Adding NPC classes versus regular classes on "sub-CR" creatures?

[Mok]

One kink I've found in trying to advance some "sub-CR" creatures, such as goblins, is that due to their very low initial CR value (1/3 for goblins) doesn't allow for any distinction between NPC classes and Base Classes.

So looking at the entry on adding classes in the Monster Advancer section:

PFSRD wrote:

Table: Monsters with Class Levels gives general guidelines regarding which core classes add directly to a monster's abilities based on its role. Classes that are marked “key” generally add 1 to a creature's CR for each level added. Classes marked with a “—” increase a creature's CR by 1 for every 2 class levels added until the number of levels added are equal to (or exceed) the creature's original CR, at which point they are treated as “key” levels (adding 1 to the creature's CR for each level added). Creatures that fall into multiple roles treat a class as key if either of its roles treat the class as key. Note that levels in NPC classes are never considered key.

So lets say I want to make a Goblin Shaman.

I start with the Goblin at CR 1/3 and I switch out the warrior 1 for adept 1.

Now I want to get this guy up to level 4 adept so he has a solid spell to cast on a party, such as web. So I advance him up another three levels of adept. This breaks down as:

Goblin adept 1 = CR 1/3
Goblin adept 2 = CR 1/2
Goblin adept 3 = CR 1
Goblin adept 4 = CR 2

I followed that progression because in the PFSRD entry above it says "increase a creature's CR by 1 for every 2 class levels added until the number of levels added are equal to (or exceed) the creature's original CR, at which point they are treated as “key” levels (adding 1 to the creature's CR for each level added)."

Because the Goblin was below CR 1 to start it resulted in the NPC class being key immediately.

It looks as if the distinction between NPC classes and Base classes is lost. I could make the Goblin Shaman built around druid classes, and end up with the same CR result. If you compare Adept 4 to Druid 4 the power jump is quite significant. While the adept is just able to squeeze off web or invisibility, the druid has a level 4 animal companion, can wildshape, cast spells, etc. You could also do the goblin shaman as a Sorcerer 4 and be able to spam the party with webs for most of the combat, rather than just once.

What would be the best way to squeeze out the fine grain detail between NPC and Base classes in these low CR situations?

[Father Dale]

It works different for creatures without racial HD, like the goblin, orc, and drow and any PC races. These creatures CR are defined by their class levels and don't follow the normal rules for determining a monster's CR. In particular, they don't follow they key/non-key class distinction.

A creature with no racial HD has a CR equal to heroic class level -1, or NPC class level -2. See "Adding NPCs" on page 398 of the CRB.

Thus a goblin warrior 4 would have a CR of 2 (NPC class level of 4 minus 2). Goblin warrior 8 has CR 6. Goblin fighter 4 has CR 3 (heroic class level 4 minus 1). Goblin fighter 8 has CR 7. and so on and so forth.

Monsters with racial HD use the normal rules for determining CR based on key/non-key classes, as set forth on page 297 of the Bestiary.

[strongblade]

thanx for that help.

[Mok]

Yes, thanks for pointing that out. I think my confusion had to do with the "roles" section and missed that the "any role" category was calculated in a different fashion.