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Metamorphs are often confused with doppelgangers, were-creatures or druids, that is, if they can be discovered at all. The metamorph’s shape shifting ability comes neither with the blood boiling savagery of were-creatures nor from their ties to nature as with the druids. They simply are. It is hypothesized that metamorphs are the descendants of dopplegangers: a quirk of nature and magic. Regardless of their origins, metamorphs often keep their abilities to themselves, considering it more of a curse than a blessing: how can someone be trusted if those closest to them are unsure whether they are wearing their real face?
Enter the Metamorph
As a side note: I prefer the pathfinder way of handling polymorphing since they are limited and controllable attribute boosts, as opposed to D&D 3.5 Edition where your physical attributes change completely. That said, polymorphing is still hellofa complicated. For example, when polymorphing, you don't gain the creature you are changing into's type or subtype. This means no aquatic subtype for your shark... so you can literally become a land shark. Ok, a shark on land has limited land speed (if any) and so is not that scary (until it flies) but an octopus becomes really scary. 20ft reach on 8 tentacles... and that is a normal druid straight from the core rulebook.
But enough of my rambling... let the criticisms, comments and suggestions flow.
Great!
Add the chance to become a smaller or greater object to the Mimic, and I could kiss you!
Great!
Add the chance to become a smaller or greater object to the Mimic, and I could kiss you!
You tempt me. :)
I did consider this very thing when I created the archetype, though then the mimic metamorph would be "better" at being a mimic than an actual mimic. I try to resist giving players abilities that are strictly better than the monsters they originally came from. That said, in this case, I think I will make an exception. Added Small at no extra cost. Large will be added later.
Edit: Oversized Object Mimicry feat added. Now mimics and metamorphs alike can enjoy being large objects. First GM to have a PC eaten by an outhouse, wins.
Ohhhh, love it. ^^
Was this idea pulled from anywhere or was this purely home brewed?
Only asking because I have seen a lot of similar pieces. Well put together though. Good use of polymorph.
I'd say that such general line of design is quite intuitive development based on the way the wildshape and polymorph works in Pathfinder.
(I thought about something like that in the past as well - a wildshaper without spellcasting unlike regular druid).
My main complaint about this class is its name ;)
Otherwise it is interesting but I don't really feel its use of Charisma: I think that Constitution or Wisdom would fit the class better most of the time, except for a specific origin stories.
Was this idea pulled from anywhere or was this purely home brewed?
Only asking because I have seen a lot of similar pieces. Well put together though. Good use of polymorph.
I'd say that such general line of design is quite intuitive development based on the way the wildshape and polymorph works in Pathfinder.
It is pure homebrew. What Drejk said. This class is the logical extrapolation of the polymorph spells all put together in one class.
My main complaint about this class is its name ;)
Its first design name was Shaper. Finding a unique name that hasn't been flogged to death is a bit of a challenge. Especially for a shapeshifter. Metamorph is an actual term for shapeshifters. So it fits.
Otherwise it is interesting but I don't really feel its use of Charisma: I think that Constitution or Wisdom would fit the class better most of the time, except for a specific origin stories.
I was flipping between Constitution and Charisma. In the end I decided to go with both. The actual strength of the shapes abilities is Constitution based while the number of uses per day are keyed off Charisma. (Also fey can use Charisma for their abilities). This lessens the dumping of the mental stats purely in favor of the physical ones. But it's still an option if you are that way inclined: turn into a monster and stay in that one form all day.
My main complaint about this class is its name ;)Its first design name was Shaper. Finding a unique name that hasn't been flogged to death is a bit of a challenge. Especially for a shapeshifter. Metamorph is an actual term for shapeshifters. So it fits.
That one is actually personal complaint... And expressed specifically to Garnath, as he is publisher of a class book that contains one metamorph base class. Written by me. I went with a different, more long-term interpretation of metamorph(osis).
I'm having a difficult time following what the class features do, specifically shaping and shaper's shift. It also doesn't help that the ability names do not match the ones listed in the class's table. The language also doesn't flow very well. This honestly feels like a first draft.
I'm having a difficult time following what the class features do, specifically shaping and shaper's shift. It also doesn't help that the ability names do not match the ones listed in the class's table. The language also doesn't flow very well. This honestly feels like a first draft.
It was my assumption that it is the first draft. It certainly needs editing and development.
I'm having a difficult time following what the class features do, specifically shaping and shaper's shift. It also doesn't help that the ability names do not match the ones listed in the class's table. The language also doesn't flow very well. This honestly feels like a first draft.It was my assumption that it is the first draft. It certainly needs editing and development.
Can't really say much to this. Is it as polished as it could be? Probably not. Is it going to change? With constructive feedback, maybe. Is it mechanically where I want it to be? Yes. Helpful suggestions are always welcome.
Edit: Also have the courtesy to say it looks like the 4th draft (which it is) :p
It seems that the name Metamorph is not as uncommon as I thought it was. And here I thought I was being all smart like.
So I will be taking suggestions for a new class name while considering a new one.
It seems that the name Metamorph is not as uncommon as I thought it was. And here I thought I was being all smart like.
So I will be taking suggestions for a new class name while considering a new one.
Is just the simple "Shifter" taken? i know there is "feral shifter" and "dark shifter" but i don't see any that are just Shifter.
As for the class itself, i love it. I just need a publisher to pick it up so I can argue the use of it in my group >_<. They only allow published classes in the games.
EDIT: or I also like "Polyform".
Polyform(ist)? Polymorph(ist)? Formshifter? Shapemorpher? Morpher? (that one is class from Final Fantasy Tactics Advanced, that, well, do almost exactly what this class does - change shape into known forms and gain their abilities, except its closer to 3rd edition polymorphs as it completely replaces regular abilities).
shapemancer
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I Once tried a similar class idea to this, called the Evolutionary. Then i was shot down by the fact that psionics won't stay within their realms of the mental powers. Even 4th editions psionic classes were more consistantly psychic than the psionic unleashed's Psions.
Hence why i'm looking forward to occult adventurers because then i can say that Psionics from d20 can stay the hell out of my games and we still have psychic classes(like the medium,spiritualist,Mesmeriser, and psychic.And the kineticist).
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I Once tried a similar class idea to this, called the Evolutionary. Then i was shot down by the fact that psionics won't stay within their realms of the mental powers. Even 4th editions psionic classes were more consistantly psychic than the psionic unleashed's Psions.
Hence why i'm looking forward to occult adventurers because then i can say that Psionics from d20 can stay the hell out of my games and we still have psychic classes(like the medium,spiritualist,Mesmeriser, and psychic.And the kineticist).
I honestly wasn't too impressed by what I read in occult adventures. It's another set of 1-off classes rather than any new frameworks, which means you have to learn each class on its own to know anything about them rather than being able to generalize a bit between them. It's fine for them to have their own mechanics, but when each invents an entire set of new concepts that everything in the class revolves around it starts to get a bit tiresome, especially since that limits how much new feats/etc can cross-pollinate.
Not sure which psionics system you're referring to, but the one from dreamscarred looks good (much of it is on d20pfsrd). Haven't ran with it yet, but plan to allow it in my next campaign.
Omnimorph or multimorph.
Now I started to wonder if this class (or something like this) should have 3/4 BAB and d8 HD, or maybe it would be better bumped to full BAB and d10?
How many natural attacks one can get with polymorphs and when it becomes too much?
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I Once tried a similar class idea to this, called the Evolutionary. Then i was shot down by the fact that psionics won't stay within their realms of the mental powers. Even 4th editions psionic classes were more consistantly psychic than the psionic unleashed's Psions.
Hence why i'm looking forward to occult adventurers because then i can say that Psionics from d20 can stay the hell out of my games and we still have psychic classes(like the medium,spiritualist,Mesmeriser, and psychic.And the kineticist).
I honestly wasn't too impressed by what I read in occult adventures. It's another set of 1-off classes rather than any new frameworks, which means you have to learn each class on its own to know anything about them rather than being able to generalize a bit between them. It's fine for them to have their own mechanics, but when each invents an entire set of new concepts that everything in the class revolves around it starts to get a bit tiresome, especially since that limits how much new feats/etc can cross-pollinate.
Not sure which psionics system you're referring to, but the one from dreamscarred looks good (much of it is on d20pfsrd). Haven't ran with it yet, but plan to allow it in my next campaign.
The Occult adventures playtest is still a playtest. they are probably going to get better in the actual book, which has not yet come out. In comparison, I like my power-sources to be more defined, and the Psionics are kind of that group that can do nearly EVERYTHING better than the actual magic classes with their prestige classes. I Know that might be the point, but a psionic is (for all intents and purposes) a class that uses their brain to defeat their enemies. That is why they are PSIonics. If they start deriding their power from magic, or start shifting their bodies with their brains, they betray the very principle their class is based on.
I Have nothing against psychic classes. I embrace the madness that using the mind to manipulate the world around you. what i am against is the rampant rendering of other classes obsolete. The Game should allow you to play what ever idea you wish to fill. The Evolutionary was going to be a Primal powered class, A monster based on rapid evolution into the ultimate creature, while also trying to hold onto their humanity. The archetypes would have enabled other variations on the main basis with some unique powers related to their creation.
The problem is the psionics won't stop basically saying "well we can already do that, so just play our class instead." maybe i'm narrow minded, maybe i'm just being sour about losing my class idea to someone else. But I do have a sense of principles when it comes to what a psychic class should be.
Summoners are not psychics, since their creations come more from magic rather than the mind. Spiritualists are psychic, but use most of their power to care for a spirit which dwells within them. To me, power sources are important-as that alone is what separates a wizard from a cleric, a sorcerer form an oracle, a magus from a paladin or war-priest. Arcane is not the same as divine, psychic is not the same as magic, and martial is nothing like magic, though some times it varies with some(Ninja, why do you pull such magic linked shenanigans. if you want to be a magic caster so badly, why not learns some more spells besides your illusionanry things(like JIRAYIA)).
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Uh, excuse me, but you might have confused threads.
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Now I started to wonder if this class (or something like this) should have 3/4 BAB and d8 HD, or maybe it would be better bumped to full BAB and d10?
How many natural attacks one can get with polymorphs and when it becomes too much?
I would say it depends. you might need to playtest with a few groups with different amounts and see what works.
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Uh, excuse me, but you might have confused threads.
Sorry, its just a reflex to any referance to P/PCBS(psionic/prestige class BS). Those are my too pet peives, and i really wish they would stop cropping up in topics i like. Your class ideas Is good. I just think the psionics really need to stop their shenanigans of not being really psychic.
That's for all the name suggestions. Would something like Polyformancer be too much of a mouthful?
Now I started to wonder if this class (or something like this) should have 3/4 BAB and d8 HD, or maybe it would be better bumped to full BAB and d10?
How many natural attacks one can get with polymorphs and when it becomes too much?
This was considered when I first created this class, the hit dice part could quite easily work. The full base attack would be a bit overpowering. I'll use the giant octopus as an example: 9 attacks. 1 primary bite, 8 secondary tentacles. The tentacles have 20 foot reach. This class can turn into this at 5th level, by choosing giant octopus as her 2nd favored form. (A core Druid can do this at 6th level). I would not like to meet this critter in any kind of ally. The full BAB goes a long way to improving the secondary natural attack penalty. This is even more an issue with monsters that have only primary attacks. I don't think its really necessary to go full BAB as the class stands now.
I am still tempted to increase the hit dice to d10s. But this would be an exception to the unwritten rule: thou 3/4 BA class shall have d8 HD.
That's for all the name suggestions. Would something like Polyformancer be too much of a mouthful?
I like it. i also like polyformist. But polyformancer reads much the same way, and is a little further down the "unique" path.
Poly(for)mancer sounds awesome... As long as you don't know that it does not exactly fit the class as there are no divinations involved.
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Poly(for)mancer sounds awesome... As long as you don't know that it does not exactly fit the class as there are no divinations involved.
Now I am leaning more towards polyformist.
On the flipside I have the name for my next diviner: Mantismancer. A diviner so good he was named twice.
Poly(for)mancer sounds awesome... As long as you don't know that it does not exactly fit the class as there are no divinations involved.Now I am leaning more towards polyformist.
On the flipside I have the name for my next diviner: Mantismancer. A diviner so good he was named twice.
I'd go with Manteia The Seer.
I actually think from time to time on making a polymancer base/prestige class that would be using various types of divination.
Update:
- The name of the class is changed to Polyformist (thanks for the brain storming)
- Minor editing changes to hopefully make the class a bit more coherent.
- Updated the body double archetype's mimic ability to be a bit less... amazing but still functional.
- Added minor attack buffs to the subterranean archetype.
Contemplating an archetype called a monoformist that forgets her own base form and becomes stuck in a single shifted form. Could then have the option to change to a new shifted form when she would normally gain a new morph group.
Any further thoughts or comments are welcome.