cynarion's Carrion Crown PbP

Game Master cynarion

cynarion wrote:

Karrik wrote:

Oh, I see Dragomir's CMD as 17.

10 + 1 Bab + 4 str + 2 dex.

Yup, but Dragomir's banded mail reduces his max Dex to +1, so his Dex only counts for +1 rather than the full +2. : )

(I did make the assumption Dragomir would likely be wearing his armour when his CMD was called upon; I should probably have spelled that out, sorry.)

Quote:

Maximum Dex Bonus: This number is the maximum

Dexterity bonus to AC that this type of armor allows.
Dexterity bonuses in excess of this number are reduced to
this number for the purposes of determining the wearer’s
AC. Heavier armors limit mobility, reducing the wearer’s
ability to dodge blows. This restriction doesn’t affect any
other Dexterity-related abilities.

Just pointing this section of the book out. Dex always applies fully to CMD, which is not written directly in the rules except for that line, and is something I can only support with stat blocks from APs, where Dex bonus being greater than the max dex of armor is exceedingly rare. So, uh, take my word on it!

Yeah, you've got to love distributed rules, because:

A creature can also add any circumstance, deflection, dodge, insight, morale, profane, and sacred bonuses to AC to its CMD. Any penalties to a creature’s AC also apply to its CMD. A flat-footed creature does not add its Dexterity bonus to its CMD.

I go with the specific rules for CMD trumping the general ones for Max Dex Bonus.

If this has been dealt with somewhere, let me know, cos I'd love to have a definitive answer beyond "Hero Lab does it this way".

Interesting. So then Dragomir's Dex-based Skills would not suffer the Dex limit ding in addition to the standard ACP penalty. I'll update the table... unless Cynarion wants to house-rule it differently.

Nup, that's how I've always run it; Dragomir should have an Acrobatics bonus of -4, for example (+2 Dex, -6 Armor Check Penalty). No further reduction for Max Dex Bonus affecting skills. It's my personal interpretation that Skills are what they really meant with the line 'other Dexterity-related abilities', they just didn't want to paint themselves into a corner by not being general--and they wound up contradicting themselves instead. Whoops!

You have questioned the Holy Words of the Dungeon Master!! Prepare to face his wrath!! Your books shall become brittle and tables shall misalign!! Your dice shall become tainted and roll only 1s!! Your sheet shall become wily and you shall misplace it on gameday!! So it has been written, so it shall be done!!

Hah! I don't think anyone has ever thought to describe my words as 'holy' before. ; )

I actually like it when someone can prove me wrong, because it means we've got to something resembling Truth. : )

I will see if I can get Sarianna to show up again sometime tonight. : )

Yeah, you've got to love distributed rules...

Those rules aren't distributed. They are wisely separated in a tactically sound fashion to prevent them all from being caught by the same Area of Effect attack. :)

Whichever way you choose to interpret the rules, you should have a doc waiting in your in-box with the appropriate stats.

Truth be told, I think it makes sense that heavy armor can hurt your CMD anyway. Though, I am going to have to worry about about this when my dex gets really high at later levels, lol.

On gear:
First of all I went back and made a few changes to his weapons to slim down the number of items because of some redundancy. Silver dagger, war razor, scimitar, and cold iron morningstar has been swapped out for silver war razor, cold iron scimitar, brass knuckles, and regular morningstar.

Cynarion, take a look at the spoiler (it's spoiled for brevity -- anyone can look if they care enough to), and let me know if you think that's a decent set-up. My goal was for him to look the part of a dapper half-orc unless he's in "adventuring mode", at which point he'll look like a dapper half-orc well-prepared with a lot of stuff. :)

---

On Max Dex and CMD:
I'm not sure I agree with your ruling on the CMD thing, but it's not a big enough deal to make a stink about or anything. Whatever you rule, I'll happily abide.

That said, in my mind it comes down to whether or not the Max Dex of an armor is a penalty or not. I don't consider it a penalty. The armor limits how much Dex can be applied to AC in the first place, it doesn't retroactively penalize the AC. CMD is something that is calculated (in my opinion) aside from the calculation of AC, so it make sense to me that the Max Dex of the armor wouldn't then be considered a penalty to AC.

I don't know if I explained that well, but it's the best I got. :)
Like I said, I'm fine with what you decide here; I just thought I'd give my (somewhat unsolicited) thoughts on it.

Into the sudden silence created as the group sifts through their own memories of the Professor, Raj speaks up though he is loath to do it. He looks to Rose and Karrik briefly, "My story isn't as interesting as yours, but it is what it is... I met Doc about 10 years ago. I was alley-runnin', stealin' - you know - kid stuff. It wasn't making me happy but I had to keep food on the table, right? Anyhow, I see this old fella traveling through town with a wagon-load of fancy gear I could pawn. So I trail him, looking for the right time to boost the cart and leave him in the dust. Before I get the chance, this pack of bully boys jump him. Well, I was gonna rob him sure enough but I wasn't gonna hurt an old man. That's low. I didn't know anything about mages at the time, so I thought Doc was in real trouble." He chuckles at his own naivete. "Anyhow, I coulda minded my business but I wasn't real fond of those boys anyway and I figured maybe the old fella would cut loose a few coins if I saved his skin, so I jumped into the fight. Doc and me came out ahead on the exchange. He didn't drop any coins in my hand but he vouched for me with some folks that got me out of the alleys, got me educated a bit better, and set me on a different course. Since then, wellll... our paths have crossed a few times and sometimes I needed his brain power and sometimes he needed me to provide unconventional solutions - that was Doc's phrase for it." He adds a shrug to emphasize that's the end of his story.

The halfling listens with genuine interest to the others and raises his voice to be heard, as if anticipating that it will be hard to gain the strangers' attention.

It seems as though the professor did not live a dull life. When I first met him he was in a spot of trouble over some book--I confess I cannot remember which one, but I have to wonder if it was this Krolvin of which you spoke?

Anyway, Raj, we also came out ahead and I helped him find what he was looking for. The details are not important. What is fascinating, though, is that all of the Professor's actions have led us to this moment. For a man to live such a long, dangerous life and succeed as often as he did--he was fortunate indeed. That our fates have been intertwined by one central figure, like a spider on a web, makes me feel as though this is exactly where we need to be. And since we are in the right place at the right time, perhaps we should stay awhile longer and drink a bit more!

Silently agreeing with the pint-sized cleric, Raj gathers another round of drinks for the table. He raises a glass, "To Benevolent Spiders."

Lem
Seems to be missing his armor class numbers, which I've calculated as AC 17 / 14 touch / 14 flat-footed.

Parade armor usually only affects people from the same country. In Lem's case, did you have a mechanic in mind for how you wanted to armor's effect to play out? The simplest explanation would be that it affects folks who share Lem's faith...but that seems a bit too specific. Let me know if you have any particular ideas.

I'll fix the AC issue in my profile. Re: the Parade Armor. What I wanted for Lem was that he have the Star and Purple Butterfly sigil on his armor and perhaps stars on the studs of his studded leather. I wanted that flavor-wise to show that he "loudly" displays his faith. And I thought it was cool to have this short, old halfling who walks with a spring in his step and has this bright, flamboyant attire on. :-)

When I was looking over equipment and saw Parade Armor I thought it was a cool representation of this, so I took it. As Lem is from Ustalav, I assumed the bonus would work on everyone from Ustalav. If you think this is too powerful (and for some reason Parade Armor costs the same as Studded Leather, which is weird) and want to limit it to people from Varno (which is the county where Lem spends most of his time) I understand. If you think that is too limited and want to make it that the bonus applies to followers of Desna or poor people or something, that's fine too. I realize that a +2 bonus to a skill for no extra cost might be overpowered and that's not my intention. I just thought it fit what kind of armor/clothes I wanted him to wear, so I took it. However you decide to rule it is fine with me.

Anybody know why my "ooc" tags don't work? In my previous post I put one in front and one behind and had two separate paragraphs in between them, but for some reason it only put the first paragraph in "ooc blue"

Having separated paragraphs kills the OOC tag. Don't ask me why.

Hey Lem. Am on a break from my training course. : ) My reasoning was as follows.

If parade armor gives a bonus vs. people from the same country, then Lem's armor should apply to followers of Desna...but that would be pretty much nobody (that I can recall) in this whole AP. So that's too weak.

If however it was Pharasmin armor, it would likely apply to everyone from Ustalav, as there is enough respect for Pharasma there for her faith to be almost universal.

To be honest, if you don't have a specific idea for the armor's effect, you paid for it so we might as well just use the listed effect of +2 vs. every Ustalavic person you meet, even if the whole Desna angle doesn't quite match up. There are plenty of alternative ways to characterise the bonus; perhaps it really is the incongruity of seeing a halfling in parade armor that does it, as you suggest.

In any case, keep the +2s, and if you actually run into a Desnan I'll add something extra. : )

PS: will see if I can find something concrete on the CMD/Dex issue over the weekend. I favour my interpretation at the moment, but will change my mind if I see sufficient evidence. : )

Theron couldn't help but smile at the ridiculous toast before gulping down some of his new drink. The professor certainly had met a number of interesting people.

Originally Theron had not been intending to say how he had met the professor, but he found himself deciding to chime in with his story as well. "I didn't meet the professor until only a few months ago. Unfortunately, it wasn't under the best circumstances... but for both of our sakes I'm glad it happened. I don't usually announce my title when I'm not 'on duty', but you see, I had recently begun my work as an inquisitor in Iomedae's service." Theron couldn't help but glance around the table for reactions. "I passed through this town one day, and some citizens found out about me and came with... accusations against the professor. I had not heard of him before, possibly because I had just finished years of studies, and I was also too eager at the time. I took the accusations too seriously." Theron paused for a moment. There was more to it than that, but he felt he didn't need to make his story drag on.

"As fate would have it, my over eagerness may have ended up saving the old man's life. I found out that the professor was leaving town to study some ruins, and I tracked him to them. Soon after we both arrived there, a number of undead crawled out towards him. When he began striking them down with his magic rather than trying to control them, I realized that the accusations had been false. I sprung out of hiding and began shooting down as many of the undead as I could."

When it was all over, the professor thanked me because he truly didn't believe he had been prepared enough for that sort of fight and would have been killed or worse if I hadn't been there. I was surprised to say the least, since I had killed a fraction of what he had. Thankfully, when I explained why I was there he was upset with his accusers rather than with me and promised to not forget me." Theron paused and thought for a moment before continuing. "I guess he was quite thankful since I was called here, though honestly I feel I don't need his thanks. I'm just glad that I learned the lessons that I did from meeting him earlier in my career rather than later."

Walter watches, amazed, as Karrik rebuts his point so flawlessly and effortlessly, speaking with zeal and energy on the topic-- energy he'd never seen in the faces or hands of any of the students at Lepidstadt, and hardly any of the professors. He found himself without response, lucky that the conversation was realigned. Walter never thought, from what he had heard, that a half-orc could be like that, and if it weren't for Karrik's mighty frame and dull gray skin, Walter may have let the thought slip his mind altogether.

Walter listened raptly to everyone's stories, trying to work up the heart or the words to tell his own. When the toast was called, he fumbled to raise his empty glass-- a gesture he hoped that Miss Vai wouldn't misunderstand as rudeness-- and set it down once again.

After Theron's story had ended, he asked him quietly: "Are you a crusader? From Lastwall," he clarified, honestly wondering. Iomedae wasn't worshipped in the provinces of Ustalav save for a few sparse places, yet just miles from Ravengro stood Vigil, the heart of Iomedae's faithful. It made sense to him when he asked, at least.

The scarred Varisian's eyes slide between the three men of professed faith - Lem, Walter, and Theron. His tone is light, "Seems my toast missed the mark... To Benevolent and NON-denominational Spiders."

Flori laughs at the Varisian's remark, and shares her story.

I was a sailor on shore leave in Vellumis. It was quite by accident that we met. He was accosted in the dark by some ruffians. I don't know who they were. I guess he didn't see them, because he cast no spell as they approached. Probably lost in some deep thought or other... He was so smart...

Though the half orc never knew him well, she chokes up a bit, then continues.

Well, I could see them just fine, so I cast sleep and got 2 of the 4. I ran at the last ones, and I guess they knew I meant business, and scrambled out of there.

The truly inspiring part, though, is the evening of wonder he treated me to, in repayment. I got to hear him give a talk about some arcane theories I barely understood then, and can't remember now.

Later, I was his guest at a fancy party, and he never made me feel less than an equal, though I was clearly out of my depth, and some others weren't so gracious. When we parted, he told me to seek excellence in my gift, and to grow it, and that's what I've always tried to do ever since.

It's still a puzzle that he would remember me after a single night. I really didn't do anything for him I wouldn't have done for anyone in those circumstances. Our interaction was so brief, I would imagine a man of his experience would hardly remember me, let alone mention me in his will. Still a puzzle.

She drains her cup and calls for more.

Another round, gents? A friend of Professor Lorrimor is a friend of mine! Another toast!

"Are you a crusader? From Lastwall,"

Theron pondered how to best answer the question before answering back quietly as well: "No, I wouldn't call myself a crusader, and I have lived in Ustalav for all of my life. The crusaders in Lastwall have devoted themselves to the cause of guarding the Whispering Tyrant's prison, may he forever be trapped there. My work lies in Ustalav however, I am dedicated both to hunting down those who try to follow in that necromancer's footsteps and to destroying any trace that might remain of his reign."

After another moment of thought, Theron decided to add a bit more. "I can understand your curiosity since followers of Pharasma are more common in these parts. However, when it comes to hunters of the undead and necromancers, there may be more Iomedaeans than Pharasmins in Ustalav. In fact, when my hometown was..." Theron stopped for a moment, remembering that he hadn't intended to talk about that. Maybe he had been having too much to drink. Sighing, the inquisitor chose to finish what he was saying. "A necromancer stole away a number of people from my hometown, and was only stopped when Iomedaean inquisitors came and hunted him down."

Upon hearing Rajuna's comment, Theron quickly changed his demeanor with a smile and raised his drink in agreement and then later (against his better judgement) joined in on the next toast suggested by Flori.

Flori drains her cup and calls for more.

Another round, gents? A friend of Professor Lorrimor is a friend of mine! Another toast!

Dragomir waves her question away and gravely rumbles, Allow me.

He waves a gold coin at Sarianna and makes a circular guesture indicating a round of drinks.

He burbs slightly and again leans on the bar, watching as if he drunk or some sort of confusion... or maybe both.

Minus a gold coin from my inventory - this should cover previous drinks and all but the most expensive of rounds

Everyone proceeds to get totally hammered, we miss the funeral and are too hung over to start the adventure path. A message appears on the screen saying 'You have doomed the world'

Hey folks. Now waiting for the plane flight home. : )

Don't worry about spending money on drinks--unless you want to. I tend to handwave those sorts of consumables (including food/rations). But not ammunition!

I did wonder whether you were all going to get tipsy soon with all this drinking. Still, you can rest assured that the imminence of the Professor's funeral (and the fact I have yet to find any rules for drunkenness!) will miraculously bring you back to sobriety. : D

Raj takes the offered drink and toasts with enthusiasm, accidentally spilling a bit on the table near Theron. He quickly mops the spill up with a napkin, cursing his clumsiness.

He laughs, "I think maybe I've had enough. Damn! Got some on you... sorry about that." He pulls a clean rag from his pocket and wipes a spot on the Inquisitor's armor... a spot that wasn't hit with liquor and has an obscure symbol of Iomedae on it.

Bluff (Send Simple Message DC:15) 1d20 + 3 ⇒ (14) + 3 = 17

Dragomir needs to be hammered! He's looking at 2 half orcs, a halfling and what is, when the make up is off, a human sized smurf!, he's waaaay out of his depth. On top of that the majority of the party so far sound educated and/or book smart when Dragomir is lucky to be able to calculate supply bills and wage estimates

Hey folks. Just doing a bit of prep for Monday, and while I don't particularly want to give the game away, I would like to know what you're carrying with you at the funeral. The locals will probably find it a little odd of you show up covered in weapons, but a single one wouldn't be weird, and there's always Sleight of Hand. Have a think about what your PCs will be wearing in the morning and let me know. Thanks!

Hey folks. Just doing a bit of prep for Monday, and while I don't particularly want to give the game away, I would like to know what you're carrying with you at the funeral. The locals will probably find it a little odd of you show up covered in weapons, but a single one wouldn't be weird, and there's always Sleight of Hand. Have a think about what your PCs will be wearing in the morning and let me know. Thanks!

Scholar's clothes. Shoes! A belt. A coat. Done!

Hey folks. Just doing a bit of prep for Monday, and while I don't particularly want to give the game away, I would like to know what you're carrying with you at the funeral. The locals will probably find it a little odd of you show up covered in weapons, but a single one wouldn't be weird, and there's always Sleight of Hand. Have a think about what your PCs will be wearing in the morning and let me know. Thanks!

Standard clothes for a decently employed Ustalavian commoner, albeit a bit studier in construction. Weaponry? He carries a dagger in his left boot and a large fighting knife in the small of his back, tilted sideways so its hilt protrudes to the right side and ready to draw. Its not a war zone or a field of battle so I can't see him wearing armour and toting a great sword IF he can find some one/where he trusts that can store them - they are worth a LOT of money as far as he is concerned and are the tools of his profession.

Hoga will leave her weapons behind in her room, except for a dagger on her belt. She wears an explorer's outfit, and cleans up with magic and a few wildflowers for the casket and her hair to show respect.

A subtle warning to the maid or whoever about not letting her stuff disappear, and she'll come back for it before we go anywhere: I'll be quite unhappy if I find my things missing or tampered with. i'm sure you wouldn't let that happen, right?

Intimidate: 1d20 + 10 ⇒ (2) + 10 = 12

Funeral clothing, with gloves, hooded black cloak and veil. No weapons/armor/adventuring gear. I didn't think to purchase outfit before, doing so now though.

The morning of the funeral, Karrik will be armorless, decked out in his finest - an outfit of all black - carrying his war razor and brass knuckles in their sheathes (boot and inner coat pocket respectively). He rarely goes anywhere without his journal (spell book). Scimitar and adventuring gear (backpack) will be left in his inn room.

Rajuna, for my own edification, how would you say that name? Ra-JOO-na? Ra-HOO-na?

Karrik listens to all of the stories, raising his wine glass in toast every time its offered, even reluctantly nodding when the tall human at the bar buys a round. After an hour or so, his dark mood has been submerged in the dark drink, and he speaks freely about stories about himself and the Professor… trying to remember to be polite enough to prompt others for more of their own stories as well. He's struck by the similarities of the stories. Stories of the Professor's attention and support. Stories of people stepping in to help and always being paid beyond what was necessary by the Old Man. Themes of redemption. Of respect. Of charity and philanthropy and support. The only dark thought that mars the evening is when Karrik realizes how many times the Old Man got himself into a bind without having someone to watch his back.

I told him time and again a second pair of eyes and a strong sword arm would be smart. The thought gets washed away once more in another side conversation.

Karrik finds himself -- at one point -- standing over Rajuna's shoulder doing his best impression of the Professor discussing Rajuna's drink of choice. It's a truly horrid impression. "Well, now, I can certainly appreciate your point, sir," he says as he pretends to push up some fake spectacles, "but I find that if you really want to make an informed decision on your beverage selection, you have to really experience more than one option." His voice dips in a terrible semblance of the way the Professor often 'got serious' with someone. "I mean even the poorest of selections can often bring perspective to a decision."

It occurs to me that Lorrimor should definitely have the Leadership feat on his character sheet.

Rajuna, for my own edification, how would you say that name? Ra-JOO-na? Ra-HOO-na?

It is closer to the former than the latter. His name and nickname are twists on an Indian name - so the pronunciation falls somewhere between Hindi and English: Rah-ZHOO-nah (sort of a soft rolling j sound). The j in his nickname can be pronounced hard or soft - so Rahzh or Rahj. If you want to go authentically Hindi on it (not that there is a need for that) - the j is hard.

Raj will wear his best clothes (not saying much) which are dark and slightly better than typical peasant garb... so he'll be dressed like someone aspiring to enter the merchant class. He'll clean his boots and leave his leathers in the room - unless there is some reason to believe dark leather armor is appropriate for a funeral. :) Over everything he'll wear his short dark burnoose. His spring-loaded daggers will be concealed and attached to his forearms (Sleight of Hand: 1d20+8+2+2 - bonuses for them being dagger-sized and for wrist sheaths designed to conceal) and he'll carry two sheathed daggers in the inside pockets of his burnoose. And he'll have his sap in his outside pocket.

Gahh, I was typing up a reaction to Raj, and firefox ate it.

As for what Theron will be wearing, he'll go with a more formal set of his inquisitor clothes with holy symbols and such, but no armor. He'll also take his longsword with him since it is a symbol of Iomedae, but will leave his bow and other gear behind.

Ah! The interwebz Gods have turned against you!

"Well, now, I can certainly appreciate your point, sir," he says as he pretends to push up some fake spectacles, "but I find that if you really want to make an informed decision on your beverage selection, you have to really experience more than one option." His voice dips in a terrible semblance of the way the Professor often 'got serious' with someone. "I mean even the poorest of...

With a growing grin, Raj watches over his shoulder as Karrik imitates the Professor and plays into it. "Doc, that's a fine answer in theory. Problem is - the world ain't the'retical, now is it? Any veteran drinker knows two things for truth - mixing your poisons will get you a headache tomorrow and it's best to dance with the devil ya know." He sobers slightly, "I argued theory versus real world more than once with Doc."

To the funeral (assuming he's not passed out drunk, hehe) Lem will be wearing his Cleric's Vestments (saved for just such an occasion) and his parade armor (I assume that the robes are roomy enough to allow him to wear armor under them). He will also wear his holy symbol around his next. He won't be bringing any weapons.

Let's see if Theron can hide his reaction to Rajuna's message...

Bluff: 1d20 + 1 ⇒ (2) + 1 = 3 ... +5 from everyone being drunk/impaired + 5 for having 'convincing proof' for acting weird (he is impaired too) = 13! ;)

Initially, Theron looks annoyed by Raj's spilled drink. Then, a surprised look crosses his face and he looks down at the symbol that Raj had cleaned before finally returning to his previous demeanor. "Ah don't worry... no harm done. Besides, I think I've had a bit too much to drink myself."

You know, it just occurred to me that I forgot to have Theron introduce himself. Let's just say he did when he first came in ;)

@ Theron - sounds good!

Walter can't help but smile at Karrik's imitation of the Professor, noting it's uncanny likeness of his tone and voice-- though his deep rumble of a voice hardly matched the Professor's sometimes-nasal-always-light tone. He watched with the amusement that only a sober person surrounded by the quickly inebriated could have, laughing along.

"Like the Professor's theories weren't the real world to him," he responded to Rajuna's history of discussion.

So high-flown. It was all I could do to understand him when he wasn't talking about some esoteric thingy or other. Still, he didn't act like being so smart made him better than others. He wasn't snobby to me. He just sounded snobby.

Hey guys. Couldn't find anything definitive over the weekend on the Max Dex vs. CMD issue, just lots of back-and-forth similar to what we've already discussed. We'll go with my original interpretation (Max Dex affects CMD) for two reasons: first, I prefer RAI to RAW, so although the rules themselves as written lean in the direction of Max Dex not affecting CMD, it makes more sense--logically speaking--for armour to reduce your chance to avoid a grapple or trip attempt just as it reduces your chance to avoid blows. Second, Hero Lab does it that way and I would prefer not to have to recalculate CMD manually for all my NPCs. (Yes, I am lazy.)

I should also add that over the weekend a fairly large job came up at work that it looks like I am going to have to manage (I am usually in the office and kept away from clients because I ain't a fan of stupidity and am not afraid to say so when I find it). Starting next week, it's likely that I will be flat-out for at least the next two months. That means I may well be limited to making one post a day myself, so things might go a little slower than I or you might like. My apologies for that.

And now, let's get started. : )

Sarianna, overhearing Flori's last remark, makes her way over from behind the bar.

Ladies and gentlemen, she can't resist a smile as she curtsies in mock-courtly fashion--although you notice she does have all the forms down pat, we are closing up for the night. It's late and probably time you all got your beauty sleep.

As she begins to pack all your glasses away, she leans in and puts a hand on Flori's shoulder. Your memories of Petros are just like mine, she says quietly. He was one of the few good men in this town, and I wish he was still here. Still, she straightens up, if wishes were horses, beggars would ride, as my mother used to say. And if you lot don't get some sleep, beggars is what you'll look like in the morning. Come on! Away with you!

She chivvies you all up the stairs and to your rooms for the night.

All right, head on over to the Gameplay thread now, where it's suddenly a new day and things have gone badly already...

Just noting:

www.rainymood.com

Perfect listening for postcrafting if you have the ability to listen to, well, crazy rain sounds.

Nice work Walter, that's awesome. : )

I have now stopped talking to myself over in the gameplay thread. : )

Pulled this into the Discussion so as not to derail the game...

You can type and preview your words and the dice results will be visible... so if you roll kick arse or craptastic you'll know before you get attached to what you are planning and write accordingly... how cool is that?!

My only concern here (and i'm not saying I don't tailor my narrative writing to what my dice say, because that is one of the benefits of playing in a PbP) is that it's a slippery slope. I've seen a few players who i had a lot of respect for fall to the temptation of taking the step from "previewing and letting the dice determine what my actions look like narratively" to "previewing and letting the dice determine which actions I will take in what order". Which is to say, it goes from framing up the dice rolls narratively (something that can [should?] be the DM's job) to previewing the dice and then deciding what to do with them. To me, this second option is tantamount to cheating. But again, that's just me.

"Well, Doc, looks like you are doing the recon on this particular job, I guess."

Great line. : )

Why, thank you, Walter. :)

Pulled this into the Discussion so as not to derail the game...

Dragomir Vuk wrote:

You can type and preview your words and the dice results will be visible... so if you roll kick arse or craptastic you'll know before you get attached to what you are planning and write accordingly... how cool is that?!

My only concern here (and i'm not saying I don't tailor my narrative writing to what my dice say, because that is one of the benefits of playing in a PbP) is that it's a slippery slope. I've seen a few players who i had a lot of respect for fall to the temptation of taking the step from "previewing and letting the dice determine what my actions look like narratively" to "previewing and letting the dice determine which actions I will take in what order". Which is to say, it goes from framing up the dice rolls narratively (something that can [should?] be the DM's job) to previewing the dice and then deciding what to do with them. To me, this second option is tantamount to cheating. But again, that's just me.

Different gaming styles I think... The player also has narrative control to determine their own actions within the result - not how it reflects on others.

In my games the player will state the attempt, give a frame work of what is attempted and roll... then flavour their attempt based on the rolls. Normally a reasonable roll one way or the other doesnt need any flavouring but a really low roll or high roll can give the player a chance to have a bit of fun with it.

I don't think this is a 'play style' difference since it sounds to me like you are both describing a similar way of playing...

I'm not saying I don't tailor my narrative writing to what my dice say, because that is one of the benefits of playing in a PbP

The player also has narrative control to determine their own actions within the result - not how it reflects on others.

Neither statement precludes the dangers of the 'slippery slope' Karrik mentioned... in a PbP format game. 'Cheating' in an IP Game is a lot harder and the 'slippery slope' cheats are nearly impossible to pull off since you have to verbally announce your intentions to the DM before you roll. However, in a PbP, these cheats are easy - hence the seduction of the slippery slope.

Having seen a player turn their odd 'slippery slope' cheat into a roaring mudslide of cheating... I have to agree with Karrik about the dangers of 'previewing rolls' too frequently.

Can we bring the dice back to the discussion thread where the rolls were high? >>; 5 12 12 7 7 6 9 11... I dare the next person to roll to roll a 20. Double dog dare!

I'm also going to mention my dice roll was Diplomacy. Since I forgot. Because I am dumb.

Well, since you can't change your roll, anything you say after it is just gravy.

1d20 ⇒ 9

The roller is cursed.

Now for a few test rolls...

1d20 ⇒ 6
1d20 ⇒ 3
1d20 ⇒ 3
1d20 ⇒ 18
1d20 ⇒ 18
1d20 ⇒ 6
1d20 ⇒ 13
1d20 ⇒ 15
1d20 ⇒ 9
1d20 ⇒ 4
1d20 ⇒ 5
1d20 ⇒ 2
1d20 ⇒ 13
1d20 ⇒ 13
1d20 ⇒ 14
1d20 ⇒ 4
1d20 ⇒ 1
1d20 ⇒ 8
1d20 ⇒ 8
1d20 ⇒ 17
1d20 ⇒ 17
1d20 ⇒ 1
1d20 ⇒ 2
1d20 ⇒ 8
1d20 ⇒ 9
1d20 ⇒ 12
1d20 ⇒ 5
1d20 ⇒ 12
1d20 ⇒ 10
1d20 ⇒ 16
1d20 ⇒ 14
1d20 ⇒ 12
1d20 ⇒ 14
1d20 ⇒ 12
1d20 ⇒ 1
1d20 ⇒ 2
1d20 ⇒ 7
1d20 ⇒ 9
1d20 ⇒ 13
1d20 ⇒ 2
1d20 ⇒ 14
1d20 ⇒ 4
1d20 ⇒ 3
1d20 ⇒ 14
1d20 ⇒ 2
1d20 ⇒ 8
1d20 ⇒ 6
1d20 ⇒ 1
1d20 ⇒ 16
1d20 ⇒ 11
1d20 ⇒ 10
1d20 ⇒ 3
1d20 ⇒ 4

And now for the Nat 20!

1d20 ⇒ 20

Amazing!! How did I know!!

Of course if I actually did that, I'd expect to be verbally (well, typedly) abused for such blatant tomfoolery.

Also, WTF!? Those are not good rolls, and took a LONG time to get that Nat 20.