Ritual Hex Feat Clarifications

[Hubaris]

Occult Origins has the feat Ritual Hex which provides you with the Ritual called Beseeching the Patron.

When you perform the Ritual you gain a single Hex of your choice (for 24 Hours) that you qualify for. Eventually, you may choose to perform it and increase the DC to gain Major and Grand Hexes.

My question is, what does "Qualify For" entail?

Hexes by themselves traditionally don't have prerequisites (outside of a few such as Poison Steep, Major and Grand variants, Witch's Brew, etc).

If a Shaman takes Ritual Hex, can they choose a Spirit Hex in their Spirit? Outside their Spirit? Can they choose a Witch Hex (such as Cauldron) even if they've already taken the Witch Hex Hex? Can a Witch take Secret from the Shaman list? A Spirit Hex? What if they have Spirit Talker as well to gain a temporary Shaman Hex, would they be able to get another Hex from that list?

I don't think I'll get much from a developer standpoint, but where do you draw the line in terms of qualifications and prerequisites for Hexes? Is it just the distinction between Major/Grand or class or some combination of both. I need help adjudicating this (not for PFS, as it isn't legal) so any opinions and readings would be most appreciated, thanks!

[Hubaris]

Going to Necrobump this because there is no reason for me to start a second thread for the same question. A player is curious if he can take it coming up; and I would like some second opinions because I don't like saying "No" flat out and would rather iron out problems.

1) What is a Hex prerequisite?

2) Can a Shaman take Ritual Hex to Beseech the Patron even if they have no Patron?
2a) Does a Shaman who has access to the Witch Hex Shaman Hex qualify for Witch Hexes for the purposes of Ritual Hex?
2b) Does a Shaman qualify for Spirit Hexes with this? If so, only within their Spirit?

3) Can a Witch qualify for Shaman Hexes (not Spirit Hexes)?
3a) Can a Witch with Spirit Talker in addition to this qualify for Spirit Hexes?

Thanks again in advance.

Also don't judge, we run our games slowly.

[Anguish]

Don't know if you're going to see this, or if it's too late, but hey.

I think it's pretty clear that the ritual only lets you gain access to hexes you could take - at the moment you perform the ritual. So you can take shaman general hexes, those from your spirit, those from your wandering spirit - if any - and witch hexes (but not grand/major hexes) if you don't already have one. Any other use would grant a hex you can't currently have. Involving Spirit Talker, timing is still an issue. Once an hour is up, you don't qualify for the hex, so it should probably be lost since Spirit Talker says you lose all benefits of the hex, and having it through the ritual is a benefit.

Still, if you can leave your witch hex untaken until a high enough level you can auto-succeed at the skill checks, this is a cool way to change it out given 40 minutes notice.

[KenderKin]

Pretty sure to obtain major and grand hexes you still need to meet the level requirements.

[pad300]

Actually, to add a question, what stops a character from researching this "ritual" separately from the feat:

Someone said wrote:

Discovering Occult Rituals

The mysteries of occult rituals are jealously guarded secrets, often painstakingly obscured by a ritual's originators or those who stumbled upon the obscure formulae detailing it.

The particulars of casting occult rituals are hidden within coded tomes, concealed in puzzles, or referenced only through allusions woven into esoteric tales. Recovering the casting method of an occult ritual can be an adventure within itself, something revealed by hallucinatory visions, coerced from an occult practitioner, or passed on by a true initiate hovering at death's door and wishing for his genius to live beyond his mortal existence.

If an occult ritual is taught or its secrets are explained directly, it takes at least 1 day per ritual level to learn the method of its casting. Learning a ritual from hidden clues or from scratch takes a week or a month per ritual level (GM's discretion). At the end of this period of study and contemplation, the person attempting to learn the ritual must succeed at an Intelligence check (DC = 15 + the ritual level if learning from clues or a coerced teacher, or DC = 10 + the ritual level if learning from an instructor eager to teach) . Failing the check means the secrets of the ritual elude the learner's understanding, though she can start the process anew at the same rate of potential discovery.

it's a 4th level ritual; a DC 19 int check just isn't that hard...