Computer tier and item level

[BigNorseWolf]

Computers don't seem to have an item level on them.

Is the item level the tier? twice the tier? (which would let you go from start to 20)

matters for purchasing availability.

[Gary Bush]

Looking at the prices for computers, it appears that the tier of the computer is the same as item level that is used for other equipment.

[quindraco]

Computers are like starships: If you have the budget, you can just buy them, ignoring level requirements. There is no rule I can find anywhere in the CRB granting them an item level. This is corroborated by the rules on Crafting, where Crafting a computer has to have an extra line about using its tier, because the standard rules based on item level otherwise would not apply.

Entertainingly, this also means the Hardened upgrade does nothing, as computers have no base hardness or saving throws. I would assume most GMs will house rule that Computers count as Item Level 1 for hardness, hit points, and saving throws purposes, if not Item Level Tier*2, just so you have actual numbers to work with when fruitlessly attempting to snap a cell phone in two.

[Andy Brown]

I don't think there's a direct tier <-> item level conversion listed, however you can sort of extrapolate from the crafting rules (CRB pg 235)

Quote:

He must have a number of ranks in the appropriate skill equal to the item level of the item to be created.

and

Quote:

you can construct a computer with a tier equal to half your ranks in the skill

That suggest item level is twice tier.

[BigNorseWolf]

Gary Bush wrote:

Looking at the prices for computers, it appears that the tier of the computer is the same as item level that is used for other equipment.

Tier___ price

1______ 50
2_____ 250
3_____ 1,250
4_____ 5,000
5_____ 10,000
6 _____ 20,000
7 _____ 40,000
8 _____ 80,000
9 _____ 160,000
10_____ 320,000

compared to weapons,

A tactical dueling sword with an item level 2 would be 250.. that works out.

a 6k tactical knife has an item level of 7 , which would be 40k as a computer.

a 320k ish item would be a molecular rift dueling sword with an item level of 18

compared to equipment

Medkit, basic 1 100
Medpatch_____1 50
Medkit, advanced 5 2,700
Sprayflesh 5 440
Medical lab 7 7,000

No that still isn't matching up.

[BigNorseWolf]

Andy Brown wrote:

I don't think there's a direct tier <-> item level conversion listed, however you can sort of extrapolate from the crafting rules (CRB pg 235)

Quote:

He must have a number of ranks in the appropriate skill equal to the item level of the item to be created.

and

Quote:

you can construct a computer with a tier equal to half your ranks in the skill

That suggest item level is twice tier.

now that works..

[Gary Bush]

BigNorseWolf wrote:

Gary Bush wrote:

Looking at the prices for computers, it appears that the tier of the computer is the same as item level that is used for other equipment.

<snip>

No that still isn't matching up.

Than hopefully it will be address by campaign leadership.

[Robert Gooding]

Well since a starship has a computer who’s tier is half it’s level, the logical conclusion would be item level is tier*2

[baggageboy]

Also since computers max at level 10 and item max at level 20 it makes sense that item level of a computer should be roughly equally to 2 times its tier.

[Furansisuco]

A Computer Tier 1 can upgrade a Tier 2 paying the difference?

[Belafon]

Furansisuco wrote:

A Computer Tier 1 can upgrade a Tier 2 paying the difference?

If your GM allows it, but probably not. The rules on computers

CRB page 213 wrote:

are designed to give GMs the tools necessary to design computer systems that are both interesting and challenging.

There are not any rules for upgrading the tier after the computer is initially designed.

In case anyone wanders by this thread, the initial question was answered in the 3.0 errata:

Quote:

Page 213: Add the following sentence after the second sentence of the first paragraph in the Tier section.

A computer's effective item level is equal to twice its tier (or 1 for computers of tier 0 and lower).

[Furansisuco]

Is for Society rule, i have a Soldier (S-177 reference) with a Personal Comm upgrade to Tier 1 with IA upgrade, and another upgrades,
some upgrade are based on the price according to the level of the computer. That is my doubt.

[Nefreet]

Unfortunately, Society banned the rule where you can upgrade an item by using 10% of its parts as UPBs towards the construction of a higher level version. So instead, just sell the Tier 1 for 10% of its value in Credits and put those towards the purchase of a higher level version.

I don't think we ever got an answer as to why they didn't like the rule. For techy characters and/or sentimental players it was fun to say that you've technically been using the same gun since Level 1. And the two practices functionally resulted in the same 10% cost reduction.

*shrug*

[Metaphysician]

Maybe *because* it has no practical difference, and thus adds complication in an already complicated play environment?

[breithauptclan]

Well, if I can get 10% of the cost from one used item, then couldn't I get 100% of the cost from 10 of those items? Sounds like a good reason to haul back all of the useless items and equipment that I find. Even better if I can hoard loot from the other players so that I can get their share too.

But yes, the reflavoring of upgrading a piece of equipment into a new item rather than selling the old one and buying a new one should be allowed. But reflavoring is different than mechanics rulings. So even in society play, you can say that this is what you did - even if mechanically you sold the old one and bought new.

[Xenocrat]

I thought society did away with loot drops and selling back stuff and you just got credits for missions. If they don't allow selling back your old equipment for 10% value then they certainly aren't going to allow you to recover 10% of the value during crafting between scenarios, and if they do, then there's no need to have a second option that is mechanically identical.