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Jolistina Susperio

Abraham spalding's page

Pathfinder Society Member. 10,045 posts (14,848 including aliases). 1 review. No lists. 1 wishlist. 13 aliases.


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It is definitely a +3 but I agree with Archaeik that you can only aid other in this instance to increase AC.

ironically enough most of the bardic performance are disconnectioned from the perform skill.

inspire courage works even if you have no ranks in perform, or even if somehow the bard lacks a charisma score.

extreme_tactician wrote:
Mabven the OP healer wrote:
You are entirely unlikely to get a developer response here, and mort is exactly correct. The rule of thumb is - if a feat/spell/ability alters any previous feat/spell/ability, it only alters it in the ways which are explicit in the text of the feat/spell/ability, and any additional changes you may infer because of similarities to other feats/spells/abilities are incorrect.
Thank you. The rule of thumb makes sense, and now I feel like this feat is less useful than I thought.

Sounds to me like you would be very interested in the Envoy of Balance prestige class.

One of its abilities that you can choose has the option to spontaneously convert to cure or inflict and the ability balances out your channeling to full dice on both as well.

Also as you can see from the envoy of balance the versatile channeling feat does not normally allow you to have both spontaneous casting options.

The Um... on number 1 is because I'm not up to date on the many threads that goes over the differences between wielded/used/hold on any specific item. The FAQ on the defender property would lead me to think that you would need to be using the item in some fashion to gain the bonus, and possibly even more specifically to attack.


My OPINION is that if you use the staff to attack (either two weapon fighting or just attacking with the staff) or cast a spell from the staff (with wand wielder if using spell combat or just as normal for using a spell from a staff) that should be enough for you to gain the bonus.

Spell strike does not state any limitations on how the spell is cast only that it is a touch spell (or you have an appropriate arcana or class ability to use other spells/with other weapon combinations), so yes how you cast the spell doesn't effect if you can spell strike with the spell.

1. Um...
2. Yes
3. Yes
4. Yes... provided you can cast the spell somehow while both hands are occupied (quickened from the staff would be fine though if you have wand wielder and the spell was in the staff and quickened).

Related question at the end Yes.

GM approval required but possibly. Spell combat states it requires a free hand -- it does not provide an exemption and therefore requires a free hand.

But that does raise the question of if you need a free hand still with wand wielder. Which would be awkward as heck since you need to attack with and a free hand and to be holding the wand.

Unarmed strike to the rescue?

Personally It is my belief that the wand or staff can be occupying the 'free hand' in order to be used with spell combat.

But RAW would probably suggest otherwise.

Finally to be absolutely clear spell combat doesn't quicken a spell -- it allows you to full attack and cast a spell with a casting time of 1 standard action at the same time with a single full round action.

So if you spell combat you could still cast a quickened spell for the round too.

Mojorat wrote:

Polymorphing effects convey the base movement that is why it is never listed.

A dwarf using AS to turn into a human would loose dark vision and probably stability (going off memory).

Which is really weird when you consider that many such spells spell out the granting of swim, fly and climb speeds.

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Specific > than general.

In general you can't reduce damage below 1 point of nonlethal. In the specific case of DR you can.



The entry indicates the amount of damage ignored (usually 5 to 15 points) and the type of weapon that negates the ability.

Note that you ignore the damage. Of course it is subtracted but the reason is important.

For example Shield of Swings halves your damage. So you roll your damage and subtract half. This is not a penalty. Your damage is halved.

Likewise a critical hit adds to your damage -- however it is not a bonus. It is an increase (typically by double but sometimes by triple or even quadruple and occasionally by quintuple the original amount).

So yes you do subtract from the damage you take -- no this is not a penalty to damage.

Interestingly it is the same language as energy resistance and immunity.

Please note this is the same basic idea of following:

Two adventurers go out and agree to split the loot in half. They kill the monsters get the loot stack it all up in the middle and the first one to pick his half says, "I'll take the bottom half". Well as he takes from the bottom more falls to the bottom and he proceeds to take that as well until there is no loot left for the other guy.

Ssalarn wrote:
You completely missed the joke...

You know, I now see what you did there...

Also this is a question about energy resistance and not DR (which also *generally* does not stack).

Just for those that come in and get confused.

Ssalarn wrote:
FLite wrote:

The confusion comes in part because the bardic perfomance class feature mentions that some uses are language dependant, and so people are confused.

Yeah, while Inspire Courage isn't language dependent, the rules for using it are.

Incorrect --


inspire courage can use audible or visual components.

It has can have audible components which deaf creatures are immune to or visual components which blind creatures are immune to, but it is not language dependent.

It only matters if you can hear or see depending on which version the bard uses.


As a full-round action, you can use a melee weapon to deliver a coup de grace (pronounced "coo day grahs") to a helpless opponent. You can also use a bow or crossbow, provided you are adjacent to the target.

Unless your spell counts as one of the three bold bits in that quote you cannot coup de grace with the spell in question.

Additionally the coup de grace is the only attack form called out that does not require an attack roll as such that still gives sneak attack damage.

As for creature targeted spells I am waiting to hear how anyone is precisely targeting a vital spot with said spells.

Can we all agree I have given sufficient evidence that area of effect spells do not normally gain extra damage from sneak attack?

Just so we can cross off each case as we go.

Torchlyte wrote:
dragonhunterq wrote:
Explain how you strike a vital spot with an area effect again?

Explain how you can fail to strike a vital spot with an area effect. Alternatively, explain how the AT capstone is intended to work. That is now your explanation for how Sneak Attacking with an AOE spell works.

I can strike someone three different ways all in the same spot and have different effects on them based on how I struck them.

Same with this -- it doesn't matter if the area effect could (or even does) strike the vital spot -- it's the fact you don't have the control to precisely target that spot (and hit it correctly) to do extra damage.

Sneak attack doesn't say you simply need to hit the spot, it says you have to be able to target it.

Which you can't do if you can't control what the spell affects.

double checks for affect/effect errors... I think I'm good

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CommandoDude wrote:

Nowhere does it say Sneak Attack requires an attack roll, so people insisting it does need to cite something if they want me to buy that.

Now, can Precision Damage be applied to an AoE spell? That is a separate question. RAW is a little murky since it doesn't say outright, but the language "must be able to pick out a weakspot to attack" seems to mean RAI the answer is No.

Meh I'll nibble:



Some spells affect an area. Sometimes a spell description specifies a specially defined area, but usually an area falls into one of the categories defined below.

Regardless of the shape of the area, you select the point where the spell originates, but otherwise you don't control which creatures or objects the spell affects. The point of origin of a spell is always a grid intersection. When determining whether a given creature is within the area of a spell, count out the distance from the point of origin in squares just as you do when moving a character or when determining the range for a ranged attack. The only difference is that instead of counting from the center of one square to the center of the next, you count from intersection to intersection.

You can count diagonally across a square, but remember that every second diagonal counts as 2 squares of distance. If the far edge of a square is within the spell's area, anything within that square is within the spell's area. If the spell's area only touches the near edge of a square, however, anything within that square is unaffected by the spell.

From: Aiming a spell

Obviously if you can't even control which creatures or objects are affected you cannot be able to pick out a weakspot to attack with the spell.

Now this does leave as your only last type of spell to worry about the targets creatures option -- but even that is "choose creature" not "target a particular part of the creature" so again... no precise targeting.



A spell with this kind of area affects creatures directly (like a targeted spell), but it affects all creatures in an area of some kind rather than individual creatures you select. The area might be a spherical burst, a cone-shaped burst, or some other shape.

Many spells affect “living creatures,” which means all creatures other than constructs and undead. Creatures in the spell's area that are not of the appropriate type do not count against the creatures affected.

Of course the surprise spell ability of the arcane trickster does change this.

Placeholder for four more ideas.

Negative energy conduit, armored shell, unstable mutation, font of ki.

Unnerving Eyes
Available to: Accursed, Abyssal, Shadow
Benefit: You have a gaze attack that shakens people. This will not stack with itself or other fear effects. The DC for your gaze attack is 10+1/2 your sorcerer level + cha mod. In addition you have low light vision, at level 3 you gain darkvision to 30 ft. This increases to 60 feet at 6th level and you may see in magical darkness (as the devil ability see in darkness) at level 9.

Warped Lungs
Available to: Aberrant, Draconic, Impossible
Benefit: Your lungs are such that you are immune to inhaled poisons and anything that would make you choke or cough (including smoke inhalation and the like). High altitude is not a problem for you. In addition you gain a breath weapon. This breath weapon does 1d6 points of damage either fire, cold, electric, or acid damage (your choice at level 1 and it doesn't change after that) in either a 15 foot cone or 20 foot line (again your choice at level 1 and doesn't change after that). The DC for your breath weapon is 10+1/2 your sorcerer level+your Con Modifier. At level 3 and every 3 levels after that the damage increases by 1d6 and the cone increase by 5 feet or the line increases by 10 feet.

Dangerous Flesh
Available to: Abyssal, Aberrant, Infernal
Benefit: Your very flesh is dangerous to those around you, pick one of the following:

Poisonous -- You are poisonous to the touch: Contact DC (10+1/2 sorcerer level+Con Mod) Onset 1 round, Frequency 1 round every 1/3 sorcerer levels (minimum 1) Effect 1d2 Dex damage Saves 1 (increases to 2 consecutive at level 10)

Slime -- You are covered in a protective slime, anyone that attacks you with a non-reach weapon must make a reflex save (DC 10+1/2 sorcerer level + Dex Mod) or take 1d4 acid damage. Weapons that strike you automatically take this damage. This damage increases to 1d6 at level 3 and 1d8 at level 6. After this acid gains +1 damage at level 9 and every 3 levels after that.

Fiery Flesh -- You gain the burn universal rule. This damage is the same as the slime damage above.

So a while back we put together the Sorcerer's Aid Project: Sigils and Talents.

I would like to work on a follow up project: The Sorcerer's Aid Project: Mutations.

A mutation replaces the sorcerer's arcana ability with an ability that is always active generally passive and has no effect on the sorcerer's casting. Instead it's more tied into their physical being. Each mutation should generally be limited to bloodlines that would have a tie in to what that mutation does.


Positive Energy Conduit
Available to: Celestial, Fey, Verdant
Benefit: Your body is a raw conduit to the positive energy plane. As such you gain 1 temporary hit point every round to a maximum equal to your level. As a melee touch attack you can deal 1d4+1 per level damage to undead. At level 3 you gain a +1 bonus on saves versus death, ability drain and energy drain increasing by +1 every three class levels.

Savage Form
Available to: Demonic, Draconic, Orc
Benefit: You gain two natural attacks from the following list: Gore, Hoof, Bite, Tail slap, Tentacle, Claw (maybe taken twice). These gain a +1 bonus on damage every 4 class levels you have. At level 3 you gain a +1 bonus to natural armor that increases by +1 every three class levels.

Elemental Nature
Available to: Djinni, Efreet, Shaitan, Elemental, Marid, and Draconci
Benefit: You gain energy resistance to your element equal to your class level that stacks with any other resistance to that element you might have. At level 3 once a day if your resistance to that element is not overcome or you have immunity to that element you are instead healed an amount of damage equal to 1/2 your class level when you are exposed a damaging effect from that element. You can use this ability 1 extra time per day at level 6 and every 3 class levels after that.

The mutations do not have to be limited to a specific number of bloodlines but shouldn't be so generic any sorcerer can take them. More suggestions are of course welcome.

What Peet said about the having an effect on everyone.

Personally I like false focus but it's hardly something I use on every character.

wail of the banshee is about as close as you get and it is indescriminate

Rules quote:

Not affected by raise dead and reincarnate spells or abilities. Resurrection and true resurrection can affect undead creatures. These spells turn undead creatures back into the living creatures they were before becoming undead.

From the undead type.

Hookers and Blow.

Archaeik wrote:
maouse wrote:
Abraham spalding wrote:
Touch of Idiocy and Enfeeblement don't do drain but do have more effects than normal for a penalty or damage.
Touch of Idiocy doesn't say damage or drain... it says "penalty" which is neither. It is a 10m/lvl penalty (like a minus to). Not the same thing at all from what I can tell. But a great way to get a stat to 1 before you whammy them with another spell for that last point? I don't know how that would stack... hmmm...

Ability Penalties

Some spells and abilities cause you to take an ability penalty for a limited amount of time. While in effect, these penalties function just like ability damage, but they cannot cause you to fall unconscious or die. In essence, penalties cannot decrease your ability score to less than 1.

Be leave me I am well aware of the differences between damage, penalty and drain.

However the two spells I mentioned are different than normal penalties because of their specific language.

With that said I meant feeblemind not enfeeblement (which isn't an actual spell).

For reference:


Touch of idiocy

Please note that spells themselves limit spell casting and other options based on the penalty (or set stat) they give. It is not the penalty itself doing this but the specifics of the spells involved.

To address the other point:

You cannot stack penalties with actual ability damage to lower a stat below 1 since penalties cannot be used to lower a stat below one.

If you had 10 strength and got hit with ray of enfeeblement for 9 points and then took 1 point of strength damage you would still have a strength score of 1 minimum since the penalty cannot lower it below 1. If you took 8 more points of strength damage it still would not be enough since the penalty cannot lower you below 1. If you then took a point of strength drain your life sucks and you are now unconscious (at minimum depending on what caused the drain and what caused the damage).

Touch of Idiocy and Enfeeblement don't do drain but do have more effects than normal for a penalty or damage.

phalanx fighter might be an option.

Some other thoughts on using a magic staff:

If your staff is intelligent it could be recharging.

A level 20 arcane bloodline sorcerer can trade 3 spell levels to prevent a drain of a charge. So instead of recharging a staff you could simply trade spell levels for higher spell levels making a staff infinity more attractive for this one particular individual (example: Trading 3 first level spell slots for a higher level spell, or 2 3rd level slots for a higher level spell that uses two charges).

Finally: Not all tools have to be useful to every character type at all times.

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I thought you should know.


Yes I play arcane casters.

What? They aren't clerics.

Yeah if you are going this route you should definitely get point blank and precise shot (and once you can improved precise shot). You will likely want rapid shot and quick draw (otherwise drawing darts is going to take a move action). You will likely want deadly aim as well.

If you use them together then I would suggest the staff be more for defense and casting potential than actual attack (since you can use the quarterstaff defense just by holding the thing).

The cards themselves won't do much damage but as a carrier for spells they aren't bad, and you can still use any thrown weapon with your class abilities so you don't always have to use cards btw.

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Hookers and blow.

Set wrote:
An actual Bat might be handicapped by the 1d3-4 damage thing, which would drop it's attack to doing 1 pt. nonlethal damage, which would make all of the sneak attack damage also nonlethal damage, but a person polymorphed into a bat will probably have a higher Str score and be less likely to roll less than 1 damage.

That makes about as much sense as saying you don't get sneak attack damage because the base damage doesn't get pass the DR. It isn't two different damage pools it's just the damage you deal. If that is 1d3-4+5d6 sneak attack then it's that, not 1d3-4 meaning nonlethal then sneak attack.

Do allow a medium creature to get sneak attack on a colossal one?

Same logic applies here.


base value is fairly correct, with generally a 75 percent chance of anything below that value being available.

purchase limit is the most any one person in town has to pay for what the pcs have.

the random items are the odd items that could be for sale and might fall outside the above price guidelines.

of course guidelines is a keyword here.

i have a thread named farmer joe is a professional that hits on this some if you are interested in looking at it.

save or lose
save or suck

also necro has nice high level damage spells

Personally I like the Skilled, sacred tattoo, shaman's apprentice half orc with fate's favored.

You get the +2 luck bonus on save throws, endurance and the skilled human bonus. You still have your weapon familiarity as well.

However since you are going with the swindler burning assurance might be a better choice for you (instead of shaman's apprentice).

cruise wrote:
Abraham spalding wrote:
need 4 levels of beast bond witch
why's that?

Nevermind -- I had incorrectly thought that the feat transfer ability was gained at level 4.

A Cleric is someone's lapdog and lives the life of luxury as long has he stays on his leash... wizards use their leash as the chain of command -- Jayne Cobb style.

For schools to give up on your first go through?

Depends. If you want to be easy on the GM give up conjuration and enchantment.

If you want bang for your buck give up enchantment and evocation.

If you want to keep evocation you can probably live without divination.

If you want power at higher levels keep conjuration.

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JoeJ wrote:
Part of the problem is that the prices for many items in the CRB, including most weapons, make no sense whatsoever. 75 gp for a longbow in a world in which a skilled worker earns 3 sp a day is absurd. (For comparison, note that the law in Medieval England required every yeoman to own and practice with a longbow.)

Well it is a good thing the average skilled worker in pathfinder does not earn 3 sp a day.


I found a web site here: that has actual medieval prices for a wide variety of items, gleaned from historical documents. Or you can take the easy way and just convert the prices from GURPS Low Tech (1sp = $4 or $5 GURPS would be a good start). Your player characters will likely be less prone to cart around a bunch of old weapons and other gear if the amount they can sell them for is reduced to a more believable level.

We have people talking about the value of rat hide and rations as well as pulling nails to sale when they get back. The individual prices no matter how low aren't what is causing the behavior.


Art objects are another matter. Why are you putting them in there at all if they're not part of the reward? In any case, unless the dungeon is still in use or has only very recently been abandoned, valuable but mundane objects will have survived only in very exceptional circumstances. Normally time, weather, and previous explorers will have removed most items of value.

Some areas have art that's simply there because it should be there. For example in an abandoned temple or a long forgotten wizard's tower or manor. Yes a good portion of it might be destroyed by various things but again something like a marble statue might last some time and could have been there for the GM to be able to add atmosphere to the area. Just because something is there doesn't mean it's a reward -- otherwise why have houses?


Magic is yet another issue, but in my world magic items appear as treasure because I expect the PCs to use them. Permanent magic items usually can't be sold without taking weeks or months to find a buyer; they are far too expensive for even kings to casually buy, and they don't generally need to be replaced. This also means, of course, that permanent magic items are made to order and never, ever found sitting in shops waiting for some adventurer to buy.

Except again generally in pathfinder using the default rules your typical NPC will be able to afford some magic. It's going to be a major purchase. But that doesn't mean it isn't readily possible. As to the 'why' -- for the same reason some people buy cars or use the internet or buy role playing books... people are complicated and want stuff.


Ultimately, though, it might be best to talk to your players. It's possible that they have their own ideas about what kind of a game would be the most fun, and talking with them can help you better come to a consensus that everyone will enjoy.

Best advice ever!

need 4 levels of beast bond witch

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one solution we used was everytime you leveled up you automatically reset to wealth by level.

party had a 10 percent party fund. any equipment you wanted came from your wealth by level. anything found after leveling up was available until you leveled again, when you had to do your next... buyback.

I've liked the cavalier for a mundane buff bot.

With honor guard (or just taking the body guard feat) helpful and order of the dragon you can drop some serious bonuses on people's AC. Take the teamwork feats that allow unprovoked movement and caster protection and maybe even the shield wall one to provide cover and concealment for your allies and you can really screw up the enemies battle plans.

It honestly doesn't take that much to do (even with the cavalier's limited feats) and helps him add something other than "I'm a variant fighter".

Cavalier (order of the star) and cleric mesh well leading into the holy vindicator.

Finally I used the cavalier as the primary class for my noble scion.

Oh no Matt

You don't know it but you just uttered fateful words of dreadful eldritch power...


Mayhem Havocrain wrote:
I would argue that a high perception and initiative are as valuable (and potentially more so) than any of these feats. If Pathfinder is just a game of rocket tag, going first and nuking any threat before it can force you to make a save seems like a better strategy. Dead enemies (usually) don't force saves.

if it was rocket tag that would make sense...

but it is usually not.

iron will is near constant for me. great fortitude is a sometimes, however i can usually find plenty of things to improve fort saves without great fortitude

Jeff Erwin wrote:
Mikaze wrote:

So with Shelyn almost confirmed as being a big deal in Vudra, considering her servitors, one has to wonder if a Kama Sutra-analogue might be heavily influenced by her and her allies. Possibly being more equal, inclusive, and safer to boot.

Which then leads to some wondering about how that book combined with Vudra's(and Jalmeray by extension) stratified caste system might lead to different mindsets concerning romance and sexuality compared to the Inner Sea, neighboring Casmaron(the probable birthplace of the Iridian Fold?), and RL India. If such a book were given such importance, that is.

resists temptation to suggest "Indian Terre D’Ange"

edit-and now I can't stop thinking about that

Ancient or Classical India was less gender caste-stratified (or properly, jati-stratified - varna or caste is a pretty much modern invention), particularly when the Kama Sutra was written, than medieval or modern India. If I were working on Vudra, I'd have some significant variation in caste structure, from free and easy (CG) to rigid and probably LE.

But if we assume that Vudra is like Jalmeray (which is fairly stratified), keep in mind that Hindu law (as a parallel) understood a wide variety of legal marriages and relationships, and while the higher castes would use arranged marriage (and Shelyn would be invoked to create marital understanding and love - post-wedding), as would certain jatis that followed strict exogamy or endogamic rules, there should be still room for love-matches and star-crossed lovers in Vudra, if it reflects any amount of South Asian folklore and pop culture.

Arranged marriages made by means of divinations - as they are in India today - would be fairly accurate in Vudra, since divination magic is more reliable in Golarion. So not so bad...

Also, Apsaras (or "dapsaras") are pretty much the poster children of dangerous infatuations and rebirth-reunions, so those elements should go with them in Vudra.

So I...

who was the demigoddes of tragedic love that had a falling out with shelyn? i would think she might have a decent following as well there.

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Ugh, let me look up the post I've been over this before...

Base line weakest saves in the game success rates from beta

Dwarven examples

Fighter min to wizard maximum

Summation post

Someone else's post this time

Ah, found it: the thread you were looking for

just because he is antimagic does not mean he is nonreligious or the setting equivalent of an atheist.

MrSin wrote:
Lincoln Hills wrote:
I'm wondering what this character will do when energy drain or permanent ability drain enters the picture...
Learn a valuable lesson or die horribly. Of course he can't come back either, that would take magic.

there are barbarian powers that could help with that.

honestly several barbarian levels are a good idea for this sort of character.

he does not need numbers and facts he has the truthiness in his gut.

not what i was trying to say.

the mechanics and balance can be fine but also be boring or onerous or simply not fun when used at the table. those are the points that playtesting can help with.

as such for me playtesting is as much for the... fun aspect as it is for the number crunching. remember the gunslinger was originally a fighter subclass. it worked as such and balancewise not much changed but making it a separate class was definitely a good move.

antecdotes are not data,

but all these antecdotes say you are wrong.

yay for old arguments made fresh.

honestly both are important. without the math your start and end points are going to be crap.

without actual play experience you will not know which parts of the mechanics will actually work as part of the game.

this is why paizo wants both as part of their development program.

Ralph L'Mao adventured to find his lost love that had left to find Xin Shalast. At the end of the adventure he found her dead and instead went back to


The college and hooked up with one of the alufiends and did research there. Eventually his daughter will be a sorceress character for another game.

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