We can only have a beach episode if someone jumps a shark on a Jet-Ski.
Me neither. ;-)
I'll PM you guys later today.
FYI, all: I'm a few minutes away from boarding a flight to Philly for a few days on a work trip. Have laptop, will GM...but it's likely to be a bit sporadic through the start of Thursday.
There's going to be a point in the scenario where it will make a good bit more sense for it to happen, actually...
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When you're grappled, you don't count as flanking, so no sneak attack.
Arguably. Gonna post some text for when the DM has to make a call. It's really just a RAW mess, thanks to Grapple being inherently complicated.
You threaten all squares into which you can make a melee attack, even when it is not your turn. Generally, that means everything in all squares adjacent to your space (including diagonally). An enemy that takes certain actions while in a threatened square provokes an attack of opportunity from you. If you're unarmed, you don't normally threaten any squares and thus can't make attacks of opportunity.
If you are grappled, you can attempt to break the grapple as a standard action by making a combat maneuver check (DC equal to your opponent's CMD; this does not provoke an attack of opportunity) or Escape Artist check (with a DC equal to your opponent's CMD). If you succeed, you break the grapple and can act normally. Alternatively, if you succeed, you can become the grappler, grappling the other creature (meaning that the other creature cannot freely release the grapple without making a combat maneuver check, while you can). Instead of attempting to break or reverse the grapple, you can take any action that doesn't require two hands to perform, such as cast a spell or make an attack or full attack with a light or one-handed weapon against any creature within your reach, including the creature that is grappling you. See the grappled condition for additional details. If you are pinned, your actions are very limited. See the pinned condition in Conditions for additional details.
A grappled creature is restrained by a creature, trap, or effect. Grappled creatures cannot move and take a –4 penalty to Dexterity. A grappled creature takes a –2 penalty on all attack rolls and combat maneuver checks, except those made to grapple or escape a grapple. In addition, grappled creatures can take no action that requires two hands to perform. A grappled character who attempts to cast a spell or use a spell-like ability must make a concentration check (DC 10 + grappler's CMB + spell level), or lose the spell. Grappled creatures cannot make attacks of opportunity.
Threatening is a usually separate thing from "being able to take an AoO," and could be interpreted as "can be attacked from that direction." Grappled says nothing about not threatening, just not being able to make attacks of opportunity.
The biggest thing that makes me think that one still threatens while grappled is the following idea: "Does an individual who had used their one attack of opportunity still threaten?" I've never met a judge who has disagreed with that idea, but I've played in (and ruled) both ways in the past. I can see a ruling either way, though I haven't looked through the old Combat Maneuver blogs.
Yep, it's a grey area. Did a lot of searching before I decided it would count (which would work both ways).
I can see the argument against, but JMSO it's less compelling than the argument for. And it's moot anyway since the attack missed. :-)
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See, but I'm always running on the assumption that Ashur is getting full-attack & sneak attacked anyways. I have 0 cases of empirical evidence to prove this has even been untrue.
Grabbing a guy with a knife doesn't stop him from stabbing you in the kidneys when his buddy walks behind you (until you pin him, that is.) It's like facing without actual facing rules.
But, yeah, most maneuvers are pretty nonviable at this level, regardless of which it is. Trip vs flying creatures, disarm vs natural weapons, Bull Rush vs massive, multiple-legged creatures, reposition, push, and pull being borderline useless.
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This may not be hurting Ashur specifically but I don't like the precedent it sets. It nerfs grappling (something that's already been hammered pretty hard with the nerf bat over the past year) even more.
Since we're applying real life logic here, I would assume grabbing a guy would keep him stabbing your kidneys specifically.
Ultimately, it's fine I suppose as long as Thunderspirit (and you) have stated your rulings up front. I just won't ever bother grappling myself.
Tripping is still plenty viable in most encounters (like this one for example). Disarm is also good plenty of the time (like this one for example). Grapple is just not allowed to be useful.
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The problem is grappling isn't "I'm holding him down." It's "I've successfully grabbed one of his arms." The other arm is free to do whatever (though casting requires concentration because you're being shaken around a James Bond martini.)
Grammar-induced tangent: Can an ettin grapple himself (with the one-hand-having -4 penalty) if, say, one head is trying to murder the other?
And grapple is incredibly useful against wizards, or unprepared clerics. Hell, pinning ANYTHING is GREAT. The problem being all Combat Maneuvers are silver bullets, and in this case, grapple isn't breaking the DR, per se.
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This always brings back memories form older editions.
Fighter: Ok Mr. wizard, I am going to grapple this enemy so he cannot get to you.
Wizard: NOOOOOOOO!
Fighter: Why not? whats wrong? Do you not want me to keep him from getting to you.
Wizard:Because we have to look up grappling rules!
Back on tangent, I will state that I specifically grabbed that one to stop sneak attacks, will remember the ruling for the future.
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Grappling isn't nearly as complicated as people make it out to be. The easy rule of thumb is, if it makes grappling useful, you're remembering it wrong.
In a recent game I had a DM try to rule that a pinned target was able to full attack unimpeded. At one point I was willing to submit. Grappling is already really bad, what's another nail in the coffin?
Bodyguards. Needed to bring my laptop up.
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See, now I'm getting really attached to Toshi. I figure once Amira is done being playable, I'm going to make him a new PFS character, but I have no idea what I'll do with him. I'm thinking a Cavalier of the Scroll or the Scroll Scoundrel from the Faction Guide, despite how awful both those ideas are.
Worse yet, I also thought of making him an Oracle that goes into Prophet of Kalistrade later, and just HATE RELIGION because of having to endure all this.
Maybe eventually into Pathfinder Chronicler?