RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 16, RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32
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Watching shows like Trigun, or movies like RED or the James Bond series, the characters are already really good at what they do. There might be a slight gain in power (Vash grows more emotionally then in skill for example,) but mostly the person is already awesome and doesn't need to gain in ability.
Is there an RPG that plays with that idea? That the character is already really good at their job and they only gain in ability slightly in the course of the game? Rewards would be in the form of wealth, contacts, information, equipment, or possibly action points that would be spent on special abilities.
Is there something like this out there?
Watching shows like Trigun, or movies like RED or the James Bond series, the characters are already really good at what they do. There might be a slight gain in power (Vash grows more emotionally then in skill for example,) but mostly the person is already awesome and doesn't need to gain in ability.
Is there an RPG that plays with that idea? That the character is already really good at their job and they only gain in ability slightly in the course of the game? Rewards would be in the form of wealth, contacts, information, equipment, or possibly action points that would be spent on special abilities.
Is there something like this out there?
you might try Atomic Highway. The V6 engine sounds like what you are looking for. check out some of the reviews on you tube as well. it's a sweet game with a sweet engine.
Watching shows like Trigun, or movies like RED or the James Bond series, the characters are already really good at what they do. There might be a slight gain in power (Vash grows more emotionally then in skill for example,) but mostly the person is already awesome and doesn't need to gain in ability.
Is there an RPG that plays with that idea? That the character is already really good at their job and they only gain in ability slightly in the course of the game? Rewards would be in the form of wealth, contacts, information, equipment, or possibly action points that would be spent on special abilities.
Is there something like this out there?
HERO can do it.
You can do it with D&D. I plan on asking my players which part of the level range they enjoyed most when I finish Shackled City, and see if they are willing to start at the low end of that range while slowly progressing to the high end. It's effectively what E6 does when the party hits 6th level.
Wow, that's interesting. I started off my Darklight Sisterhood game at level 3 because I hadn't had my house rules for first level characters ready just yet(I'm testing them out in Kingmaker now), and we arrived at that level after figuring out what level of power most players were used to starting off at.
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Realizing that has actually made me frustrated with the people that say 'D&D can't do low-magic/Lord of the Rings/gritty fantasy' and what not. Of course it can't, IF you think you have to use every level. However, if you pick the level that models the story you want best, and STAY at that level, you can tell any story you want. Constant level advancement is what breaks stories like that.
Call of Cthulhu and Traveller do this.
The character can become a little more skilled but not too much.
The stories are very different, not "Epic" since every one is pretty much the same (OK characters are more but not like 20th level vs 1st).
For Traveller think Firefly, for CoC - well that's an experience all to itself.
I have designed advancement and improvement awards for my Legion of Super-Heroes RPG based on the concept that the Legionnaires are already good at what they do (as they appear in the comics) and yet they are rewarded for play.
Character advancement does not require any points to spend, levels to reach, etc. its totally different and not based on how well the character did in the game.
The other half of the award system is spending points to alter one's powers beyond there standard use/description. This enables them to pull off the "out there" events you'll see in the comics.
If your interested I can post the actual rules.
I seem to recall Marvel Super Heroes had pretty slow advancement; you could use Karma for increasing your stats (very expensive) or for improving die rolls (quite cheap).
I seem to recall Marvel Super Heroes had pretty slow advancement; you could use Karma for increasing your stats (very expensive) or for improving die rolls (quite cheap).
Oh, the memories!!! I truly love Marvel Super Heroes, it was one of my first RPGs, and I remember waiting FOREVER to get my character the ability to fly, and the day I was FINALLY able to do it felt like Christmas morning. I do wish I still had that character, it was a great example of the good and bad things about the system.
I seem to recall Marvel Super Heroes had pretty slow advancement; you could use Karma for increasing your stats (very expensive) or for improving die rolls (quite cheap).
I've never seen Marvel Super Heroes, but judging by your description, it sounds much like the DC Heroes RPG (published by Mayfair, later rewritten as Blood of Heroes by Pulsar Games.) Robin will never achieve Superman's level of power. If you want to play a mega-powerful character, you should start out that way.
I seem to recall Marvel Super Heroes had pretty slow advancement; you could use Karma for increasing your stats (very expensive) or for improving die rolls (quite cheap).I've never seen Marvel Super Heroes, but judging by your description, it sounds much like the DC Heroes RPG (published by Mayfair, later rewritten as Blood of Heroes by Pulsar Games.) Robin will never achieve Superman's level of power. If you want to play a mega-powerful character, you should start out that way.
Yes and no. My memory is a bit hazy (I haven't played either game in twenty years and I always preferred Champions, at any rate), but I thought it was expensive to improve an existing power/ability in DC Heroes (from a 7 to an 8, say), but not nearly as expensive to buy a brand new power (from a 0 to a 7, say). It's entirely possible (a) I'm misremembering or (b) I misread the rules in the first place.
Also, I think that if you killed someone in Marvel Super Heroes, your Karma would be reset to zero instantly! :-O (Wolverine-type superheroes had slightly different rules.)
I seem to recall Marvel Super Heroes had pretty slow advancement; you could use Karma for increasing your stats (very expensive) or for improving die rolls (quite cheap).I've never seen Marvel Super Heroes, but judging by your description, it sounds much like the DC Heroes RPG (published by Mayfair, later rewritten as Blood of Heroes by Pulsar Games.) Robin will never achieve Superman's level of power. If you want to play a mega-powerful character, you should start out that way.Yes and no. My memory is a bit hazy (I haven't played either game in twenty years and I always preferred Champions, at any rate), but I thought it was expensive to improve an existing power/ability in DC Heroes (from a 7 to an 8, say), but not nearly as expensive to buy a brand new power (from a 0 to a 7, say). It's entirely possible (a) I'm misremembering or (b) I misread the rules in the first place.
Also, I think that if you killed someone in Marvel Super Heroes, your Karma would be reset to zero instantly! :-O (Wolverine-type superheroes had slightly different rules.)
no, your memory serves you well here. The game encouraged more power stunts (doing more things with the powers you already have) than the purchase of new powers. Raising ability scores was costly but well worth it and a lot more feasible.
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RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 16, RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32
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Cool! Thanks everyone. I was just curious, and not currently serious about running that type of game. When I have a game slot available I will have to come back and pick one of the suggestions here!
I think it would fun to try something else besides a D&D/PF game. So possibly CoC, Traveler, or HERO.
My memory is a bit hazy (I haven't played either game in twenty years and I always preferred Champions, at any rate), but I thought it was expensive to improve an existing power/ability in DC Heroes (from a 7 to an 8, say), but not nearly as expensive to buy a brand new power (from a 0 to a 7, say). It's entirely possible (a) I'm misremembering or (b) I misread the rules in the first place.
When creating a new character, it was cheap. But buying a new power when advancing was very expensive. Not only did you have to pay ten times the base cost, but you had to buy individual Attribute Points on the Increasing Attributes Chart.
had a GM named Neff back at Ft Gordon in the late '80s; he ran his game where you didnt have any level; you just tried stuff and maybe it worked - maybe it didnt. You didnt track you hps or anything; gm would tell you how weak you felt. This was a great game, an amazing game; one could get totally immersed in their character and roleplaying; we didnt worry about exps and the like; you just played. Now, to be fair; I wasnt playing a caster so dont know what it would have been like for them.
I seem to recall Marvel Super Heroes had pretty slow advancement; you could use Karma for increasing your stats (very expensive) or for improving die rolls (quite cheap).Also, I think that if you killed someone in Marvel Super Heroes, your Karma would be reset to zero instantly! :-O (Wolverine-type superheroes had slightly different rules.)
Wolverine and the Punisher used lethal attacks, the version of MSH (Marvel Super Heroes) I played you'd get -400 karma per kill. (I think it was GM's option) However, you might also notice that Wolverine in particular had TWO 'class 1000' abilities his adamantine claws and his mutant healing factor(I think), karma meant very little to him. The Punisher was slightly different relying more heavily on a big wallet (his resources), like Batman. Where as an ordinary (player) character survives almost solely using karma until the get a few arrests under their belt.
EDIT: Class 1000 is the highest an ability can attain in the game. Players typically start with 1 power class 50 or less. I think mutants and androids received 2 powers to start.
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MSH used Karma instead of Experience, but the Karma could be spent in a similar fashion to hero/action points toward die roles. You didn't necessarily 'gain levels', but the karma would be spent to increase your powers rank/class OR to learn NEW powers OR NEW tricks with old powers.
ex: Class 10 - Electric Blast .... 1000 Karma (and precentile die roll on a chart) = Class 20 - Electric Blast. Now does 20 dmg and attacks on a slightly better chart using percentage dice.
ex: Class 10 - Electric Blast (1 target/line attack) .... 500 Karma (and precentile die roll on a chart) = Class 10 - Electric Blast (Cone-Shape/AoE attack). I think it was slightly cheaper to do this on a case-by-case basis as well (power stunts, someone mentioned above), like 300 Karma, but then you had to pay 300 Karma each time you tried to do it and it still required a roll, each time.
ex: You want to learn FLIGHT... 5000-10000 Karma (and precentile die roll on a chart)
Failure on Karma rolls meant wasted Karma, no power increase, of course you could spend more Karma to alter the die roll! Costs and design are just guesstimates from memory as it's been over 15 years since I played it.
My memory is a bit hazy (I haven't played either game in twenty years and I always preferred Champions, at any rate), but I thought it was expensive to improve an existing power/ability in DC Heroes (from a 7 to an 8, say), but not nearly as expensive to buy a brand new power (from a 0 to a 7, say). It's entirely possible (a) I'm misremembering or (b) I misread the rules in the first place.When creating a new character, it was cheap. But buying a new power when advancing was very expensive. Not only did you have to pay ten times the base cost, but you had to buy individual Attribute Points on the Increasing Attributes Chart.
I think I probably missed the bit about using the Increasing Attributes Chart then, or maybe I was just thinking about buying one point worth of a power.
Traveller. That's sort of it's allure, really. The original version more or less openly mocked the idea of XP.
In the more current Mongoose version, it's a counterbalancing element to the semi-random character generation. You can end up with a character who's old and experienced and will never get another skill point, or you can end up with a young, inexperienced character who will get skills every few sessions, though even then skill progression operates as a factor of in-game time, rather than real time.
Watching shows like Trigun, or movies like RED or the James Bond series, the characters are already really good at what they do. There might be a slight gain in power (Vash grows more emotionally then in skill for example,) but mostly the person is already awesome and doesn't need to gain in ability.
Is there an RPG that plays with that idea? That the character is already really good at their job and they only gain in ability slightly in the course of the game? Rewards would be in the form of wealth, contacts, information, equipment, or possibly action points that would be spent on special abilities.
Is there something like this out there?
you might try Atomic Highway. The V6 engine sounds like what you are looking for. check out some of the reviews on you tube as well. it's a sweet game with a sweet engine.
Nice seeing other AH fans here on Paizo
I seem to recall Marvel Super Heroes had pretty slow advancement; you could use Karma for increasing your stats (very expensive) or for improving die rolls (quite cheap).I've never seen Marvel Super Heroes, but judging by your description, it sounds much like the DC Heroes RPG (published by Mayfair, later rewritten as Blood of Heroes by Pulsar Games.) Robin will never achieve Superman's level of power. If you want to play a mega-powerful character, you should start out that way.
Was that the SAGA one?
I had it at one point and played as Spiderman.(I remember being very careful/freaked about keeping in line with established character traits and continuity and then the Storyteller said: "really Val, who cares?" ;p)
Cyberpunk can be good for this. Getting 'basic' level skills in something is generally something you can do with their experience system but getting really good takes a really long time.
Also I have played in a game where we simply all started and stayed at one level two different times -- once was level 15 once was level 20. It worked well since the focus was on different parts of the game than 'gaining power' through leveling up. The focus wasn't "gain more personal power" it was "figure out how to get the problem solved" since there was no leveling up.
I'm really not interested in e6 -- I feel it kind of defeats the purpose of the game itself, but I don't mind simply staying around level 11~17.
It just frustrates me when you are going along in an AP you finally get to your apex and then the game ends. I want more end game than that.
My own game, Adventures in Oz: Fantasy Roleplaying Beyond the Yellow Brick Road, characters don't gain experience points or level up. They gain Oz Points by making friends. They can spend these Oz Points to call on their friends in times of need. Depending on the power of a given friend, this can be significant.
Pokethulhu by S. John Ross also doesn't feature traditional advancement. Instead, the assumption is that characters will grow in power by capturing and taming more little monsters and training them to battle.
Also, I think that if you killed someone in Marvel Super Heroes, your Karma would be reset to zero instantly! :-O (Wolverine-type superheroes had slightly different rules.)
Even worse, if you were on a team with said character, the whole team's Karma went poof!
I guess the X-Men didn't have a lot of Karma back in the day. Kinda makes sense why Scott used to be so uptight about Wolvie's tactics . . . ;)
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GURPS, M&M and most of the Storyteller games (Vampire, Aberrant, etc.) work like this as well. Start with a hundred or so character points worth of attributes and abilities, and gain only a couple of points per session, with the decent abilities perhaps cost twenty points or so to aquire.
It's probably my favorite thing about superhero games is that you don't start in life or death battles with centipedes, rats and goblins. You want to play a flying bulletproof man who can lift a truck and shoot lasers from his eyes, that's the character you are playing *at first level.*
Absolutely no, 'I got this feat I'll never use and ate these skill ranks in Perform (dance) so that, in six months, I can qualify for a prestige class that 'matures' my build into the character I actually want to play.'
In M&M 'Hide in Plain Sight' is a 1 pp feat you can start with. That's hot.
GURPS, M&M and most of the Storyteller games (Vampire, Aberrant, etc.) work like this as well. Start with a hundred or so character points worth of attributes and abilities, and gain only a couple of points per session, with the decent abilities perhaps cost twenty points or so to aquire.
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In M&M 'Hide in Plain Sight' is a 1 pp feat you can start with. That's hot.
I can't speak about GURPS or Storyteller, but in Mutants & Masterminds, you can certainly get noticeable power increases after only one module. You said it yourself -- Hide in Plain Sight only costs 1 power point (which is the recommended reward for an adventure that lasts a single gaming session).
GURPS does this as well. You gain character points to spend as you adventure but your character generally starts at a competent level (for your particular game world) and doesn't gain power exponentially during play.
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I'm not super familiar with it, but I think Smallville might work. The rpg spends less time modeling superman's powers and skills and more time on his relationships and emotions.
Green Ronin's A Song of Ice and Fire RPG allows you to make characters of different ages. Older characters have more skill points, younger characters have more Destiny Points (use to buy advantages and pay for rerolls).
Any skill based game could work, you just set the power level to where you want and then all rewards are money, contacts, info, etc. Could also do that with Pathfinder if you want, though it does miss out on a major portion of whats in the game, but if you're having fun, who cares?
If you were local, I'd offer to run a game of Firearms and Fornication. A friend of mine writes/edits indie games and he's been messing around with variations of a game that captures some of the essence of the movie Crank. You have to be willing to "playstorm" the game though, both playing and brainstorming ideas of how the rules should work. Its a ton of fun so far, but the only way to explain it is to play it.
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keep in mind that no system is perfect. GURPs being a system where you start with, depending on the version, maybe a total of 150 pts to make your character and might get 3 xp per adventure/ session is one example. However it also tends to have a power creep issue.
So, once again with GURPS as an example, it is hard to say increase your stats any. Skills on the other hand a point or two can get you simple skills at high levels very quickly.
This leads to some wonky characters with starting points in hard to learn skills and stats, with characters then over the course of the first game or so becoming experts in simple skills they did not know at character creation but that fit the character concept.
It also leads to wizards, in a fantasy setting, starting off as "johnny one shots" able to cast a single spell, usually combat oriented, really well and know nothing else.
Watching shows like Trigun, or movies like RED or the James Bond series, the characters are already really good at what they do. There might be a slight gain in power (Vash grows more emotionally then in skill for example,) but mostly the person is already awesome and doesn't need to gain in ability.
Is there an RPG that plays with that idea? That the character is already really good at their job and they only gain in ability slightly in the course of the game? Rewards would be in the form of wealth, contacts, information, equipment, or possibly action points that would be spent on special abilities.
Is there something like this out there?
Sure! RuneQuest, Call of Cthulhu, Pendragon, etc. were all level-less systems.
in service,
Rich
www.drgames.org
