Help figuring out my build when pcgen dont x) Does Large limb + EffortLess Dual Wielding Stack?

[Alesander]

Class: Warpriest 6

Archetype: Arsenal Champion

Race: Thiefling - OniSpawn
Variant Ability Large Limbs

Stats: STR16 DEX15 CON12 INT8 Wis18 CHA5

Favored Weapon: Aldori Sword

Deity has unarmed Strike

Arensal lvl 5 - Weapon Training 1 - (Blades/Heavy)

Feats: Dodge, Crane Style, Two Weapon Fighting, Advanced Weapon Training - Effortless Dual Wielding Blades/Heavy, Two Weapon Defense

Trait:Aldori Caution,
Skill:Acrobatic 3

So how does this all play out? Does it work?
It seems i qualify for AWT from having weapon training and taking it with my bonus feat from warpriest.

Tweaks and suggestions taken.

In PCGEN when I select EffortLess Dual Wielding nothing changes.

I hope with the two combined Large limb + Effortless Wielding I can dual wield 2 large Aldori Swords?

[Derklord]

"You have oversized limbs, allowing you to use Large weapons without penalty." I believe this is what you're talking about. It only mentions penalties, it says nothing about handedness. Which means that a large Aldori Dueling Sword is a two-handed weapon for a tiefling. Not only can't you wield two of those to begin with, Effortless Dual-Wielding, like all abilities that alter things in combat, check for how the weapon is actually used. Thus, a large ADS does not qualify for the AWT, as it's not a one-handed weapon for the character.

In general, the Variant Tiefling Ability only alters penalties, i.e. nothing but numerical values. It doesn't allow you to do something you can't already do. The same is truw for Effortless Dual-Wielding, it only affects the penalties from using two-weapon fighting.

As for your original question, the Variant Tiefling Ability and Effortless Dual-Wielding do stack, but you would need to use a large light weapon to make that happen.

Alesander wrote:

It seems i qualify for AWT from having weapon training and taking it with my bonus feat from warpriest.

Yes. A Molthuni Arsenal Chaplain gains Weapon Training which a small alteration but mostly "as per the fighter class feature". Which means the Warpriest does select a weapon group, and only weapons for the group that are also either their deity's favored weapon, or for which the Warpriest has Weapon Focus, are affected. On the flip side, this means AWT options that select weapon groups do function. Of course, as you've correctly done, the Warpriest needs to use the AWT feat to take any AWT option, as only actual Fighters get AWTs from levels.
Your character would need Weapon Focus to apply Weapon Training and AWTs to anything but unarmed strikes.

[Alesander]

I see!

In pcgen when i add the oversized limbs, the alduri in my inventory went from from being one handed to light category, and a large alduri became one handed instead of two handed, which allowed me to equip it to one hand thuse the dual wield.

So there are no ways in pathfinder to say one hand a two handed weapon?

[Alesander]

Post from another forum
"Larger creatures can weild smaller creatures’ two-handed weapons in one hand
You can wield the two-handed weapon of a creature one size category smaller than yourself at a −2 penalty. That means you, if we assume you are a Medium creature, could wield a Small two-handed weapon one-handed at a −2 penalty. On average, you generally see a ~1 damage increase for a two-handed weapon over a one-handed weapon, which is not worth a −2 penalty."

So are you sure this doesnt' work?

- You have oversized limbs, allowing you to use Large weapons without penalty.

In my large hands, that allowes me to wield larger weapon without penalty. Medium sized weapons becomes one size catergory smaller then me, thus allowing me to wield it in one hand.

If I was enlarged person, I could wield a medium sized two handed weapon in one hand right? Just as my hands are with the oversized?

[Derklord]

Alesander wrote:

So are you sure this doesnt' work?

Yes, very sure.

"Penalty: Penalties are numerical values that are subtracted from a check or statistical score." CRB pg. 12

This is the game definition of the term penalty. Don't mistake the general non-game meaning of the term with the definition used for the game; not everything that's a downside counts as a penalty, rather only negative numerical values. The change in handedness (i.e. that a large one-handed weapon is a two_handed weapon for a medium sized character) is not a penalty (in the meaning of the game term), and thus completely unaffected by the tiefling ability.

Alesander wrote:

If I was enlarged person, I could wield a medium sized two handed weapon in one hand right? Just as my hands are with the oversized?

A medium sized two-handed weapon is considered a one-handed weapon for a large creature. That has nothing to do with the tiefling ability, which as mentioned before does not affect handedness at all.

The tiefling ability is horrendously written. RAW, the ability only ever applies to large weapon, no matter your size. What the ability is supposed to do is remove the penalty for using an inappropriately sized weapon for weapons one size larger than the tiefling.
RAW, if you're large sized, the ability can't ever do anything, period. RAI, if you're large sized, it (only) affects huge weapons.

For reference, the proper rules on the topic:
"Inappropriately Sized Weapons: A creature can’t make optimum use of a weapon that isn’t properly sized for it. A cumulative –2 penalty applies on attack rolls for each size category of difference between the size of its intended wielder and the size of its actual wielder. If the creature isn’t proficient with the weapon, a –4 nonproficiency penalty also applies.
The measure of how much effort it takes to use a weapon (whether the weapon is designated as a light, one-handed, or two-handed weapon for a particular wielder) is altered by one step for each size category of difference between the wielder’s size and the size of the creature for which the weapon was designed. For example, a Small creature would wield a Medium one-handed weapon as a two-handed weapon. If a weapon’s designation would be changed to something other than light, one-handed, or two-handed by this alteration, the creature can’t wield the weapon at all." CRB pg. 144

[Alesander]

Thanks for a great answer! Neatly explained, thanks!

[Nylanfs]

If you want a quick fix I "believe" there is a bonus you can add under GM Awards, that will let you adjust the numbers somewhat.