RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 8
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They don't? I was not aware of this. How does this work?
It would also require GMs and players to check things online more frequently, something a lot of players and GMs currently don't do. (GMs don't need to be the ones that report games, and a lot of players take a very long time to register their character).
Anyone with a Paizo Account tied to a PFS number can report. All you do is create the event, get your event number for the participants, then put in the GM/player info for the table. Organizers do it all the time.
If you ever go to a big con, sometimes you'll see a table with PFS reporting sheets stacked next to a laptop, with one poor schmuck inputting them into the system :P
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The online reporting system is only a tool. No one is required to use that tool. We appreciate it when they do, but I'm sure that many don't use it.
I know I am missing quite a few things on my electronic record, maybe 4-6 scenarios. Some of these I ran and some I played. It would have been more but I've sent reminders to post or fix errors and some people were very helpful.
Honestly, this hasn't made any difference with most missing scenarios. I honestly gave up trying to keep my online record up to date as a result. Unless I'm reporting, it's simply out of my control
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Since this is essentially a repeat thread of repeat threads... I will simply say this.
I don't believe that there should be unlimited replay. Once you have unlimited replay you start having people farming for items which isn't fun. While I wasn't involved with past OP campaigns, I've heard horror stories from friends who were that would talk about sitting down at a table to play something for the first time (for them) and the rest of the table had already replayed it multiple times and just was there for the loots....
I would hate to see the game that I love and have dedicated a fricking ton of time to, turned into a loot farming operation.
I have played since season 1, I have two level 12s -- mostly GM credit and a slew of lower levels, mostly GM credit... The reason that they are mostly GM credit is because I tend to GM first and play later. Already knowing what is coming and having to be silent when the party makes a wrong decision is hard... I don't choose to deal with that so I rarely play.. but that's me.
There are a crapton of scenarios already out, ranging through 4.5 seasons of scenarios... these scenarios are of all levels. It is fairly easy to level up a 2nd or 3rd or even 4th character if you want to.
With as many replay/chronicle variations as the campaign as been through (and yes I've dealt with them all), this is the one that is best suited for the campaign and works out in the favor of everyone, not just the powergamers that want to game every day.
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Ok, let's turn this around. You keep asking why you can't replay scenarios.
I have to ask: Why do you want to?
Do you know anyone who is even remotely close to running out of scenarios they can play? Other than the one person in this thread, I don't know anyone who has played that many of them.
Personally, I'm happy with the system the way it is, though it might be an improvement if someone could get multiple GM credits for the same adventure. This would help encourage people to GM more. And most people get better at running a scenario after they've done that scenario once or twice.
The down side, as mentioned earlier in this thread, is that it might reduce the number of different scenarios an individual purchases from Paizo, since they might run the same few repeatedly instead of buying more. But maybe allowing 2-3 runs for GM credit instead of just one would be a reasonable change.
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I have to ask: Why do you want to?
The only reason I can think of would be if the first time I went through a scenario it was with a really crappy GM who was running cold and I wasn't able to enjoy it.
Thankfully that's never happened, but if it did I would want to replay the scenario under a competent GM (even if not for credit).
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Then Jussi brought up another that is even more applicable, and it is exactly what my argument is - one is not supposed to look up loot lists and choose scenarios based on that. But the current system will lead players to do that, and there isn't really anything we can do to prevent them from doing it. If they knew they could safely replay it, they would not care about the loot or boons, and would focus on the roleplaying experience. It's true there is a downside to knowing where you are going, but honestly - how much do you remember about a scenario after a year, especially if you play tabletop RPGs relatively often? I would simply enjoy it much more if i could just choose to play a scenario with any character i think would be fun to play in it, instead of having to do all of this metagame planning.
(For what it's worth, I can remember story outlines and the most interesting encounters from scenarios I haven't touched in over a year. But that is beside the rest of the point.)
You seem to be saying "will lead players to do that" with an awful lot of certainty, but there is no need for that to happen. I certainly haven't seen that among the players in our lodge. They come to a PFS sessions and generally don't seem to give a damn about the loot and boons beforehand. They pick a character that is tier appropriate, balanced with others in the party and (if they still have more than one choice) perhaps sounds compatible with the scenario description, and enjoy the ride.
So this seems more like a matter with the culture in the local lodge than with campaign rules, though I do realize that it's hard to bring a change if people are set in their ways.
My previous post was an opinion from a design/VO perspective. Let me give you another from my GM perspective. When I run games, I don't just want to play "against" them in encounters. I want to surprise them, awe them, to give them drama. I want to see them react and make decisions based on incomplete (sometimes false) information. Hell, I even want to see their faces when they realize they are screwed. If I knew that players come to my table knowing beforehand what's going to happen, GMing would lose its charm for me.
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I have to ask: Why do you want to?The only reason I can think of would be if the first time I went through a scenario it was with a really crappy GM who was running cold and I wasn't able to enjoy it.
Thankfully that's never happened, but if it did I would want to replay the scenario under a competent GM (even if not for credit).
Unfortunately, I have played adventures with crappy GMs. Not many, but maybe 5 or 6 out of probably 80-90 PFS sessions. My usual response seems to be "I wonder how that was supposed to go", and then I check the thread in the GM subforum here to see what others have said about the adventure. And then I want to find an excuse to GM the scenario so I can read it to prepare and know exactly what was supposed to be going on.
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RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 8
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Ok, let's turn this around. You keep asking why you can't replay scenarios.
I have to ask: Why do you want to?
One argument I'd sympathize with is that it would make organizing events and game nights far easier. You wouldn't have to worry who could play what, you would just pick out the games that GMs had the desire to run.
But again, it wouldn't work for the reasons listed, and I, personally, wouldn't want replaying opened for said reasons.
Venture-Lieutenant, South Dakota—Rapid City
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Ok, let's turn this around. You keep asking why you can't replay scenarios.
I have to ask: Why do you want to?
One argument I'd sympathize with is that it would make organizing events and game nights far easier. You wouldn't have to worry who could play what, you would just pick out the games that GMs had the desire to run.
But again, it wouldn't work for the reasons listed, and I, personally, wouldn't want replaying opened for said reasons.
wow...
you could just schedule the same scenarios for each weekly game each month.
"This the third weekends this month? Oh, yeah, we're playing 'Whips & Midgets' - hey - I get to insult the guards this time, right guys?"sheesh...
Zarta Dralneen's faction missions are getting outta hand it seems.
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** spoiler omitted **...Although there are a few infamous counter-examples, lower-level scenarios aren't that deadly, even for characters of inexperienced players. If a player manages to get his character killed during 'Silent Tide', for example, then something's gone horribly wrong.** Silent Tide Derail spoiler omitted **
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Ok, let's turn this around. You keep asking why you can't replay scenarios.
I have to ask: Why do you want to?
One argument I'd sympathize with is that it would make organizing events and game nights far easier. You wouldn't have to worry who could play what, you would just pick out the games that GMs had the desire to run.
But again, it wouldn't work for the reasons listed, and I, personally, wouldn't want replaying opened for said reasons.
I would like some replay ability. Maybe tied into GM rewards or something, such as you can replay 1 game per star every 6 months or something.
I hate sitting out from game days when they already have GMs and I've played the mod(s). I know some GMs who just go out for an extremely long lunch session or something during cons because of this. I know at least one VO who does this consistently. Others, like myself, play and run other living campaigns
With that said, I don't think it will ever happen.
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** spoiler omitted **** spoiler omitted **...Although there are a few infamous counter-examples, lower-level scenarios aren't that deadly, even for characters of inexperienced players. If a player manages to get his character killed during 'Silent Tide', for example, then something's gone horribly wrong.** Silent Tide Derail spoiler omitted **
Cliffs is melee. Almost killed the Wizard, but that was because most of the other PCs went over the cliff after the NPCs. That was the first time I have seen it where the PC Wizard's Color Spray timed out before the combat was over. But no archers that I recall.
Granary is melee with undead. No archers there, either.
Torch is just a skill challenge type of thing.
Optional is just melee undead, again.
Final is a couple of crossbow users, who quickly get into melee with most parties, a couple of melee mooks in the main tower, and the archery boss.
Ah, well. Maybe your party didn't go after the crossbow users?
@Furious Kender: There is the ability to replay, mainly to make a legal table, but for no credit.
And the local Game Day has been "coordinating" games with me, since I am one of the locals who has played the most, since I also play online. Even with that, though, sometimes I wind up having to GM a session at teh Game Day, because of last second online play of a scenario, or I forgot that I was scheduled for scenario X in one venue or another...
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RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 8
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Ok, let's turn this around. You keep asking why you can't replay scenarios.
I have to ask: Why do you want to?
One argument I'd sympathize with is that it would make organizing events and game nights far easier. You wouldn't have to worry who could play what, you would just pick out the games that GMs had the desire to run.
But again, it wouldn't work for the reasons listed, and I, personally, wouldn't want replaying opened for said reasons.
wow...
you could just schedule the same scenarios for each weekly game each month.
"This the third weekends this month? Oh, yeah, we're playing 'Whips & Midgets' - hey - I get to insult the guards this time, right guys?"sheesh...
Yep, that would be another reason why replaying for credit wouldn't work.
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Yep, that would be another reason why replaying for credit wouldn't work.wow...
you could just schedule the same scenarios for each weekly game each month.
"This the third weekends this month? Oh, yeah, we're playing 'Whips & Midgets' - hey - I get to insult the guards this time, right guys?"sheesh...
First steps can be bad enough...
*Looks around*
"Who hasn't played this scenario?"
"Uhh...I haven't."
"Alright, this is all you buddy. We'll support ya."
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I have had the proverbial I've PLAYED all those scenarios players before. It is a bit of problem. Ironically, I told them about moving into Adventure Paths. At first, they resisted, but once they tried, I never saw them again!
Yeah, it is very possible to run out, especially if y'all aren't mixing in some modules and AP action here and there. Running multiple tables with various types of games (such as the modules) can help alleviate this somewhat. We post our games a month or so out, so players who have played a lot can decide to skip weeks where there's nothing being offered that they haven't done before.
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RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32
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Okay, I haven't read everything in this thread, so forgive me if this is silly or repetitive or whatever, but I just had a thought:
What if you could replay scenarios any number of times, but each time after the first, you don't get any of the item access or (positive) boons?
That solves the "figuring out the best scenarios for loot for a particular PC" issue, but lets people who just happen to have played everything that's running this week to still be able to play for credit.
Thoughts?
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Ok, let's turn this around. You keep asking why you can't replay scenarios.
I have to ask: Why do you want to?
I think there are a couple of reasonable answers to this question . . .
First, why do people go back and read their favorite books multiple times, or re-watch their favorite movies? It's not so unreasonable that people should want to go back and revisit their old favorites in the medium of rpg adventures, although it doesn't really answer why it has to be for credit.
Second there are certain mods that would turn out quite different with a different group of characters. Consider playing Blackrose Matrimony with your most suave social character, and then replaying it with a different character who is the awkward guy that everyone wonders how he got invited at all. Could be fun both ways. It still doesn't need to be played for credit.
Maybe, now that I have written this down, I more or less agree with Fromper.
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Okay, I haven't read everything in this thread, so forgive me if this is silly or repetitive or whatever, but I just had a thought:
What if you could replay scenarios any number of times, but each time after the first, you don't get any of the item access or (positive) boons?
That solves the "figuring out the best scenarios for loot for a particular PC" issue, but lets people who just happen to have played everything that's running this week to still be able to play for credit.
Thoughts?
I would love this.
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Since this is essentially a repeat thread of repeat threads... I will simply say this:...every time these threads come up...
yep yep yep yep yep
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If you want to go back through an old favorite, just grab a group that's already played it and say "Let's play _____ just for fun." There's nothing stopping you from enjoying another playthrough, you just won't get credit. Think of it as a chance to test out that new build you've been wanting to try with no penalty for failure.
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I'm against unlimited replay.
However, I'm at the point where it's hard to find low level stuff to play. So, I would not mind if, say, as a boon for finishing the retirement arc, X number of modules (say 6) played by that character only became replayable. Most likely, said player would mostly pick low level stuff they played two years ago and have pretty much forgotten.
This would still make replay very rare, but accomplish another goal of making games more accessible.
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Venture-Lieutenant, South Dakota—Rapid City
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If you want to go back through an old favorite, just grab a group that's already played it and say "Let's play _____ just for fun." There's nothing stopping you from enjoying another playthrough, you just won't get credit. Think of it as a chance to test out that new build you've been wanting to try with no penalty for failure.This
Ya know, I thought Mike said that if you replay a credit for fun/to fill a table and you die, it still counts against you.
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RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32
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Ya know, I thought Mike said that if you replay a credit for fun/to fill a table and you die, it still counts against you.If you want to go back through an old favorite, just grab a group that's already played it and say "Let's play _____ just for fun." There's nothing stopping you from enjoying another playthrough, you just won't get credit. Think of it as a chance to test out that new build you've been wanting to try with no penalty for failure.This
I think what Mystic Lemur was saying was that you play it as not even being a sanctioned PFS game. Just make some PCs and play it.
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I have to ask: Why do you want to?The only reason I can think of would be if the first time I went through a scenario it was with a really crappy GM who was running cold and I wasn't able to enjoy it.
Thankfully that's never happened, but if it did I would want to replay the scenario under a competent GM (even if not for credit).
That did happen to me and my wife once, at a con. My solution was to buy the scenario the next week, prep it, and run it at my weekly game. My wife replayed for no credit so she could enjoy it. We both had a blast (and that particular scenario is now one of my "Top 5" that I will run anytime I am asked).
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That did happen to me and my wife once, at a con. My solution was to buy the scenario the next week, prep it, and run it at my weekly game. My wife replayed for no credit so she could enjoy it. We both had a blast (and that particular scenario is now one of my "Top 5" that I will run anytime I am asked).I have to ask: Why do you want to?The only reason I can think of would be if the first time I went through a scenario it was with a really crappy GM who was running cold and I wasn't able to enjoy it.
Thankfully that's never happened, but if it did I would want to replay the scenario under a competent GM (even if not for credit).
There have been a number of times at Cons when I did not have either what I would consider a decent GM or most prepared GM (not always their fault) run a game.
It makes me want to get the module and run it that much more, so that those I run for have a decent if not excellent time.
Nathan Meyers
NYC GM/Player
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So right now you have 1 GM credit and 1 Player Credit for each person (only one per character I believe?)
What about allowing infinite GM credits, since GM finding is such an issue? Obviously 1 chronicle per character but doesn't it encourage GMs to GM more?
Maybe for a few - but GMs are motvated by different things.
There are quite a few experienced GMs which don't take GM credit at all.
I took my last one at GenCon 2011. I prefer to actually play my characters and have enough of them as it is. And I know about a few other ones who do the same.
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You should never be forced to GM. If you are being forced to do it, then of course it's going to be reflected in the game. I have known people who have gamed for years but never gm'd. Im not sure why all the time, but for some its because they dont want to 'miss out'. Miss out on what I have no idea but I think they are worried being a dm/gm is too much responsibility or they wont be able to have the same level of fun.
I like the current system as is. I dont want people playing the same scenario twice. Sure we can all say we dont metagame , but I think even if there is the slightest bit of knowledge there, the subconscious will try and latch on and run with it. GMing credit is a different issue. I have no problem if they changed it so people could award the credit to different characters. Im not unhappy with the system as is now though either.
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I like the current system as is. I dont want people playing the same scenario twice. Sure we can all say we dont metagame , but I think even if there is the slightest bit of knowledge there, the subconscious will try and latch on and run with it. GMing credit is a different issue. I have no problem if they changed it so people could award the credit to different characters. Im not unhappy with the system as is now though either.
Agreed.