Question about combining the singularity form infusion wild talent with the pulling infusion or pushing infusion substance infusion wild talents


Rules Questions


1 person marked this as FAQ candidate.
Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

When combining the singularity form infusion wild talent with the pulling infusion or pushing infusion substance infusion wild talents, are the victims in the area moved in relation to the kineticist? Or to the origin point of the singularity?

For example, If I create a pulling singularity, are the people caught in it pulled towards me, or towards the center of the singularity? The rules support the former, but it seems that the latter (which I'm hoping for), makes more sense.

I love the idea of mini-black holes sucking people in, or a rip in the fabric of reality releasing enough cosmic energy to blow everyone away from it. Is this the way this combo was intended to work?


I'm hoping for the 'makes sense' latter one.

I'd like to tack on combining them with Snaking infusion and Fragmentation, for the non-primary target, to this inquiry.


Can you link the Singularity Form Infusion?


Good question. I would ere towards the latter interpretation, although I do admit that RAW seems to favor the former.

Frankly I think the entire occult book needs an overhaul. Just the sheer number of questions it has raised is a tribute to the confusion it had added to the game. I don't even allow those classes into my games until they get seriously looked at again.


After rereading the pushing infusion if pulling works the same way, and I see no reason why it shouldn't, I don't think it'll work with singularity. Bold for important part.

Pushing Infusion:
The momentum of your kinetic blast knocks foes back. Attempt a bull rush combat maneuver check against each target damaged by your infused blast, using your Constitution modifier instead of your Strength modifier to determine your bonus. This infusion can push a foe back by a maximum of 5 feet. You can increase the burn cost of this infusion to increase the maximum distance pushed by 5 feet per additional point of burn accepted. You can't use this infusion with a form infusion such as cloud that causes your kinetic blast to lack a clear direction to push.

But that still doesn't address the alternate direction hits possible from snake and fragmentation.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Kolyarut wrote:
Can you link the Singularity Form Infusion?

I cannot, as there is no online version of it that I know of. It is from Occult Origins.

Texas Snyper wrote:

After rereading the pushing infusion if pulling works the same way, and I see no reason why it shouldn't, I don't think it'll work with singularity. Bold for important part.

** spoiler omitted **

But that still doesn't address the alternate direction hits possible from snake and fragmentation.

I don't know about that, I can clearly envision it pushing outwards from the center. That's a pretty clear direction (if the latter interpretation above is to be believed).


Ravingdork wrote:
Texas Snyper wrote:

After rereading the pushing infusion if pulling works the same way, and I see no reason why it shouldn't, I don't think it'll work with singularity. Bold for important part.

** spoiler omitted **

But that still doesn't address the alternate direction hits possible from snake and fragmentation.

I don't know about that, I can clearly envision it pushing outwards from the center. That's a pretty clear direction (if the latter interpretation above is to be believed).

The common sense reading would make you think so but without definitive ruling on it, it can be interpreted differently.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Texas Snyper wrote:
Ravingdork wrote:
Texas Snyper wrote:

After rereading the pushing infusion if pulling works the same way, and I see no reason why it shouldn't, I don't think it'll work with singularity. Bold for important part.

** spoiler omitted **

But that still doesn't address the alternate direction hits possible from snake and fragmentation.

I don't know about that, I can clearly envision it pushing outwards from the center. That's a pretty clear direction (if the latter interpretation above is to be believed).
The common sense reading would make you think so but without definitive ruling on it, it can be interpreted differently.

Yep, hence the thread. :)


I would definitely rule that Singularity has a definite direction of Push/Pull, the epicenter of the AoE. The direction is essentially inwardly/outwardly in a direct line from the center of the AoE to each square that is affected.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Faelyn wrote:
I would definitely rule that Singularity has a definite direction of Push/Pull, the epicenter of the AoE. The direction is essentially inwardly/outwardly in a direct line from the center of the AoE to each square that is affected.

This is what I'm hoping for. It would make the power combinations both thematically and mechanically amazing.


CampinCarl9127 wrote:

Good question. I would ere towards the latter interpretation, although I do admit that RAW seems to favor the former.

Frankly I think the entire occult book needs an overhaul. Just the sheer number of questions it has raised is a tribute to the confusion it had added to the game. I don't even allow those classes into my games until they get seriously looked at again.

I think really the "sheer number of questions" are mainly for the Kineticist. We have nothing like to to know how it works. But It's been mostly cleared up and Mark is great at providing more clarifications as we have these questions. Other than that I'm not aware of much "problems" with any of the other classes.


My book should arrive today, i hope to weigh in on this shortly. Mostly because i love the concept of gravity manipulation and dropping singularities. how exactly does singularity work? I've seen mention on the boards that it is something like 1/4 damage but persists and grows in AoE over time?


Choose a grid point. Start with 5 ft blast that grows to 10 then 15 then disappears.


This is the nerdiest-sounding thread title ever.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Kobold Cleaver wrote:
This is the nerdiest-sounding thread title ever.

I love using the kineticist class' official terminology when making thread titles; it clearly shows how ridiculously wordy they can get.

Community / Forums / Pathfinder / Pathfinder First Edition / Rules Questions / Question about combining the singularity form infusion wild talent with the pulling infusion or pushing infusion substance infusion wild talents All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.