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Hello,
I have read many threads on this subject, but I have not read a definitive
FAQ on the following question: 1) Can a mounted Cavalier use a lance and a shield while charging, and 2) Would that same Cavalier get the 1 and 1/2 Str. and Power Attack bonus to damage while using the lance and shield?
There has been many debates on this question, but I'm trying to get a solid resolution on this debate.
Furthermore, can a mounted character (w/ a Lance), and with the Ride-by-Attack feat, charge by one enemy and attack them and then the mount end up charging into another enemy and attacking that enemy. For example, the mount charges in a straight line to an enemy target, but by doing so, it rides by another enemy allowing the character on the mounts back to attack the enemy that the mount just rode by...and can the Cavalier apply his charge bonus to the one the the mount rode by. Therefore, two charges, on two separate targets, in on round.
Thank you for your input and answers.
1) This is a given. Yes.
2) The FAQ contradicts itself.Yes and no. The FAQ that applies will be up to your GM. I would probably take a guess that FAQ 1) is meant to be for wielding a lance specifically, whilst FAQ 2) is for weapons like the bastard sword, but RAW... good luck!
3) You might be able to get away with it (mounted combat is a mess), but RAW, probably not. The ride-by attack specifies that "you may move and attack as if with a standard charge and then move again (continuing the straight line of the charge)." Both you and your mount are considered charging, and the feat only allows you to continue moving after attacking once, so to do this twice (or attack at the end of the charge) would be breaking this logic (if your mount attacked at the end, and you attacked in the middle, you would be using ride by and he wouldn't..... which you may get away with but I doubt most GMs would allow it).
Note that RAW ride-by attack doesn't work at all (you have to continue a straight line... which would take you through their square, which you can't do), so the whole thing is very much up in the air anyway. Like I said, mounted combat is a mess.
Note that RAW ride-by attack doesn't work at all (you have to continue a straight line... which would take you through their square, which you can't do), so the whole thing is very much up in the air anyway. Like I said, mounted combat is a mess.
Ride-By-Attack works because you don't have to charge the enemy straight on. "You must move to the closest space from which you can attack the opponent." So you start the charge from the side of the target, attack on an angle or adjacent to the enemy and keep on riding.
>>>>H>>>>>>
............X
X=Enemy H=Hit >=Charge Path
Note that RAW ride-by attack doesn't work at all (you have to continue a straight line... which would take you through their square, which you can't do), so the whole thing is very much up in the air anyway. Like I said, mounted combat is a mess.
Ride-By-Attack works because you don't have to charge the enemy straight on. "You must move to the closest space from which you can attack the opponent." So you start the charge from the side of the target, attack on an angle or adjacent to the enemy and keep on riding.
>>>>H>>>>>>
............X
X=Enemy H=Hit >=Charge Path
And if you are on a cardinal direction? What then?
Also, you're ignoring this line:
"You must move at least 10 feet (2 squares) and may move up to double your speed directly toward the designated opponent"
Note that RAW ride-by attack doesn't work at all (you have to continue a straight line... which would take you through their square, which you can't do), so the whole thing is very much up in the air anyway. Like I said, mounted combat is a mess.
Ride-By-Attack works because you don't have to charge the enemy straight on. "You must move to the closest space from which you can attack the opponent." So you start the charge from the side of the target, attack on an angle or adjacent to the enemy and keep on riding.
>>>>H>>>>>>
............X
X=Enemy H=Hit >=Charge PathAnd if you are on a cardinal direction? What then?
Also, you're ignoring this line:
"You must move at least 10 feet (2 squares) and may move up to double your speed directly toward the designated opponent"
/facepalm
Dude, these are the kind of "literalist interpretation" debates that people have when discussing the Bible.
This is the CRB of a table top roleplaying game, just apply a little common sense. Of course someone should be able to charge parallel to someone else!
And if you are on a cardinal direction? What then?Also, you're ignoring this line:
"You must move at least 10 feet (2 squares) and may move up to double your speed directly toward the designated opponent"
The parallel path that I laid out is a direct charge towards the target that moves to the closest square the charger can hit the target. Most people I've played with have interrupted "directly towards" as being able to draw a straight line to get to the closest viable square to attack the target.
While doing a Ride-By-Attack, think of it like jousting. You ride up to the target, try to impale it on your lance, and keep on moving.
As far as cardinal directions, you can charge at an angle as well if it's the most direct path to the target. Here's a diagram showing some example angles for charging that was posted by Sean K. Reynolds.
2) The FAQ contradicts itself.Yes and no. The FAQ that applies will be up to your GM. I would probably take a guess that FAQ 1) is meant to be for wielding a lance specifically, whilst FAQ 2) is for weapons like the bastard sword, but RAW... good luck!
The FAQs do not contradict themselves. One applies to a two-handed weapon used in one hand (which, to my knowledge, the only thing that qualifies is using a lance while mounted), and the other applies to using two-handed weapons as one-handed weapons (such as the Titan Mauler's Jotung Grip or the Phalanx Fighter's ability whose name I cannot remember right now).
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1) This is a given. Yes.
2) The FAQ contradicts itself.Yes and no. The FAQ that applies will be up to your GM. I would probably take a guess that FAQ 1) is meant to be for wielding a lance specifically, whilst FAQ 2) is for weapons like the bastard sword, but RAW... good luck!
3) You might be able to get away with it (mounted combat is a mess), but RAW, probably not. The ride-by attack specifies that "you may move and attack as if with a standard charge and then move again (continuing the straight line of the charge)." Both you and your mount are considered charging, and the feat only allows you to continue moving after attacking once, so to do this twice (or attack at the end of the charge) would be breaking this logic (if your mount attacked at the end, and you attacked in the middle, you would be using ride by and he wouldn't..... which you may get away with but I doubt most GMs would allow it).
Note that RAW ride-by attack doesn't work at all (you have to continue a straight line... which would take you through their square, which you can't do), so the whole thing is very much up in the air anyway. Like I said, mounted combat is a mess.
Thank you for the reply. I can only assume that all of this is up to everyone's own interpretation. If this is the case, why would I not want to charge with a lance and shield and do 1 and 1/2 of my str. and power attack damage to my charge target. It's too bad there is not an official FAQ on this subject...you would think that all of the threads on this subject would warrant an official clarification. Thank you again.
Note that RAW ride-by attack doesn't work at all (you have to continue a straight line... which would take you through their square, which you can't do), so the whole thing is very much up in the air anyway. Like I said, mounted combat is a mess.
Ride-By-Attack works because you don't have to charge the enemy straight on. "You must move to the closest space from which you can attack the opponent." So you start the charge from the side of the target, attack on an angle or adjacent to the enemy and keep on riding.
>>>>H>>>>>>
............X
X=Enemy H=Hit >=Charge PathAnd if you are on a cardinal direction? What then?
Also, you're ignoring this line:
"You must move at least 10 feet (2 squares) and may move up to double your speed directly toward the designated opponent"
/facepalm
Dude, these are the kind of "literalist interpretation" debates that people have when discussing the Bible.
This is the CRB of a table top roleplaying game, just apply a little common sense. Of course someone should be able to charge parallel to someone else!
/facepalm yourself. Of course you should apply common sense. He was asking for some direct rules clarification - the point being there is none, so he should apply common sense.
/facepalmDude, these are the kind of "literalist interpretation" debates that people have when discussing the Bible.
This is the CRB of a table top roleplaying game, just apply a little common sense. Of course someone should be able to charge parallel to someone else!
You must be new here.
Welcome to the Rules Forum! :D
Owner - D20 Hobbies
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1) Can a mounted Cavalier use a lance and a shield while charging
2) Would that same Cavalier get the 1 and 1/2 Str
3) Ride-by-Attack feat, charge by one enemy and attack them and then the mount end up charging into another enemy
1) Yes
2) The Lance would deal 2H damage and Power Attack because it is being wielded two handed using only one hand due to a special ability of the lance.3) Your mount and you must charge the same target, and your mount must have the Ride-By-Attack feat. Some GM's may require the rider to have it also. This is clarified in recent mounted charge FAQ.
Note: Charge and "directly toward" issues. You don't have to do some bee line to the target, you can move in a straight line in any way you wish so long as you attack the target from the first square you can attack it and there is a square on your line that can attack it. This has been clarified by pictures by developers.
There will be table variance, because before I saw the pictures I was a GM and player that subscribed to the "bee line" way of thinking.
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I have not seen the FAQ James alluded to (care for a link?) but my understanding was that you could charge a different opponent than your mount either by moving past the target and you whack him as you moved past, or your mount could overrun the creature you just lanced on its way to its own target.
If you get a mount with improved and greater overrun, you should be able to one of two things (depending on what the faq shows) either
A) charge enemy 1 with lance, overrun target providing AOO, hit it with your shield (or lance haft if you are a dragoon), allow your mount to get one "hoof" attack, and continue on to the mounts target
B) charge enemy 1 with lance and mount, over run 1 target enroute, knock if over and get one AOO from you and one "hoof" attack from mount, deliver both a weapon charge attack and your mount's charge attack to enemy 2.
Hi,
Why would your mount need the ride-by-attack feat? You are controlling the mount and the rider needs it, but not the mount. Does not seem to make sense otherwise. Thanks.
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Owner - D20 Hobbies
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Mounted Combat: When making a charge while mounted, which creature charges? The rider or the mount?
Both charge in unison, suffer the same penalty to AC, the gaining the same bonus to the attack rolls and following all other rules for the charge. The mounted combat rules are a little unclear on this. Replace the third paragraph under the "Combat while Mounted" section on page 202 with the following text. Note that a "mounted charge" is synonymous with a "charge while mounted," and that when a lance is "when used from the back of a charging mount" it is during a mounted charge not when only the mount charges.
A mounted charge is a charge made by you and your mount. During a mounted charge, you deal double damage with your first melee attack made with a lance or with any weapon if you have Spirited Charge (or a similar effect), or you deal triple damage with a lance and Spirited Charge.
This change will be reflected in future printings of the Pathfinder RPG Core Rulebook