
Ravingdork |

I was hoping you could help me further develop my troll myrmidon. It's a variant troll designed to fight in small groups that are extremely difficult to defeat in traditional melee combat.
I'm primarily looking for ways to make them more efficient while still keeping the CR relatively low.
A myrmidon quartet (EL 11) will often wait in a tightly packed 2x2 formation for melee opponents to come to them, attempting to trip them with their reach weapons as they close (possibly using the aid another action while they do so) before pouncing on them with fang and claw. Myrmidons only advance when they are ordered to, or when doing so is more strategically sound (such as to approach and nullify a troublesome spellcaster).
Should an enemy attack them, they use their Bodyguard feat to increase their ally's AC by +4 against the attack. Should the attack still land, the strongest troll in the group always opts to take the hit, allowing weaker trolls more time to regenerate. In this manner, they spread the damage out amongst them, granting the individual members of their group a much longer life span.
If necessary, a strong troll will also move to the front row of the formation, pushing a weaker troll to the back row with the Swap Places feat so that the latter can benefit from cover bonuses from its comrades while it regenerates (this helps to prevent enemies trying to focus attacks on a single troll). Due to their Escape Route feat, this does not provoke attacks of opportunity for either troll. Said weaker troll can also continue to contribute to the fight from the back row with its guisarme.
Ideally, a quartet of myrmidons will be fighting a single powerful foe, such as in an arena setting, or in an ambush after the party of heroes has been successfully divided by traps, the environment, or other enemy forces.
So, what do you think? Can the concept be improved?

Ravingdork |

What is the Benevolent armor feature? I can't find that in the rules? And how much does it cost?
It cost 2,000gp. The wearer gains a bonus equal to his armor's enhancement bonus on any aid another attempts to increase an ally's AC.
For them, it means they can use aid another to grant +4 AC rather than +2.

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Seems a bit much. If all three use their aid another abilities on one, it's going to get a +12 AC boost, putting it at 49 AC. That's ridiculous for a CR7 Monster.
Also, looking at your stat block, you aren't adding the damage from power attack. The hit penalty is there, but not the damage boost.
Finally, I'm not sure if you want to have roughly 6,000g worth of gear on a CR 7 critter. That's almost 3 times the treasure budget for that CR.

Ravingdork |

Seems a bit much. If all three use their aid another abilities on one, it's going to get a +12 AC boost, putting it at 49 AC. That's ridiculous for a CR7 Monster.
Also, looking at your stat block, you aren't adding the damage from power attack. The hit penalty is there, but not the damage boost.
Finally, I'm not sure if you want to have roughly 6,000g worth of gear on a CR 7 critter. That's almost 3 times the treasure budget for that CR.
- I hadn't thought of them piling on the AC like that. I suppose they could do that if they are fighting a single enemy, but I built them with the assumption that one troll would protect one other at any given time.
- I'm not? Oh I see. I added it for the guiarme, but not their natural attack line. Thanks for pointing out the mistake.
- 6,000gp is exactly the right amount for a CR 7 monster with class levels in a fast track XP game (our group's standard). This was a deliberate decision on my part.

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Elamdri wrote:Seems a bit much. If all three use their aid another abilities on one, it's going to get a +12 AC boost, putting it at 49 AC. That's ridiculous for a CR7 Monster.
Also, looking at your stat block, you aren't adding the damage from power attack. The hit penalty is there, but not the damage boost.
Finally, I'm not sure if you want to have roughly 6,000g worth of gear on a CR 7 critter. That's almost 3 times the treasure budget for that CR.
- I don't picture them piling on the AC like that. I built them with the assumption that one troll would protect one other at any given time.
- I'm not? Oh I see. I added it for the guiarme, but not their natural attack line. Thanks for pointing out the mistake.
- 6,000gp is exactly the right amount for a CR 7 monster with class levels in a fast track XP game (our group's standard). This was a deliberate decision on my part.
-Fair enough, it was just the 1st thing that jumped out at me. That being said, do you worry about your players using their gear to do so?
-You're welcome.
-Ah, sorry, wasn't aware of that. So long as you're cool with it.

Ravingdork |

...do you worry about your players using their gear to do so?
Honestly, if the PCs actually manage to beat these guys, then they've more than earned it. Also, benevolent armor is not nearly as useful to someone without the Bodyguard feat. Finally, tatami-do is not going to be appropriate to a lot of characters out there, making it a seller's item for most.

Bigger Club |
Depending on party composition this is either going to be relatively easy or a nightmare of an encounter. So if you would post a short summary of the party, would be easier to comment.
Regardless I would try to squeeze in bows in to their equipment, with slings they have absolutely no chance if the party is able to fly which they should be able to do unless the encounter happens in enclosed space. Which would be favorable terrain to the trolls which might be enough to raise the CR of the encounter.
Because the tactic of the trolls is based on formation a dedicated blaster would really shine in this encounter more so if they can do it with fire or acid.

Ravingdork |

Goth: They do have ranged attacks. Your typical 7th-level sorcerer would have to use all four 3rd-level slots to finish them off. If he casts fly, he doesn't have enough to do it.
Your average CL 7 fireball does 24.5 damage. 24.5 x 4 slots = 98 damage.
Using additional resources (such as a bunch of 2nd-level slots for scorching rays) might finish the job, but by then it such a resource sink, the sorcerer has basically earned the victory. What's more, not every scorching ray will land since their aid another actions can deflect them (adding as much as a +12 to their touch AC).
An 11th-level sorcerer (or a lower-level specialized build) likely wouldn't have much difficulty against them I admit, but if this thing was tough against EVERYBODY, then it would probably be broken.
In any case, they are elite shock troops meant to be used as such. The party has likely already expended some of its resources mopping up other mooks prior to this encounter, or else will waste a great many resources cleaning up the myrmidons quickly before fighting a boss encounter (who is all too happy to see the party use up valuable resources against his "bodyguards").
Bigger Club: This encounter is not meant to be tailor made against any particular party. I did it just for fun, and it will likely be tucked away for a rainy day when I need just such an encounter.

Bigger Club |
My mistake then, just read further in to than there was there. Probably it was the discussion about the value of the gear.
Well against 7th level characters it is CR11 so I would expect undedicated sorcerer to be in trouble trying to kill them. But like you said with specialized or higher level it would not be that bad, no surprise because of the tight formation.
I would probably use this bunch as part of a bigger group, perhaps as these guys as the main foe and low CR mooks with ranged weaponry.
As far as improving these fellow apart from the bow suggestion. Well you could change the +2 enhancement bonus on the armor to +1. With this you get 3k gold, use that to buy amulet of natural armor +1 with 2k. That leaves you with extra thousand to play with.

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I used a variant of these guys in a 3.x game a while back, as bodyguards to a 13th-level orc wizard the PCs had made an enemy of. Wall of force to cut off one annoying mystic theurge PC from the party, and antimagic field to nullify his abilities, and three rounds later we had a dead PC. There were only two trolls, but they each had four levels of fighter. Regeneration is an EX ability, and doesn't go away in antimagic. I felt especially evil after that one.

Ravingdork |