I only now realized that my previous post might be taken as a single flow of thought.... horrifying, but funny. Hey, we are posting this around Halloween, and what better subject than the unspeakable horrors of beings born with the foulest blood in existence?
Anyway, just so all readers can be clear, the second half was about hands.
So, tiefling preferences: Humanoid feets or hooves? Or other?
To get my full fashionista on, I need human feet.
As for Tiefling rarity, it really doesn't seem that setting wise they're that uncommon. I mean, they were all over the place in Planescape, they had their own Empire in 4e, and in PF we have several countries where they would be fairly common (as someone else pointed out). In all honesty, in a "typical" PF game, Tieflings and Aasimar are probably way more common than drow, a little less common than half-elves (or Half-Orcs), and on par with Tengu's for rarity (seeing as Aasimar, Tiefling, and Tengu are PFS legal, they can't be THAT rare).
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So, tiefling preferences: Humanoid feets or hooves? Or other?To get my full fashionista on, I need human feet.
Hey now, if you shop some furry art, there are plenty of non-human footwear! *
Of course, one would need to find a good tailor/cobblesmith for odd anatomy.*Not really the best example I can find, but they're out there!
So, tiefling preferences: Humanoid feets or hooves? Or other?To get my full fashionista on, I need human feet.Hey now, if you shop some furry art, there are plenty of non-human footwear! *
Of course, one would need to find a good tailor/cobblesmith for odd anatomy.*Not really the best example I can find, but they're out there!
Usually I see it devoted to stockings and wraps and harnesses myself. I'm more of a boot kinda' guy, so my opinion may be a bit biased. That said, there is quiet a bit of gear that works great on hooves and reptilian claws that just doesn't work that well with human feet. Takes a certain mentality to get into that sort of thing I think. I mean erm... not that I would know.
Hmm... Need to start a thread or two on fashion some day...
So, tiefling preferences: Humanoid feets or hooves? Or other?To get my full fashionista on, I need human feet.
As for Tiefling rarity, it really doesn't seem that setting wise they're that uncommon. I mean, they were all over the place in Planescape, they had their own Empire in 4e, and in PF we have several countries where they would be fairly common (as someone else pointed out). In all honesty, in a "typical" PF game, Tieflings and Aasimar are probably way more common than drow, a little less common than half-elves (or Half-Orcs), and on par with Tengu's for rarity (seeing as Aasimar, Tiefling, and Tengu are PFS legal, they can't be THAT rare).
I personally feel the homogenized appearance of tieflings from 4e DnD is a good idea for Devil-spawned tieflings, as they're supposed to be lawful even in their blood. More chaotic appearances (but still natural) work better for demons, like having leaves where hair should be, shading glowing yellow eyes that have red sclera. Subtle plant traits that fit in where there should be entirely animal traits.
Damn, I have to use that appearance sometime.
As far as it goes, I particularly like playing lawful characters, as it fits my personality better. I'm actually planning on playing up a tiefling paladin when my GM starts running Wrath of the Righteous.
On the topic of footwear, the pic that Halae's avatar is taken from comes from Blood of Fiends, in the Social traits chapter if I'm not mistaken. She's wearing some kind of boot or high-heeled shoe made for hooves. It doesn't look bad.
I'm playing a Korvosan devilblooded tiefling in S&S. I opted for human eyes with black sclera and red irises (any Gambit fans?), vestigial horns and prehensile tail. He spews smoke from his sinuses when angry; that's been a lot of fun, and a very memorable quirk.
I don't mind being treated differently; the only time when NPC treatment was a problem was when it was inconsistent. At the beginning of the game, there were no social repercussions at all. About ten days into the voyage, however, the racism came out of nowhere. It was a bit jarring having Sandara Quinn (whom I had saved from being raped previously) accuse me of being a traitor without grounds. I would have rather been treated with hostility from the start than to have to suffer the whiplash, immersion-breaking change.
I enjoy tieflings. They're one of the most inherently varied races (each with some sort of explicit theme that tends to be great roleplay fodder), and canon in-world attitudes about them are just as varied. Frankly, I like them way more than aasimars; maybe I just have a much more finely-grained understanding of evil than of good, but I would find it much easier to create ten distinct tiefling characters than ten distinct aasimar characters.
On the topic of footwear, the pic that Halae's avatar is taken from comes from Blood of Fiends, in the Social traits chapter if I'm not mistaken. She's wearing some kind of boot or high-heeled shoe made for hooves. It doesn't look bad.
When you said that, I had to take another look, because I knew what you were talking about, vaguely, but not quite.
I initially thought they were just high-heeled boots, but the more I look at it the more I see what you mean about them being hooves. This is a great look.
On the topic of footwear, the pic that Halae's avatar is taken from comes from Blood of Fiends, in the Social traits chapter if I'm not mistaken. She's wearing some kind of boot or high-heeled shoe made for hooves. It doesn't look bad.When you said that, I had to take another look, because I knew what you were talking about, vaguely, but not quite.
I initially thought they were just high-heeled boots, but the more I look at it the more I see what you mean about them being hooves. This is a great look.
Hmm... Any chance someone knows where I can find the picture elsewhere? I don't have Blood of Fiends on me atm. Good shoes are always a plus, and nice headwear is almost as important... almost.
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On the topic of footwear, the pic that Halae's avatar is taken from comes from Blood of Fiends, in the Social traits chapter if I'm not mistaken. She's wearing some kind of boot or high-heeled shoe made for hooves. It doesn't look bad.When you said that, I had to take another look, because I knew what you were talking about, vaguely, but not quite.
I initially thought they were just high-heeled boots, but the more I look at it the more I see what you mean about them being hooves. This is a great look.
It could easily be said that technically, any non-plantigrade feet are somewhat already in a high-heel format. So it's a matter of just forming the fabric/material around that! :3
Hmm... Any chance someone knows where I can find the picture elsewhere? I don't have Blood of Fiends on me atm. Good shoes are always a plus, and nice headwear is almost as important... almost.On the topic of footwear, the pic that Halae's avatar is taken from comes from Blood of Fiends, in the Social traits chapter if I'm not mistaken. She's wearing some kind of boot or high-heeled shoe made for hooves. It doesn't look bad.When you said that, I had to take another look, because I knew what you were talking about, vaguely, but not quite.
I initially thought they were just high-heeled boots, but the more I look at it the more I see what you mean about them being hooves. This is a great look.
Here, I found one image through google and the other I just took a screenshot from my pdf copy of BoF. They're both in the same book, and are both good examples of what you can do with footwear based on hooves rather than plantigrade feet.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b283/pyranack/1372232582635_zps56c890d8.j pg
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b283/pyranack/Hoof-boots_zps5d727277.png
Hmm... Any chance someone knows where I can find the picture elsewhere? I don't have Blood of Fiends on me atm. Good shoes are always a plus, and nice headwear is almost as important... almost.Here, I found one image through google and the other I just took a screenshot from my pdf copy of BoF. They're both in the same book, and are both good examples of what you can do with footwear based on hooves rather than plantigrade feet.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b283/pyranack/1372232582635_zps56c890d8.j pg
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b283/pyranack/Hoof-boots_zps5d727277.png
Ahh, cool thanks!
It could easily be said that technically, any non-plantigrade feet are somewhat already in a high-heel format. So it's a matter of just forming the fabric/material around that! :3
Note to self: Study shoe science...
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I just recently started this tiefling witch for PFS. I considered the ways I could make a tiefling really WEIRD to reflect the low charisma, and being agendered or dual gender popped up. So, Jani has no fixed gender identity, reflecting the chaotic nature of their abyssal heritage, uses we and us as personal pronouns, and prefers others use they and their and them (I expect people to go all grammar afficionado on them once in a while) and they do in fact feel like they have two souls in one body, which is why they take the appelation 'two-spirit'. (It's also an allusion to the fluid gender identity known in some Amerindian cultures, but since neither I nor the character are Amerindian, Jani is explicitly NOT that type of 'two-spirit'.)
They also have features similar to that of an arthropod -- if they ever got naked, which is very unlikely to happen in a session, you'd see no sexual characteristics -- no breasts, no external genitals -- as well as a chitinous carapace covering their body (mechanically represented by the Armor of the Pit feat). The tail is like a scorpions, but without a stinger and more flexible, allowing it to be prehensile. Red eyes are just for fun, and I'm considering having their teeth be replaced with insectile mouthparts, but that might just be too bizarre.
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To get my full fashionista on,
I'm honestly wondering how much business someone that specialized in that sort of thing could get in Absalom. Or Cheliax... Of course there could be some crossover customers from certain kinds of aasimar too. And oreads...
Seriously, a "fantasy fashion" thread does sound like a good idea.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b283/pyranack/1372232582635_zps56c8 90d8.jpg
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b283/pyranack/Hoof-boots_zps5d727277.png
Keeping that in mind for next year's Gencon. It looks like one of the less painful optins to pull off that look.
The biggest problem I've seen is that players expect no negative consequences for playing an 'undesirable' race, a problem common to Half-orc players as well.
This is too situational to be a rule though. In a world with so many intelligent species, and tieflings having such variable appearance, why would the human villagers of Dirtville react differently to a tiefling compared to, say, a gnome. Both are non-humans beyond their experience.
And why would people automatically recognize a tiefling as such? An oni-spawn tiefling might be confused for a half orc, a Rakshasa-spawn could be thought a catfolk. Tieflings are supposed to be varied in appearance, so how do you look at one and say "Its a tiefling"?
That's not to say negative roleplaying consequences should be entirely avoided. Those Dirtvillers should react with suspicion to any non-human if they are that isolated, including tieflings. Maybe a dwarf does think the oni-spawn is a half orc, and reacts accordingly. If the tiefling you are playing is the "traditional" horns, hooves, and tail; an thus more readily recognizable as infernally tainted, this could cause problems.
To be honest I'm not a fan. Most of the time they don't really play different from normal characters. Like mentioned above they're the new drizz't and common as dirt. This also means that most groups don't have NPCs react harsh enough if a horned red person walks through the hamlet of Dirtvale and no one cares.
I've never seen one played in person (my group is excellent and could change my opinion) but online games have left a bad taste in my mouth.
The roleplay is going to go down three tracks:
1)Everyone hates me because I'm a devil but I'm good!
2)Everyone thinks I'm evil and they're RIGHT! MUAHAHAHA (see also players that can't play evil alignments well)
3)Oh no I have to resist my evil inner nature and do the right thing. Also known as roleplaying any character with moral qualms. But at least other morally uncertain characters don't have their angst show up when they're ordering breakfast.Mostly I dislike alignment based outsider mixes so I dislike aasimar just as much. They show big problems of "look how much I follow my birth alignment" or "look how much I don't follow my birth alignment" roleplay.
Although now at the end of my stream of consciousness rant I realize I have seen one played decently in 4e as a female bard.
Well, how rare they are is campaign dependent. I don't see any reason they shouldn't be common necessarily. This would cut down on the racism as a side effect.
And I don't think alignment should necessarily be viewed as rebelling/following their fiendish heritage. The racial description says that while they carry infernal taint in their blood, their worldview is entirely up to them. Maybe your tiefling is good just because his parents raised him right. Maybe your tiefling is evil just because Evil is Awesome...err.....easy. The reasons for their alignment don't have to be ancestor related.
I'm honestly wondering how much business someone that specialized in that sort of thing could get in Absalom. Or Cheliax... Of course there could be some crossover customers from certain kinds of aasimar too. And oreads...
Good I'd hope. I'd imagine even Gnomes, Orcs, and Elves have their own fashion styles. Who's to say planetouched can't try to look pretty too?
Seriously, a "fantasy fashion" thread does sound like a good idea.
And... Done.
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And I don't think alignment should necessarily be viewed as rebelling/following their fiendish heritage. The racial description says that while they carry infernal taint in their blood, their worldview is entirely up to them. Maybe your tiefling is good just because his parents raised him right. Maybe your tiefling is evil just because Evil is Awesome...err.....easy. The reasons for their alignment don't have to be ancestor related.
This cuts to the heart of why I can't get behind "all X characters are Drizzt clones" and similar statements. They ignore all of the nuance each player might be bringing to their character to make it their own.
And... Done.
Hittin' that!
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They also have features similar to that of an arthropod -- if they ever got naked, which is very unlikely to happen in a session, you'd see no sexual characteristics -- no breasts, no external genitals -- as well as a chitinous carapace covering their body (mechanically represented by the Armor of the Pit feat). The tail is like a scorpions, but without a stinger and more flexible, allowing it to be prehensile. Red eyes are just for fun, and I'm considering having their teeth be replaced with insectile mouthparts, but that might just be too bizarre.
I'd recommend Wayne Barlowe's Communion (which is NSFW like most of his Inferno artwork) as a possible reference source for chitinous demon people, but they do have visible sexual characteristics. (this only accounts for some of the NSFWness)
It's mainly the details on their backs that might be worth looking into, esepecially since the "bone wings" they've got might be something a chitinous Sarenraen tiefling might spontaneously sprout. ;)
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I've got two tiefling characters. One, an inquisitor of Calistria, has a very outre appearance, including disgendered appearance, black, hide-like skin, no hair, and serpentine eyes, jaw, and tongue. This character has a charisma of five - and uses Wisdom for Diplomacy, Bluff, and Intimidate through the Conversion Inquisition.
I assume that ze's appearance is horrifying - but also strangly, subtly beguiling. Ze expects to be treated badly, and is always pleasantly surprised when PCs or NPCs ask about zir gender. "Oh, I'd be happy to give you an all-expenses paid tour of everything I've got going on under my armor, sweetcheeks, but not in the middle of the enemy stronghold. No no, no need to be embarrassed! You'd be amazed how many people have a taste for the ... exotic."
My chain-spawn paladin of Saranrae, on the other hand, is quite the tortured individual. Of course, her aberrations aren't all that visible under the full plate armor. But she is quite honest about her heritage, seeing herself as a prime example of the Dawnflower's powers of redemption. She specializes in intimidation. "My blood sings for my enemy's slow, painful destruction. However, I am sworn, in the Dawnflower's name, to offer Mercy to all who surrender to me. Choose wisely."
I've never played Tieflings much, but they always seemed full of great opportunities to play in campaigns.
I like the tieflings but I understand the previously stated fear of "Drizzt syndrome". On the other hand I have only played a tiefling once and he was a lawful neutral devil sorcerer who was all about making contracts with people.
This is an interesting thread, to say the least...