Let's go.
Here are some rough guidelines for your name based on size:
Size (in hexes) 1 - 20: Baron(ess), Viscount(ess)
21 - 80: Count(ess), Graf(inya), Duke/Duchess
81 - 100: King/Queen, Prince(ss), Czar(ina)
Here the steps we need to start:
1) Choose Kingdom name
2) Choose alignment
3) Choose leadership roles and titles.
4) Start Treasury - you have 50 BP right now
5) Determine Kingdom attributes (Econ, Loyalty, Stability)
I have also put links to the exploration/knigdom map and the calendar in the spoiler above. That way you have access to both in both threads.
1 Looks like a choice between Fairhaven/New Something-or-Other/Menedek
2 NG
3 Do we need to ask Asha and Kesten to join us, or can we assume they're willing?
4 I will update the kingdom spreadsheet with our new riches!
5 In progress; just need stat modifiers for our NPCs: Wis/Cha for Asha and Darrick, Str/Con for Kesten
Asha and Kesten will be willing, as well as Darrick. The invites should be RP'd, but the stats go:
Asha WIS +2
Kesten STR +3
Darrick CHA +3
Agreed on the RPing, I just want the numbers to be correct for now.
Also: we don't have a Royal Enforcer. There's no penalty for not having one, but there's a nice bonus for having one. We should keep an eye out for a suitable NPC!
Gah, there's always one more thing...
Talia: you get to be flexible - you have a choice whether to put your stat bonus into being popular (Loyalty), being competent (Stability), or being rich (Economy). Eventually you get all 3, but not right now.
Once made, this choice cannot be unmade, so choose wisely.
Let me know which one you want.
Awesome. Dotting to get my name on the thread.
Well, Talia believes if you can show competence, then loyalty and money will follow, so...
Stability for the first modifier.
EDIT: Regarding OGGM's questions above:
1) I like Fairhaven. Gives a good, safe vibe for potential settlers. Barony or Viscounty both work.
Thanks Talia, I agree FWIW on Stability being crucial. I'll update the spreadsheet once I'm home.
Oh, yeah. Another thing.
Three other things.
Taxation
Representation
Promotion
Festivals
I suggest Normal taxation (+2 Economy, -2 Loyalty) Token promotion (+1 Stability, +1 Consumption) and 6 festivals/year (+2 Loyalty, +2 Consumption).
Not set in stone, let me know what you think.
Fairhaven isn't a bad name, I just wish it were a little more unique to us and our country. It also doesn't fit linguistically with the neighboring nations (or most nations in Avistan).
I'd prefer Barony to Viscounty.
Ah, but its unique linguistic-ness makes it unique to us and stand out in the region :)
Seriously though, I'm fine with going in another direction. Propose something!
Maybe we should ask everyone to propose a name, and then have a vote*?
*(with the consideration that no one can vote for the name they propose)
Include the title barony or viscounty with your proposal.
OK, my suggestion:
Barony of Hafen ("haven" in German)
OK, spreadsheet updated with all members of the Council (minus a Royal Enforcer) and with the taxation/promotion/festivals as proposed above.
The results are in:
Economy: 13
Loyalty: 9
Stability: 20
Consumption: 3
Unrest: 0 (for now...)
Treasury: 50 BP
As for a name, if we're going to revert to something more linguistically fitting for the region and sufficiently unique:
The Viscountcy* of Ulfgostrad
*Yes, apparently, that's how it's spelled
Dear Abadar, that loyalty score...
I believe Viscounty is the territory, and Viscountcy is the rank. "Talia was granted a viscountcy by the Swordlords to rule the Viscounty of Fairhaven."
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Spreadsheet is in the Exploration map/loot sheet link; if you tab along the bottom, there's a Kingdom Summary and a Kingdom details tab.
Dear Abadar, that loyalty score...
Sure, but look at the stability: you may not be popular, but you're sure as hell perceived as competent!
It is better to be feared trusted than loved...
Or alternatively we fill the Royal Enforcer position.
Ok, keeping things moving: we need to found a settlement so we can start our kingdom! This means we:
1. Explore the hex with the Stag Lord's fort (1 day)
2. Claim the hex (1 BP)
3. Build our first settlement (immediate and 1 BP if it's plains; takes 1 month and 2 BP if it's hills)
4. Construct a building (plus - optional - one tenement/house/mansion/villa).*
Once that's done, we can start the kingdom turn sequence.
*I suggest a Castle (we get 50% discount and it provides great benefits) and a Noble Villa (to stop Talia whinging about having no proper house the Castle gives a discount, and a villa provides further nice benefits)
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As your treasurer, I recommend not implementing edicts that will cost us Consumption until we have an economy to handle such. The bonuses to our income through a greater economy will not take care of the amount of BP we will eat through. Our current Consumption is 3, it will be 5 when we claim a hex and build a settlement. If we simply change our edicts in a couple of months once we're able to self-sustain and be sure of our resources.
My recommendation is no holidays for the first six months, no promotion for the first three months, and to make up for the lack of holidays, no taxes for the first year. We'll still make money, it's just such a low tax rate that people will be pretty happy about it.
In any case, my numbers tell me that this will give us between 12-15 more BP in the first year with which to build a better infrastructure for the future. I agree that those edicts suggested are a good place to end up, but to start, we might need to tighten the belt.
The recommendations for a Castle and a Noble Villa are good, I propose we move forward with them.
Also, looking through the game play thread, you have a reformed bandit by the name of Nat? Perhaps an Enforcer role would be useful for them. At the very least, we'll get a bonus to loyalty and the ability to reduce unrest should we need it. Since it's not really a prestigious position, we wouldn't even have to knight him, but that's an in game problem.
Ok, keeping things moving: we need to found a settlement so we can start our kingdom! This means we:
1. Explore the hex with the Stag Lord's fort (1 day)
2. Claim the hex (1 BP)
3. Build our first settlement (immediate and 1 BP if it's plains; takes 1 month and 2 BP if it's hills)
4. Construct a building (plus - optional - one tenement/house/mansion/villa).*
Once that's done, we can start the kingdom turn sequence.
*I suggest a Castle (we get 50% discount and it provides great benefits) and a Noble Villa (
to stop Talia whinging about having no proper housethe Castle gives a discount, and a villa provides further nice benefits)
I'd vote for houses for the people before a noble villa (and other 'necessities' like a granary, inn, general store, etc).
One of Talia's more radical notions (at least for the Brevic) is that the government should work for the people it has sworn fealty to, not work to line the pockets of the wealthy. Talia will be building her own home out of pocket. She plans on making her fortune through her as yet unbuilt theater/musical venue.
Castle sounds good. One of the nobility's chief purposes is to provide security to its subjects after all.
As your treasurer...
Nice! As an 8 wisdom ruler, Talia appreciates this advice.
Sad as it would be to have no holidays (and the attendant parties!), it makes financial sense to follow Kaalib's idea here.
We could also farm the hex with Concord in it, if I understand the rules correctly. That would lower consumption by 2.
Also, looking through the game play thread, you have a reformed bandit by the name of Nat? Perhaps an Enforcer role would be useful for them. At the very least, we'll get a bonus to loyalty and the ability to reduce unrest should we need it. Since it's not really a prestigious position, we wouldn't even have to knight him, but that's an in game problem.
Nat's a little too kind-hearted to be a headsman. He's the local boy turned to banditry through tough circumstances type of character, rather than happy to hurt willing bandit guy. He was brought back into the fold by Magna's kindness, and he's better suited to a life of farming, imo.
Farms are the backbone of any kingdom. We should build as many of them as we can and keep building them. Kaalib, I am thrilled that you proposed having no taxes - I agree wholeheartedly. They're a huge drain and don't provide us enough wealth to justify having early on.
If the hexes around Concord City are hills, that makes farms expensive - I recommend we move to expand north, and claim some plains hexes on a path to claiming Oleg's. That's a good way to expand and it'll be good to get Oleg's within our borders.
Once we start, you will have months to work on this. Don't get hung up on 'what do we do first'. You have 10-12 kingdom building turns to start.
Kaalib: Those are all great comments that I hadn't thought of; it looks like the others agree, so I'll update the spreadsheet accordingly.
Talia: that is radical! I like it. I was sure that she would want Nice Things...
Naralesh: agree entirely on the importance of farms, and on aiming to build them on plains if possible. Also, they need to be adjacent a river (or 2 other existing farms), so heading up the map makes all kinds of sense.
Oh, Talia wants nice things (she does take a lot of treasure in jewelry, after all). She's just sure that those nice things will come with a thriving populace, a strong craftsman and merchant class, and well-fed (and safe) laborers. There's some self-interest here, but it is all about the delayed gratification.
Re: Farms: It will be four turns at least until we can get a farm on a plain. Perhaps we should build one or two before then? Though I'm willing to see how our consumption shakes out without them before entertaining the thought.
And yes, Talia for one wants the gold mine.
Build Turn One: Desnus 4707
Phase 1: Upkeep
Step 1: Stability Check
Step 2: Consumption
Step 3: Magic Items
Step 4: Modify Unrest
Phase 2: Edicts
Step 1: Assign Leadership
Step 2: Claim/Abandon Hexes
Step 3: Build Terrain Improvements
Step 4: Create/Improve Settlements
Step 5: Create Army Units
Step 6: Issue Edicts
Phase 3: Income
Step 1: Withdrawals
Step 2: Deposits
Step 3: Sell Items
Step 4: Collect Taxes (Kaalib 1d20+13/3 round down)
Phase 4: Events
=no event
Phase 1 Upkeep? Don't really have anything to keep up, do we?
Step 1: Might not need, due to the fact that we have no hex, no settlement, indeed nothing at all to stabilize.
Step 2: Nothing built, no Consumption
Step 3: No magic items
Step 4: No unrest to modify.
Maybe we could start with phase 2:
Phase 2:
Step 1: Assign leadership as per kingdom sheet please.
Step 2: Claim Former Stag Lord's Fort as our own. -1 BP
Step 3: Terrain Improvements: Build Farm. -4BP
Step 4: Found Fort Concord. -1 BP
Build discounted Castle. -27 BP +2 Loyalty, Stability, Economy
Step 5: No Army discussion yet.
Step 6: Edicts, None. No holidays, no promotions, no taxes.
Phase 3:
Steps 1-3, not really doing them...
Step 4:
+8 BP
That look about right to everyone? We could possibly build a housing district, or raise a small army for defense yet. If anyone has any amendments to the above, or corrections if I have it wrong, let me know.
No armies yet. They're expensive as heck and unnecessary unless we're engaging in mass combat with another nation. We certainly don't need one on the first turn.
The rest seems to be good to my viewing.
Sidenote: Since it seems unrealistic to build an entire castle in one month (considering on Earth (albeit without the aid of magic) it might take decades), we might want to discuss how that translates into roleplay. Maybe we get the kingdom benefits for it now but in-character it's under construction for a while.
The D&D 3.0 book Stronghold Builder's Guide had some content on how castles got built with magical assistance - I'll see if I can locate my copy for some flavor ideas.
One thing: it takes 1 month to clear the (hills) site for Concord City/Fort Concord, so we can't actually build our castle (and house/noble villa if chosen) until Turn 2. I believe everything else functions the same, though the result of Kaalib's check this turn will be different (and any checks made next turn before the castle is built).
+7 BP and 49 BP total, if I am correct (+27 from no castle, +7 from check, -2 for site prep).
We need a room (with a privy) for our Privy Council!
In all seriousness, a meeting room would be good, and bedrooms for each of us in case we're under siege.
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Guess what? No taxes = no ECON roll. Phase 3, Step 4 is called 'collect taxes' for a reason.
Second, I pretty much said that there is no upkeep phase at size 0.
Third, you build in the turn we are in. I'm not going to try and keep track of 'what's due next month'. If you do it in this turn, the BP is spent, the adjustments are made to the ELC (Econ, Loy, Stab). If not, then you don't get the bonuses either.
Fourth, is Kaalib going to be the 'official report guy' each month? That's fine by me.
Fifth: building housing or tenements does not count against your total number of buildings for the turn.
Sixth, the fort hex is prepped already - it has a structure on it. 1 BP to claim it and found Concord-on-the-Lake as well as the Viscounty of Fairhaven.
Seventh (sheesh), the map will have to be updated to show all of this: claimed hexes, farms, forts, cities, roads, etc.
OK, Time the frag Out.
I need to update the spreadsheet before we go any further.
EDIT: OK, Turn 1 Summary so far
Economy 13
Loyalty 11
Stability 20
Unrest 0
Consumption 0
Treasury 22
Control DC 22
But - we only built a castle so far in turn 1, and no houses.
EDIT II: Screw that, I'm assuming we build a house. Anyone strongly disagree, let me know and I'll undo it.
EDIT III: I think that completes Turn 1. Go us!
EDIT IV: If you go to the Kingdom summary sheet, the town of Concord should be hyperlinked; click on it to view our dominion so far!
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Fourth, is Kaalib going to be the 'official report guy' each month? That's fine by me.
If Kaalib wants the job...
Sixth, the fort hex is prepped already - it has a structure on it. 1 BP to claim it and found Concord-on-the-Lake as well as the Viscounty of Fairhaven.
SWWWWWEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEETTTT!!!!
Seventh (sheesh), the map will have to be updated to show all of this: claimed hexes, farms, forts, cities, roads, etc.
I've got a date with Campaign Cartographer tomorrow night...
Fourth, is Kaalib going to be the 'official report guy' each month? That's fine by me.If Kaalib wants the job...
Other than the really busy weekends, I don't mind helping compile consensus. I do want to make sure we have everything added up properly. It's what the treasurer should do. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. If I'm late, rather than wait for me you can always just follow my template. Just go through each time we go up or down BP and make sure they are all there and run the math from there.
50 starting BP
-1 Claim Hex
-4 Build Farm
-1 Found Concord
-27 Discount Castle
-4 Build House
Roll for Economy= 10+13(Post Castle Bonus, regarding different edicts on spreadsheet)=23 +7BP
= Current BP
We also need someone to get a settlement grid and put our buildings on it. We're still up for volunteers. We should be able to do it in a spreadsheet on the Kingmaker Spreadsheets too, unless someone wants to do it more artistically. Also, for the next turn, we'll need someone to roll the stability. That should be Talia, probably, although any other volunteers are fine with me.
Sorry missed this earlier catching up.
Kaalib: it's 3 BP for a house, not 4 BP. But you're right, the collect taxes roll only gives us 7 BP, not 8. Spreadsheet updated.
OK, Turn 1 Summary:
Economy 13
Loyalty 11
Stability 20
Unrest 0
Consumption 0
Treasury 21
Control DC 22
We also need someone to get a settlement grid and put our buildings on it. We're still up for volunteers.
Unless anyone else wants to do it, here's the default:
1. Click on Kingdom spreadsheet
2. Click on the hyperlink to the town (in this case, Concord)
3. Result!
Note that the placement of buildings is completely open; I just wanted to get something that we could look at. If anyone has ideas for more rational/effective building placement, then speak up.
I've also put a hyperlink to the Kingdom Spreadsheet, as well as the Turn Summary, in my avatar, just above my portrait. Hope it helps.
Are we ready for Turn 2 now?
Ready!
Thanks for the spreadsheet, Vosil - it looks great.
And thanks for being turn report guy dragon, Kaalib!
Ok, turn 2 is GO; roll the stability check, wench!
Turn 2 is a go.
EDIT: Keep in mind that each of these is a month, so with Turn 2 we are already ahead of the current 'gameplay' timeline. I will work to keep it together.
Sidenote: Since it seems unrealistic to build an entire castle in one month (considering on Earth (albeit without the aid of magic) it might take decades), we might want to discuss how that translates into roleplay. Maybe we get the kingdom benefits for it now but in-character it's under construction for a while.
Commenting on the fluff side basically because I don't currently have time to get into the mechanics.
I think you can make good argument for a castle in construction would provide a boost to the local economy, stability and loyalty. We can hand wave the castle being in construction until we need it as a defensive structure. Since the falling apart fort decreases the cost by 50% I assume we are talking about a single building castle rather than the (beautiful) sprawl of Edinburgh Castle.
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Talia looks at the activity on the hilltop and smiles. The walls of the castle have been repaired, a tower added, and below it, stretching out in Fort Ulgofstrahd's shadow, a few score of tidy wood framed homes have sit, stone chimneys belching cookfire smoke. On the other side of the fort, south-facing, arpents have been roped off, and the first crops of spring are sprouting; radishes, kale, and beans stretching their leafy stalks towards the ever-earlier rising sun.
This will be a fine month, the noble thinks, as she listens to the crows of morning roosters, a symphony in its own right.
Good point about hand waving the castle construction, Dregan. Let's do exactly that. Naralesh, if you're working on a floorplan, maybe you could take the existing stone walls and work it into the new castle to demonstrate our discount and the previous foundation. If I remember correctly, the castle, including grounds and such can fill up an area roughly 1500 feet squared. That's pretty big, and room for a fantastic castle, but probably not quite as amazing as the one in Edinburgh.
Several questions before I roll my part:
1. Granary, Inn, General Store were the suggestions for the building in the future. Inn gives us what we need, Loyalty and Economy. We're good on Stability for now, so should we go ahead and build one? Does someone want to come up with names for these places, just for fun?
2. According to our map, which hex have we claimed? I know it's D6, but are the letters a straight up and down thing, or do they go on a slant?
3. If we're adjacent to the Fangberries, do they count as a resource for more beneficial farms? If so, I'd suggest expanding there right away, or at least preparing that hex for colonization.
4. On turn three, we can expand, build a farm, build a granary so that we won't lose extra BP during expansion from this point out. Does that sound good to you guys?
5. I looked on d20pfsrd and on the Paizo Pathfinder PRD and found that farms in hills are 4 BP. Roads are 3 BP. We should have 20 BP total. I guess that's more of a point than a question. Here's one then. Do we want to build roads yet, or wait?
You now are size 1, I believe the DC should go to 21.
Yes, that's true. I'll make the change now.
Edit: Oh, shouldn't it go up for each city district we have as well?
Kaalib: I'm prett sure that the spreadsheet is accurate. I did enter 4 BP as the cost of the farm.
Look:
Makes 21 - where are you getting 20 from? Wthat have I missed?
And it's about to be 22, because Talia made a Stability check with Unrest at zero.
As for roads, Vosil is in favour of all things civilised; but let's wait til we have somewhere to connect to.
Building: what about a Town Hall? It's discounted due to Castle, it provides good bonuses and it gives a discount on other useful buildings.