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If I had them roll when they declared they were avoiding notice I would have a roll to compare to any DC that mattered and I could have held off on the initiative rolls until one of them took a hostile action.
My group may have had the players not stealthing walk up and talk first, the others might have continued to avoid notice and scope out the place or get into position.
So yeah I do feel I robbed them of some opportunities and creative solutions in that situation and should have waited on that initiative roll.
Let's say creature A uses the hide action while they're completely alone. They then stay still, making no further actions, until a couple of minutes later, creature B passes by. They have line of sight to the square creature A is occupying but at every point of creature B's movement, creature A has cover. Creature B is NOT doing the seek action. Creature A simply stays still, until B has passed by.
Is there any roll involved? Does B has any chance at discovering A? My current RAW reading of the rules is that no, if B isn't using the seek action, and A has cover or concealment the whole time, A succeeds "automatically". Is that correct?
Creature A needs to be unnoticed for Creature B to not start actively Seeking. The Hide action doesn't let Creature A become undetected, let alone unnoticed. Even Sneak can't make Creature A unnoticed. Creature A must Avoid Notice to accomplish this.
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Creature A needs to be unnoticed for Creature B to not start actively Seeking. The Hide action doesn't let Creature A become undetected, let alone unnoticed. Even Sneak can't make Creature A unnoticed. Creature A must Avoid Notice to accomplish this.Let's say creature A uses the hide action while they're completely alone. They then stay still, making no further actions, until a couple of minutes later, creature B passes by. They have line of sight to the square creature A is occupying but at every point of creature B's movement, creature A has cover. Creature B is NOT doing the seek action. Creature A simply stays still, until B has passed by.
Is there any roll involved? Does B has any chance at discovering A? My current RAW reading of the rules is that no, if B isn't using the seek action, and A has cover or concealment the whole time, A succeeds "automatically". Is that correct?
Being Stealthy, Player Core
"If you want to sneak around when there are creatures that can see you, you can use a combination of Hide and Sneak to do so.
First, Hide behind something (either by taking advantage of cover or having the concealed condition due to fog, a spell, or a similar effect). A successful Stealth check makes you hidden, though the creatures still know roughly where you are.
Second, now that you're hidden, you can Sneak. That means you can move at half your Speed and attempt another Stealth check. If it's successful, you're now undetected. That means the creatures don't know which square you're in anymore."
Avoid Notice is an "attempt a Stealth check to avoid notice while traveling at half speed." Technically Hiding in place isn't covered as it's Stealth at 1/2 speed.
Creature A needs to be unnoticed for Creature B to not start actively Seeking. The Hide action doesn't let Creature A become undetected, let alone unnoticed. Even Sneak can't make Creature A unnoticed. Creature A must Avoid Notice to accomplish this.Let's say creature A uses the hide action while they're completely alone. They then stay still, making no further actions, until a couple of minutes later, creature B passes by. They have line of sight to the square creature A is occupying but at every point of creature B's movement, creature A has cover. Creature B is NOT doing the seek action. Creature A simply stays still, until B has passed by.
Is there any roll involved? Does B has any chance at discovering A? My current RAW reading of the rules is that no, if B isn't using the seek action, and A has cover or concealment the whole time, A succeeds "automatically". Is that correct?
Being Stealthy, Player Core
"If you want to sneak around when there are creatures that can see you, you can use a combination of Hide and Sneak to do so.
First, Hide behind something (either by taking advantage of cover or having the concealed condition due to fog, a spell, or a similar effect). A successful Stealth check makes you hidden, though the creatures still know roughly where you are.
Second, now that you're hidden, you can Sneak. That means you can move at half your Speed and attempt another Stealth check. If it's successful, you're now undetected. That means the creatures don't know which square you're in anymore."
Avoid Notice is an "attempt a Stealth check to avoid notice while traveling at half speed." Technically Hiding in place isn't covered as it's Stealth at 1/2 speed.
Unnoticed is a separate condition from undetected. The latter means the enemy doesn't know where you are. The former means the enemy doesn't know you are even present. That is the scenario that prevents the enemy from Seeking you. Hide and Sneak cannot do that.
As for "while traveling at half speed," this is likely intended to limit how fast you can move while Avoiding Notice rather than force you to move.
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Ok, I misread your post a bit SuperParkourio. I see the distinction now. Sorry for the confusion.
Ok, I misread your post a bit SuperParkourio. I see the distinction now. Sorry for the confusion.
No prob