Grimm Tales

Game Master Red Velvet Tiger

Oooh, I may be fluff focused but even I shy away from an archetype that bad.

Gunslinger or Ranger then? Maybe Bard?

Sad thing is Emmy, your character could probably drink any of the others under the table. 'Hey bartender, I'll have a cask of ale! What do you mean I can't have any because I'm underage?! EMMY ANGRY! EMMY SMASH!'

Also, the legal drinking age in Victorian-Era Prussia/Germany, where some of the best fairytales come from, was 'if you can climb on the barstool by yourself and you have the money for your booze'. Quite sensible, eh? Oddly enough, there were fewer alcoholics back then, proof that temperance usually exacerbates a problem!

Neils, what a... quaint sentiment. I suppose you would have no problem with a CR13 member of The Five, TRIPLE-GESTALTED, would you? And possibly a Jabberwocky or a Fruminous Bandersnatch? ;)

Gunslinger would be pretty cool, but then the concept would be so MAD I wouldn't get anything done. Bard might actually be the best choice in that case, but I'm still not thrilled about it. Oh well, I won't worry about it until RVT makes a decision.

Sad thing is Emmy, your character could probably drink any of the others under the table. 'Hey bartender, I'll have a cask of ale! What do you mean I can't have any because I'm underage?! EMMY ANGRY! EMMY SMASH!'

Also, the legal drinking age in Victorian-Era Prussia/Germany, where some of the best fairytales come from, was 'if you can climb on the barstool by yourself and you have the money for your booze'. Quite sensible, eh? Oddly enough, there were fewer alcoholics back then, proof that temperance usually exacerbates a problem!

Neils, what a... quaint sentiment. I suppose you would have no problem with a CR13 member of The Five, TRIPLE-GESTALTED, would you? And possibly a Jabberwocky or a Fruminous Bandersnatch? ;)

Emmeline's going to get wasted on orange juice, kthxhavefun.

Sad thing is Emmy, your character could probably drink any of the others under the table. 'Hey bartender, I'll have a cask of ale! What do you mean I can't have any because I'm underage?! EMMY ANGRY! EMMY SMASH!'

Also, the legal drinking age in Victorian-Era Prussia/Germany, where some of the best fairytales come from, was 'if you can climb on the barstool by yourself and you have the money for your booze'. Quite sensible, eh? Oddly enough, there were fewer alcoholics back then, proof that temperance usually exacerbates a problem!

Neils, what a... quaint sentiment. I suppose you would have no problem with a CR13 member of The Five, TRIPLE-GESTALTED, would you? And possibly a Jabberwocky or a Fruminous Bandersnatch? ;)

EVEN THE SCORCHING BLAZES OF HELL COULD NOT BURN THE FIRES OF JUSTICE! MY CAUSE IS RIGHTEOUS, MY ACTIONS PURE!

Mwahaha, the power IS AWESOME, YEAH?!

Gunslinger would be pretty cool, but then the concept would be so MAD I wouldn't get anything done. Bard might actually be the best choice in that case, but I'm still not thrilled about it. Oh well, I won't worry about it until RVT makes a decision.

Unless I'm grievously mistaken, we are gestalting as of...like 10 minutes ago?

Mwahaha, the power IS AWESOME, YEAH?!

The power of a hero? Yeah, duh.

I had not seen a confirmation from RVT on that yet. Just saying we should brainstorm possible gestalt ideas.

Can Xerxes gestalt? Maybe with Ranger? He seems like he would be incredibly weak without some extra power, especially in comparison to me. (by the way, as a Feywarden//Sorcerer(Fey-Blooded Seeker), I an AWESOME both crunch- and fluff-wise.)

So, at this point I'm going to have to respectfully bow out.

One of the coolest things about this game was a gathering of humans (plus one fey I guess) rallying against forces so drastically beyond their control; Humanity with it's back really against the wall. Then, when all is seemingly lost, a few fragile but worthy heroes step forward to end the darkness and, hopefully, usher in a new light.

It was cool and an interesting concept; one that I feel is lost between around 1/4th of the applicants being non-human, Tales Feats for supreme power, and now Gestalting on top of everything else. Instead of a fantastic Dark Fantasy setting akin to Ravenloft, where it's tough to be a hero, I'm getting more of a "WAT if EVERYTHING was SUPA POW3RZ" vibe, which is simply not what I signed up for.

I wish you all luck in the selection process, and I hope you have a great time.

Happy Gaming,

Gen. Thunderfist

I am not bowing out, but I agree with much of what Eliah said. I wanted the dark fantasy with a real struggle, where quick thinking and careful planning were the only ways to win the fight; not being all powerful and lazily blasting your abilities away at everything.

*reads Eliah's post*

...nope, no Gestalting. Not here. Eliah is right. I agree with everything, even if I am technically a Gnome.

Thirding for effect, though that had already been my opinion.

Fourthing!

*sigh* now I feel like it's partially my fault for egging this on. The campaign would be way more interesting if we were lower-power.

*sigh* now I feel like it's partially my fault for egging this on. The campaign would be way more interesting if we were lower-power.

Don't worry about it. You weren't as zealous as you think you were.

I disagree that gestalt superpowers PCs, as Doomed Hero seems to agree on, but that is the purpose of this vote: to find out what everyone would prefer. The campaign will be tough regardless of whether gestalt is included. A LOT of encounters will be challenging. And some will be pretty much impossible unless the party uses their heads. I leave the gestalt decision up to the group.

@Cake: To an extent, it does, by giving us more tools at our disposal. It tips the odds in our favor when we are meant to go against the odds.

I disagree that gestalt superpowers PCs, as Doomed Hero seems to agree on, but that is the purpose of this vote: to find out what everyone would prefer. The campaign will be tough regardless of whether gestalt is included. A LOT of encounters will be challenging. And some will be pretty much impossible unless the party uses their heads. I leave the gestalt decision up to the group.

Even if you don't think the PCs become more powerful, you have to at least admit they aren't really your average joe schmoe anymore. Certainly not "normal people thrust into the fight against the dark forces in the campaign setting".

I would definitely prefer gestalt, and I have faith in RVT's abilities to still make the game challenging, scary and dark, even with us being a bit more powerful than normal.

Perhaps a compromise? What if we become gestalt, after game the game starts, due to some cool, awesome event?

If we stick with gestalt from the start, I would go Fair Folk racial paragon/Sorcerer.

Also,

Arwyne was more zealous than Nelis claims she wasn't, but her enchanting fey powers beguiled him into believing otherwise.

Finally, Whirrun, for your PC, if chosen and gestalt happens, a Bard with the right archetype or perhaps a divination focused(not necessarily specialist) Wizard might be good.

I would definitely prefer gestalt, and I have faith in RVT's abilities to still make the game challenging, scary and dark, even with us being a bit more powerful than normal.

Perhaps a compromise? What if we become gestalt, after game the game starts, due to some cool, awesome event?

Yes well I disagree, and wouldn't that just be Mythic then?

Also I especially don't want some freakish magic altering my body right off the bat. I'm a hero dagnabit. I'm gonna stand against the witches on my own two feet, not on some crutch from the gods!

The reason I don't like becoming more powerful is because innovative thinking doesn't matter as much. Even if we are just as equally outmatched by a villain, it's much harder to come up with a clever way to beat a wizard 7/cleric 7 than a cleric 7. When high leveled characters fight they don't use the terrain and get fancy, they stack their abilities and feats up.

I've decided that if we decide to make the campaign gestalt than I will also bow out. That's not trying to pressure anybody to make a decision, but it doesn't fit with my character and I don't think it fits with the campaign.

The reason I don't like becoming more powerful is because innovative thinking doesn't matter as much. Even if we are just as equally outmatched by a villain, it's much harder to come up with a clever way to beat a wizard 7/cleric 7 than a cleric 7. When high leveled characters fight they don't use the terrain and get fancy, they stack their abilities and feats up.

I've decided that if we decide to make the campaign gestalt than I will also bow out. That's not trying to pressure anybody to make a decision, but it doesn't fit with my character and I don't think it fits with the campaign.

Same here, honestly.

This has turned into something of a debate, hm.

I've seen what gestalt can do, and while it is nice in some campaigns, you should never underestimate what having more tools can do for players. It's not always a good thing, and I can assure you it gets incredibly irritating when a group has an answer to literally anything you can throw out at the time.

I'm fine either way.

My gestalt end would be a Tattooed Sorcerer with the Imperious Bloodline.

Fluff wise the origin of the bloodline would connect with my original idea for Maena which is that she comes from a line of well known and respected monster hunters and that the aunt and uncle that saved her are both monster hunters.

As for the Tattooed Sorcerer archetype, for some reason I think the Varisian flavor from Golarion really fits the people of your world, probably the gypsy idea. That and I just really like the archetype.

I'd keep the feats as is though the Arcane Bond from Eldritch Heritage would become an item as I'd get a familiar from Tattooed Sorcerer.

Um...

You guys do know that our enemies are going to be made as gestalts, right?

Whatever, seems you are all against it, which is a bummer.

I'll have to talk to RVT more about my concerns for my build privately.

To be honest I think it's a little hard to give the decision to the group when it hasn't been chosen yet. I think it's a bit of a bummer that some folks bowed out because of a rules convention that hasn't even been decided on yet.

Since you say are more focused on role-play then roll-play, perhaps you can choose players based on backstory and leave the gestalt decision to the actual player group? I was looking forward to the possibility of selection last night and now I'm all confused about where we are at with this.

To clarify, I'm not bowing out. I just voiced my opinion on the matter as I was asked. I still find the plot to be interesting, so I would still like to play, provided I'm chosen.

Monkeygod wrote:

I would definitely prefer gestalt, and I have faith in RVT's abilities to still make the game challenging, scary and dark, even with us being a bit more powerful than normal.

Perhaps a compromise? What if we become gestalt, after game the game starts, due to some cool, awesome event?

Yes well I disagree, and wouldn't that just be Mythic then?

Also I especially don't want some freakish magic altering my body right off the bat. I'm a hero dagnabit. I'm gonna stand against the witches on my own two feet, not on some crutch from the gods!

Agreed here. I like my ranger just da way he is, and dammit, he doesn't need help from the gods when the gods didn't help the village!

Ok, I will make selections soon, then everyone can decide. Sound reasonable?

I think so :)

Sounds good, RVT.

Sounds good RVT. Anything else you would like to see from Whirrun?

Eagerly anticipating your choices! :-)

It seems almost every thread I'm following blew up last night.

I feel that everyone being gestalt takes away a little from necessary teamwork, but I'm also okay with gestalting. I'm not sure what other class would be good for a non-magic/non-combat support character, though. Any ideas?

Also, per Wynnie the Gnome's suggestion:

Tale Feat: Storyteller:(GM controlled) Things are always more interesting when the old man tells the stories. Though beyond his control, things seem to work out more often when he is around. Enemies and allies both die more dramatically or survive hits that they normally wouldn't, as long as it makes for a better story. Common NPCs are also more likely to have heard of the party's exploits, making them either more or less likely to help based on their allegiances.

Edit: Now that I think about it, I'd probably go with a bard archetype, especially if I could switch out spells for rogue talents or something similar.

Heh, sorry about blowing up like that at everything last night. I just realized that Eliah was probably just looking for an excuse to leave the campaign - he was talking about RVT 'losing focus' when I showed up (as the ONE exception to the human- or human-like-only rule).

@Doc: It's Ar! I was looking for a pooh-bear when you said Wynnie.

@Ar: I was very much thinking of a pooh-bear when I said it. Too Taoist for you? :P

Though it would explain the Tigger that follows you around...

I will be obsessively checking this every five minutes now.

Again, probably won't get in, so good luck all!

There's a lot of really great PCs with awesome submissions,

If I personally had to pick, I would choose Arwyne and Emmeline based on their awesome interaction, Doctor Rogers because an old man storyteller type is pretty cool and The Huntsman as that's a classic character in a variety of fairy tales.

However, our Hunter appears to lack a profile, which he should definitely remedy, asap. I would suggest the Hunter from the Advanced Class Guide, which even though its not out yet, I believe has been approved by RVT.

@Ar: I was very much thinking of a pooh-bear when I said it. Too Taoist for you? :P

Though it would explain the Tigger that follows you around...

Well, sir, I am the furthest thing from a Tigger you could find. I am a cat of HONOUR.

I'll be busy tonight, trying to build an EKG. I might not be able to check in to the forums much. Good luck all!

I'll quickly get my profile up so she can make her selection without post hunting ;)

EDIT: I got my profile up. Also, I didn't get the jump on the ACG, and I can't find the alternate class anywhere.

So, at this point I'm going to have to respectfully bow out.

One of the coolest things about this game was a gathering of humans (plus one fey I guess) rallying against forces so drastically beyond their control; Humanity with it's back really against the wall. Then, when all is seemingly lost, a few fragile but worthy heroes step forward to end the darkness and, hopefully, usher in a new light.

It was cool and an interesting concept; one that I feel is lost between around 1/4th of the applicants being non-human, Tales Feats for supreme power, and now Gestalting on top of everything else. Instead of a fantastic Dark Fantasy setting akin to Ravenloft, where it's tough to be a hero, I'm getting more of a "WAT if EVERYTHING was SUPA POW3RZ" vibe, which is simply not what I signed up for.

I wish you all luck in the selection process, and I hope you have a great time.

Happy Gaming,

Gen. Thunderfist

While I do not feel as strongly as Eliah, many of his sentiments echo with mine. I said fairly early on that I saw us as the "vitims" not the perpetrators. Hansel and Gretal are human kids going for cookies and running into a hugely powerful witch. This doesn't mean we have to play with kid characters, only that our power levels should be as children compared to theirs. The villains are crazy, lazy, run around a lot or freak out during key points. Maybe they monologue too much. Maybe they never imagined that one of the PCs was the "destined one" that they thought they killed when she was five.

A whole fey game feels more like, "we supernatural beings are trying to take over your playground. Oops, try not to step on the humans down there..."

Naturally however, I am not the person making this decision. I know that the game can be made challenging if we all gestalt, just as it can be made challenging if we use all 3PP materials or the mythic rules. With challenging comes complicated, of course, and I'm not sure that is a good thing.

Overall, I came for the concept. Have you ever read a fairy tale and thought "man, things always turn out well for the bad guys" or "damn it, another wolf dies like a chump to a bunch of pigs!"

Hopefully that is what will we keep going for. I really want to play, and really put a lot of work into Marianne. She's a good character, made for Ravenloft. I'm really hoping that it'll be a Ravenloft that she's dropped in.

My 2 cents.

PS: Is selection going to be finished sometime soon. I am excited about this game, but if I am not chosen, I'd like to apply for one of the CC games recruiting now. CC isn't Ravenloft, but it's better than nothing.

This thread has gone so creepy quiet now that we are all awaiting the decision....

::returns to nail biting in a corner::

Thursday was party night for RVT and her friend and mentor TSP.

And this is Easter weekend, so I expect things to be slow all around.

Given that we are almost two weeks past the original deadline anyways (and have missed another 2-3 deadlines on top of that), I'm not particularly concerned. I guess it's proving to be a difficult decision.

Any thoughts on what people see as required for the party or anyone have a favorite submission so far?

I know Monkeygod is already in and has cast his vote.

I like Emmeline and Arwyne because of their zany antics, Neils because he'd be able to pull off some cool stuff with a little support, and maybe the lady Spidre because she seems really creepy or one of our woodsmen because they really do seem to fit.

Royce(?) is cool too, and having a kid around means that other characters might become over protective and act differently. I feel Johan would get along well with me story-wise as well.

Wow. I'm having trouble picking through all these submissions and I'm not even GM. x.x;

Correction on my previous post: almost one week past the original deadline, not two.

My party choices are as follows:

Emmeline
Arwyne
Doctor Rogers
Marianne

Based on complete applications as well as defined personalities that I would like to work with. It also fills out all the traditional party roles (arcane caster, healer, combat, and skill roles). I also like it because the party members, while not 100% traditional fairy tale personas, each have unique takes on their roles that make them fit well into this new kind of Grimm style fairy tales.