How should I optimize my shortbow weilding Halfling Rogue

So my friends and I are all new to Pathfinder, we are currently going through the beginner box using the pre-gen characters to get a decent feel for the mechanics of the game from both the PC and the GM side. While we are doing this we are also creating our own primary and secondary characters to use when we finish the box stuff.

We have all agreed to stick strictly to the core rules as we really don't want to confuse ourselves more than we already do while we play.

We are all starting at level 1: Here is my character thus far:

Name: Alton Greenbottle
Race: Halfling
Alignment: Chaotic Neutral
Class: Rogue
Age: 25
Height: 3' 3"
Weight 38 lbs.

Ability scores: (The racial traits are already applied, and before you wonder the agreed upon generation by my friend and I was we roll 4d6 per ability and removed lowest roll) (*used a random generation program I wrote but I think the seed number I used heavily favored 5's and 4's)

Str: 12 +1
Dex: 17 +3
Con: 14 +2
Int: 15 +2
Wis: 15 +2
Cha: 17 +3

The ranked skills are Acrobatics, Climb, Disable device, knowledge(dungeon), knowledge (local), linguistics, perception, escape artist, sense motive, stealth
everything is either 6,7 or 8 except stealth which is at 11

Fort: +2
Dex: +4
Will: +2

Perception: +3

Feats:
Point blank shot

Equipment:
Shortbow (small) 1d4+1
Shortsword (small) 1d4+1
Arrows(40) (I expect to miss for now)
Leather armor (Light)
Outfit
(*other equipment will be decided at quest time and for now we are ignoring inventory/load penalties during quests)

Special:
Sneak attack +1d6
trap finding

Growth rate is Medium: ~2,000pts

My idea was to stealth into locations scout a room for traps and treasures, and when combat come around I stealth to flank and shoot from a safe distance. My focus is to do the exploring outside combat, but I don't want to slouch inside combat either. The drawback is that because Halflings are small characters I have to used small weapons which are not as powerful as the weapons of other races.

I am looking for advice on how I should go about my leveling my Character, to make him a force to reckon with. And I want to focus on ranged combat and stealth as well as disabling things outside, while sticking to the Core Rules.

I like this little dude a lot, which is why I want to take him far before he retires especially since he can last longer (age-wise) than the other races in my party.

Can I ask you why you went Rogue? It seems that the class you want to go with is Ranger...

If I were you I'd go Ranger over Rogue and I'd put your two 17's in Str and Dex and put the 12 in Cha. Being a small character you are going to take a hit on damage so having a higher Str and getting a Compound Longbow is going to be one way you are going to make up that damage deficit. If you REALLY want to be able to disarm traps you can do it without trap finding...just not magical traps...but that isn't really something that a 20 ft metal pole can't fix or a sheep.

Also, someone correct me if I am wrong, but just to put it out there: You cannot gain the flank condition with a ranged weapon, if you are counting on that to allow sneak attacks every round.

Someone brought up in another thread the fact that 3 levels of the Fighter Archer archetype gives you the ability to feint at range.

If you max out bluff, and invest in Combat Expertise, Improved Feint, and probably Skill Focus:Bluff you would probably have a good chance of expecting to have a sneak attack opportunity most rounds.

Archery is feat intensive, so the fighter levels will be handy. So handy that going 4 levels to get another feat (Weapon Specialization? It's 2/3.5 of a sneak attack die on it's own.). If you do that though, and your dm lets the archer archetype qualify for Gloves of Weapon Cheese (Training) you are well served by going 5 levels in fighter.

Your Bab and 4 attacks a round will thank you, but at this point why are you taking rogue levels, unless you just want to disarm traps?

This is roundabout, but unless you have some good way of reliably getting sneak attacks off at range, your damage isn't going to be nearly as good as a true archer. And if this is your only trick I'm not so sure you wouldn't be outdamaged by one anyway.

Maybe someone else has a different take, but aside from the skills Greater Invisibility is about all that makes a Rogue Archer viable. Even stuff like Hide in Plain Sight usually takes up at least a move action, so you only get one attack. If you want to do the whole multiple arrow attacks with sneak attack damage it seems to me the only way to get it off reliably unless you have a teammate who can make sure they lose their dex bonus via dazzling display or some spell.

Good luck, this kind of character is hard to pull off if you ask me.

As a halfling archer rogue you should take the "swift as shadows" racial trait. Only -10 for sniping to stay hidden. Get skill focus: stealth and later hellcat stealth. That already allows you to stealth in most conditions for sniping and one reliable sneak attack per round is not bad damage.Rogue Talent snipers eye and the advanced talent stealthy sniper help you out a lot then. Also a ring of chameleon power.
Dipping into shadow dancer is a possibility too, but not really a good one because of the feat tax and it doesnt help your archery.

Of course later on higher levels you want to hit twice or more, what is not possible with sniping.
Feinting with archery is a possibility, but i didnt reserach that yet.
Very feat heavy but reawrding is getting the snap shot combat feat line with combat expertise. Or combat patrol. And then choose prestige class halfling oportunist untill level 5, where you get sneak attack on all attacks of oportunity.

The other possibility is taking the teamwork feat enfilading fire, but you need another party member taking this feat too, then you can flank with ranged attacks. Tis is very good in combination with someone using a reach weapon or having a great threat zone and gang-up too.

There was a big discussion long time ago about wether a 5 foot step is movement enough to use stealth and i dont remeber the outcome, but i think it was yes. So with clever positioning and the right feats you could eventually pull off full attacks with sneak attack later and 5 foot step into hiding then.

Enfilading Fire does not give you the flanking condition necessary for sneak attack. It merely mimics the +2 attack bonus.

No matter what you do or how you do it the sneak attack damage ranged character doesn't work...hate to be blunt about it but its just the reality of the situation. Either you are a ranged character or a sneak attack character...not both. The game was designed to make Stealth all but useless in combat, and sure you can feint but you are wasting actions and potential attacks that could hit for damage on it. Putting feats into Feint takes away from feats you need to be competitive as a ranged character.

3 levels of archer-fighter, one level of zen archer. that would give you 3 feats + flurry of blows, and the ability fo feint at distance.

Then the important step is to choose the feinting flurry feats. you loose one attack but all the remaining attacks are Sneack attacks.

I think he's just going for first round sneak? and then any time he can go back into stealth?

3 levels of archer-fighter, one level of zen archer. that would give you 3 feats + flurry of blows, and the ability fo feint at distance.

Then the important step is to choose the feinting flurry feats. you loose one attack but all the remaining attacks are Sneack attacks.

hell, feinting flurry only works with melee attacks.

Enfilading Fire does not give you the flanking condition necessary for sneak attack. It merely mimics the +2 attack bonus.

It did, i´m pretty sure. Looks like it got errata or something because it could have helped a ranged rogue.

Well snap shot is enough for flanking anyway, since you threaten.
With improved snap shot it gets better.

Cheapy wrote:

Enfilading Fire does not give you the flanking condition necessary for sneak attack. It merely mimics the +2 attack bonus.

It did, i´m pretty sure. Looks like it got errata or something because it could have helped a ranged rogue.

Well snap shot is enough for flanking anyway, since you threaten.
With improved snap shot it gets better.

Flanking

When making a melee attack, you get a +2 flanking bonus if your opponent is threatened by another enemy character or creature on its opposite border or opposite corner.

Benefit: You are considered to be flanking an opponent if at least two of your allies are threatening that opponent, regardless of your actual positioning.

That was the key to that build. It seemed something changed with Enfilading Fire though, so just forget about it.

FAQ
Quote:

Gang Up: Does this feat (page 161) allow you to flank a foe with ranged weapons?

The Gang Up feat allows you to count as flanking so long as two of your allies are threatening your opponent. The feat makes no mention of ranged attacks being included, and since flanking specifically refers to melee attacks, ranged attacks do not benefit from this feat. (JMB, 8/13/10)

—Jason Bulmahn, 08/13/10
If the gang up feat was important to the build this is the FAQ that addressed the issue, hopefully not beating a dead horse, just for completeness.

Gang Up doesn't work for ranged flanks either, since flanks are melee attacks only.

UC hasn't received errata yet either.

I think you're misremembering it, mate :)

@Halfling's Shadow: If your GM allows homebrew material, you could ask about this. It's my replacement for sneak attack, and it helps ranged rogues out quite a bit :)

I chose rogue cause filled a gap that my team needed to be more well rounded and since as a Halfling, a melee damage dealer wouldn't be ideal strength penalty and slow speed, thus I decided to use range with a shortbow.

I appreciate the help with other class suggestions but as I said my friends and I are new to this and multiclassing is confusing as hell to us. We are sticking to core rules, by which I mean no extra supplementary books outside the Core Rules book. But i appreciate the advice with the bonus racial traits and other class feat/traits.

So far BltzKrg242 has my idea of combat the closest. I want to initially attack in stealth and then get back into stealth as soon as possible, before I attack again, unless my party needs me to attack to try and save another character. Is that a plausible combat strategy? Be sort of the attacker of opportunity outside of the 'attacks of opportunity' rule kind of thing, if that makes sense.

As for damage dealing I guess I can live without being a power house and be more of the 'utility' guy that will whittle enemy HP down to nothing.

I understand that you want to be a rogue; you will just not be decent as a ranged combatant (with core only). Maybe just take weapon finesse for your first level feat?

@ Halflingshadow: Ask you GM to allow you a Halfling Slingstick as a non-martial weapon or just give you proficiency. It´s pretty cool for the flavor and with the special halfling sling feats you can do very good.

Point-blank shot; Precise Shot; Halfling Slinger; Arc Slinger; Large Target; Weapon Focus; Rapid Shot; Snap Shot.

You´ll do some damage and can get a sneak attack sometimes.
You still can take Halfling Oportunist PrC then.

@Cheapy: I´m really pretty sure there was a way to pull that off actually, it was a big thread sometime last year.

From what i understand weapon finesse only affects light weapons which would work if my intention was to get into the fray with melee with the shortsword or a dagger, but a shortbow is a marshal ranged weapon so I don't think it can be applied. Can it?

Old hat gamers will tell you it doesn't work well. Only your DM can tell you that. Ask him/her about certain combat scenarios and see how he/she interprets them. If you can stay in stealth and make an attack every other round then that's fine. It keeps you from taking damage.

Essentially it comes down to your group and the fun you seek to have. This really is a question you should be asking your GM.

If you are Stealthed and shoot your bow only the FIRST shot you take gets sneak attack.

Have you read how impossible it is to stealth in combat? You will literally get 1 shot per combat with sneak attack 90% or more of the time.

Just setting you up so you are aware of the trap you are walking into.

I understand the trap that it is, and I just finished reading Eidolon's rogue guide, according to him my character, as he stands, will be more of a skills focused character and will use archery to stay out of direct combat for as long as possible.

I still think you'd enjoy the Ranger more...heck you even get spells to increase stealth and eventually Hide in Plain sight. I'd REALLY give the Ranger a solid read over and before you tell me that isn't the character you have in mind.

I understand the trap that it is, and I just finished reading Eidolon's rogue guide, according to him my character, as he stands, will be more of a skills focused character and will use archery to stay out of direct combat for as long as possible.

be sute to take the sniper archetype.

I read Treantmonk's guide to a Ranger while helping a friend create his character, and maybe in the future I will create one but I am happy with my rogue. Beside my party is already fielding two of them. After a couple playthroughs if the archery thing isn't going well for me; I can ask to respec him to a TWF rogue. I am sure they would agree as long as i don't hamper my skill set to reduce the effectiveness outside combat.

If you do decide to stay as a rogue, try getting the stag's helm, magic item. T boosts your atk and also allows for you to catch an opponent flatfooted up to 3 times per day, for your sneak attack within 30'. This however is only if you worship erastil or some other deity, with GM approval, of the hunt or archery type domains.

I read Treantmonk's guide to a Ranger while helping a friend create his character, and maybe in the future I will create one but I am happy with my rogue. Beside my party is already fielding two of them. After a couple playthroughs if the archery thing isn't going well for me; I can ask to respec him to a TWF rogue. I am sure they would agree as long as i don't hamper my skill set to reduce the effectiveness outside combat.

Rogues do have one advantage in TWF: you can take Two-Weapon Feint, which lets you use your first attack to feint so you can sneak attack with the second one.

Take two short swords (I prefer the gladius) with Weapon Finesse, and you should be pretty effective. You can also use your second level Rogue Talent to get Finesse Rogue/Weapon Finesse.

Generally, though, for melee sneak attacks, I wouldn't worry about the feint or the stealth. You should train the rest of your party to give you flanking in combat as often as possible.

Best advice I could give is focus your concept. Basically, you want to choose whether this is "a ranged character with a melee backup" or "a melee character with a ranged backup". The times I've tried to split my focus between melee and ranged have not worked out well.