her guard company, where she trains her guards, all in the skills of guarding but some get taught more of magic.
As she is familiar with the river kingdoms, she occasionally takes jobs that go there or advises those who will be traveling through there.
This is just a basic sketch, but if this starting point seems good, I get into developing it more.
Edit; Why would she be selected for this trip? She has a good solid reputation including unwavering loyalty to her word and contracts, has useful skills, and has a native's intimate knowledge of the river kingdoms.
So far, I haven't posted in the spreadsheet because I haven't submitted a character yet, and my ideas for what to build keep fluctuating. Do you want incomplete entries in the spreadsheet, with player name and tentative character info with no link?
Thanks for the question. You can, yes; it can help give me an idea as to whom is interested and with what, and give other players some ideas and flexibility as to their own applications.
Also where are you getting your info? The wiki and player's guide don't have a lot of what you just mentioned or implied you have access to.
Most of the information I'm using starts at the two Wikis, then delves into their references. Other information comes from other Paizo sources. Still other 'factoids' come from logical evolution of what's right there, as based upon medieval politics and how trading routes work. If you had a specific question, I could track it down for you.
Also, the map I have places that border much shorter and I noticed a lot of maps, even the seemingly official ones, tend to vary quite a bit, so it'd be nice to make sure I'm running on the same map. Though it might just be a miles vs kilometers mixup in this case as my map has it as 200 km.
Probably the latter. Use miles.
I don't mind not getting that backstory, it wasn't even cherished or special, I'm just good at weaving things together. Of course I need stuff to do the weaving with.
You need accurate information to 'weave stuff together'. Get accurate information first.
So I can't use the spelllist, okay, but here is a link to a thread with it should you feel like looking it over someday.
After all, I found it, may as well share.
Seeing as the commentary says the spell list is a slimmed-down version of the Sorcerer, I don't see why you don't just use the sorcerer's spell list and restrict yourself to selections from that.
Now I'm off to see what I can salvage from those campaign traits. Don't really like them all that much, but I'll see what I can work out.
What Loup Blanc said.
*** character concept ***
Looks fine on a glance-through. See above re: Witch spell list, just as a note.
Ok, found it. So just so that I make sure I am correct before I spend the gold. the covered wagon is a medium wagon and can carry 800 lbs of cargo and only six people?
Would I be able to carry more people if I had a covered wagon that did not carry any cargo?
Are you going to be using the caravan rules from Jade Regent?
Thanks for the find. To 'carry' more people, you have to give up 200 lb of cargo space per person. And this is more than just straight-up carrying, this is also living space.
Jade Regent's caravan rules will not be in effect; this game is not about running a caravan across the trackless wastes.
And you said that that the followers will level with us, something that I love! It's weird that by the rules they do not. I just wanted to say that I like that in this case you are saying the rules are bad :D
Remember that depending on your leadership, they will not all level up at the same time / same rate, and that there will be times that you SHOULD attract new followers of more-than-1st-level.
I am quite interested in this game and have built Bartek Yaroslav as my leader character. The crunch is in the link.
I have filled out the recruitment sheet, excluding the scores and the cohorts first name and alignment.
Welcome; thank you.
In the alias is a link to a spread sheet with my 30 first level followers statted out by area of expertise. They have spent pretty much all of their wealth by pooling it together with some of Bartek's to purchase expedition supplies, which are all in the caravan tab of the spread sheet.
This is not a bad idea; it is also not necessarily a good idea. Wiser to first purchase individual items (armor, weapons, personal supplies) and then contribute to the central pool.
Writing up the full back story, the cohort stats, and the last 5 followers will take a few more days/weeks, but I figured I would submit this now. If there are any crunch issues, or if you want more detailed information on anything, please let me know.
I will; thank you.
Taking a gander at the Kingmaker player's guide would be a smart thing ... ?
I may have missed it somewhere, but I see that some people are submitting hybrid classes such as hunter and warpriest where you had initially stated core and base only. Did you happen to repeal that Wyrm?
Except for psionics, all Paizo if it can be explained into the region. (Like I said, background counts.) No 3rd party unless added below.Classes: Core and Base (no 3rd party). Barbarian, Monk, Rogue, and Summoner must be Unchained. No witches. Standard multi-classing, no variants.Does this mean all paizo is allowed for character options but we are only allowed Core, Base and Unchained classes?Okay, also: echoing the above question on classes—does this mean no hybrid, psychic, or vigilante classes? (Also, are PrCs limited to the original set of books?)All right, that's what I get for doing a 'copypasta' from someone else's old campaign, and not having my wits about me and my head in the game when it comes to PF classes and PrCs and stuff. So let me handle these one at a time, and please forgive me if my terminology is screwed up; it's pretty clear that I've screwed up the differences between 'Core' and 'Base' classes, and forgot things like the hybrid classes.
Psionics: For some reason I thought the psionics stuff was Paizo. (Dreamscarred Press, now that I actually look at the cover. Duh.) So thankfully that's by-definition out. :D
Psychics: Thank you for mentioning this, because I totally forgot about it. My apologies, but psychics adds another level of complexity to things, and I'd rather not go there.
P&P Explanation: Understand that I like the ideas for both of these; one of the best characters I played in early AD&D was a heavy-duty psionic class. But at least at the moment, both psionics and psychics (or both simultaneously, if they're essentially the same thing by different names) are rulesets that have been radically revised from what I learned lo these many years ago, and I'm pretty much completely unfamiliar with the revised versions. Maybe at some point I'll try to play in or run a game that's entirely psychic/psionic so I can get...
So yeah. This is about halfway down the first page, if you're interested in the full post.