Sign Language?

[Sheboygen]

My gaming group raised an interesting question, and I volunteered to ask it here on the boards:

Our DM seems to recall a Golarion-specific form of hand signal/sign language in one of the many Pathfinder books that was completely independent of the Drow's finger-talkan. Can anyone think of what that might be off the top of their heads?

[Sheboygen]

Nobody? At all? I'm sadfacing right now.

[Dork Lord]

I don't know of a specific language from the books, but in our groups our characters usually learned "Battle Sign" to communicate tactics wordlessly in combat or right before combat.

[Rezdave]

Dork Lord wrote:

our characters usually learned "Battle Sign" to communicate tactics wordlessly in combat

We have something similar ... an "Adventurer Hand-signs" language that is common in the region. One PC from the prior campaign arc developed a backstory that introduced the concept of an upgraded "Commando Hand-signs" language (developed for a group of Fighter-Rogue infiltrators) akin to our modern military hand signs.

FWIW,

Rez

[Sheboygen]

I'd suggested that we simply make one up, myself, figuring that since my character was a linguist he could take the time to figure it out, which is whayt we may end up doing anyway - but alack, the question still stands.

[James Jacobs]

You might be thinking of "Into the Darklands," which introduced several new languages to Golarion. Among them a couple of sign-language type languages. The one in particular you might be remembering is Sakvroth.

[Ekeebe]

I do recall a type of hitorical sign language, called Thieves Cant, based off of hand signals made by back alley pickpockets and high class break and enter thieves alike.

Not sure if this is what you want, but I use something similar in my Pathfinder games, and like Druidic, it is only available as a bonus language to the Rogue class.

[Sheboygen]

James Jacobs wrote:

You might be thinking of "Into the Darklands," which introduced several new languages to Golarion. Among them a couple of sign-language type languages. The one in particular you might be remembering is Sakvroth.

That's probably what they were thinking of, I'll e-mail the group and let 'em know. Thanks a bunch.

[LREggers]

Sheboygen wrote:

James Jacobs wrote:

You might be thinking of "Into the Darklands," which introduced several new languages to Golarion. Among them a couple of sign-language type languages. The one in particular you might be remembering is Sakvroth.

That's probably what they were thinking of, I'll e-mail the group and let 'em know. Thanks a bunch.

I seem to recall something in the Pathfinder Campaign Setting book where adventurers from a specific region that have a hand signal based form of communication that "supplements" the spoken word, and is primarily for conveying "secret" info between adventurers from that region. Only problem is, I don't remember which region it is.

[Ambrosia Slaad]

Don't have my hardcover handy, but I think it was a sidebar in the Absalom section. Can't remember the name though.

[Cpt_kirstov]

Ambrosia Slaad wrote:

Don't have my hardcover handy, but I think it was a sidebar in the Absalom section. Can't remember the name though.

yup page 57 has the feat secret signals +5 to bluff and ability to give warnings without verbally doing soalso allowing aid another in certain situations

[KnightErrantJR]

Sheboygen wrote:

That's probably what they were thinking of, I'll e-mail the group and let 'em know. Thanks a bunch.

That may indeed have been what I was thinking of. Given that our primary character that wants to use signs is a dwarf, a general language that is used "mainly by beings with prehensile digits that have darkvision" wouldn't be too much of a stretch.

That having been said, I think I may have been half remembering the feat from the Absalom book as well.

Thanks all.

[Mosaic]

Ekeebe wrote:

I do recall a type of historical sign language, called Thieves Cant, based off of hand signals made by back alley pickpockets and high class break and enter thieves alike.

I'd love to see Thieves' Cant make a comeback.

[Hmm]

Yes, I am engaging in thread resurrection.

James Jacobs wrote:

You might be thinking of "Into the Darklands," which introduced several new languages to Golarion. Among them a couple of sign-language type languages. The one in particular you might be remembering is Sakvroth.

James Jacobs, when I looked up "Into the Darklands," I saw Sakvroth and Flail Snail as sign languages. Unfortunately, Sakvroth is "secret" language, which means that I cannot learn it with linguistics. Flail Snail is described as a full sign language but one that uses slime (eew!) as well as gestures.

It also stated that flail snail has been studied by the Pathfinder Society. I really want to use sign language in PFS. Is there a way for humanoids to adopt flail snail to be gestures without slime? I will willingly buy the book if it will give me a sign language that I can use in PFS for my deaf character and her best friend (my boyfriend will be playing with me.)

I am also planning to take the rank in linguistics for read lips. But I would love a second rank in linguistics if I can have a sign language that is PFS approved. Is there a Golarian Sign Language? An Avistan Sign Language?

Hmm

[Onyxlion]

I thought you could learn secret languages through linguistics?

[Hmm]

I guess we can. Would Sakvroth be allowed in PFS? Or any other Golarion-based sign language with the linguistics skill?

Hmm

[Emmanuel Nouvellon-Pugh]

To pass secret signs requires a bluff check, meaning you may not need to make a check to pass obvious signs?

[Kazaan]

Emmanuel Nouvellon-Pugh wrote:

To pass secret signs requires a bluff check, meaning you may not need to make a check to pass obvious signs?

Arguably, if it's just about signs to communicate without compromising stealth, no check is needed. However, in the thick of the fight, your signs may be easily interpreted by any intelligent enemy. If you want signs that only your own group would understand, it takes a bluff check to communicate in a manner that adversaries won't understand. Linguistics could be used by the whole group to learn a "language" all their own in which case it would fall under language rules; anyone who "knows" the language can figure out what they're saying no problem but people who don't "know" can't.