"Necessary Evil" - supervillains save the world!

Game Master ZenFox42

I would say stick with the default rules. The problem with limiting the maxes or enforcing an average is that you force everyone into similar builds. Everyone is Captain America, but no one is Spiderman or the Hulk. The points are supposed to be the limits. The default rules allow for an Agility based, low toughness character; or high toughness, low agility character.

I would caution strongly against enforcing everyone to be:

Medium | Medium | Medium

Sometimes its fun to do:

Medium | Low | High

Sure you can shoot me, but make it good or I'll shake it off. Or, hit me and you'll put me down, but just try to hit me.

The point restrictions mean that you have to choose where to put them, but the choice is the point. Limiting the maxes and mins just means we all end up with very similar characters without much uniqueness. If I want to make the ultimate unkillable guy, max out armour, toughness, parry, and dodge, I could, but I'd have nothing left I could do against the enemy, and the only role I could play would be to draw fire. That might actually be a worthwhile role, but that character is almost never going to take anyone down, because he is pure defense.

I think the point of the power limits is that you could never afford to have max armour/toughness, max defense, max force field and regeneration, and max attack power. You have to ration them, pick an approach and stick to it.

Speaking of Force Fields, it sucks that they got rid of Force Control. Green Lantern would need about 5 different powers now to do what one did in the old system.

Also, one of three of you has said they'd like to open Recruitment (others have just speculated about it).

If you don't mind, please let me know whether you're for or against opening Recruitment if you haven't already, thanks!

I am Pro-recruitment.

I can see taking those maximums for my Paragon, as he is meant to be tough and then spend the rest on Super Strength and other minor abilities. I will play around with the numbers later, but my question is, are you meaning that total for Armor, Toughness and Force Field can’t be more than 13 or is that for each one? I’ll probably just use Toughness, but we’ll see.

The rule is in the RAW for SWADE Super Power Companion. You may only spend a maximum of 13 pp on Armour and Toughness combined. It does not limit your actual end stats, just how many power points you can spend. You could still bump it up by also increasing your Vigor, your size (or by taking Growth), as well as by taking edges that increase your Toughness directly, such as Brawler and Bruiser. You could also put all the points into Toughness, and then wear conventional armour.

I'm all for recruiting someone new. The android would not be overpowered; she would probably be underpowered as I envision her. Her Toughness is a 14 (I've been toying with creating characters), but her Parry is only a 6 and she only has a d6 Fighting. The reason is that she isn't supposed to be very experienced. She is new to the world (she is only a few months old). As I said, she's strong and tough but is thrust into the hero game somewhat unwillingly when her creator is killed during a burglary.

What would the android's power set be (if any)? Just a Data type (Stronger, faster, more durable, with a photographic memory, and processing ability), or something else? Just wondering about covering the classic group roles... The Paragon, the blaster, the speedster, the stealthy one, the investigator, etc.

Greetings! I (the player, Clebsch73) am an old friend of ZenFox (I won't say how old, but older than some players). He invited me to consider joining this restart of the NE game world, after the fall of the V'sori.

I played this PC in another version of SW NE PBP campaign that has died. I could adjust this to fit the current new PC character creation rules or come up with something different. I could go either way at present.

Karma is based on a Dark Horse Comics character called Ghost, published 30 years ago. Karma can go intangible and invisible and so is a great character for gathering intel. She could also be a super thief if she wasn't generally morally opposed to stealing, unless its from the rich and obnoxious. In the other game, the GM allowed her to just make a gun or other weapon go substantial for a moment to allow a physical attack without dropping her ghost-like abilities. The game ended before she had tested her combat abilities much.

I'm not a comics superhero nerd. A while back I collected some eclectic comics like Gen 13, Witchblade, and others, but I'm not a fan of most of the DC and Marvel line-up, with the possible exceptions of the Birds of Prey team. I like strong female supers, but could do otherwise if there is a preponderance of that.

One drawback at the moment: I'm a bit overextended in PBP commitments. I'm cutting back some games as they end and may drop out of one that's on hold that I've never had a chance to play my character in. That should help. I GM one game. Fortunately, my work is only part-time and I usually have plenty of time to post. I'll be retiring in a few months so that will open up some time.

This is a vacation week, so I'll put some time into considering a new character.

I just skimmed chapter 3 of SPC3. Is there a particular set of options included or excluded?

The rule is in the RAW for SWADE Super Power Companion. You may only spend a maximum of 13 pp on Armour and Toughness combined. It does not limit your actual end stats, just how many power points you can spend. You could still bump it up by also increasing your Vigor, your size (or by taking Growth), as well as by taking edges that increase your Toughness directly, such as Brawler and Bruiser. You could also put all the points into Toughness, and then wear conventional armour.

Thanks, Rigor, couldn't have said it better myself. I saw the question after you had replied.

The problem with limiting the maxes or enforcing an average is that you force everyone into similar builds. Everyone is Captain America, but no one is Spiderman or the Hulk. The points are supposed to be the limits. The default rules allow for an Agility based, low toughness character; or high toughness, low agility character.

I'm not setting the *max* limits, the rules themselves are. I was just letting you know the power of the opponents you will run into will probably require RATN ~ 10, Parry ~ 10, and Toughness ~ 20 *for max overall survivability*. I then calculated the SPP for all three to be maxed out. I didn't mean to imply that everyone *must* max out all three, altho I can see in retrospect how it could have been taken that way. Feel free to max out one or two of them, or none of them. But at this power level, and with Acing, don't be surprised by a Damage of 20 to 25 typically, with occasional outings into the over 30 ranges.

I wanted to include Force Field in the Toughness limit because the limit is there for a reason, and Force Field totally ignores it, allowing an overall max Toughness up to 10 points higher than the "maximum". I honestly don't know why the devs didn't include it.

Karma - there are so many options in Ch. 3 that it would take me a day or two to go thru them well enough to understand their impact on the game, and even then one of them could become unbalanced. After a *very* quick glance, I'd say "for sure" :

Combined Attacks
Knockback
Large Improvised Weapons
Death & Defeat
No Finishing Moves
Never Surrender
Throwdown
I'm not going to pick a Super Style

Regarding Power Stunts, I'll allow them until someone figure out a way to abuse one, then that one's gone. :)

Thanks. I just didn't want to put time into a character only to learn one of those setting options would force a redesign.

In the original Necessary Evil, the PCs were expected to start as villains who thereby avoided the purge of supers. Is that still the expectation or now that the V'sori are gone, or are regular good guy supers coming forward again?

The following are spoilered just to reduce the length of the post. Anyone can read and give feedback.

Third option
Keep Karma with some changes to reduce her initial power points, maybe change her hinderances to be less villainous.

Playing a villain could still work. I would imagine that a pardon would be issued for every villain that fought with the resistance. Your character could simply be a member of a different cell. The pardon would only be for past actions of course, meaning every villain out there would have to decide whether to go straight, return to villainy, or pretend to have gone straight as long as possible, as a cover for a return to villainy.

Karma - there are so many options in Ch. 3 that it would take me a day or two to go thru them well enough to understand their impact on the game, and even then one of them could become unbalanced. After a *very* quick glance, I'd say "for sure" :

Combined Attacks
Knockback
Large Improvised Weapons
Death & Defeat
No Finishing Moves
Never Surrender
Throwdown
I'm not going to pick a Super Style

Regarding Power Stunts, I'll allow them until someone figure out a way to abuse one, then that one's gone. :)

I just realized something. When you say the list is "for Sure", is that for sure included in our rules or excluded?

Since the rules in chapter three are characterized as options, I expect the default is that they are not in effect unless the GM says they are. So at some point, it would be good to take the time to read through them to select those that are in play, so we know what to expect.

"For sure" = "definitely" included (but I reserve the right to exclude any of these later as I learn more).

I'll look that chapter over in more detail soon.

What Rigor said about playing a villain is exactly what I was thinking (and was going to make a post about it, but...). If anyone wants to play a villain that appears to have gone straight, but is still doing evil, that would require the Major Secret Hindrance, and occasional private communication with me about their on-going villainous activities. But if you get caught, that PC would probably have to leave the game.

I'm not interested in playing a villain, but since it was required in the first game I played, I wanted to see if it was still expected.

I worked up a first draft of a character. See the linked document from my Shared Drive. Anyone is free to look and give advice and/or point out problems. I have a second character idea I hope to work up a draft for today.

Lu Yan Immortal

I have not selected gear nor thought much about background. I don't have anything in mind at the moment that will have a significant game effect. The link in the document is to a Wikipedia page about a legendary figure of Chinese folklore. The character is often depicted as fond of drink (source of some of the Drunken Master Styles of Martial arts), so I might add the edge Liquid Courage after an advance. He is also depicted as a ladies man. A certain inspiration for this character comes from the character of Egg Shen from Big Trouble in Little China, although he was a sorcerer. Jackie Chan played a version of this folk hero in a movie but I have not seen it yet.

I'm working on my 2nd character idea, with a Tarot Theme.

The rules for one power seemed odd. The power is Object Reading, p. 78 of SPC2. The cost is 2, with a modifier of "Requires Touch" which modifies the power by -2. If correct, that would make it a free power. Maybe the Requires touch should only be -1.

I'm still juggling powers, but I've chosen the hindrances and edges and one important power.

It will be a human female with the Young (minor) hindrance, basically a teenager. Poverty is the other minor hindrance, which makes sense for a teenager. I'm thinking her mother was her sole parent who was a super who got taken out by the V'sori, so her other hindrance is Vengeful (major), particularly wanting revenge on the V'sori but also anyone who takes away her Tik Tok app. Her mother was a sorcerer with a special Tarot deck that was the source of her powers. The daughter has inherited the deck and her mother taught her the basics of sorcery.

I would like to give her super sorcery and the edges Luck and Extra Luck, which gives 2 extra bennies each time they refresh. That way she can have some options that simulate spells. I might have some questions about what the limits are on that. For example, does it have to be just one power using up to 13 points or could it be two different powers combined with no more than 13 points?

Below is a link to a document on my shared drive with the stats I've worked out for my 2nd character idea.

Fortune Bravo

Anyone can look at it and let me know if there are any issues or make any suggestions. The character is described above.

Each Limitation placed upon the power reduces its total Power Point cost by one (to a minimum of 1). If this would normally reduce the cost to 0, you gain a +1 bonus (+2 maximum) to the arcane skill total instead.

But that only applies if you are taking a Power whose default is long-range and are reducing it to Touch. If the Power's default Range is Touch, that's not Limiting it, that's just its normal Range.

Will look over the PC's and get back to you soon.

One quick thing : could you also show your "derived" stats (Pace, Parry, [total]Toughness, Size) for the PCs? Thanks!

I noticed that Object Read was at range ability (within 6" {12 yards}) in the rules that thought that was a bit unusual. Object Reading and Psychometry show up in all sorts of systems, and it is always a Touch based ability. It actually stuck in my memory as odd that in this system you only need to be close.

Requires Touch (-2) is actually listed with the power as a option. Even weirder is that it is a yes/no type of power with no additional levels you can add.

It is possible they fixed that in later printings. Nope, checked the Errata, and it is not listed. Curious.

Karma - that didn't take long. Both PC's look to be solid and useful characters.

I'm concerned that Absorption's Reflection mod doesn't give the targeted foes *any* kind of roll to *not* be affected, which is pretty powerful, especially since you're transferring Wounds, not damage points, and you've included virtually every Power Type. The only downside is that you *do* take all Wounds that you didn't Soak with your one free Focus roll, which is pretty significant (altho you can still spend a Bennie afterwards to re-Soak without any Reflection). If you use this PC, I'll see how it works in gameplay, and reserve the right to tweak the Power.

So, your choice - a PC who has lots of immunities and two non-standard attacks (both pretty powerful when they work), or a martial artist mentalist who has one pretty powerful physical attack. Both have Healing, which is always good.

DaRules wrote:

Each Limitation placed upon the power reduces its total Power Point cost by one (to a minimum of 1). If this would normally reduce the cost to 0, you gain a +1 bonus (+2 maximum) to the arcane skill total instead.

But that only applies if you are taking a Power whose default is long-range and are reducing it to Touch. If the Power's default Range is Touch, that's not Limiting it, that's just its normal Range.

Sorry, that was the Core Rules' Object Reading. The Supers version says "Modifiers may never take a power’s cost below 1."

So for the Supers version, the SPP cost is 1. Don't know why the devs didn't just make the Modifier -1, it would have been a lot clearer.

My current take on Chapter 3 / Setting Rules : I'll allow

Combined Attacks
Large Improvised Weapons
Death & Defeat
No Finishing Moves
Throwdown
Power Stunts (with the caveat from above)

I noticed neither of Karma's builds increased their Ranged Attack Target Number (RATN, my term). The default is 4, which means that anyone with a ranged weapon can hit you on a simple Success (ignoring situational modifiers). Since ranged attacks are so handy (the target can't hit back if they only have a Fighting attack), they will probably be somewhat common.

Raising your RATN to 8 (Dodge, 4 SPP) would mean that your attacker would have to get at least an ordinary Raise to hit you, and would need *2* ordinary Raises to add a d6 to the damage roll!

And while having a high Toughness helps, it's far better to not be hit in the first place than to hope the bad guys' damage rolls don't Ace. After all, extra Raises on attack rolls (after the first) don't do anything extra, but every extra Raise on a damage roll is another Wound.

In general broad terms, increasing your Parry or RATN by 1 is equivalent to increasing your Toughness by 2, in terms of overall survival.

Not advocating anything, I'm aware that not everyone is interested in maximizing survival, just pointing out something for everyone to think about...

Thanks for all the analysis. I will consider the suggestions.

I still could go with a revised version of Karma, the character I ran in the previous Necessary Evil SW game. She needs to be toned down to just 40 power creation points.

Her main mode is intangible and Invisible, which means she is mainly vulnerable to energy attacks. Her main concern is therefore concealing her presence and moving after attacking to avoid retaliatory attacks with energy powers that have an area effect.

Using the phasing attack (part of Intangible), she can cause a wound without regard to armor or toughness. She has some conventional martial arts + potent magic weapons she can fight with if the enemies are not presenting a threat of energy attacks.

She is excellent for scouting, getting past security, collecting intel, etc.

As for the standard RATN, Lu Yan Immortal relies on high toughness means a lot of damage will be needed to have the chance of causing a wound. If it is an energy power type, it will be reduced by 4. Backing that up is hardy, which means a second shaken result will not cause a wound.

I don't know if I could raise his RATN without sacrificing other aspects of his defenses. He also has the chance to heal wounds that get through all this, although that is getting into last resort terretory.

I don't think any build can be air-tight with regard to taking damage. That is where player decisions play a role in avoiding the things that can cause harm.

I'll look at Fortune Bravo to see if there is a way to improve her RATN. My goal with her is to make her relatively secure with some conventional attack possibilities, and then rely on the Super Sorcery for situations where she needs something extra. If I run her, I'll work out some possible "spells" and clear them ahead of time to make sure I know how they work and if they are legal. Does the Super Sorcery spell require using just one power with a limit of 13 points or could one combine two or more powers whose total does not exceed 13. I suspect the former, but just want to be sure before I put anymore thought into options.

I'll hold off on deciding which character to run until I know who else is in the mix. I could enjoy playing any of the ones I've got, plus I'll have two back-ups should the worst happen. I'll work on Karma 40 next.

I watched a Jackie Chan movie, The Forbidden Kingdom, where he plays Lu Yan, loosely based on legends from China. Several characters are motivated to receive an elixir of immortality. He is, of course, showing off mad martial arts (Kung Fu) which my version will not have. It might be fun to see what kind of pure martial arts super one could come up with.

Over the weekend, I viewed an exhibit at our local art museum that had many examples of Samurai armor. Makes me curious what kind of Super Samurai I might be able to develop.

Over the weekend, I viewed an exhibit at our local art museum that had many examples of Samurai armor. Makes me curious what kind of Super Samurai I might be able to develop.

I just had a flashback to the Saturday mornings of the 80s. "Kaze no Yō ni Hayaku!"

Over the weekend, I viewed an exhibit at our local art museum that had many examples of Samurai armor. Makes me curious what kind of Super Samurai I might be able to develop.

The idea I'm working with is a physically infirm guy who projects an idealized form of himself as a psychic manifestation. The main form I was working on so far was a winged paladin in plate armour. Given I was thinking of having multiple personas, one idea I had for differentiating them was using different styles of armour; a greek hoplite, a viking berserker, and a samurai, for instance.

In practice, I think all would basically come out as melee fighters, so the variations would probably be mostly flavour. Maybe he should do D&D classes instead? His other personas could be a Wizard, a Rogue, and a Ranger?

The idea with the different manifestations is to be adaptable, and reinforce the group's main need, so variations like a Tank, a Melee fighter, a blaster, and an infiltrator would probably make the most sense.

Karma - all three are good PC's, and I wasn't picking on you specifically about the RATN (nor insisting that it be raised), you just happened to be the first person to submit a build, which made me think of it.

Rigor - how are you cramming multiple builds into one PC? Power Sets cost a certain number of SPP to "buy", which wouldn't leave much for the builds. But if Karma picks her ghost PC, she'll have infiltration covered.

Firstly, @Rigor: How dare you know Paradigm so well? He is not above making sure everything stays within his.. umm.. paradigm. :-)

Here is my idea for the new guy. I couldn’t afford speed or flight, but I think this will work for now as he ‘discovers’ his abilities over time.

The idea of this character is a guy who is the most unlikely hero possible. Overweight, shy, physically infirm (I'm picturing a cane or wheelchair), smart and probably successful on paper, but insecure and probably still living with his mother. He has always wanted to be something great, and it has bothered him that there are no heroes left. At some point, his psychic powers emerged and he discovers the power to wish things into reality. He'd be a tragic idealist, envisioning heroes the way he thinks they should be. Since there aren't many heroes around, he creates them in his mind; a few, to fill all the different roles. Of course, he can only be one of them at a time, but he does his best.

I like the idea of taking stereotypes and turning them around. So the idea for this character was what if a mother's basement, fedora wearing, obese neck beard was actually the bravest and most pure hearted guy on earth, and had only lacked the chance to try to make things better.

The way the character worked in M&M was that he basically had the power to affect reality, and imagine things into existence - like if a character had the Force Control and Illusion powers combined; create an illusion, and make it solid with force fields. In SWADE it would have to be slightly different given the mechanics, but would work in a similar way, by wishing or imagining them into reality.

There are a few different ways it can be done mechanically. The simplest is to use Power Sets, where each different set costs 2pp, so 4 personas, if I went with that many, would leave 34pp per. Each would be more specialized than a typical character, and therefore able to get by on a smaller budget, because if faced with a situation they could not handle, he could switch to an alternate. Only one would be good in a melee, one good at range, one good at sneaking, etc.

My preferred idea is to use a Summonable Minion, taking over the body with the Possession power. Minion, with the Summonable add on, allows him to imagine his hero body into existence. The default stats of a minion can be tweaked, and his would have no independent mind, as he is only imagining them. He then uses Possession to inhabit the minion body, which can have a specific set of powers. His real body would be left uninhabited back at home base. Switchable allows him to imagine a different minion, with a different power set, though only one at a time, for 1pp per persona.

The third option would be to use the minions, give them Resilience to make them tougher (as without Possession, they wouldn't be Wildcards), and then use the Telepathy power Mind-Rider to follow along with the minion, helping them out with long distance telepathy powers as much as possible. This is the weakest option of course, because it leaves the Wild Card character as the guy in the chair for his own heroes, though he could potentially field all his persona's at once via this method, so the power level might balance out. With Common-Bond, or something similar, he'd be able to spend Bennies on their behalf.

Possessing the bodies would be my favourite option, since it keeps the wildcard in the field, doing the work. Possession or the minion option also allow him to maintain the fiction that the minions are real heroes, presumably with secret identities and the whole deal. The Power Set option is probably my least favourite, as while it fills the same function, the ability to switch from one hero to another on the spot ruins the fiction, as this character would want all the heroes to be seen as real, in order to give people hope. Batman going to the bathroom just long enough for Superman to come out of nowhere to lift the bus, just to fly off and have Batman reenter to continue tracking the villain would not fool anyone for long. That kind of build would actually work fine for another concept though, the extradimensional being that thinks our reality is a video game, and can just respawn in as a different character type. He'd always be the same guy, just wearing different suits.

Last idea I guess would be to just have a single hero persona, probably the Paladin type, and have it be a Requires Transformation Hindrance, or a single alternative power set so he could keep both at 38pp. That way he could be the mental, psychic investigator type at HQ, but the warrior in the field.

SBM - 40 SPP, and only a d10+d6 punch? This is Level III! I'd suggest you move a whole lotta SPP from Regeneration into the Melee Attack, and maybe add a weapon. The Brawler and/or Bruiser Edges might come in handy (using Super Edge). You're going to want to be doing at least 4d6 or 5d6 (or the equivalent in other die types) per punch.

Rigor - I think you're using the SWD Supers rules. In SWADE, for your power level (basically Level 3), it now costs 8 points per set. For 4 personas, that's 24 SPP, with hardly anything left for the "super" part. But for 3 personas (Tank, Melee fighter, blaster), that's 16 SPP, so you'd have 24 SPP for each persona. Can you work with that?

I'll think over the other options tomorrow.

I'm using the SWADE version that is available for free online. There have been changes since, but I downloaded the errata and thought that would show any differences. I've been wanting to buy the real book, but didn't have an excuse, since I wasn't using it in any games. That change wasn't listed in the errata, but I'll review it once I get the real thing. I'm sure there are other subtle changes here and there as well, though that one is pretty dramatic. It makes power sets pretty much useless, unless there is some fine print somewhere explaining exceptions and workarounds. Like I said, I'll review when I have the real thing. If the concept becomes unworkable, I have other ideas.

Yeah, when SWADE Supers first came out, there was a lot of complaining about the Power Sets getting nerfed. I think they were too powerful before, but maybe now a little underpowered.

At Level 3, it's still pretty easy to create one extra power set. At 40 SPP, that'd leave you with 32 SPP per set. I guess the change discourages having several power sets at once.

Fortune Bravo V2

Lu Yan Immortal V2

I adjusted toughness down and added 4 points of Parry and Dodge each. Derived stats now listed, including RATN.

Here is my first idea. I kicked her up by giving her laser vision, as she lacked a ranged attack. She originally had machine control, but I felt she needed something more offensive. As I said, she isn't overly powerful, but that is by design. She is supposed to be new to life and the hero game.

What is starting wealth? In the previous game (PWGM), we started with $1000.

Bought the full version of the Super Heroes companion. They nerfed a ton of stuff. The version of power sets is completely unusable, I can't imagine why anyone would ever take it as it is now. An option that is utterly useless shouldn't even take up space in the book. They also removed the option for minions to have full power points, so that option is gone as well. Guess I'll have to come up with a new concept, or stick with the single Requires Activation version.

I'll read through the book and see if anything speaks to me.

Rigor - I looked thru the old SPC, and Switchable costs 2 SPP *per Power* to use. It sounded to me like you wanted entirely different power sets, so if each build has, say, 6 Powers, wouldn't you have to pay 12 SPP per added build (or 24 SPP for three builds)? I couldn't find any reference to "power sets" in the old SPC (except with regard to Switchable).

In the new system, you'd only pay 8 SPP for a completely different set of powers, no matter how many (or 16 SPP for three sets). This sounds like a better deal to me. Or am I missing something? I never did understand Switchable and Power Sets very well...

Karma - $1000 sounds good.

Rigor - I looked thru the old SPC, and Switchable costs 2 SPP *per Power* to use. It sounded to me like you wanted entirely different power sets, so if each build has, say, 6 Powers, wouldn't you have to pay 12 SPP per added build (or 24 SPP for three builds)? I couldn't find any reference to "power sets" in the old SPC (except with regard to Switchable).

In the new system, you'd only pay 8 SPP for a completely different set of powers, no matter how many (or 16 SPP for three sets). This sounds like a better deal to me. Or am I missing something? I never did understand Switchable and Power Sets very well...

No, it was entirely different, though the example was still the same. Here's a screenshot.

Basically, you spend 2pp, and you can design two full 38pp power profiles, with as many different powers as you wish. For example: This set includes combat powers and skills, and then I transform non-combat form with all my communication and investigative powers.

The classic example is Iron Man: This is my stealth suit for infiltration jobs, this is my underwater suit, this is my outer space suit, here's one for melee, here's one for fighting hulks, etc. Each is slightly diminished because of the divided attention, but manageable because of the ability to specialize. Sure, each suit only has 32 PP instead of 40, but I can afford to concentrate on making it really good at its specialized role, and have 5 to choose from (in this example).

Switchable is different, but still useful, as it is basically just a different expression of the same power. If I have Ranged Attack 5d6 as a power, and say that is my fireblast, I can use 1pp for switchable, and design an exploding fireball for the same PP as the fireblast. Spend one more pp and I can had a third version I can fire in a cone for a flame thrower. 1pp more and I can use an ultra concentrated heat beam with Armour Piercing, etc.

This version of Power Sets is... ill conceived. I cannot imagine any circumstance where a character would benefit from using it.

Ah - I've always used the "0th edition" of the SWD Supers, which was taken from the original Necessary Evil manual and tweaked a little bit (it doesn't even have any drawings of supers!). Apparently, they later came out with an official SWD Supers manual with lots more tweaking, which is what you have.

In my very old version, they didn't even have Power Sets.

40 SPP, and only a d10+d6 punch? This is Level III! I'd suggest you move a whole lotta SPP from Regeneration into the Melee Attack, and maybe add a weapon. The Brawler and/or Bruiser Edges might come in handy (using Super Edge). You're going to want to be doing at least 4d6 or 5d6 (or the equivalent in other die types) per punch.

I had thought about that and as I was building him, the idea of being shot and blasted multiple times and having the villains see him simply heal right in front of them like it was no big deal was pretty nifty. Perhaps though, with that extra $500 I can pay for a V’Sori type melee weapon that he stole on his way out. That and I originally imagined him picking up random items and swinging them around as weapons. On top of that , I don’t think I can take Bruiser yet, as we’re just starting, unless we’re using Born a Hero.

That and I originally imagined him picking up random items and swinging them around as weapons. On top of that , I don’t think I can take Bruiser yet, as we’re just starting, unless we’re using Born a Hero.

Super Edge. Any non-legendary edge, presuming you meet the other qualifications. You already have Brawler, so if you can afford the 2pp...

Alternatively, 2pp would get you Melee Attack at a 1d6, which might also apply to your staff... Make it force amplifying wristbands (Device -1), and you could get it for 1pp.

SBM - thanks for the explanation, I couldn't figure out the point of all that regeneration. It would be cool, but I'm glad you increased your melee damage. With the pain staff, you'll be doing d4+d10+2d6+3d6 damage, which is plenty good (30 points average).

You could even take the SPP from one of the d6 damage and put it elsewhere (maybe boost your RATN? - every point helps), that'd still give you 25 points damage on average. But not required.

Just FYI, I'd suggest your first Advancement be to boost your Fighting skill, for both better attacks and a higher Parry.

Thanks Rigor and GM. I think I will keep him as is and when I get advances and PP, I will put them towards Fighting and the Bruiser edge. One thing though, I think the pain staff will only do STR+3d6 damage as Brawler does not count with weapons, as far as I am aware. STR+1d6 (staves are normally STR+d4) as an energy weapon and +2d6 from his Melee Attack power, which does count with weapons. Unless there is something I am missing in the reading of the rules. That leaves an average damage of about 16.

In the build I did for Karma (see this PCs profile) I gave her edges of Martial Artist and Martial Warrior (using a super edge). Then I used a minor hindrance to add to her initial wealth and used it to create some super powered melee weapons. See the section on combat for the dice combinations to hit and damage. I never had an opportunity to use them in the limited time I played the character, so I'm not sure how effective they are.

I am working on a revised version of Karma as a potential PC and I'm now working on the weapons again. She has other options for attack that are her primary mode, but I figured having some martial arts and super weapons could be a cool alternative for enemies who are not too jacked up with armor and toughness.

Thinking of an idea that works with the duplication power, with a custom modifier.

I'm thinking of a guy who has discovered some sort of secret of space-time, allowing him to teleport/open portals, but has also allowed him to figure out how to be in multiple places at once. In essence, he is not duplicating himself, because he is physically translocated, and independently interacting with several locations at once.

This would be like duplication, with something like (but not) the Equipped and No-Tell mods, but with the disadvantage that all the versions are actually him, in real time. This would mean that all of them have the same gear, the same bennies, etc. If one gains a condition (Shaken, Stunned, etc.) they all get it, and if one is wounded, all the versions also get wounded. If any of them gets killed, they all die. They are all the real him, at the same time. Since he is also a teleporter, the trick of handing something to one of him, just for another of him to hand it to someone else near another of his locations would be thematically appropriate, and a fun trick to pull if given the opportunity. It would probably make him an amazing shoplifter...

Seems like an interesting mix of advantages and disadvantages, but has some really fun flavour.

This is another idea I've had kicking around for a while. The main issue I've had with it is coming up with a good story, background, and character concept that makes it interesting to play. The most obvious is probably having him be a nerdy, hard science guy with no prior combat experience, but seeing a need for heroes and doing his best with the discoveries he's made. A little on the nose, but I'd be interested to hear other ideas of concepts that could use this idea, if anyone has any.

I think the pain staff will only do STR+3d6 damage as Brawler does not count with weapons, as far as I am aware. STR+1d6 (staves are normally STR+d4) as an energy weapon and +2d6 from his Melee Attack power, which does count with weapons.

So with a great sword or maul (for example), you'd do 2d10+2d6, for about 20-24 points damage on average.

But I can't find any mention of a "pain staff" in any of my NE books. I even tried Googling it, with no results. Where did you get its specs, and why such an odd price? I'm hesitant to grant a starting PC such a powerful weapon, especially since it's V'Sori.

Rigor - a -1 overall is fine with me. You could get 4 copies total (including the original), right?

Rigor - a -1 overall is fine with me. You could get 4 copies total (including the original), right?

That's right.

..pain staff" in any of my NE books. I even tried Googling it, with no results. Where did you get its specs, and why such an odd price? I'm hesitant to grant a starting PC such a powerful weapon, especially since it's V'Sori.

That’s because it came from my imagination. You said I should have a weapon to increase my damage output and I wanted something to fit within Six’s story. I built it using a basic staff from the main book and added the Energy Weapon modifier from Supers. I couldn’t afford the spear, or I would have used that as my base. It came to $760, plus the $200 for my armor leaves me with only $40 left. I figured the stuff I have, I took from a dead V’Sori guard before escaping the lab.

SBM - going by your PC post, your Powers total up to 39.

To build a super weapon, you could build it just like your PC :

V’Sori Pain Staff, Energy Weapon (STR+3d6, AP4, Heavy Weapon, +1 Parry, Reach 1, Min STR d8, $760)

Melee Attack(d6) +2
AP4 +2
Heavy Weapon +1
Device -2

Which totals 3 points, which you don't have to spare.

Energy Weapon increases damage a die type (for STR+d6), adds AP4 and makes it a Heavy Weapon, and costs $750.

Since weapons don't "double dip" with your Super Strength, total damage is d10(STR)+2d6(power)+d6(weapon), for an average damage of 19-24 points, which is acceptable.

I see now that the confusion was that you incorporated your Melee Attack damage into the weapon's stats, while I thought that the weapon's listed damage was in addition to your Melee Attack damage.

Fair enough. I do see that extra point in powers and I think I will actually save it so I can increase one of my powers later. I had thought about making a device, but as you said, I would have to take points from something else for it and, it makes sense for him to not have much actual money.

That said, unless you have something else, I think I’m ready to create his alias and flesh him out a bit.

SBM - I have no problems with your current build, but I will go over it again in more detail once it's "official".

Rigor - where are you at with your PC?

I know Karma is waiting for your two PCs to be built in order to pick the one of her 3 possible PC's to best compliment the team.