That's highly subjective, Lady-J. Some groups use 10-point for a more challenging game, some use it to encourage SAD classes over MAD ones, some don't know that the game is mostly balanced around 15-points, and yes, some because the GM is being a jerk. But that's not the only reason.
1) Wrong forum :)
2) What kind of character? People might be able to suggest a build.
Lady-J, there are other reasons beyond 'punish' for 10 point buy. Could be lack of understanding, could be a low-power game, could be any number of reasons.
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That's highly subjective, Lady-J. Some groups use 10-point for a more challenging game, some use it to encourage SAD classes over MAD ones, some don't know that the game is mostly balanced around 15-points, and yes, some because the GM is being a jerk. But that's not the only reason.people don't really need a reason to play a wizard or a cleric over a monk or paladin though low point buy is just there to punish classes that aren't as strong as the tier one sadest of sad casters altho if you want to go back to 3.5's party dynamic of 2 clerics and every one else is wizards you hardly need 10 point buy to do that just ban every other class but clerics and wizards
That is your opinion Lady-J. There are a number of reasons to run low point buy. You don't know the GM's reason in this case, you don't know what style of game they are playing nor what options and restrictions they are playing under.
Yes, if you try to do a 10point buy in a standard game there would be a number of issues, but we don't know that this is a standard game.
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The tier one sadest of sad casters altho if you want to go back to 3.5's party dynamic of 2 clerics and every one else is wizards you hardly need 10 point buy to do that just ban every other class but clerics and wizards
I'm just going to give some examples of 10 point builds to show how absurd the above statement is, with no more than a 2 pt dip.
Human 10 pt martial
STR 17 (15+2racial)18 at 4th
Dex 12
Con 13 14 at 8th
Wis 10
Int 10
Cha 8
Gnome Bard
STR 8
Dex 14
Con 14
Int 10
Wis 8
Cha 16
1/2 elf Summoner (Lots of self buffs mean you don't need a high casting stat)
STR 11 (ignore if encumbrance ignored)
Dex 13
Con 14
Int 10
Wis 8
Cha 15
I've played a summoner with 15 starting cha in pfs (20 pts) no problem.
Halfling Swashbuckler
STR 10
Dex 16
Con 13
Int 8
Wis 10
Cha 14
Point made.
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hello I have been trying to make a character sheets and the GM is useing a 10 point buy system I am not sure how this works can someone pls help me understand how this works
Anyone who wants to keep arguing about this, I started a new thread .
So if you're using a point buy system you don't roll dice to determine your starting stats. Instead you start with every stat as a 10 and have a certain amount of points (in this case 10) to allocate to your stats any way you like. This helps you customise your character a little more than dice rolling usually does and cuts out some of the randomness of character generation.
Lady-J's post actually had a lot of good information here:
Score Points
7 –4
8 –2
9 –1
10 0
11 1
12 2
13 3
14 5
15 7
16 10
17 13
18 17
So you start with:
Str: 10Dex: 10
Con: 10
Int: 10
Wis: 10
Chat: 10
Let's say you want to take your Int up to 14. You consult the chart and see that the 14 in the "Score" column is next to the 5 in the "Points" column. That means you have to spend 5 of your 10 points if you want to bring your Int up to 14.
Next you decide you want your character is going to be physically weak but dextrous. You decide you want him to have a 7 Str and a 16 Dex. 7 in the "Score" column costs (-4) points, which means it actually gives you back 4 more points to spend. 16 in the "Score" column costs 10 points.
Your Character now looks like this...
Str: 7 (-4)
Dex: 16 (10)
Con: 10
Int: 14 (5)
Wis: 10
Cha: 10
... with the numbers in brackets representing how many points you've spent. If you add the points you've spent together you get: (-4) + (10) + (5) = 11
This means you've spent 11 points. Unfortunately you only had 10 points to spend, so you have to take another penalty. Dropping Con/Wis/Cha to 9 will give you (-1) points which will bring you back to 10 points and you'll be ready to go. Let's assume you drop your Cha to 9 (Str:7 Dex:16 Con:10 Int:14 Wis:10 Cha:9).
Now you add in your racial modifiers. You decide to go Elf (since it adds to the things you like).
Elf adds the following modifiers...
Str: 7
Dex: 16 (+2)
Con: 10 (-2)
Int: 14 (+2)
Wis: 10
Cha: 9
... so your character ends up looking like this:
Str: 7
Dex: 18
Con: 8
Int: 16
Wis: 10
Cha: 9
It's important to remember that the racial modifiers apply AFTER the point buy system. In this way you can use certain races to get a higher score in the stats that are important to you without having to spend so many points. This means that racial choice is often more important in a low point buy game.
With the standard point buy system you can't have a score higher than 18 (before you apply racial modifiers) or lower than 7 (before you apply racial modifiers). If you get an Int score of 18 (which costs 17 points) and drop your Con to 7 (which costs (-4) points) and then take Elf as your race you can end up with 20 Int and 5 Con at level 1.
Rub-Eta posted a really useful link for new players working out there point buy. HERE is that link again for convenience sake.
It's worth noting that some classes suffer more than others with a low point buy game. Any class that mostly relies on one Stat (Wizard=Int, Sorcerer=Cha etc) is going to have an easier time than a class that relies on multiple stats (Paladin=Str/Con/Cha, Monk-Str/Dex/Con/Wis). The classes that have an easier time here are often the more powerful classes as well, which means people often view this kind of game as unfair as they strongly push you toward playing certain classes, and can feel like they're punishing players who choose the other classes.
Also some terminology for future reference:
SAD = Single Attribute Dependant.
MAD = Multiple Attribute Dependant.
SAD classes are classes that mostly rely on one stat.
MAD classes are classes that rely on more than one stat.
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Another option (for casters only) with a 10 point buy is to see if your GM allows older characters. That allows +1 to +3 to mental stats (Int, Wis, Cha) but penalties of -1 to -6 to physical stats (Str, Dex, Con). However, since point buy costs more to increase high stats than it does low ones, you can 'buy off' the penalties relatively cheaply. Example;
Old Human Wizard
Str: 10 (10 - 3 age + 3 pt)
Dex: 10 (10 - 3 age + 3 pt)
Con: 10 (10 - 3 age + 3 pt)
Int: 18 (10 + 2 age + 2 race + 5 pt)
Wis: 12 (10 + 2 age)
Cha: 9 (10 + 2 age - 4 pt)
Another option (for casters only) with a 10 point buy is to see if your GM allows older characters. That allows +1 to +3 to mental stats (Int, Wis, Cha) but penalties of -1 to -6 to physical stats (Str, Dex, Con). However, since point buy costs more to increase high stats than it does low ones, you can 'buy off' the penalties relatively cheaply. Example;
Old Human Wizard
Str: 10 (10 - 3 age + 3 pt)
Dex: 12 (10 - 3 age + 5 pt)
Con: 10 (10 - 3 age + 3 pt)
Int: 17 (10 + 2 age + 2 race + 3 pt)
Wis: 12 (10 + 2 age)
Cha: 9 (10 + 2 age - 4 pt)
That's actually a really clever idea. Nice.
Just double checking some of your values there though:
Dex: 12 (10 - 3 age + 5 pt) (Totally Ninja'd =P )
If you spend 5 points on dex it takes it to 14. -3 from age would bring it down to 11. Or is that not what you meant?
More terminology for new players:
Ninja'd means that someone posted something while that makes my post less meaningful while I was writing my post. In this case CBDunkerson corrected his mistake while I was writing my response ... He was too fast for me, like a Ninja!
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PLay a pet class. Your pet horse will be one of the strongest members of the party
hello I have been trying to make a character sheets and the GM is useing a 10 point buy system I am not sure how this works can someone pls help me understand how this works
Anyone who wants to keep arguing about this, I started a new thread .
So if you're using a point buy system you don't roll dice to determine your starting stats. Instead you start with every stat as a 10 and have a certain amount of points (in this case 10) to allocate to your stats any way you like. This helps you customise your character a little more than dice rolling usually does and cuts out some of the randomness of character generation.
Lady-J's post actually had a lot of good information here:
Score Points
7 –4
8 –2
9 –1
10 0
11 1
12 2
13 3
14 5
15 7
16 10
17 13
18 17So you start with:
Str: 10
Dex: 10
Con: 10
Int: 10
Wis: 10
Chat: 10Let's say you want to take your Int up to 14. You consult the chart and see that the 14 in the "Score" column is next to the 5 in the "Points" column. That means you have to spend 5 of your 10 points if you want to bring your Int up to 14.
Next you decide you want your character is going to be physically weak but dextrous. You decide you want him to have a 7 Str and a 16 Dex. 7 in the "Score" column costs (-4) points, which means it actually gives you back 4 more points to spend. 16 in the "Score" column costs 10 points.
Your Character now looks like this...
Str: 7 (-4)
Dex: 16 (10)
Con: 10
Int: 14 (5)
Wis: 10
Cha: 10... with the numbers in brackets representing how many points you've spent. If you add the points you've spent together you get: (-4) + (10) + (5) = 11
This means you've spent 11 points. Unfortunately you only had 10 points to spend, so you have to take another penalty. Dropping Con/Wis/Cha to 9 will...
BEST ANSWER EVER.
Listen to this, he gave you a great answer.